2023 Skate America Women's Short Program

[CellarDweller]

Please remember the sage just in case we need to ward off chaos.

I think you'll be pleased once you get to that thread.

 

[rain]

And, I'm probably in the minority, but I do not like the bit of hanging over the boards flirting with the judges.

It makes me second-hand uncomfortable for everyone involved. But between this and ice dance it seems to be something of a fad.

Choreographically Levito's program is my favourite of the top three, but when you put her out there with powerful skaters like Hendrixx and Glenn her weaknesses really show.

Hendrixx will need to hit that program every time or it will be a painful watch, as the music does not carry it.

Whole package wise between music and choreography and performance my favourite was Glenn, but then I've always had a soft spot for her and keep hoping she's going to finally have that breakthrough year.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

That was wonderful from Loena Hendrickx! She was in great form too. Confident, in shape, no hesitation. It was fun, and she had fun dancing right in front of the judges' faces too. LOL! I'm happy for her and her brother, Jorik. I didn't know what to expect from Loena. I didn't like her programs last season, but this was so much fun. I hope she has a fp that suits her personality too!

I am really so glad to see Amber Glenn hit it out the ballpark too. I love the expression Amber gave at her ending pose. Yep, Amber! Werk it, girl. Amber has always had IT! She just has had self-doubts, and then not full, consistent support, which can make things harder. Hopefully, she's put all the angst behind her, and she's in shape mentally and physically. Cuz Amber has huge talent. At 2023 Worlds, Amber deserved better scores, based on how she performed vs some of the competitors in front of her.

When the scores came up at SA, Amber said, "Finally!" I guess she'd never broken 70 before? She certainly should have. Even the 71.45, IMO, should have been closer to 73. There isn't a huge difference between the aggressive attack that both Loena and Amber exhibited, so I wonder if the difference is in difficulty, or GOE, and PCS. Figures, if that's the case. It just feels as if they always hold back a little on Amber. I hope she will maintain her strength and focus in the fp. I'm glad to see Amber in front of Isabeau.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

I think the flirting with the judges should have died when Katarina Witt retired.

But Loena did it so well. You got to have chutzpah, joie de vivre, and supreme confidence to pull that off.

 

[withwings]

I know that was an excellent skate, but I didn't really like her programme. Kaori's skate in the olympic season really showcased a positive power in women. I'm not sure if I'm just misunderstanding Loena's programmes, but she seems sometimes to present women as having value just if they are a sexualised object. I'm actually quite uncomfortable with the sexually provocative bit (which she's done similar before) Loena as a persona is very humble.. Very caring for others and simple.

You would be surprised how surprisingly humble and simple as a person Loena is. I would say she has such a pure soul. Her team ( if I am not mistaken her brother is designing her costumes. perhaps not always.i do not know) has their own vision how she should look and she trusts their guidance unconditionally...

 

[lileychristie]

I know that was an excellent skate, but I didn't really like her programme. Kaori's skate in the olympic season really showcased a positive power in women. I'm not sure if I'm just misunderstanding Loena's programmes, but she seems sometimes to present women as having value just if they are a sexualised object. I'm actually quite uncomfortable with the sexually provocative bit (which she's done similar before).

Being sexual and being a sexualized object are 2 very different thing. Loena here is taking charge of her own sexuality and clearly she's proud of it. Meanwhile being a sexualized object is about the perspective of other people, doesn't matter how the woman is presenting herself. The sickest objectification I've seen in figure skating was when I once saw someone commenting on the breasts of a 14 year old skater, ugh...

Sadly this is a big issue in our culture in general, not just in figure skating. Women are constantly being objectified and sexualized, but the moment a woman takes charge of her own sexuality and proudly being sexual, they got reprimanded for it. So Loena here is also showcasing the positive power of women, just in a different way to Kaori's. Loena is definitely being sexual on her own accord, showing her empowerment. Women's power come in many forms and shapes.

One can dislike how much she showcases this in a program or how often she does this style, but I don't think it's right to say that "she presents women as having value just if they're sexualized object."

 

[skylark]

Wow, she got insane GOE on just about every element. Good for her.

And, I'm probably in the minority, but I do not like the bit of hanging over the boards flirting with the judges.

With that and her costume, she reminded me of Katerina Witt back in the 80s.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

I would say she has such a pure soul.

For me, that sweetness and blitheness of spirit really comes across in Loena's personality, and in her smile.

 

[moonvine]

I'm so excited! I'm flying to Texas tomorrow for like 6 hours just to watch the ladies free skate and the free dance. GL everyone!

Stop by handicapped row and say hi!

 

[moonvine]

My first time watching skating live I have to do it a least once!

You will love it!

 

[moonvine]

Thanks for the confirmation. Is the rink smaller than what the skaters are used to?

Probably.

 

[moonvine]

From what I understood, the US was GeoBlocked from the livestreams on YouTube.

Just get a VPN. Proton is free. Set it to Netherlands

 

[icewhite]

As someone who usually likes Loena and her skating a lot I am very disappointed. I think the programs are bad, I think the sexuality is so in your face it takes over completely and dominates everything else - the skating and the program. The short is better than the free, which is just terrible. While I don't have a problem with some sexuality per se and have defended Loena against criticism in the past I don't enjoy this.
And I think it's not about objectification, but imagine one of the male skaters putting on the most minimal outfits, very small swimming trunks which make us see the shape of everything, cut just around his genitals, plus some additional fabric here and there on his front and hanging around his butt, dancing around in front of the judges, flirting with them, shaking his butt in front of them... We would be like "what???" So, why do we consider that normal for a female in this sport?

 

[lariko]

From where we were sitting, I was underwhelmed by the scoring Kawabe and Chiba recieved. There is visible difference between Hendrixx delivery imo and Glenn's, not in favor of Glenn. Levito's mistake on the spin was quite obvious, and her jumps were never great, but her arm work was so cool to watch.

 

[TT_Fin]

Watching women and don't read the comments. I was getting a little bit bored but then Amber and Nina woke me up. I am not biggest fan of ultra elements or teens but as everybody are looking for levels I feel all have the same program. The rules need something new, Imo. Ekaterina and Amber have natural personality but the programs, everybody"s, need someone new and I definetely don't mean morevir more difficult jumps. I just cannot say what I miss. I don't feel this way in men or pairs. yet. In dance I have felt like this already for years.

 

[lileychristie]

As someone who usually likes Loena and her skating a lot I am very disappointed. I think the programs are bad, I think the sexuality is so in your face it takes over completely and dominates everything else - the skating and the program. The short is better than the free, which is just terrible. While I don't have a problem with some sexuality per se and have defended Loena against criticism in the past I don't enjoy this.
And I think it's not about objectification, but imagine one of the male skaters putting on the most minimal outfits, very small swimming trunks which make us see the shape of everything, cut just around his genitals, plus some additional fabric here and there on his front and hanging around his butt, dancing around in front of the judges, flirting with them, shaking his butt in front of them... We would be like "what???" So, why do we consider that normal for a female in this sport?

I don't recall Loena's performance being that overly sexual, and she definitely didn't do any butt shaking. And her costume is not any more revealing than many ice dancers' costumes. She's not breaking any rules and the judges definitely agree with her.

Many of the male skaters wear deep, deep V-necks (especially in this exact same SkateAm) and some of them have been flirting with the judges as well. And let's not forget Nika ripping his shirt open mid-program.....

You actually raised a good point for a different reason. Even if a male skater would like to wear a very small swimming trunks, he cannot because the ISU rules specifically stated that "Men must wear full length trousers and must not wear tights."
Why do ISU rules allow female skaters to wear minimal dresses while mandating the men to wear trousers? Go figure.

Apparently I read that the no-tights rule for men is to prevent visible bulge. But, what's wrong with visible bulges!? Ballet dancers wear tights with bulges all the time and no one have any issues with it On the other hand judges don't mind (or want!?) to see women's legs in tights?

Sexism and body policing hurt both men and women. Really every skater should be allowed to wear whatever they want as long as it's safe to skate with. Loena definitely likes wearing dresses like that and I'm happy to see her able to wear what she loves on ice

(also, Vladimir Litvintsev's wore ballet-esque tights for his Nutcracker free, and I definitely saw a bit of bulge. Glad he didn't get penalized for that)

 

[icewhite]

I don't recall Loena's performance being that overly sexual, and she definitely didn't do any butt shaking. And her costume is not any more revealing than many ice dancers' costumes. She's not breaking any rules and the judges definitely agree with her.

Many of the male skaters wear deep, deep V-necks (especially in this exact same SkateAm) and some of them have been flirting with the judges as well. And let's not forget Nika ripping his shirt open mid-program.....

You actually raised a good point for a different reason. Even if a male skater would like to wear a very small swimming trunks, he cannot because the ISU rules specifically stated that "Men must wear full length trousers and must not wear tights."
Why do ISU rules allow female skaters to wear minimal dresses while mandating the men to wear trousers? Go figure.

Apparently I read that the no-tights rule for men is to prevent visible bulge. But, what's wrong with visible bulges!? Ballet dancers wear tights with bulges all the time and no one have any issues with it On the other hand judges don't mind (or want!?) to see women's legs in tights?

Sexism and body policing hurt both men and women. Really every skater should be allowed to wear whatever they want as long as it's safe to skate with. Loena definitely likes wearing dresses like that and I'm happy to see her able to wear what she loves on ice

(also, Vladimir Litvintsev's wore ballet-esque tights for his Nutcracker free, and I definitely saw a bit of bulge. Glad he didn't get penalized for that)

The rules being different for men and women indeed bothers me. They should be the same for both.
About Loena, I think my big issue is with her free - her outfit in that, but combined with the terrible music (editing) and choreo, and then she does similar things in the short - very short outfit, very much going for sexual, similar style of music - and I think it's just too much, I want to see skaters being skaters first, and don't want the "I'm sexy" thing to stand out first and before anything.
It's a trend though this season (not something new, skaters of the past have taken this at least as far, but in the last years it was often going in another direction). It's not just Loena. For me it's fine if it's part of the variety, but not if it becomes the main focus.

All the talk this season about the v-necks is quite telling, isn't it? Because that's really nothing compared to what some female skaters wear.

 

[Skating91]

It's time to ding Loena for a costume violation imo. Or at the very least have a quiet word to her after the tournament as to not cause public embarrassment, and tell her you will be dinged if you wear that costume again.

Last year was borderline as well, but this new one she's practically not wearing anything from behind. It's not suitable for this competition.

Let the skating and natural charisma excite the judges, there is no need for her to resort to this.

The judging was a little tough on some but very lenient on others. Isabeau's 3Lz+3T they did call the flat edge on the lutz, but not the clear q on the landing then clear UR on the 3T. Again, not called. Extraordinary. 2A on the q as well, one judge even gave it a 4 . 3F looked like a flat edge to me as well but can give the benefit of the doubt. Again, 3F on the q. I'm happy to make some screen grabs if no-one wants to believe the judges missed all of this.

I like the program, especially the first 30 seconds, but it needs to be judged properly for her benefit.

Glenn was probably most impressive achieved close to her maximum in front of a home crowd. Well done.

Edit. I'll add them anyway
3Lz landing

3T landing

2A landing

3F landing

The flip is borderline I don't have a problem with the judges overlooking that one.

But 4 on the 2A that's what Sakatomo gets for one that's close to perfect.

 

[Dawn825]

How do you add pictures like that??

Also I wonder if Loena's URs were called with such a huge score, hers were the most obvious to me. I think her costume is perfectly fine tho and I'm rooting for her today.

 

[Mathematician]

Just checked out the replays. Amber was the best skater there.