Kim's representatives end Orser's coaching relationship threads merged

[MrBerkeley]

Yes, but when I read that e-mail that Orser sent to Yuna I did wonder how it came across to Yuna. He tells her that the rumors are true and that he told Mao's people that Kim is "his first priority." He never says, I would never ever ever coach Mao. He never even says, "I told them no." Then he goes on to ask Yuna what her plans are for the upcoming seasons and ask if they should talk about it.

From that e-mail I gathered several things
1. Brian and Yuna didn't have the kind of relationship, for whatever reason, where they could just pick up the phone and talk to each other about things in a straight forward manner. Brian, for whatever reason, didn't just call Yuna and say, btw, Mao sent out some feelers but don't worry I said no. And Yuna hadn't been speaking to Brian about her competive plans.
2. I seems that Brian was trying to say to Yuna, I would never even think about coaching Mao while I coach you. But in the meantime, Brian doesn't know if Yuna wants to keep competing. Sort of sounds like he might have left the door open to coach Mao IF Yuna decided to stop competing. Nothing wrong with that, in theory. But maybe Yuna didn't understand that from the e-mail and wondered if Brian had actually considered coaching Mao. Or maybe she understood perfectly well and thought Brian was pressuring her to make a decision and letting her know that he was getting other offers while she was trying to make her up mind about her career. I doubt Brian was trying say that, but it MIGHT have come across that way to Yuna. Just saying.

Isn't speculation fun?

I just don't know why Brian had to say he was flattered by the offer. It would have been better if he said "MAN, I'm INSULTED that I could ever be seen as DISLOYAL to you, my FAVORITE SKATER in the WORLD. Go Yuna." Then we have no problems (not that he had any reason to be diplomatic or anything like that, but it would have been better lol).

(Edit: Not that he was being disloyal to Yuna by normal standards but a lifetime rival and a fierce one at that and especially given the Korea/ Japan thing, that could have been seen as a betrayal).

 

[bekalc]

I still don't see the part where he ever considered accepting the offer.

What do I see is that he turned down the overture from Mao's camp because of his loyalty to Yu-na.

He actually never said I turned them down, he said my first loyalty is to you. And called the offer flattering. But where were the words that he turned them down.

 

[seniorita]

This thread will pass the posts of the old plushy thread in less than a week

everyone has his worries...

 

[Layfan]

He actually never said I turned them down, he said my first loyalty is to you. And called the offer flattering. But where were the words that he turned them down.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.... But I think Brian WAS trying to tell her, look, while I coach you, I will not coach Mao. But Brian didn't know whether he would have Yuna to coach next season because her plans were up in the air. It sort of seems like a misunderstanding that was allowed to fester and resulted in what one poster, I think you, called a major error. It's all very unfortunate.

 

[ilfs]

I believe he did consider and rejected it right away. Regardless of who(orser/IMG, who knows) initiated the offer and/or interest, the very fact of the event was the seed of discontent, and not revealing it right away to the trustees especially Yuna, sprouting into this rather ugly unfoldment. This faux pas successively led to another one involving the as yet infantile, inexperienced agency that is ATS.

It does not stop there as Orser steps outbound again by commiting the "cardinal sin" of revealing her upcoming program.
http://www.universalsports.com/blogs/blog=gofigure/postid=490379.html#orser+breaks+cardinal+rule

 

[janetfan]

I just don't know why Brian had to say he was flattered by the offer. It would have been better if he said "MAN, I'm INSULTED that I could ever be seen as DISLOYAL to you, my FAVORITE SKATER in the WORLD. Go Yuna." Then we have no problems (not that he had any reason to be diplomatic or anything like that, but it would have been better lol).

(Edit: Not that he was being disloyal to Yuna by normal standards but a lifetime rival and a fierce one at that and especially given the Korea/ Japan thing, that could have been seen as a betrayal).

Good answer as was mathman's.

This feels like such a non-issue to me and the fact that ATS in a display of shocking ineptness used this as an excuse for firing Brian would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

I think it would be pathetic if Yuna believed this nonsense. Sheltered or not there is no way she can't have felt the devotion Brian has shown to her. Yuna does not strike me as being that cold or out of touch with reality.

 

[Mathman]

"MAN, I'm INSULTED that I could ever be seen as DISLOYAL to you, my FAVORITE SKATER in the WORLD. Go Yuna." Then we have no problems (not that he had any reason to be diplomatic or anything like that, but it would have been better lol).

So true, so true. A few "Go Ya-na!"'s thrown into the mix would have smoothed everything over.

*whole post*

Thank you for that thoughtful perspective. That might be exactly the way it went down.

 

[bekalc]

Good answer as was mathman's.

This feels like such a non-issue to me and the fact that ATS in a display of shocking ineptness used this as an excuse for firing Brian would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

I think it would be pathetic if Yuna believed this nonsense.

See the thing is I actually think it probably was an ISSUE. Why else would Brian go to such trouble to read that email as well and why else would their relationship change so much out of the blue like that. It could have very well been an issue. And I expect the issue wasn't really that Mao's team offered (and I don't blame them) but maybe rather if Yu-na got any idea in her head that Orser would consider the offer, or was pressuring her to make a decision, so that he could answer team Asada.

I mean people say why wasn't she answering his emails about her plans, but the email was only a week after the Fiesta Show.

"MAN, I'm INSULTED that I could ever be seen as DISLOYAL to you, my FAVORITE SKATER in the WORLD. Go Yuna." Then we have no problems (not that he had any reason to be diplomatic or anything like that, but it would have been better lol).

I think maybe if he had just said I turned them down flat, because all I can think about right is that I want to coach you. And I refuse to entertain any offers from a top skater, while you are making your decision. And Yu-na take all the time in the world, to make your decision. That would have been the best way to answer her. Because maybe she wouldn't have minded so much Brian coaching Mao, if Brian's decision to coach Mao came after Yu-na had already made it clear she was retiring. Maybe or maybe not . But I can imagine the idea of Brian and Mao, while she was still trying to make an important decision would be to much. Hurry up now, or I'll go to your biggest rival

 

[janetfan]

See the thing is I actually think it probably was an ISSUE. Why else would Brian go to such trouble to read that email as well and why else would their relationship change so much out of the blue like that. It could have very well been an issue. And I expect the issue wasn't really that Mao's team offered (and I don't blame them) but maybe rather if Yu-na got any idea in her head that Orser would consider the offer, or was pressuring her to make a decision, so that he could answer team Asada.

I mean people say why wasn't she answering his emails about her plans, but the email was only a week after the Fiesta Show.

I believe the only reason Brian showed the email was to discredit this ridiculous charge from ATS. Why is everything that goes wrong in Yuna's life somehow related to Mao? I think it sounds absurd.

 

[bekalc]

I believe the only reason Brian showed the email was to discredit this ridiculous charge. Why is everything that goes wrong in Yuna's life somehow related to Mao? I think it sounds absurd.

But the point is the email wasn't exactly any where near as strong as you would think it would be. I mean some of the rumors were so bad as to say Brian might dump Yu-na for Mao. You'd think in those circumstances a coach wouldn't call the offer "flattering".

The point is once again not how Brian thinks his email came accross, but rather how his email came accross to Yu-na.

And Mao has nothing to do with the break up because obviously there was other stuff going on.

 

[ilunga1965]

I still don't see the part where he ever considered accepting the offer.

What do I see is that he turned down the overture from Mao's camp because of his loyalty to Yu-na.

Well? being flattered? he might have entertatined the possibility of coaching her. My post is for the possibility.

 

[Layfan]

So true, so true. A few "Go Ya-na!"'s thrown into the mix would have smoothed everything over.

 

[janetfan]

But the point is the email wasn't exactly any where near as strong as you would think it would be. I mean some of the rumors were so bad as to say Brian might dump Yu-na for Mao. You'd think in those circumstances a coach wouldn't call the offer "flattering".

The point is once again not how Brian thinks his email came accross, but rather how his email came accross to Yu-na.

And Mao has nothing to do with the break up because obviously there was other stuff going on.

Good enough answer - but I think Yuna was aware of how hard brian worked for her - and not just on the ice training. The way he prepared things so well for Vancouver would be enough proof for me let alone Yuna.

But after the way this split went down I would concede others in Yuna's camp may have felt uneasy (but I think for other reasons)

We are told that Yuna said way back she would go to Worlds regardless of how the Olympics turned out. We have also been reminded that "Yuna always keeps her word."

We have also read more than once that Yuna said "Brian will be my coach until I retire from competitions."

 

[SkatingAnalyst]

See the thing is I actually think it probably was an ISSUE. Why else would Brian go to such trouble to read that email as well and why else would their relationship change so much out of the blue like that. It could have very well been an issue. And I expect the issue wasn't really that Mao's team offered (and I don't blame them) but maybe rather if Yu-na got any idea in her head that Orser would consider the offer, or was pressuring her to make a decision, so that he could answer team Asada.

I mean people say why wasn't she answering his emails about her plans, but the email was only a week after the Fiesta Show.



I think maybe if he had just said I turned them down flat, because all I can think about right is that I want to coach you. And I refuse to entertain any offers from a top skater, while you are making your decision. And Yu-na take all the time in the world, to make your decision. That would have been the best way to answer her. Because maybe she wouldn't have minded so much Brian coaching Mao, if Brian's decision to coach Mao came after Yu-na had already made it clear she was retiring. Maybe or maybe not . But I can imagine the idea of Brian and Mao, while she was still trying to make an important decision would be to much. Hurry up now, or I'll go to your biggest rival

The content of the e-mail copy was sent by Orser to Hershey as a proof...how loyal he is to Yuna...
Apparently, it back-fired...I think he just tried to show his loyalty to Yuna...the word FLATTERED was just a bluffing.
Just to ease the tension between them.

The real problem lies elswhere...mostly neglection...I'm guessing though.

 

[ilfs]

The content of the e-mail copy was sent by Orser to Hershey as a proof...how loyal he is to Yuna...
Apparently, it back-fired...I think he just tried to show his loyalty to Yuna...the word FLATTERED was just a bluffing.
Just to ease the tension between them.

It seems Orser went out of his way to share this email(rather private professional matter), and perhaps suggests that he wanted to prove that he rejected the offer, in a rather back-pedaling way. He could have ended this issue from festering by simply informing Yuna, right away, in person, rather then some weeks later of rumors that made his star student uncomfortable.

 

[Layfan]

It seems Orser went out of his way to share this email(rather private professional matter), and perhaps suggests that he wanted to prove that he rejected the offer, in a rather back-pedaling way. He could have ended this issue from festering by simply informing Yuna, right away, in person, rather then some weeks later of rumors that made his star student uncomfortable.

Yeah, but from the e-mail it sounds like Orser and Yuna didn't really have a free-flowing relationship where they just picked up the phone. Perhaps Brian planned to tell Yuna when he finally got to talk to her in person but then realized that the rumors got out before that could happen. It just sounds like an uncomfortable situation that got out of hand for no good reason. I can just imagine Brian seeing the rumors on the Internet and thinking, oh no, what do I do now...... And he tried to reach out to Yuna in a reassuring way, and it didn't work.

 

[bekalc]

It seems Orser went out of his way to share this email(rather private professional matter), and perhaps suggests that he wanted to prove that he rejected the offer, in a rather back-pedaling way. He could have ended this issue from festering by simply informing Yuna, right away, in person, rather then some weeks later of rumors that made his star student uncomfortable.

Yeah. For the record, I never believed for a second that Orser would drop Yu-na for Mao. It would make HIM look bad, and I do believe he cared about her. But reading that email, I'm not convinced at all that he handled it in the best possible way. And to be frank, if I was Team Yu-na AND Team Mao, I'd be bothered that he talked about that offer to the press (and I'd wonder how the offer got out). And I'd be bothered as well that he released those emails now to the public. I do think Brian needs to learn a little bit about discretion.

I agree that the main issue is probably neglect.

Yeah, but from the e-mail it sounds like Orser and Yuna didn't really have a free-flowing relationship where they just picked up the phone. Perhaps Brian planned to tell Yuna when he finally got to talk to her in person but then realized that the rumors got out before that could happen. It just sounds like an uncomfortable situation that got out of hand for no good reason. I can just imagine Brian seeing the rumors on the Internet and thinking, oh no, what do I do now...... And he tried to reach out to Yuna in a reassuring way, and it didn't work.

The thing is the date of the email is about a week after Fiesta on Ice, and well after worlds. So Brian DID have plenty of time to talk about the offer with Yu-na in person. I can actually see though why he wouldn't want to talk about it with her, thinking it might upset her, who knows.

 

[Mathman]

Wouldn't it be funny if this whole thing turned out to be a nefarious plot by the Mao people to destroy Yu-na with mind games?

"I know -- we'll approach Orser with the suggestion that Mao wants to work with him, then sit back and watch the whole Kim empire crumble into dust. Heh, heh, heh."

 

[Layfan]

Yeah. For the record, I never believed for a second that Orser would drop Yu-na for Mao. It would make HIM look bad, and I do believe he cared about her. But reading that email, I'm not convinced at all that he handled it in the best possible way. And to be frank, if I was Team Yu-na AND Team Mao, I'd be bothered that he talked about that offer to the press (and I'd wonder how the offer got out). And I'd be bothered as well that he released those emails now to the public. I do think Brian needs to learn a little bit about discretion.

I agree that the main issue is probably neglect.



The thing is the date of the email is about a week after Fiesta on Ice, and well after worlds. So Brian DID have plenty of time to talk about the offer with Yu-na in person. I can actually see though why he wouldn't want to talk about it with her, thinking it might upset her, who knows.

Perhaps. Remember that whole thing about the triple axle? When Orser said in some interview that he was going to teach her the 3a? He was obviously trying to be flip and funny but then Yuna was asked about it at a presser and she turned to him and said "I didn't know about this!" It made me cringe becasue I knew Brian had only been teasing when he said that. But it just wasn't really smart because there was some serious debate at the time about whether Mao was undermarked with her two 3a. It just wasn't really something to talk about lightly. But he didn't mean anything by it.

Still, his slight indiscretions are nothing compared to ATS and their cringe-worthy press releases.

 

[seniorita]

Wouldn't it be funny if this whole thing turned out to be a nefarious plot by the Mao people to destroy Yu-na with mind games?

"I know -- we'll approach Orser with the suggestion that Mao wants to work with him, then sit back and watch the whole Kim empire crumble into dust. Heh, heh, heh."

I think you play the Age of Empire a little too much.