The Tutberidze Effect

[colormyworld240]

And I disagree with pretty much your whole post but just one point - I don't see where Flanker was saying that Daria is on the level of Alina or Alena, we probably read a different post.

You have to read the entire conversation. My original comment was about the biggest "miraculous" improvements of skaters who moved to Eteri. I mentioned Alina and Alena, and flanker said he'd add Daria to the list. I replied to flanker disagreeing because the level of improvement was less than the former two.

 

[colormyworld240]

It is not exact comparison, because the scoring system has changed, but if you look at the scores for orientation, I don't think it's that different if we compare Daria and Aliona's first junior season at international events.

event/Aliona/Daria
1st JGP/197.91/194.40
2nd JGP/192.15/197.19
JGPF/204.58/200.37
WJC/207.39/207.94

As for the "constant winning", it's relative, because the competitors became much stronger. Alysa and the korean girls were much stronger rivals than Aliona/Sasha met (Rika wasn't strong enough in her 2nd junior season). And I repeat, it's just for orientation. As Azikin has mentioned, my point wasn't direct comparison, but the improvement of Daria's skating, incl. consistency, where she at the end defeated everyone (but Kamila) who previously defeated her.

Whether someone personally enjoys particular skater's skating it's of course a different question.

While constant winning is relative, I would say scores are as well (across competitions and definitely across multiple seasons). But just looking at the skates, Daria had 1 clean international competition last season IIRC, where as Alina and Alena had many (they each had 1 competition where they made major errors, 2 for Alina if you count youth olympic festival but Alena and Daria didn't compete there). They also did that while doing a layout that was more difficult than what Daria is doing now (and yes we have to consider the backloading rule changes too). This is regardless of who they were competing against or how they were judged.

 

[Amei]

I still think Sasha is one of the favorites for gold in the next Winter Olympics. If she can master doing three or four quads in the free skate cleanly she wins. I hope her new coaches play it smart and don't start her out with five quads with her new free skate of Romeo and Juliet. I would start with three witches what TT really wanted and then grow it to four and then that could make her virtually unbeatable.

I would be a bit surprised if they stay at 3 or 4 quads for Trusova, she said that was the disagreement that led to her leaving Eteri, they were wanting her to cut down on the quads and go clean and that's not what she wanted.

I think it's hard to say she isn't a favorite for the Olympics but at the same time as of right now from what we have seen of her - she's all quads if those don't work and she falls or even if she pops them into triples or doubles like she did last season, she doesn't have the spins or the second score to compensate like Shcherbakova, Valieva and Kostornaia.

Good luck to the girls because they're such great credits for their sport. Tough breaks for TT because if the pandemic never happened both would probably still be there. Certainly Aliona would be because she never would have lost her jumps. Now TT will not dominate like they did this past season because the Dynasty is broken. But that's Sports and that's life.

I have my doubts based on what Trusova has said that she would have stuck with Eteri regardless of what happened at Worlds; they were pushing back on what she wanted to do. I think it's a little premature to say Eteri's dynasty is over, as others have said historically skaters that left Eteri have not matched the success they had with Eteri as their coach - I get the Kostornaia is leaving after her peak season and neither skater is injured. Eteri still has plenty of skaters that can win the top competitions. As of right now, yes the constant 'sweep' of gold for her skaters at every competition and sweep of podiums might be over, but I don't think their dominance/dynasty is over because a couple of skaters left.

 

[flanker]

While constant winning is relative, I would say scores are as well (across competitions and definitely across multiple seasons). But just looking at the skates, Daria had 1 clean international competition last season IIRC, where as Alina and Alena had many (they each had 1 competition where they made major errors, 2 for Alina if you count youth olympic festival but Alena and Daria didn't compete there). They also did that while doing a layout that was more difficult than what Daria is doing now (and yes we have to consider the backloading rule changes too). This is regardless of who they were competing against or how they were judged.

It can be tricky to focus only on international competitions, russian domestic competitions, esp. (junior) nationals are harder than JGP and on the same level as junior worlds, so Daria had clean junior worlds but also clean junior natoionals (and clean spartakiada). Yes, score can be realitive, but then we can take Aliona, who made some serious errors during her 2nd junior season at JGP Ostrava (just a cadet instead of 2A in the SP and a fall in the FS) and still won, mistakes that you couldn't afford the last season.

Yesterday Daria has shown uncertainty, but it was her first performance after about five months worsened by forced hiatus, after some more training it can be different. And what Maiia has shown yesterday shows that you can't predict the further development.

 

[Edwin]

These best go here: Daniil Gleikhengauz answered questions from reporters

 

[Edwin]

Daniil Gleikhengauz being interviewed by Figurist chain of figure skating supplies stores in three parts:





Sergey Dudakov being interviewed too:

 

[Edwin]

New interview with Daniil Gleikhengauz:

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www.gq.ru

"High level sport is not about health", - an interview with the chief choreographer from the team of Eteri Tutberidze

With the programs of Daniil Gleiлhengauz, Alina Zagitova won the Olympics, and Alyona Kostornaya and Aleksandra Trusova set world records.

Modern figure skating is not only quadruple jumps, but also choreographic programs that are remembered. After performing to music from "Schindler's List" at the Sochi Olympics, Yuliya Lipnitskaya made female single skating a national treasure. Delighted with her performance, even Steven Spielberg, the director of the film about a girl in a red coat fleeing from the besieged ghetto, wrote a letter to the skater. This performance was prepared by the team of coach Eteri Tutberidze, based in the Khrustalniy Ice Palace. And since then, this group did not allow themselves choreographic mistakes - thanks to the new director Daniil Gleikhengauz. With his "Black Swan", Alina Zagitova took Gold at the Olympic Games in Korea, and "Anna Karenina" brought Silver to another member of the team - Yevgeniya Medvyedeva. The "Fifth Element" of Gleikhengauz turned Aleksandra Trusova into the "Russian rocket", "Flight of the Soul" allowed Alyona Kostornaya to set a world record in the short program, and "Firebird" helped Anna Shcherbakova defend the title of National Champion of Russia.

- Can you remember 2014, the Khrustalniy Ice Palace? At that moment, when you had not yet worked in Eteri Tutberidze's team, your mother already collaborated with her (Lyudmila Shalashova - former ballerina of the Bolshoi Theater, choreographer)?
-- No, I started working with Eteri Georgievna first, and then, about a year later, when a choreographer was needed for the dry hall, for ballet classes, I suggested my mother. Eteri Georgievna watched her teach, and everyone was satisfied.

- How did you get into "Khrustalniy" yourself?
-- At that time, I had been working as a trainer and choreographer at other skating rinks for several years, doing a show with Ilya Averbukh. And when Eteri turned to Ilya for help, she said she needed a new person for the team, a choreographer, he advised me, gave her my number, and that's how it all started.

- It turns out that Eteri had already seen some of your works, say, in a show or for other athletes?
-- Knowing Eteri Georgievna, I don't think she had time for this. Because, preparations were underway for the Olympics.

- You remember the first program you staged for member of Tutberidze's team?
-- If we take a landmark program, the first that was shown in the big arena was the short program of Adyan Pitkeyev.

​

- And how do you come up with programs fitting for the athlete? How do you choose music, images for this or that skater?
-- Due to the fact that I work with these athletes every day, teach them how to skate and see their abilities, it is easier for me to understand what will suit them and help them to open up. And then I try to offer several options for musical compositions. Or, if I have a ready-made idea and image, I explain everything in detail, show it, and then preparation begins.

- Where is the easiest place to find images? In movies, in music?
-- This is all thanks to the internet. And I have more opportunities than when I myself went to the theater, opera, cinema, concerts and shows. Thanks to the Internet, information is easier to gather. And in really every different source you can find this or that image. An interesting story is the exhibition number of Alina Zagitova, which she skated in tribute to the memory of my mother (Lyudmila Shalashova died on August 29, 2019). I watched a video on YouTube, but then the plot was interrupted by an advertisement, which we all don't like very much, and the track of the band M83 played in this advertisement. I heard it, shazamil, began to listen to it again, and so the idea of a number about a flower and about life appeared.

​

- Last year's program of Alyona Kostornaya - 'flight of the soul during clinical death', as she herself described it - is this also a dedication to your mom?
-- No, Alyona skated this program for two seasons. Eteri and I staged it before everything happened.

- Your group is known all over the world for World and Olympic champions, as well as for the fact that figure skaters from team Tutberidze are already mastering quadruple jumps at a young age. The dominance of these elements - does it interfere with the staging of artistic programs? How to reconcile complex technical elements that require concentration and preparation with a smooth artistic plot?
-- One, two and even three quadruple jumps, if you correctly arrange them in the program, do not greatly affect the programmatic flow of the plot and the choreography. But if you have to put five quads or more, the program will begin to suffer here: because approaches to such difficult jumps require more speed, more preparation time. Because of this, the continuity of the program can be destroyed.

- How often do you recruit new athletes to your team?
-- If we talk about small children, then quite often, more than 3-4 times a year. As for older athletes - from 11 and 12 years old and up, then at any time. But this usually happens at the end of the season when athletes decide to switch from one coach to another. Both from us and to us.

​

- With what do you associate the fact that "Khrustalniy" today has become the world's center of female figure skating?
-- This probably happened after the Sochi Olympics, when Yuliya Lipnitskaya made a splash, and people became interested in figure skating. And since that moment, thanks to the work of the coaching staff, every year we show results of the highest level. Parents see this, understand this, so they come to us for screenings even from other cities.

- What do you pay attention to when watching children? We are talking about 7-8 years of age.
-- This is where the experience and professional view of the coach are at work. We assess the build and proportions of the athlete, we look at the height ...
We require a very high level of coordination. It is clear it will be difficult for tall children to jump quadruples. What else are we looking at? At jump height, muscle softness, stretching, spinning. There are many pieces to complete this puzzle. It is also important for us to understand whether we can help the child to reach the level that, in fact, its parents expect from us. They don't just bring their children to the rink for a skating run. Every parent thinks that his child should become an Olympic Champion. And, in order not to disappoint the parent later, it is important for us to immediately understand whether there is content fit for this purpose. Many people think: we will bring our child to Tutberidze's team, and everything will turn out by itself.

- When you talk about the importance of build and proportions - what exactly are you talking about?
-- The athlete must be in good shape, without excess weight.

- Should an athlete be different from others?
-- Hmm ... Every athlete is different, we don't have clones.

- I am not talking about that. Should the skaters be visually different from each other? Does this rule of the modeling business work in sports?
-- Of course, any person whose appearance brings a smile on your face will find it easier to win over the audience and judges. We see this in the example of rhythmic gymnastics. Just like in figure skating, there are many beautiful girls who become great athletes from a technical point of view.

​

- Is competition in figure skating good for athletes?
-- Of course, this is why we have so many strong athletes. This is generally the problem of many countries: there is no competition and an athlete who skates at a good level, does not feel another is breathing in his back, does not improve; he already knows that he will make it to the World or European Championships.

- How does competition affect the mental health of athletes? Surely this is not much different from any other super-competitive enterprise, where the results of this struggle are apathy, burnout.
-- We all know that it is one thing to participate in sports for your health, and another thing to be part of top sports.
Top Sports is not about health, physical and emotional injuries can happen. But we try to be in constant contact with children, talk, discuss these moments. The important thing is to find the right words, to support, to explain why happened what happened. It is important to always be honest. Not talking like: how wonderful for you to be with us, how unfair is the world. No, if something didn’t work out, there’s a reason for that, something was not properly done, it needs to get better, and results will come.

- And sports psychologists - do they generally work with skaters?
-- Yes, they are, but I cannot say in which schools and groups their services are used on an ongoing basis. An athlete spends most of his life with a coach, and the problems that he experiences are also solved with the same coach.

(c) Вадим Смыслов

 

[[email protected]]

Tutberidze and her school today destroyed the myth cultivated by her "friends". The myth that they are only good with underage pre-puberty girls. 99.56 by Morisi - a 6+ foot tall guy. I remember his first CoR performance when he was still skating for Russia and could not clear 200.

I encountered him a couple of times: at the airport on arrival from Korea, in the line at Luzhniki entrance. He seems like an easy going and modest guy. He was genuinly surprised that some people recognized him and asked an autograph. He gave them with a kind smile.

He had to find his own way in the shadow of the world's best "underage pre-puberty" lady skaters. And I hope that he has found it. I am rooting for him tomorrow. And one more time, kudos to Eteri - she is truly a genius coach!

 

[Edwin]

concluding part of the Figurist series of interviews with Daniil Gleikhengauz and Sergey Dudakov on injuries and the prevention thereof:

 

[Edwin]

Daniil Markovich with have a new interview published in January issue of GQ Magazine.

Provisional title " Blade runner "

LOL, Daniil Markovich commenting "read about the hero I've become" and "It was a new experience, fashion photography"

"How do you like my image?"

 

[Amei]

Tutberidze and her school today destroyed the myth cultivated by her "friends". The myth that they are only good with underage pre-puberty girls. 99.56 by Morisi - a 6+ foot tall guy. I remember his first CoR performance when he was still skating for Russia and could not clear 200.

I encountered him a couple of times: at the airport on arrival from Korea, in the line at Luzhniki entrance. He seems like an easy going and modest guy. He was genuinly surprised that some people recognized him and asked an autograph. He gave them with a kind smile.

He had to find his own way in the shadow of the world's best "underage pre-puberty" lady skaters. And I hope that he has found it. I am rooting for him tomorrow. And one more time, kudos to Eteri - she is truly a genius coach!

While I don't necessarily fall into the hardcore people that demeans Eteri's coaching because she has very little success when it comes to skaters past puberty - there's a difference between boys and girls especially when their bodies transition from child to adult, females are usually curvier after puberty which causes issues with jumps and Eteri's group really has yet to show that they can coach and adjust a female skater's technique for those changes - while everyone wants to tout out Medvedeva and Tursynbayeva as being adults trained by her with success they are 2 skaters that appear to be a thinner body type. Zagitova while not a body type similar to those 2, was having issues with her jumps the last 2 years she competed, was it issues with technique failing or motivation issues is difficult to say.

And the knock with Eteri and boys/men skaters is just that she doesn't have the success like she does with ladies, while Morisi has some shining moments, if you look at his results, he's not exactly a top flight skater like her female skaters are.

 

[Edwin]

Team Tutberidze's Youtube account hacked or attacked in such a way it was precautiously taken down by Youtube.

Like with the other social media accounts connected to Tutberidze and Zagitova, it seems they have enemies with endurance and resources.
Plus, hackers don't work for free, so money is also involved.

Makes you wonder which party has both sufficient hate and money ...

 

[Fried]

If I hate something, it is vaguely worded accusations for fear of making himself vulnerable. Simply unworthy.

 

[flanker]

While I don't necessarily fall into the hardcore people that demeans Eteri's coaching because she has very little success when it comes to skaters past puberty - there's a difference between boys and girls especially when their bodies transition from child to adult, females are usually curvier after puberty which causes issues with jumps and Eteri's group really has yet to show that they can coach and adjust a female skater's technique for those changes - while everyone wants to tout out Medvedeva and Tursynbayeva as being adults trained by her with success they are 2 skaters that appear to be a thinner body type. Zagitova while not a body type similar to those 2, was having issues with her jumps the last 2 years she competed, was it issues with technique failing or motivation issues is difficult to say.

And the knock with Eteri and boys/men skaters is just that she doesn't have the success like she does with ladies, while Morisi has some shining moments, if you

Oh yes you do, with the same old BS.

First, the difference between boys and girls leads through the whole world of russian skating. Still, Morisi has shown good results in the last seasons in comparison with his russian counterparts. Currently two time Rostelecom silver medalist, european bronze medalist (while I would have put him above Danielian there), and generally his build completely crushes the nonsense "Eteri can work only with prepubescent girls". The thing is that the reserve among girls is far more broader in Russia than among boys, the competition is harder. Currently there are potentially only four or five young men in Russia who can potentially achieve higher results than Morisi, so I think that they are doing well. There are at least four (five with Samsonov, whose health problems would have appeared anywhere) very promising boys it Eteri's camp currently, let's see on their progress.

Second. That "adjusting". What the hell. Why people still point this only to Eteri's camp when this is shown everywhere, and not just in Russia. Should I once again remind Tuktik's problems she had for three years and let's not pretend, enven though she returned among the best, she still has those problems on at least the same level Alina had. But you still do like "Alina was having issues with her jumps the last 2 years she competed", while supposing others haven't (and I should remind that Alina suffered from Osgood-Schlatter, while she still won worlds despite local predictions). Selective BS. Not to mention Pogo, Radionova and others, who were never trained by Eteri, but still haters only connect this with Eteri and nobody else. And that's not just Russia, worshipped coaches abroad experienced (and are still experiencing) the same problems with their skaters. It is laughable for instance like everybody admits that what currently happens to Alysa Liu "is natural", while Eteri is bad. Nope. Also it fascinates me how for another instance Lilbet started to be ridiculed for her small build only when she came to Eteri, it wasn't a problem before. That bias is reaching the heavens.