Kwan and Slutskaya each without Olympic Gold, does it seem picture is wrong?

[hockeyfan228]

if you compare Arakawa's OGM-winning performance to either Sarah's or Tara's it was pretty underwhelming. Safe, conservative, just enough to get the job done. Just barely squeaked by.

She just barely squeaked by by nearly 8 points -- a two-fall advantage -- over 2nd, almost 10 points over 3rd, and over 15 points over 4th.

Not to mention that she fully rotated her jumps, had power and height in them, and had proper jumping technique, apart from the lip.

 

[R.D.]

Barely squeaking by compared to the two performances I mentioned above, not the other (dismal) performances at the event she competed in and won.

 

[Ladskater]

Interesting observation. In fact some of the greatest skaters from the past who missed out on Olympic gold include:

Toller Cranston although he did win the bronze

Karen Magnussen although she did win the silver

Janet Lynn - never made the Olympic podium

These three great skaters missed the top of the podium due to their figures. Karen Magnussen was edged out by Trixi Schuba at the 1972 Saporo games. Although Karen certainly surpassed Trixi in the free skate she had to settle for Silver as Trixi was such a superb figure skater. Toller Cranston won the Bronze medal at the1976 Winter Olympics, Innsbruck, Austria. Toller always felt he had not quite "made the grade" or "graduated" is how he puts it by not capturing the gold. Janet Lynn too was surpassed by the great Trixi Schuba in figures.

So Kwan and Slutskaya are not alone without Olympic gold. There have been many great skaters over the years who have not won Olympic gold, but it does not take away from their talent or contributions they have made to the sport of figure skating.

Toller for instance left the legacy of being one of the greatest influences of all time in male skating.

More on Toller:

http://www.histori.ca/minutes/minute.do;jsessionid=957BE3EC383912C50EA7382926FEAFFF.tomcat2?id=14242

 

[kyla2]

Imo

It makes the point I have made for years, the Olympic gold medal is irrelevant. Michelle and Irina will be remembered for as long as there is figure skating. Many Olympic gold medalists will be forgotten before the next decade is over. The OGM is much a do about nothing. It's just one more competition.

 

[slutskayafan21]

Interesting observation. In fact some of the greatest skaters from the past who missed out on Olympic gold include:

Toller Cranston although he did win the bronze

Karen Magnussen although she did win the silver

Janet Lynn - never made the Olympic podium

These three great skaters missed the top of the podium due to their figures. Karen Magnussen was edged out by Trixi Schuba at the 1972 Saporo games. Although Karen certainly surpassed Trixi in the free skate she had to settle for Silver as Trixi was such a superb figure skater. Toller Cranston won the Bronze medal at the1976 Winter Olympics, Innsbruck, Austria. Toller always felt he had not quite "made the grade" or "graduated" is how he puts it by not capturing the gold. Janet Lynn too was surpassed by the great Trixi Schuba in figures.

So Kwan and Slutskaya are not alone without Olympic gold. There have been many great skaters over the years who have not won Olympic gold, but it does not take away from their talent or contributions they have made to the sport of figure skating.

Toller for instance left the legacy of being one of the greatest influences of all time in male skating.

More on Toller:

http://www.histori.ca/minutes/minute.do;jsessionid=957BE3EC383912C50EA7382926FEAFFF.tomcat2?id=14242

Actually Janet Lynn did win the bronze at the 1972 Olympics. Schuba was 1st in the figures by an enormous margin, but 7th in the free skating. Magnussen was 3rd in figures, 2nd in free skating, and silver overall. Janet Lynn was 4th in figures, 1st in free skating, and bronze overall. You are definitely right that Magnussen and Lynn were far superior to Schuba in the free skating, but Schuba was so incredible at compulsory figures she built up insurmountable leads and just had to skate respectably in free skating to ensure winning the gold.

I also kind of doubt Cranston losing the gold at the 1976 Olympics due to the compulsory figures. In the short program he was a narrow 1st over John Curry the eventual gold medalist. In the free program Curry blew everybody including Cranston away though, and Cranston barely finished 2nd in the free skating over a couple of other contenders, while barely moving up the bronze overall. His 7th place in figures cost him the silver for sure, and any shot of the gold, but it would not have been gold unless he performed much better in the free skating then he did, I have his performance on tape and it was clearly not his best and Curry was masterful.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Barely squeaking by compared to the two performances I mentioned above, not the other (dismal) performances at the event she competed in and won.

Shizuka was the winner by a substantial margin. She skated the best that night. The other skaters lost the gold because they didn't skate as well. Over and out.

 

[Jaana]

Interesting observation. In fact some of the greatest skaters from the past who missed out on Olympic gold include:

Toller Cranston although he did win the bronze

Karen Magnussen although she did win the silver

Janet Lynn - never made the Olympic podium

Well, although they all were highly enjoyable skaters, Toller Cranston never won a Worlds gold either, Magnussen was not a multiple World champion and Lynn never won a Worlds gold. Kwan and Slutskaya on the other hand are skaters with multiple World titles, but no gold medal from the Olympics.

 

[clara]

Michelle has 9 US titles does she not, not 10 as posted. That ties
her for the record and there was some talk she might come back
to try and "get the record" with a 10th.

she does have 10.that is if you count the title that was taken away from tonya but was never given to michelle.

 

[Fred Goss]

Yes, and if he had wheels, my grandfather could have been a trolley car.

When the USFS disqualified Harding in 1994, they "could have" decided to
advance Kwan to the title.

They did not.

They chose to leave the title "vacant" and that is the way it reads in their record
book.

 

[Mathman]

Actually, in the real universe -- the universe of Truth that lies behind this vale of tears -- Michelle also skated better than Tara in 1997 and, although Michelle wasn't there, she beat Sasha soundly in 2006. So Michelle has 12 U.S. championships. This is true.

 

[attyfan]

Way OT, but has the USFS ever had another situation where a skater was disqualified and stripped of a title, or is Tonya the only one?

 

[hongligl]

Short answer: No, it is not wrong, but sad.

No matter what we think, to the elite skaters, it is an everlasting pain not having an OGM.

Somebody commented that S/Z have 3 world titles and 5 GPF titles and numerous other gold medals, it should be equivalent to OGM. S/Z replied NO. It is a competitive sport, when you don't have it, you don't have it. There is no such thing as equivalency.

IMO, it is kind of FATE. It all depends on peaking at the right time and have the guts or the right stratigy or the right federations.

 

[SeaniBu]

Anyone hear of the new buzz about "The Secret." Celestine prophecy, etc...

eta, to explain "the price of tea in China" -
"If I am always depressed, that's what I project in my energy field -- and I attract people and situations that are even more depressing," she says. "It's about matching energies."
The Secret is "not wishing for something and thinking about it and focusing on it, it's about understanding and perhaps changing our personal energy."
http://www.webmd.com/balance/features/the-secret-is-it-the-real-deal


"These people will develop their own meaning of life from deep within. They will discover that true life purpose isn't found in religion, philosophy or materialism. Rather, true meaning and purpose comes from energies, vibrations and auras."
http://www.allabouttheoccult.org/celestine-prophecy.htm

Regrets are the same way.

 

[kittycat26]

Actually, in the real universe -- the universe of Truth that lies behind this vale of tears -- Michelle also skated better than Tara in 1997 and, although Michelle wasn't there, she beat Sasha soundly in 2006. So Michelle has 12 U.S. championships. This is true.

I truly hope you are joking on the first part of your statement. Michelle at the 1997 U.S Nationals had a meltdown of sorts. She fell on the double toe at the end of a triple toe, fell on a triple flip, opened up in mid air on a planned triple loop then fell, and doubled a final triple lutz. Tara was flawless and won the event hands down in a major shock at the time. Michelle was scored quite generously to even finish 2nd, I felt both Bobek and Nikidinov should have been placed over her to be honest. She looked like she was skating in terror which took away from her normaly exquisite artistry that night as well.

 

[attyfan]

Short answer: No, it is not wrong, but sad.

No matter what we think, to the elite skaters, it is an everlasting pain not having an OGM.

Somebody commented that S/Z have 3 world titles and 5 GPF titles and numerous other gold medals, it should be equivalent to OGM. S/Z replied NO. It is a competitive sport, when you don't have it, you don't have it. There is no such thing as equivalency.

IMO, it is kind of FATE. It all depends on peaking at the right time and have the guts or the right stratigy or the right federations.

I think a lot depends upon what the OGM does (or should) stand for. It will always be painful for some skaters (MK, IS, S/Z) not to have the OGM, just the way it is painful for other skaters (Kurt Browning, for instance) not to have an Oly medal of any color -- simply because the Oly medals (and especially the gold) is what theyse skaters have been dreaming of since they were children. From this point of view, you are right, it is sad they don't have the OGM, but it is not wrong.

What I think is wrong is the idea that the OGM equates to overall greatness, or legendary status. IMO, MK and IS are both greater skaters than Sarah Hughes ever was, and the one dream skate for SH in SLC shouldn't alter that.

 

[SeaniBu]

What I think is wrong is the idea that the OGM equates to overall greatness, or legendary status. IMO, MK and IS are both greater skaters than Sarah Hughes ever was, and the one dream skate for SH in SLC shouldn't alter that.

AMEN!!!:yes: :agree:

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

No matter what we think, to the elite skaters, it is an everlasting pain not having an OGM.

Totally disagree. I think most skaters like Rosyln Summers move on with their lives. There is always a tug at the heart but life without skating takes hold. Many have done quite well without the Olygold.

We are not living in their skates and I am sure each Olygoldless skater is different in handling the future.

I do think some fans like to constantly remind other fans of skaters who have never won an Oly gold medal. The skaters put it to rest, but the antiFan keeps bringing it up. It does tell you something about the antiFan.

Joe

 

[hongligl]

I think a lot depends upon what the OGM does (or should) stand for. It will always be painful for some skaters (MK, IS, S/Z) not to have the OGM, just the way it is painful for other skaters (Kurt Browning, for instance) not to have an Oly medal of any color -- simply because the Oly medals (and especially the gold) is what theyse skaters have been dreaming of since they were children. From this point of view, you are right, it is sad they don't have the OGM, but it is not wrong.

What I think is wrong is the idea that the OGM equates to overall greatness, or legendary status. IMO, MK and IS are both greater skaters than Sarah Hughes ever was, and the one dream skate for SH in SLC shouldn't alter that.

ITA! OGM does not equal to great skater(s), it says that at that competition the owner(s) of the OGM might have done the best job. That's it. (e.g. 2006 olympics pair). To me and apparently to many others, S/Z are the greatest in the past decade even without the OMG. But still, every great skater still wants to have an OMG

 

[Mathman]

I truly hope you are joking on the first part of your statement. Michelle at the 1997 U.S Nationals had a meltdown of sorts. She fell on the double toe at the end of a triple toe, fell on a triple flip, opened up in mid air on a planned triple loop then fell, and doubled a final triple lutz....She looked like she was skating in terror which took away from her normaly exquisite artistry that night as well.

But other than that....

 

[Tonichelle]

Totally disagree. I think most skaters like Rosyln Summers move on with their lives. There is always a tug at the heart but life without skating takes hold. Many have done quite well without the Olygold.

I dunno... Roz still spouts sour grapes when she talks about her near misses of gold... so I wouldn't use her as an example...

Kurt says he regrets not doing better at teh olympics...

most of the skaters do...

I personally feel that's why Michelle tried so hard to be ready for Turin... just one more shot... *shrugs* did she need it to prove her greatness, no... but that didn't stop her desire to have it...

as for anti-fans bringing it up... just because you don't like a skater it doesnt make a point or question any less valid...