Moves That Don't Quite Make It: Master it or Scrap it?
- Thread starter Piel
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- Aug 19, 2003
Interesting! I didn't know that spin was called the "egg-beater." All this time I had just thought of it as the "Michelle Kwan Y-spin..."
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- Oct 31, 2006
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^^ Johnny is doing a pancake spin in that photo. Here is another pancake spin: http://z.about.com/d/figureskating/1/8/t/E/-/-/pancakespin.jpg
This is a donut spin by Shizuka: http://z.about.com/d/figureskating/1/8/p/E/-/-/donutspin.jpg
Well, Michelle does a slightly different variation. She doesn't grab the blade like Midori Ito is doing; instead Kwan would have her hand on her extended leg to support it. A lot of these spins tend to have multiple names. The Y-spin and the egg-beater spin are essentially the same thing. The pancake spin has also been called the cannonball spin, still essentially the same spin.
Cannonball spin: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...et.JPG/89px-Kevin_Van_Der_Perren_-_piruet.JPG
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- Jul 27, 2003
I, Y, Egg Beater, Martini.........whatever spin is being attempted. I don't think the height of the leg matters. It is having the knee bent that I dislike.
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- Oct 31, 2006
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You may be talking about the shotgun spin: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bb/Shotgun_spin.jpg
Here is a front attitude spin by Tanja Szweczenko: http://www.geocities.com/Vienna/3271/TanjaSzewczenko-spin.gif
These spin names are so funny!
- Joined
- Jun 22, 2007
I'm just curious, who names the spin??
Is that, for example shotgun spin, like a technical figure skating term that one must call it that way??
Is that, for example shotgun spin, like a technical figure skating term that one must call it that way??
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2006
If that is what he's talking about, I can't stand that spin either. I really don't want to see some skater spinning around with their butt in the air. :no:
I'm also not a fan of the hydrant spiral that Sasha apparently brought to the table (she was the first one I saw do it) although it doesn't seem like as many girls are trying that these days which is a relief!
Yes--it was this one! (And Toni--calling the butt spin is a polite version of what some of my friends called it)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v69/donquijote/ouch.jpg
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- Jul 1, 2007
The pancake spin has also been called the cannonball spin, still essentially the same spin.
For me, a pancake spin is where the back is flat. Like what Lucinda Ruh did.
Cannonball is where the back is rounded/hunched.
The same difficult variation for CoP, but the pancake looks more impressive (+GOE!).
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
Flexibility may not be required in the sport but it is definitely required in a show. The audience loves to watch things they can not do. That is why Cirque du Soleil is such a popular show and always sold out.
Flexibility does start when one is a toddler but it must continue as an adult. I've watched many dancers work on splits on floor and rolling on them to the left and right as warmups. Of course, it is the main focus in Acrobatic Dancing. It really is essential for back somersaults, walkovers, forward flips, Arabian Cartwheels (that's a no hands cartwheel which I've only seen from Kulic), etc.
How important is flexibility in figure skating? I really don't know. Laybacks in the Nikidinov manner require flexibility but I believe the rule says it only requires the skater to bend at the waist, which in itself is flexibility.
Skaters who can not contort their bodies because of a lack of flexibility do have flexibility for figure skating as do all sportspeople, but not necessaarily in the contornionist way.
One only has to look at Kwan and realize there is no contornionism but a wonderful supple body moving along the ice. The question is, do you need the acrobatics?
Joe
Flexibility does start when one is a toddler but it must continue as an adult. I've watched many dancers work on splits on floor and rolling on them to the left and right as warmups. Of course, it is the main focus in Acrobatic Dancing. It really is essential for back somersaults, walkovers, forward flips, Arabian Cartwheels (that's a no hands cartwheel which I've only seen from Kulic), etc.
How important is flexibility in figure skating? I really don't know. Laybacks in the Nikidinov manner require flexibility but I believe the rule says it only requires the skater to bend at the waist, which in itself is flexibility.
Skaters who can not contort their bodies because of a lack of flexibility do have flexibility for figure skating as do all sportspeople, but not necessaarily in the contornionist way.
One only has to look at Kwan and realize there is no contornionism but a wonderful supple body moving along the ice. The question is, do you need the acrobatics?
Joe
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2004
My gold medal least favorite element is .....
Any quad. (Big and ugly and even when landed they wreck the rhythm)
Silver medal least favorite element is:
Any poorly executed Biellmann position (this includes about 98% of them over the last five years)
Bronze medal least favorite element is:
Footwork with frenetic arm movements (you're not kidding anyone, you're just trying to keep your balance).
Just off the podium:
Crotch-flashing moves in general (stop pointing that thing at me!)
Strawberry picker spins (showing off your finely developed skater's rump for the world to admire)
Pantomime (you're not being expressive, you're being annoying)
Any quad. (Big and ugly and even when landed they wreck the rhythm)
Silver medal least favorite element is:
Any poorly executed Biellmann position (this includes about 98% of them over the last five years)
Bronze medal least favorite element is:
Footwork with frenetic arm movements (you're not kidding anyone, you're just trying to keep your balance).
Just off the podium:
Crotch-flashing moves in general (stop pointing that thing at me!)
Strawberry picker spins (showing off your finely developed skater's rump for the world to admire)
Pantomime (you're not being expressive, you're being annoying)
The shotgun spin looks ridiculous-the name really suits the movement!
IMO the Y-spin looks disastrous if it's done like that:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2003campbell/ac04.jpg
But that way it's beautiful to watch:
http://img351.imageshack.us/img351/1686/sashayspinkd2.jpg
I think ladies shouldn't do a biellmann spin if they aren't able to do it the way it's supposed to look. I always liked Plushenko doing the biellmann, though.
looks ridiculous-the name really suits the movement!IMO the Y-spin looks disastrous if it's done like that:
http://www.sashafans.com/media/gallery/2003campbell/ac04.jpg
But that way it's beautiful to watch:
http://img351.imageshack.us/img351/1686/sashayspinkd2.jpg
I think ladies shouldn't do a biellmann spin if they aren't able to do it the way it's supposed to look. I always liked Plushenko doing the biellmann, though.
- Joined
- Oct 27, 2006
LOL Mafke!!
I think that many of the spin positions that skaters do now are just ugly. If I wanted to see half those positions, I would go to Cirque De Soliel (spelling?). Besides half the time they are holding their leg and the look on their faces kind of says "yeah I have to do this for the points...it hurts and I can barely straighten my leg...yeah it's ugly and painful to watch no less perform...but I get mega points for it."
I also have to mention that spiral position where you leg goes out to the side and up and it looks really weird. I don't know what this position is called though.Everyone was doing them last season but you don't really see them a great deal of them this season, thankfully.
And...flailing arms. I think that's why I don't like Lambiel's program this year....such an overuse of arms. I spent more time watching his arms then his skating? (can you tell really stupid things get my attention?)
Finally.....split jumps...russain split jumps...if you can't bring your legs up that high like Sasha can...then really you shouldn't do them because you risk looking like you are on a jv cheerleading squad!!
I think that many of the spin positions that skaters do now are just ugly. If I wanted to see half those positions, I would go to Cirque De Soliel (spelling?). Besides half the time they are holding their leg and the look on their faces kind of says "yeah I have to do this for the points...it hurts and I can barely straighten my leg...yeah it's ugly and painful to watch no less perform...but I get mega points for it."
I also have to mention that spiral position where you leg goes out to the side and up and it looks really weird. I don't know what this position is called though.Everyone was doing them last season but you don't really see them a great deal of them this season, thankfully.
And...flailing arms. I think that's why I don't like Lambiel's program this year....such an overuse of arms. I spent more time watching his arms then his skating? (can you tell really stupid things get my attention?)
Finally.....split jumps...russain split jumps...if you can't bring your legs up that high like Sasha can...then really you shouldn't do them because you risk looking like you are on a jv cheerleading squad!!
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- Jun 21, 2003
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- Oct 27, 2006
Yes that is how they should be done...and most of them are not!!
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- Jul 26, 2003
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Besti squats. I really dislike them. I dislike them even more when done by a pair, sbs.
Donut spins when the skater has to stick their rump in the air to grasp their foot, like Oksana Baiul. (I have seen this done smoothly, but many do the Oksana version). Plushenko did one without having to stick up his rump to catch the foot.
If you're going to do an I spin, I want you to point your toe, not the way Sasha does it with the square foot. Here's this lovely balletic performance, and then this wrenched square footed spin. Yuck. AFAIR Czisny manages one with the pointed toe.
I don't like the A spin, no matter who's doing it.
I don't like to see spirals, particularly in pairs, where the man can't get his leg over 90 degrees and the lady is dragging her leg down to try and match legline.
Donut spins when the skater has to stick their rump in the air to grasp their foot, like Oksana Baiul. (I have seen this done smoothly, but many do the Oksana version). Plushenko did one without having to stick up his rump to catch the foot.
If you're going to do an I spin, I want you to point your toe, not the way Sasha does it with the square foot. Here's this lovely balletic performance, and then this wrenched square footed spin. Yuck. AFAIR Czisny manages one with the pointed toe.
I don't like the A spin, no matter who's doing it.
I don't like to see spirals, particularly in pairs, where the man can't get his leg over 90 degrees and the lady is dragging her leg down to try and match legline.
- Joined
- Dec 16, 2006
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- Dec 28, 2006
who could not like russian splits? when they are well done they are a great move!
Couldn't you say that about the sit spin (or camel spin)... oh, there she's bending her knee and now she's all the way down in a sit position to finish it off!
- Joined
- Jul 11, 2003
I find Lambiel's headless spin so exciting. Some people have said it is easy but I can't believe those who said that actually make their heads disappear. I believe one would have a loss of balance doing that spin and at that speed.
Joe
Joe
