Should JSF push Marin Honda as No.1?

[ioanna]

ETA: Extroverted, give-it-your-all performances win OGM in the ladies discipline. Skating safe or skating tentative does not.

This is subjective; I wouldn't call Satoko's skating tentative. I would call it precise; that's her personality and it reflects in her skating. Besides, "cool beauty" Shizuka Arakawa didn't have to be extroverted to win the OGM.

Anyway I don't see any Japanese lady winning the Olympics, neither Satoko nor Marin. I think the favorite is well established.

 

[andromache]

This is subjective; I wouldn't call Satoko's skating tentative. I would call it precise; that's her personality and it reflects in her skating. Besides, "cool beauty" Shizuka Arakawa didn't have to be extroverted to win the OGM.

Anyway I don't see any Japanese lady winning the Olympics, neither Satoko nor Marin. I think the favorite is well established.

I figured this went without saying...but Shizuka was the only one to skate clean. She would have lost to a clean Sasha or Irina. It's a very different situation than comparing skaters who skate clean, or at least skate with similar mistakes (Oksana versus Nancy, for example.)

 

[shiroKJ]

It's all that has to be said, basically. :thumbsup:

How many top skaters (Russians, Canadians, Americans, Caro?) have to mess up for Satoko to win?
3,4,5? How likely is it? Close to impossible.
Marin has the potential to win it by herself or with mistakes from 1-2 skaters.

 

[ioanna]

I figured this went without saying...but Shizuka was the only one to skate clean. She would have lost to a clean Sasha or Irina. It's a very different situation than comparing skaters who skate clean, or at least skate with similar mistakes (Oksana versus Nancy, for example.)

The scores after the SP were pretty tight though, and Shizuka would have probably stayed on the podium anyway. Just making the podium is the most I can expect from the Japanese girls in 2018... of course, things can change.

 

[Ice Dance]

JSF doesn't have to push Marin, her own coach Mie Hamada is pushing her by admitting publicly she is her most talented student (over Miyahara and Kihira).

It's not the most talented athlete who wins. It's the best competitor.

And often athletes become better competitors when their Federations, the press, and the public do not push them into the spotlight. But, rather, when those athletes earn that place via competition. Some athletes do that early. Others later. I like Marin. She had a gradual climb within her season last year, and I wish her the best at Junior Worlds.

I love Yuna Shiraiwa as well. She has loads of difficulty and a wonderful, emotive personality on the ice.

I'm very impressed with Mai. She was lovely last season, but missed out on qualifying for Senior Nationals and, therefore, Junior Worlds. But she came forward great guns on the Senior GP. Then medaled at her first Senior Nationals.

And Higuchi's jumps are incredible.

Lots of great talent among the Japanese ladies. I think the tougher the field, the better they will all be in the long run.

 

[Daniel1998]

I agree that Honda has the "it" factor.
However, the "it" factor does not guarantee an Olympic gold medal. While I think it is improbable that Satoko will win gold at Pyeongchang, since it means 2-3 Russians have to screw up, I don't think Honda has the consistency yet to cement herself as a gold medal favourite.
I think Honda's going to peak around 2022, not 2018, and by then I'm sure her PCS will be very high anyway, so there's no real reason to "push" Marin right now (or at all, for that matter).

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Lol - no. Marin has potential but JSF would be crazy to push her. Her year will be 2022. She is quite elegant but there is still a lot to be desired in her skating IMO.

Her JGP performances weren't exactly consistent either.

Also, I'm rather perplexed by the Zagitova and Honda for OGM 2018 threads. Like, people, it's a single nationals competition (yes JGPF in Zagitova's case)... Which they didn't even win (Honda coming 4TH at that). And people are thinking they'll swoop in to win Olympic gold without a single senior international competition. Hah, well, stranger things have happened.

 

[topaz emerald]

For the upcoming Olympic year, I think JSF would be wise to push Marin as Japan's no.1 skater over Satoko.
Marin really has the special factor that is required to win the OGM, Satoko's jumps are just too small and lackluster....it would be wise to advocate for higher PCS for Marin as she is probably the best bet for Japan for the OGM.
If they stick with Satoko, they will only get a silver/bronze at best.

What is everyone's opinion on Marin?

I like Marin, but I think the girl with the Cinderella program should be pushed. Maybe she's too young...I forgot her name. Just because I think her jumps are stronger. I like Marin, but she's starting to remind me of Grace Gold, they pop their jumps a lot.

 

[Interspectator]

Pushed? All the ladies skaters in the top 6 this Nationals were very good. There isn't a strong reason for any one of them to be pushed harder than others to the front of the line unless they can show solid international competitions. So far this year, it's been Satoko with Wakaba and Mai behind her, and the rest about even after that. The juniors are very promising as well. -They were the next three in the nationals standings, Marin, Yuna S. and Kaori (with Rika H. also in 5th place)

So, I think whoever has the strongest showings in competition should be given air-time. Satoko-Wakaba-Mai.
There's no good reason to hype juniors to the edge of nervous breakdowns which is what seems to happen to Marin when she goes in as a favorite. Let her develop her considerable talents without the hype so she can get her nerves under control.

 

[topaz emerald]

Lol - no. Marin has potential but JSF would be crazy to push her. Her year will be 2022. She is quite elegant but there is still a lot to be desired in her skating IMO.

Her JGP performances weren't exactly consistent either.

Also, I'm rather perplexed by the Zagitova and Honda for OGM 2018 threads. Like, people, it's a single nationals competition (yes JGPF in Zagitova's case)... Which they didn't even win (Honda coming 4TH at that). And people are thinking they'll swoop in to win Olympic gold without a single senior international competition. Hah, well, stranger things have happened.

In Zagitova's case, I think many are basing her OGM win on the fact that she backloads her jumps, does tanoes. But this girl lacks tremendous grace and polish....I actually do not find her skating appealing at at all...

Marin is lovely, but I think nerves get to her. And her jumps are getting to look more and more slanted, not enough height. If Japanese Fed don't push her, maybe she will do well at Olympics, if she even qualifies, sorry, don't know how old she is.... Just saying a trick is to keep the pressure off her. But now that I've gotten a chance to look at all the Japanese girls, I like Mai Mihara...I think they should push her instead. I didn't like her at first, but I change my mind now, haha.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pAxqp-ehdOs&t=46s

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Mai is probably my fave as well. Lovely 3Z+3T and great presentation. Wakaba strikes me as "solid" but I don't find her skating quite special yet - the potential is there. Miyahara should definitely still be the front runner on paper and Marin is literally the newcomer on the scene and not quite the spoiler just yet. She doesn't even do the hardest difficulty (yet) compared to the other top Japanese skaters who all do 3Z+3T reliably. Although her PCS should be credited because I still think she's lovely - just not Olympic champion material at the moment or even within 1 year.

 

[christinaskater]

Naturally the one with the possibility to be one of the best is
Marin HONDA - so much beauty , charisma , effervescent personality and musicality .

For me #1 is Satoko especially this season
I found her a bit stoic before , but her Grand Prix final performance brought tears to my eyes
She was so artistic and musical. She reminded me of Michelle Kwan.
She help captive the whole crowd with her story and presence.
Satoko may not be tall and she may not be the most beautiful but she is solid and has the mentality
Of a champion. Her jumps are also getting bigger.
Satoko works so hard and she has become truly phenomenal

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

If any Japanese has the potential to transform into a Kwan it's Mihara. She was giving me shades of Kwan at her first Worlds (maybe it's the ponytail, lol). But Satoko still has the greatest maturity and elegance.

 

[MaiKatze]

I think JSF should push whoever has a reliable 3A. It's the only jump that can put you ahead in a field that's stagnating technically.

 

[Ares]

Why should JSF push Marin or anyone for that matter? Because she's your fave? I can't at how overhyped Miss Honda is by her worshippers on this forum. Among younger Japanese skaters the biggest potential I see in Wakaba Higuchi.

 

[TheCzar]

To be honest, I think JSF will and should push for Mao Asada's heir. Whoever that may be. Unfortunately, none of the current ladies are as prodigious technically as Asada was at 15. However, Marin is the one who stands out the most. Technically she is fine, but its that star quality that will see her through. She draws the crowd, she's cute, and if she's consistent then she's the whole package really. Wakaba reminds me of Miki Ando- talented but veers on clunky and tacky, Mai is again talented but very plain. Great story but very....regular. Mai and Satoko are actually not too dissimilar is that sense. Foot perfect, consistent and reliable to get the spots- but not enough to market either one as the next big star of Japanese lady figure skating. And hasn't it started already? It is Marin who got an Japan Airlines push wasn't it?

In any case, It'll be Marin if she survives puberty. Plus- she's young enough to be hot on the heels of the new Russian fleet.

 

[ioanna]

Unfortunately, none of the current ladies are as prodigious technically as Asada was at 15. However, Marin is the one who stands out the most.

Then you don't know much about the current ladies. If by prodigious technically you mean jumping the 3A then none of the ladies worldwide aren't as prodigious technically. However what the current ladies have and Mao didn't is the 3Lz-3T combination. With the exception of (surprise) Marin, the other girls Satoko, Wakaba, Mai, Yuna, all have this combination. Yuna can jump both the 3Lz-3T and 3F-3T. Wakaba can jump two 3Lz-3T combinations in her FS, one in the first half and one in the second half. Wakaba also revealed in an interview that there are 3 or 4 ladies jumping the 3A in practice, herself included. The depth of the Japanese ladies has never been so impressive IMO and it's not right to dismiss them because they're not "Mao Asada's heir".

As for Marin getting JAL sponsorship and so on, the whole Honda family is a brand. She is managed by Oscar Promotion, a huge talent agency which deals with the entertainment industry. Her sisters Miyu (also an actress) and Sara also belong to the same agency. So do famous Japanese actresses like Aya Ueto, Emi Takei, Ayame Gouriki. Marin doesn't need JSF to push her, her management company does it as a job. It's a privilege her team mates don't have.

 

[Eclair]

I don't think JSF or any federation should push anyone to be their no. 1. They have to earn it and fight for it in a fair competition. The skater who turns out on top will be the skater most reliable and proficient. Look at what hype can do with a young girl e.g. Gracie. Though tremendously talented, she turned out to be a headache and I think partly because USFS never gave her the vibe that she can't afford to be a head case. She is afraid of competition and "disappointing" everyone, because she was hyped as the best skater since Michelle. I wish for Marin to have the support of her federation, yes, but not the hype. Just as Wakaba, Mai and the other upcoming skaters should feel that their federation is supporting them.

 

[Imagine]

No. I am a fan of Marin and decidedly NOT a fan of Satoko, but whatever "push" Satoko has received as of late, she has earned. I find that the victory can only be sweeter if Marin gives her all and makes that magical moment a reality, rather than getting pushed into it.

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

I think the JSF has to be fully behind Satoko, as long as she's skating well. She has competed outstandingly for three seasons and has shown the ability to take advantage of others' mistakes to earn high placements. She has topped 200 internationally at least 6 times, so she is very capable of being the leader of the Japanese ladies at the moment.