Why figure skating is not a sport (Article)
- Thread starter R.D.
- Start date
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
We all know the OPINION of the poster. It is not fact, it is an opinion. Don't feed it and maybe it will go away.
Joe
Joe
Mathman said:BTW, if you click HERE you can order the CD of all of Anky van Grunsven's horse dancing music. The CD is titled "Anky's music from Atlanta to Athens" and is 60 minutes of all original compositions that she used in her Olympic Kur performances.
Anky van Grunsven and her horses are the Michelle Kwan of dressage
And having seeen Robert Dover's barn, the horses are treated like royalty.
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2005
Riding outfits are actually fairly practical, if hopelessly boring compared to skating dressing (*tactfully ignores Western Pleasure outfits*). Except the dressage hats--expensive and useless if you fall. The show jumpers where helmets (I don't think I've seen anyone lately who hasnt' switched to the not-as-elegant but ASTM-certified helmets) and the eventers wear shock vests, not that it helps a lot if a 1000-pound animal lands on you.
Most of the Olympic riders don't own their horses. The stallions especially are worth a lot of money. In any case riders usually have several horses they campaign, though only one at the Games. I even recall some horses who were obviously corporate sponsored--their names are Spirit of Xerox, Virtual Village Hopes Are High and Virtual Village It's Otto. I'm sure the riders like them, but you can't afford to love any horse to pieces if you're in the sport professionally. It's likely to be sold out from under you, retired, etc. And of course you have multiple mounts. Once in a while a great partnership comes along and a rider and horse have a spectacular connection, like Ian Millar and Big Ben, but even when he was campaigning Big Ben (whom he, or rather his stable as a corporate entity, owned), he still rode other horses. And of course Big Ben's dead now, and he's still in horses.
Racing--there is very, very little sentiment. It is a business and a by-necessity ruthless one. I know some people in the horse world (often farriers and vets) who won't work on thoroughbred racers because the attitude about them disturbs them. I'm of two minds--I love the horses, but I understand that it's a business and you can't afford to keep money-pit losers around. (I'd prefer they be sold off to recretation/sport homes, but sometimes there isn't a place for them.)
I do think horses know when they did something well. I know my horse (he's dead now, too) would actually check to see if people were watching. His race owners said one of his jockeys told them he would actually get distracted before and during a race checking out the spectators. (He was sold off to my first trainer once he was injured. A lot of track people didn't understand why his owners, who were one-horse hobbyists rather than major owners, didn't just race him until he broke down completely and then have him put down, since as a gelding he was worthless retired. That kind of put them off racing in general once they sold him.)
Joesitz is right, btw--AFAIK Equestrian is the only Olympic discipline where men and women compete directly against each other. Horses, too. Mares, stallions, and geldings, too.
Most of the Olympic riders don't own their horses. The stallions especially are worth a lot of money. In any case riders usually have several horses they campaign, though only one at the Games. I even recall some horses who were obviously corporate sponsored--their names are Spirit of Xerox, Virtual Village Hopes Are High and Virtual Village It's Otto. I'm sure the riders like them, but you can't afford to love any horse to pieces if you're in the sport professionally. It's likely to be sold out from under you, retired, etc. And of course you have multiple mounts. Once in a while a great partnership comes along and a rider and horse have a spectacular connection, like Ian Millar and Big Ben, but even when he was campaigning Big Ben (whom he, or rather his stable as a corporate entity, owned), he still rode other horses. And of course Big Ben's dead now, and he's still in horses.
Racing--there is very, very little sentiment. It is a business and a by-necessity ruthless one. I know some people in the horse world (often farriers and vets) who won't work on thoroughbred racers because the attitude about them disturbs them. I'm of two minds--I love the horses, but I understand that it's a business and you can't afford to keep money-pit losers around. (I'd prefer they be sold off to recretation/sport homes, but sometimes there isn't a place for them.)
I do think horses know when they did something well. I know my horse (he's dead now, too) would actually check to see if people were watching. His race owners said one of his jockeys told them he would actually get distracted before and during a race checking out the spectators. (He was sold off to my first trainer once he was injured. A lot of track people didn't understand why his owners, who were one-horse hobbyists rather than major owners, didn't just race him until he broke down completely and then have him put down, since as a gelding he was worthless retired. That kind of put them off racing in general once they sold him.)
Joesitz is right, btw--AFAIK Equestrian is the only Olympic discipline where men and women compete directly against each other. Horses, too. Mares, stallions, and geldings, too.
- Joined
- Mar 19, 2006
I knew what you were...
...talking about before I read a single sentience of the mentioned article.
This is simple!
This "person" would like to gain attention to themselves, 1.
Redefine a definition of a word, not possible, 2.
And forgot about all of the mitigating circumstances of the events he says are sports such as disqualification, sportsmanship, ect.. that are integrated into the "just finish" or "cross the line" events that are also known as sports.
...talking about before I read a single sentience of the mentioned article.
This is simple!
This "person" would like to gain attention to themselves, 1.
Redefine a definition of a word, not possible, 2.
And forgot about all of the mitigating circumstances of the events he says are sports such as disqualification, sportsmanship, ect.. that are integrated into the "just finish" or "cross the line" events that are also known as sports.
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- Joined
- Jan 18, 2006
Red Dog said:I guess by that token chess could also be a sport.
Actually I think it is. Isn't there a World Chess thing every year??
I could swear I've seen it on ESPN-the erm ..sports channel..
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2004
Joesitz said:I also agree with Ant about the sequins and costumes. I think if skaters wore the same attire during a competition, the concentration would be on pure skating and not on some glamour aspect.
I think too, that many posters here would not want that. They like the fashion show which, imo, is the main reason for some people not to consider it a sport.
Can you imagine those Divers in assorted bathing togs.?
Joe
I say put the big macho "male" sports people in tutus and have them manage to concentrate through it and still do well, nopw that would show skill and strength of character!!!!
That should presented to all writers who think figure skating needs to be butched up!!
Ant
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2004
Mathman said:Yeah, that's what I'm talking about, the Musical Freestyle.
Sort of like how music and costumes make the sport of figure skating fun and accessible to non-skaters and the general public.
Obviously, equestrian events would be "more like real sports" if the horses didn't dance to music and if the riders didn't wear such silly outfits, but that's entertainment. No one would ever watch a figure skating contest if it consisted merely of one contestant after another just running systematically through through their array of jumps and spins wearing an old sweatshirt. (That would be too much like school figures, LOL.)
What if the horses wore helmets and pads and chased after a ball...would people think it a sport then?!!!
Ant
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2004
Mathman said:In dog shows, it seems like when those gorgeous critters prance around the ring, they KNOW they're pretty and are darn proud of it. "Hey, hey, hey, everybody, look at me, look at me, look at me!!!" (The smaller breeds anyway, LOL.)
MM
Heh - my dog prances around like that anyway! He is a cutie though!
Ant
Red Dog said:
So I guess basketball and baseball aren't sports, either. (I guess you didn't see that game in the ALCS playoffs last year where the umpire called the runner safe on a dropped third strike when the replays clearly showed that the catcher didn't drop the ball). And basketball--have you ever head about the home team advantage, meaning the home team refs?
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2004
Red Dog said:I guess by that token chess could also be a sport.
Several years ago I happened on my first (and last!) example of chess (british soundtrack) on Eurosport. The chase: I have _never_ heard any announcers display such emotion toward any other sport. I was mesmerized and disappointed I never heard the like again:
"AND THEN HIS KNIGHT _BURST_ THROUGH HIS OPPONENT'S DEFENSES!!!!!!"
"AFTER CONTEMPLATING SEVERAL MINUTES HE STUNNED HIS OPPONENT BY PLAYING HIS ROOK!!!!"
"AN ABSOLUTELY AMAZINGDEFENSE!!!!!"
just thought I'd share ....
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
They recently re-televised the 1997 rematch between former world champion Gary Kasparov (widely considered the best player ever) and IBMs Deep Blue. Deep Blue won the sixth and final game with a nifty knight sacrifice, and claimed the match 3.5-2.5.
But the true brilliancy was Kasparov's victory in game 1, where he totally took advantage of the machine mentality of his opponant.
Anyway, this was the first time a computer beat a human champion and was considered a milestone in artificial intelligence. (The current generation of chess-playing machines have gone even farther, and now have no human peer. Interestingly enough, the advances in technology have all been in the hardware. They are basically running the same programs that they developed years ago, but modern computers are so fast that they really can't be outsmarted by humans in a finite combinatorical endeavor like chess.)
This was totally absorbing television! If only figure skating could be like that!
Click here for the blow-by-blow score of the game. (You can also download videos of each game, but you need a video program called "bomba" to play them.)
http://www.research.ibm.com/deepblue/watch/html/c.shtml
MM
But the true brilliancy was Kasparov's victory in game 1, where he totally took advantage of the machine mentality of his opponant.
Anyway, this was the first time a computer beat a human champion and was considered a milestone in artificial intelligence. (The current generation of chess-playing machines have gone even farther, and now have no human peer. Interestingly enough, the advances in technology have all been in the hardware. They are basically running the same programs that they developed years ago, but modern computers are so fast that they really can't be outsmarted by humans in a finite combinatorical endeavor like chess.)
This was totally absorbing television! If only figure skating could be like that!
Click here for the blow-by-blow score of the game. (You can also download videos of each game, but you need a video program called "bomba" to play them.)
http://www.research.ibm.com/deepblue/watch/html/c.shtml
MM
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