I would not say Russian audience have deeper understanding of FS. Russian OG audience (Sochi) is especially rude towards all skaters that is not Russian. It is the worst figure skating OG audience in recent memories (Russian non-OG figure skating audience may be different ). I think the best figure skating audience is Japanese and Canadians.
Nathan Chen
- Thread starter matmuh
- Start date
Nathan's SP sit spin get level 3 at SA, GPF and OG except for COR, I could not figure it out why, maybe is his second sit position(after hop) is not low enough?? but it looked to me, he did okay with the minimal 2 revolutions (he kept it low enough for 2 rev).
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2018
Totally agree on the Canadian audience. About Russia, I wouldn't equate the OM audience with the real FS audience. Most OM audience are there to root for their country to win gold.
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2018
Oh... I never looked at Nathan's spins GOEs and your post made me sad because I always thought they were GREAT and I had no doubt they got high GOEs! But it's not like that??
I remember watching him live this season, his scratch spin made me said "Oh my!" out loud because it was SO FAST it was impossible! I love his "trademark" sit spin where he bends aside (which is on the Coca-Cola bottle, yeah), a veeery beautiful position!
And his half-biellmann is excellent, too!
You can NEVER tell his spins are slow, never. Also, literally yesterday I thought how well-centered his spins are, lol.
All in all, I can't explain why his spins GOEs are low. Because until this moment I thought they had to be very high, lol. The only thing I can think is that judges are npt yet ready to call him a good well-balanced skater and they're basically lowering his GOEs.
(For example you can watch Shoma Uno's protocols. I remember that his final spin in the FS always looks like twizzle, lol, cause Shoma always loses his center. No wonder if it's GOE +2 'cause Shoma is considered "a well-balanced" skater
)
Speaking of audience, one of the worst moment of the year for me was the very cold atmosphere after Nathan LP at Rostelecom. I know that many people were here for other skaters, still it was a bit sad that there wasn't a better appreciation for him because he took the gold from Yuzuru (I'm one of those who likes when all the skaters - and especially the low ranked - receive some love from the audience). Bittersweet moment to see, I would have been hurt if I were him...
BTW: happy that the thread reached the 200 pages! I always find a bit weird that in a North-American forum, North American skaters seems to have less fans than foreign ones...
BTW: happy that the thread reached the 200 pages! I always find a bit weird that in a North-American forum, North American skaters seems to have less fans than foreign ones...
- Joined
- Feb 21, 2018
That's sad. Hopefully he gains more fan support over time. Us Nathan fans also need to show up to support him. If he indeed goes to the Beijing OM, I will definitely go. Near term, go to SOI when it comes to my town in May.
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2018
Cold? I remember myself crying so loud that I've lost my voice
Everything around was blurry because of tears. My hands were shaking and I couldn't feel my feet 'cause they were weak. I was crying cruying crying when I realised he was 1st overall (because for the 1st time I thought he was 2nd but it wasn't the final result). I was congratulated by a girl next to me 'cause she saw me in such an emotional state she said she also rooted for him and gave me a high five.Yes, at first I was there for Hanyu. But in those 2 days I fell for Nathan.
(and some other skaters, too).
And Nathan was the reason I decided to not go back home, stay in Moscow and buy Gala tickets. My places were right above the K&C, oh Lord :')... but that's another story.
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2003
Just curious, which competition did you see him live?Oh... I never looked at Nathan's spins GOEs and your post made me sad because I always thought they were GREAT and I had no doubt they got high GOEs! But it's not like that??
I remember watching him live this season, his scratch spin made me said "Oh my!" out loud because it was SO FAST it was impossible! I love his "trademark" sit spin where he bends aside (which is on the Coca-Cola bottle, yeah), a veeery beautiful position!
And his half-biellmann is excellent, too!
You can NEVER tell his spins are slow, never. Also, literally yesterday I thought how well-centered his spins are, lol.
All in all, I can't explain why his spins GOEs are low. Because until this moment I thought they had to be very high, lol. The only thing I can think is that judges are npt yet ready to call him a good well-balanced skater and they're basically lowering his GOEs.
(For example you can watch Shoma Uno's protocols. I remember that his final spin in the FS always looks like twizzle, lol, cause Shoma always loses his center. No wonder if it's GOE +2 'cause Shoma is considered "a well-balanced" skater
Cold? I remember myself crying so loud that I've lost my voice
Yes, at first I was there for Hanyu. But in those 2 days I fell for Nathan.
(and some other skaters, too).
And Nathan was the reason I decided to not go back home, stay in Moscow and buy Gala tickets. My places were right above the K&C, oh Lord :')... but that's another story.
It's nice to hear; from what I gathered from various threads here the impression between TV and people live in the ice rink were pretty dissimilar so I'm happy to hear he got support!
ETA: congratulations @shine for the 3000 message in the thread!
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
Can someone knowledgeable explain to me why Nathan gets such low GOE for his spins? Because I'm not that much into spins, so I'm not good at judging their quality, unless they are done by someone who obviously excels at them, like Jason Brown for instance.
I mean, I can see that Nathan doesn't have the fastest spins out there, but I don't think they are slow either.
And sometimes they are not that well-centered, but neither are the spins of other top contenders and they still end up with better GOE, so unless it's biased judging...?(I mean, I've seen some spins that travelled a LOT, and they still got like +2s or even some +3s...)
His positions look beautiful to me, even though he's not doing anything requiring above average flexibility, but it all looks nice, supple and stretched... and I particularly love that his skating leg, during his camel spins, is always straight and not bend in the knee, which I think looks super ugly and will ruin any camel spin for me (and I see many men have that kind of bend knee... :noshake
His combo spin usually gets high GOE, but not his camel and sit, so what makes his combo better than the other two?
The only obvious flaw I can see is the change of foot by jump in his camel, which isn't very high, looks really untidy and throws him off a lot (and if it's so problematic, why doesn't he choose another level feature? Maybe he could pull off a donut spin, even if it's not a nice round one...?)
Just speaking about his Olympic FS:
His Camel spin wasn't too fast, as compared to his other spins here. And not the best match to the music.
His Flying entry made him travel a bit.
His sideways upright position is kind of weak (he seems to have lost control at the end), and he traveled a little at the end.
He's become good at spins, good looking positions, good use of arms for me.
I wouldn't compare him to others, because I do think some like Javi are overscored (he's pretty inflexible), and Shoma sometimes too.
Oh... I never looked at Nathan's spins GOEs and your post made me sad because I always thought they were GREAT and I had no doubt they got high GOEs! But it's not like that??
I remember watching him live this season, his scratch spin made me said "Oh my!" out loud because it was SO FAST it was impossible! I love his "trademark" sit spin where he bends aside (which is on the Coca-Cola bottle, yeah), a veeery beautiful position!
And his half-biellmann is excellent, too!
You can NEVER tell his spins are slow, never. Also, literally yesterday I thought how well-centered his spins are, lol.
All in all, I can't explain why his spins GOEs are low. Because until this moment I thought they had to be very high, lol. The only thing I can think is that judges are npt yet ready to call him a good well-balanced skater and they're basically lowering his GOEs.
(For example you can watch Shoma Uno's protocols. I remember that his final spin in the FS always looks like twizzle, lol, cause Shoma always loses his center. No wonder if it's GOE +2 'cause Shoma is considered "a well-balanced" skater
Ha, I'm sorry!
Well, I can see that there's some room for improvement, like the speed on some of his slower spin positions, and he could maybe match it to the music in a more obvious way... it's just that when I watch others that receive much higher GOE on their spins... I just don't see how theirs are so much better and in what way they fulfill more bullets for +GOE...? Everyone has positions that look a bit wonky to me, or travel somewhat...
As I said, I'm really not good at judging spins, so maybe this is just another case of me liking something because it looks aesthetic to me, but technically there are weaknesses that I don't spot...
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2018
Rostelecom Cup.Just curious, which competition did you see him live?
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
Well, I can see that there's some room for improvement, like the speed on some of his slower spin positions, and he could maybe match it to the music in a more obvious way... it's just that when I watch others that receive much higher GOE on their spins... I just don't see how theirs are so much better and in what way they fulfill more bullets for +GOE...? Everyone has positions that look a bit wonky to me, or travel somewhat...
I agree others have weaknesses that are overlooked. Here he was only in the second group, so maybe that also had something to do with it. For what it's worth, I think Nathan got reasonable GOEs, where others might have been overscored.
Yes, but I'm not just talking about the olympics, but the past two seasons, comparing the top men to each other... and the judging on spins is the one thing that is the most cryptic to me.
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
Yes, but I'm not just talking about the olympics, but the past two seasons, comparing the top men to each other... and the judging on spins is the one thing that is the most cryptic to me.
Hmm, I don't remember the GOEs all season. I think scoring close to 1.00 for Nathan is reasonable, as the maximum on a spin is 1.50.
For the previous season, I'm not sure. I wasn't following him, but I remember he used to have a problem of getting the levels in, and he needed work on them, so I think maybe he was slower and lacked control.
Comparing to Yuzuru and Shoma, I think Nathan needs to match to the music more. Shoma travels more, but I think he has better positions? But his arm movements in his final spin are really well-matched to the music.
Assigning GOEs is pretty cryptic in general, whether for jumps or for spins or for steps.
- Joined
- Jun 2, 2014
(For example you can watch Shoma Uno's protocols. I remember that his final spin in the FS always looks like twizzle, lol, cause Shoma always loses his center. No wonder if it's GOE +2 'cause Shoma is considered "a well-balanced" skater
I would tend to disagree with you on Shoma's spins. https://www.instagram.com/p/BONa7FxA4LK/?taken-by=skatingprotocol And that's one of many good ones...But, since this is Nathan's thread -- just wanted to say how envious I am that you were able to see him at Rostelecom. That was a really awesome event (even on TV!). I can only imagine how good it was in person.
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
^^Oh, yeah, Shoma's really fast, too. So that's one thing Nathan might need to improve on. But he's still a lot better than he was.
That's what I would think too, but in reality he's usually more in between 0.40 - 0.80 I think... he only ever comes close to 1.00 with his combo spins, and even that is not always the case.
What do you mean by better positions?
- Joined
- Dec 9, 2017
Well, just looking at the video Arriba627 posted, his upright position seems well extended with the arms, more control. If you see Nathan's sideways upright, it kind of just flops. https://youtu.be/VSUM4J465AQ?t=4m25s
Just compare their combination spins. Shoma's looks tighter to me, even in the shapes he creates.
- Joined
- Jul 27, 2003
I’m curious, have you ever seen Nathan as a junior? If you have I don’t think you would say he is “a lot better than he was”. He was actually a better spinner in his younger days, especially on the camel, with one of the best stretched out positions I’ve seen. I also think he was a bit better last season.
Also which upright position does he just “flop”? Are you talking about the one where he extends the free leg and holds it with one hand? Also, in the video posted I didn’t see a position where Shoma does a spin like what Nathan does, so how are we comparing?
Similar threads
