Mao still has to do it

[sorcerer]

It doesn't stand out nearly as much when she's skating to cheerful music, like last year's Chopin nocturne, in fact it can feel quite appropriate.

ITA.
I like the aspect of Mao as a perfectionist the most.
Her goal is perfection.
So I want Mao to be perfect, she has the talent to be so.

That doesn't mean she can fit to every kind of music.
I don't like her choice this year.
I think Mao's intent to "show strength" (that's her words) is against her natural character. To me her huge movements of her upper body this season is aesthetically incoherent to her charm.
I think Tarasova has mistaken the meaning of Mao being perfect.

 

[Oscilla]

I rather like Mao's music choices this year. LP and EX particularly are lovely.

SP is not as good, but that is mostly because the music cut is too dull (reminds me of Michelle's Bolero) and I don't like how all the jump passes are squished together.

But, overall, I think the Mao team made a wise decision. This is not an Olympic year, so she can and should experiment. Even if she ultimately decides that a different type of music is more appropriate for her, everything she learned performing current programs will benefit her. More speed, better upper body movement, the ability to handle complex choreo without stamina being affected to much to execute jumps - all those things will come in handy later.

I like the way Mao's ballet instructor put this - first you need a perfect techique, when you have it, the freedom of expression will come automatically.

 

[bekalc]

Oscilla, I watched Mao's performance again, and her arms were much better than I gave her credit for, but I still don't think they are as beautiful as let's say Yu-na's. I wonder though why Mao is giving up her triple flip/triple loop because that garners more points than a triple flip/triple toe...

I think right now Mao may really need two triple axels to counter Yu-na, unless Mao can get the other triples under control...And I know people are saying that Mao supposedly has the triple toe/triple salchow. But if she really had those jumps, why didn't she use them... I suspect that they are still a work in progress.

As for leaving that message to Yu-na, it's really funny.. I've heard that both girls seem to get a long pretty well, and that's it's not a bitter rivalry..

Personally, I loved Mao's short program last year...

 

[kandidy]

I'm surprised reading some of the posts above, as one thing that I liked the most in her LP yesterday was amazing connection to music and by far the best arms of any ladies today.

I also don't think cheerful music suits her well. The Czardas LP was a fiasco, IMHO, and she herself admitted that she didn't feel the music suited her at all.
I thought she is the best in slow, lyrical pieces, like her Nocturne LP (I can't even count how many commentators stated that "Chopin must have written this piece for Mao" or some variation of thereof, and I agree) or her EX this season. However, yesterday she proved to me that she can skate well to more dramatic, faster music with changes of tempo.

She totally disconnected from the music in the SP, though. Sadly, she seems to do this often when she makes a mistake that she cannot forgive herself for. This is one thing that she needs to work on.

As for the jumps - I think what we have seen was a very temporary jump layout. Because of the fire in Lake Arrowhead and mandatory evacuation she lost some training time (and certainly it affected her mentally as well). I can't give the link to the interview, because its up on (Removed by admin - see Announcement), but if you'll search for it you should find it.
She didn't have that much time to work on jumps during the summer - the injury, shows, ballet training and improving steps and presentation with Tarasova took her a lot of time. I think she meant to work on jumps harder when she got back with Arutunian, but then there was that fire.

I don't think she is going to stop attempting 3A. In a recent interview she said that she wants to attempt two 3A in her LP at Worlds, but maybe give up the brackets into it, at least into the combo. From looking at her practices I think she wil attempt a 3F-3T. She wrote a message to YuNa recently saying that she loves that combo. YuNa was very amused.

Yes, I saw that messages also. I was also thinking at that moment that she wanted to try triple flip-toe.

 

[cosmos]

The point of this thread is that the Mao hype was (has been) so exaggerated, for some people, she was supposed to be one of the greatest in history even at age 17.

I think the hype has not been good for Mao.

But, she is an excellent skater, no doubt about that.

 

[bekalc]

The point of this thread is that the Mao hype was (has been) so exaggerated, for some people, she was supposed to be one of the greatest in history even at age 17.

I think the hype has not been good for Mao.

But, she is an excellent skater, no doubt about that.

I think the hype was exaggerated and honestly unfair to Mao. But I'm angry if people are disappointed in Asada, because she's had quite an amazing Senior career so far. I think that it's asking to much of a skater to expect them to win Worlds at their first go at it . Sure Meissner did it but with a lot less competition and a lot less expectations...

My feelings are that Asada is an immense talent, and maybe she could be the best skater ever. But if that is to happen she has to get that salchow and tripe toe loop under control...

 

[Medusa]

I think that it is not her fault that she was hyped. And second, she became Vice-World-Champion at the age of 16, won several other competitions - I think that is pretty great. Sometimes she struggles and sometimes she wins. Just because she landed very difficult jumps at an early age she has to be the unbeatable wunderkind? It is much more suspenseful so see the skaters grow up, struggle, lose competitions and win again. Miss Arakawa landed her first triple jump at the age of 8, but it took her a long time to become world champion and even longer to become olympic champion. And in the end she became olympic champion without presenting her incredible jumping ability - but everyone was in awe of her artistry and maturity. That makes this sport interesting.

I also prefer a Mao Asada, who may not have won everything she could in the first years as a senior, who has still to improve in lots of areas of skating, but who stays with the sport and fights - over a Tara Lipinski who I never really watched, who became olympic champion and than, well, disappeared. Of course she was injured and everything - but just as an example. Why not watch Miss Asada grow over the next years, see her improve (or perhaps not) etc.? Perhaps she will not even make the podium in Vancouver - and perhaps we will see an amazing mature 23-year-old Mao Asada in Russia and she will win like Miss Arakawa did in 2006.

As for her artistry, I really like it and do not think that she is trying to be Szizuka Arakawa (I actually think that Yu-Na Kim skates a lot like Miss Arakawa, which is not really a bad thing). But artistry is this very subjective element of figure skating, so just because I like Miss Asada's, the next person can despise it and it is neither my mistake nor his (I always thought Mr. Plushenko very artistic in his own way, not like Mr. Yagudin, but, well, he is not Mr. Yagudin, he is Mr. Plushenko). I think that Miss Asada has great speed on the ice and moves fluently - other people can interpret this as racing through the program.

Last week everyone said that we could and should cut Miss Zhang some slack, maybe we could do the same for Miss Asada, who is really talented, has already won a lot and tries and fights - and on my opinion makes this sport more interesting.

 

[bekalc]

Medusa, thank you, you said exactly what I'm trying to say.. I like Mao. It's weird because I prefer Yu-na and so I have had to force myself to start appreciating Mao because i don't want to be an uber fan of just one skater. But the more I watch this free skate of Mao's the more I must say that I do love her, she's amazing.

I think the expectations on Mao were ridiculously high. I mean you must win the world championships etc? On your first try, that's completely ridiculous. The girl has a world silver medal. Really, give Mao a chance to get use to skating at that level, before you flame her...

That being said, I don't think it's ridiculous to expect a top level skater to have more than 3 types of triples in her program. I can understand having problems with one triple, but two triple jumps? That's glaring, and it's one area where I think Mao or at least Mao's coaches deserve a lot of criticism.

 

[rtureck]

I think that's just her style. She does seem to skate with a certain detachment, like she is in her own little world.

There are 2 kinds of detachment IMO. Detachment from audience and detachment from music. IMO, connection with audience is very much bound by the location. Most skaters who are with home crowd where there is a mutal lovefest going on, they connect well with audience. Obvious example Michelle at nationals. Another example Jenny Kirk at SA 2003. Fumie is an example of a skater who is connected to her music even if she is not in front of home crowd. Dick Button comment on Johnnhy Weir's connection with his music (audience are just kinda peeking in and in awe). But Mao is only 17!!!. Every year her choreographers tried to give something that challenges her to the limit, and that includes up to level 4 footwork. OTOH, look at poor Mai's lp, elevator music.

For years Sasha Cohen was detached from audience and music.

The alternative -- to wear your heart on your sleeve and emote with passionate facial expressions -- maybe that suits some other skaters, but I don't know that I really like it any better.

If I may go back to Cohen's example, she finally got the passionate facial expression in the olys R&J (some of her fans joked about the *rg@smic look). To me that was forced, and I prefer the Cohen who was detached from music and audience.

I think it is a huge challenge for Mao's choreographers to come up with something that is age appropriate, and at the same time they have to pack in tons of tech content.

About the hype throne, I have a feeling that princess Caroline will be dethroning Mao soon. That is just fine with me.

 

[Mathman]

I agree with everything RTureck wrote.

But I will say this, too. I think that Mao has lived up to the hype.

She was promoted as a astonishingly talented child prodigy, and that's just what she was. What she could do at age twelve, thirteen, and fourteen defies the imagination. At fifteen she won the senior Grand Prix over Slutskaya, Ando, and Nakano, and to qualify, along the way she beat Cohen, Arakawa (twice), Meissner, and Rochette.

The universal consensus is that she is one of the top two skaters in the world, and probably the best.

Well, ice is slippery. We'll see.

 

[bibi]

Yes, I saw that messages also. I was also thinking at that moment that she wanted to try triple flip-toe.

She did a lot of those in practices at Skate Canada ... her toe technique has improve so much!

 

[sorcerer]

I saw Mao's Gala performance, broadcast on TV-Asahi today.
There I thought I saw the PERFECT Mao, just the way I wanted her to be!
Breathless.
This is the second time I felt like this to her.
The first time was her short program performed in SA '06.

TV showed her two encores. I envy her talent as a human being in persuit of beauty.

I want to see her short program this season to be as exquisite as this exhibition number.
Of course it should be with the right edge with no "e".
I'm sure I'm not asking too much. She can do it!

 

[kittycat26]

What does she have to be ashamed of? That she was ripped off of a chance to win an Olympic and World title by silly age eligility rules, and got a bit unlucky in losing the World title last year but still wins a World silver at her first ever Worlds?
Mao has nothing to feel sorry for, it is sad in a way she does not have a big title yet since she could easily have 2 or 3 but people should only be proud of what she has already done.

 

[sorcerer]

...Mao has nothing to feel sorry for, .....people should only be proud of what she has already done.

You're right, I feel the same way, I dream of her perfection with no regards to titles; but Mao wants to win those titles way more than any of her fans, that's very characteristic of her.
Mao's chief motivation now seems to be TO WIN.
We can't do anything with it.

 

[kandidy]

What does she have to be ashamed of? That she was ripped off of a chance to win an Olympic and World title by silly age eligility rules, and got a bit unlucky in losing the World title last year but still wins a World silver at her first ever Worlds?
Mao has nothing to feel sorry for, it is sad in a way she does not have a big title yet since she could easily have 2 or 3 but people should only be proud of what she has already done.

Take it easy!

 

[Mathman]

...she was ripped off of a chance to win an Olympic and World title by silly age eligility rules...

She beat the entire Olympic podium that year -- Arakawa at Cup of China and also Eric Bompard, Cohen at Eric Bompard, and Slutskaya at the Grand Prix final. She also beat the world champion, Meissner, at Eric Bompard. None of the world podium (Meissner, Suguri, Cohen) made the Grand Prix final, which Mao won.

The only one Mao didn't beat was Suguri, who won the Japanese National Championship to Mao's second. Mao did not face Suguri in international competition.

It was a good year for Ms. Asada!

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

You'll forgive me if I believe Mao's presentation comes according to what the choreographer tells her to do. It's fine! Don't get me wrong, but the praise should go to the choreographer now. I think Mao in a year or two will be using her own nuances while performing and become a good stylist. Of course, her technical is the most point gathering.

We've seen Kimmie, Miki and Mao and awaiting breathlessly for Yu Na.

Joe

 

[ciroc83]

As am I... I haven't been this excited for new programs in years. I can't wait for Yu-na...

 

[Fossi]

Mao wasn't anymore ripped off than Sasha Cohen was ripped off when she wasn't old enough for Worlds. Pu-leaze!!!!!

Count me in the minority, but just because Mao Irina, Shizuka and Sasha before the Olympics doesn't mean she would consistenly beat them.

I love Mao, but she wasn't ripped off. She is a great skater and will hopefully give us years of good performances. Let us enjoy them!

 

[bekalc]

She beat the entire Olympic podium that year -- Arakawa at Cup of China and also Eric Bompard, Cohen at Eric Bompard, and Slutskaya at the Grand Prix final. She also beat the world champion, Meissner, at Eric Bompard. None of the world podium (Meissner, Suguri, Cohen) made the Grand Prix final, which Mao won.

The only one Mao didn't beat was Suguri, who won the Japanese National Championship to Mao's second. Mao did not face Suguri in international competition.

It was a good year for Ms. Asada!

Perhaps, But...Mao also lost to Yu-na Kim at Junior Worlds. So if Mao was ripped of you could argue that Yu-na was ripped off too.

Personally, one could argue that a lot of skaters have been ripped of by the age rules, and a lot of talent skaters have had to sit out a year Meissner, Cohen, Ando etc...Mirai and Caroline are going to sit out too. So to single out just Mao isn't fair.

Back then, I felt that it would have been wrong to change the rules after the Grand Prix Final anyways. Because Korea thinking that Yu-na couldn't go, send another skater to the qualifer, and had no Olympic spot. So to change the rules would have punished Yu-na.

I do though feel bad for Yu-na and Mao becuase they were 3 months to shy. However, who knows what would have happened if both girls would have gone. It's not out of the realm of possibilty, especially considering that the winner only had 5 triples, that one of those girls could have won, and then pulled a Tara. So at least the ISU gets ot keep their young talent.