Repeating Programs - Pros and Cons

[4everchan]

Well...it is Chan's last season...

I don't think that has an incidence.... many skaters are planning to retire and are reusing and vice versa... Chan's reasoning was that he wanted to minimize his involvement in his programs this year and he let his team make the choices... he felt he was too invested in Sochi with the programs and that stressed him out.

 

[Sorrento]

What we saw in 2015-2016 from Yuzuru Hanyu was SEIMEI 1.0. This season he wil rewamp it. It will be a different program with a new upgraded BV, heavily packed 2nd half (all his combos in a second half, mind you, who else can do that?), new music cuts and most probably a new costume. I honestly hope he can surpasse image of an absolute masterpiece he had created two seasons ago. That's the aim- conquer what he had achieved before.

I can't agree on the statement that a clean tech performance make a program or a skater legendary. Like, seriously, Vancouver was not legendary, at all.

 

[4everchan]

What we saw in 2015-2016 from Yuzuru Hanyu was SEIMEI 1.0. This season he wil rewamp it. It will be a different program with a new upgraded BV, heavily packed 2nd half (all his combos in a second half, mind you, who else can do that?), new music cuts and most probably a new costume. I honestly hope he can surpasse image of an absolute masterpiece he had created two seasons ago. That's the aim- conquer what he had achieved before.

I can't agree on the statement that a clean tech performance make a program or a skater legendary. Like, seriously, Vancouver was not legendary, at all.

yuna was legendary so were scott and tessa... and shen and zhao

the point i am making is that IT WILL NEED TO BE CLEAN.. to be legendary... nothing less.... i am not saying that ALL CLEAN programs will become iconic... but i can see with the current top 5 or 6 men that it could be the case this year... if one of them has a great clean and emotional skate... javi within his style, shoma with another revamp that is powerful and charged with emotion, patrick with hallelujah and being at 3rd olympics after all of what he has been through to get back in the quad race he started by being so consistent with his 4t and being a complete skater, nathan and boyang with their big quad lutz could also have great programs and we know they have the flair and youth on their side... so any of these men can bring the crowd down with a clean and exciting performance... this is not vancouver... nor torino... just remember 4cc... it went crazy because of the quality of the top contenders... the men contest will be different here...

YMMV

 

[Sorrento]

We are talking about Men's field, aren't we. Vancouver was not about those ladies and gents at all...
Now, Shoma... His quads are far from gold standard that could be mentioned in a book. Olympics should be about quality, not a so-so technique.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

We are talking about Men's field, aren't we. Vancouver was not about those ladies and gents at all...
Now, Shoma... His quads are far from gold standard that could be mentioned in a book. Olympics should be about quality, not a so-so technique.

Is Shoma repeating programs this season too. Oh lawdy :shocked:

 

[4everchan]

We are talking about Men's field, aren't we. Vancouver was not about those ladies and gents at all...
Now, Shoma... His quads are far from gold standard that could be mentioned in a book. Olympics should be about quality, not a so-so technique.

well the thread was about everyone... but now it seems it's just about Seimei

 

[MaiKatze]

Is Shoma repeating programs this season too. Oh lawdy :shocked:

Shoma has a new SP, to Vivaldi's Winter (Four Season) and kind of repeats Turandot from his debut season. Kind of, because it's a different music and different choreography and layout. Here is a very early version from THE ICE.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

well the thread was about everyone... but now it seems it's just about Seimei

Everyone repeating programs and everyone competing against people who are repeating programs. Really...what's the difference.

 

[4everchan]

Everyone repeating programs and everyone competing against people who are repeating programs. Really...what's the difference.

what? i think it's too late... my brain didn't get that LOL...

Patrick has 2 new programs who would have thought ?

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Late??? Isn't it early

 

[Sorrento]

Everyone repeating programs and everyone competing against people who are repeating programs. Really...what's the difference.

Let the Vintage Games begin!

 

[OS]

Seimei is like a pair of old comfortable shoes for a sport that is becoming a jump drill, a game of points crunching probabilities. I was never a fan of the program, but I totally understand the ease the pressure aspect. Seimei is musically and rhythmically (first 2/3rd) giving enough for mistakes and improv adjustments to focus on jumps and slow build up which helps those want to manage their stamina better. PCS has become irrelevant since it rarely reflects what the skater did on the day, or actual artistic values.

Figure skaters should define their programs, and not let programs defining them for points scoring purposes. Hanyu better do something original and challenging in his short for balance.

If I am the judge, as a general rule of thumb I would mark PCS -5, -8 just based on repeated programs. Otherwise, skaters gain unfair advantages in TES: GOEs, and favourable established benchmarking already, only fair. Otherwise it is unfair for others who put in the effort of learning new choreography every season, take risks with their choices, new routines etc.. Otherwise anyone can just bring their greatest hit, stick with it for 3 seasons, just focus on clean clean rotate and be done with it.

 

[MaiKatze]

Seimei is like a pair of old comfortable shoes for a sport that is becoming a jump drill, a game of points crunching probabilities. I was never a fan of the program, but I totally understand the ease the pressure aspect.

Figure skaters should define their programs, and not let programs defining them for point scoring purposes. Seimei is giving enough for mistakes and improv adjustment to focus on jumps through the performance. PCS has become irrelevant since it rarely reflects what the skater did on the day, or actual artistic values.

Hanyu better does something original and challenging in his short for balance.

If I am the judge, as a general rule of thumb I would mark PCS -5, -8 just based on repeat programs. Otherwise, skaters gain unfair advantages in TES: GOEs, and favourable established benchmarking already, only fair. Otherwise it is unfair for others who put in the effort of learning new choreography every season, take risks with their choices, new routines etc.. Otherwise anyone can just bring their greatest hit, stick with it for 3 seasons, just focus on clean clean rotate and just be done with it.

Yuzuru's already announced that he's doing his Chopin SP for the third time. Which, imho, is the real disappointment.

 

[OS]

Yuzuru's already announced that he's doing his Chopin SP for the third time. Which, imho, is the real disappointment.

Wait, he is doing Seimei AND Chopin, both repeateded programs?! Whaaa.... sorry i havn't been following.

Well..I guess the jumps are going to be amazing!!


The only good thing I can say about it is... well, at least it is not POTO!
The other bad thing I can say about it is ... well, if it is going to be a repeat! Why can't it be Romeo and Juliet!!!? Waaaaaaa ... :sad21:

 

[MaiKatze]

Wait, he is doing Seimei AND Chopin, both repeateded programs?! Whaaa.... sorry i havn't been following.

Well..I guess the jumps are going to be amazing!!

I guess consistency and amazing jumps are the focus. And technically it's a threepeat for Chopin.

 

[liv]

I was ok with Chopin being repeated because I thought it meant he wanted a reliable sp because there was a new long program. Now that we know it is a repeat of Seimei, I am happy about that, but much more disappointed with the sp repeat. I understand all the reasons, but i still cannot help but feel disappointment. If he brought out his 4lutz, then it might make it better for me... I really wanted to see a new buttle sp from him.

 

[rugbyfan]

I also hadn't been following but I really wish he weren't repeating both. I want a store of Yuzuru's programs to look back to in the future and now I am going to be deprived of that. I rarely watch more than one version of the same program. Next year may become his best versions and may take over others in my back catalogue but that is a different thing. I think that is one of my big problems with repeating - I can see skater's reasons for it, but I feel deprived as a viewer if they have already done it really well.

 

[Sorrento]

We say that figure skating is not fine art. And then why on earth people get offended by the fact that skaters reuse their music? Why?

Let's talk about Top Men's field- are they all great dancers? No. Don't they all have the same tricks and more or less same jump content and the same jump and elements layout that they use every season, even the step sequences? Do they differ visually in the way they move or present themselves to the audience and the judges every season at the top field? No. Most of us can see their new program and say- yeah, it's the same old Patrick or same old Yuzu that I know and love. So why there's such a noise on not learning the new choreo? What is new choreo exactly? What is new in it except- in oh so many cases- just the music itself?

 

[ranran]

We say that figure skating is not fine art. And then why on earth people get offended by the fact that skaters reuse their music? Why?

Let's talk about Top Men's field- are they all great dancers? No. Don't they all have the same tricks and more or less same jump content and the same jump and elements layout that they use every season, even the step sequences? Do they differ visually in the way they move or present themselves to the audience and the judges every season at the top field? No. Most of us can see their new program and say- yeah, it's the same old Patrick or same old Yuzu that I know and love. So why there's such a noise on not learning the new choreo? What is new choreo exactly? What is new in it except- in oh so many cases- just the music itself?

I think people wanted to be entertain~ you know it's boring hearing the same music. I will be disappointed if he repeat Romeo and Juliet 2.0 because that version is not a good track but he chose to repeat Seimei which is a good track that I don't mind repeat over and over again. Back in Sochi, I don't even noticed Patrick repeat his program for his SP because it felt new and the emotion watching it during the games is different as well.

 

[ranran]

Competitive figure skating is about winning. Exhibitions and ice shows are about entertaining the crowd. Probably 98% of the global audience who tunes in wouldn't have seen the program performed 10 times before.

And I remember during last Olympic, on twitter people who watch once in 4 years said things like "Oh did she use the same music from the team event last week? That's boring" or "Wait is he using the same music as last week? Why is he wearing the same costume?!" Apparently according to logic skaters should change every time the perform... WOAH imagine the work need to be done!