2016-17 State of Russian Ladies skating

[EVAMARIA]

A little bit OT, but I have often wondered how Swedes pronounce the name of Ulrich Salchow. Here are three versions. In the first I can barely hear the "L" sound. It is more like the silent L in walk and talk.

In the third version it definite ends in "chov" rather than "cow." (I think. )

https://www.howtopronounce.com/salchow/

As a Swede I would say the 3rd version is the most correct one. It's s hilarious to hear specially English speaking pronouncing the end chow as if its a cow with the name "Sal" .

 

[Sweet Dream]

How comes that when Rika jumped 3A and 4T everybody was all over the place writing posts about how amazing it was but when Russian girls do something awesome it's suddenly wrong. Did you criticise Marin in Japanese ladies thread as well? Right now 14 years old junior boys jumping 1-2 quads is nothing surprising. Gogolev trained by Brian Orser is 12 and has 4S and I haven't seen a single post questioning his methods. As far as I know boy's bodies can be damaged too. Nathan Chen is 17 and his FS included 5 quads

Russian ladies' fields is deeper than any other field in the world. They now they have to be one step ahead of their opponents to have a chance to perform internationally

Don't you think Anna looks too skinny? I just feel that the Russian girls' skating career is like some beautiful flowers, which are starting to fade even before they are in full bloom. It is totally wrong to blame it all on their "Puberty".

 

[drivingmissdaisy]

No...Mao sucks at salchow. She didn't even have a proper 3s during the Vancouver Olympic quad.

Yeah, she wasn't close on the 4S: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1yEgPt-faII

It's strange that she didn't have a reliable 3S when she could rotate the jump 3.5 revolutions, though.

Edit: A bit off topic, but here's a video of her at 12 years old skating an exhibition in which she tries 3A and 3F-3Lo-3T: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtpBHeW6jY8

 

[MaiKatze]

Well the Russian field for ladies is deep but they are vulnerable as we saw at worlds with only one skater in the top 5 and not all three in the top ten. There is a lot of chatter about quads from the juniors but they are "so far" away from seniors especially in light of not surviving puberty. I am not even sure - has Evgenia survived puberty yet? We see the issues with Radinova - she has grown so so much over the last couple of years and like Julia Lip and Nam from Canada who really sprouted has struggled but just been stronger at fighting the puberty monster than the rest. It is exciting but kind of sad that a 2015 world champion is barely remembered and the 2014 olympic champion is seen as more of an icon from the past. And if you are 19 forget it our an old lady. Evgenia is almost in the geriatric stage of skating (LOL sarcasm).

I think you can clearly see that Medvedeva had a growth sport between the last two seasons. She is taller and filled out a bit. I think she's after 'puberty' now and since she shows no sign of weakness, she is one of the rare cases that weren't influenced as much. Perhaps her parents are on the lighter side, too. If she's genetically slim and lean like this she won't change. Unfortunately for Elena she is not that lucky. She won't ever return to the small girl with the powerful jumps. She's grown, but the jumps did not. Not to say she should stop competing but with the way her body developed, I don't see her as World Champion anymore. didn't I read somewhere that Tuberidze only chooses a certain type of girl? I bet she looks at the parents, too.

 

[ejnsofi]

Well the Russian field for ladies is deep but they are vulnerable as we saw at worlds with only one skater in the top 5 and not all three in the top ten. There is a lot of chatter about quads from the juniors but they are "so far" away from seniors especially in light of not surviving puberty. I am not even sure - has Evgenia survived puberty yet? We see the issues with Radinova - she has grown so so much over the last couple of years and like Julia Lip and Nam from Canada who really sprouted has struggled but just been stronger at fighting the puberty monster than the rest. It is exciting but kind of sad that a 2015 world champion is barely remembered and the 2014 olympic champion is seen as more of an icon from the past. And if you are 19 forget it our an old lady. Evgenia is almost in the geriatric stage of skating (LOL sarcasm).

According to Eteri Evgenia already had her growth sprout. She has always been small girl. Puberty is something every skater has to survive, not only Russian ladies. Kanako Murakami was great during her junior years and first season as senior and later she struggled seriously. Elena had rough time but she won CoC for God's sake and qualified for GP Final. And Yulia's problem were more mental/emotional than physical not to mention she was in conflict with Eteri. And in regards of Worlds can we really say that Kaetlyn is better skater than Pogorilaya taking whole season into consideration?

Adelina isn't the first skater who left the field after winning OGM (I'm looking at you Tara) and probably her life as athlete would be easier if she didn't receive death threats from fans. If I were her I wouldn't dare to skate competitively again out of fear.

Is Anna too thin? Maybe. But she is just 12 years old girl who is active. When I was her age I looked like skeleton no matter how much I ate. Elizabet Tursynbaeva is like 150 cm tall and I doubt she is weights more than 45 kg yet she jumps combinations with 4S in practice and nobody has a problem. Also she is even younger than Zhenya and nobody is like "OMG wait till puberty strikes her... She won't be able to jump any more".

 

[moriel]

I think you can clearly see that Medvedeva had a growth sport between the last two seasons. She is taller and filled out a bit. I think she's after 'puberty' now and since she shows no sign of weakness, she is one of the rare cases that weren't influenced as much. Perhaps her parents are on the lighter side, too. If she's genetically slim and lean like this she won't change. Unfortunately for Elena she is not that lucky. She won't ever return to the small girl with the powerful jumps. She's grown, but the jumps did not. Not to say she should stop competing but with the way her body developed, I don't see her as World Champion anymore. didn't I read somewhere that Tuberidze only chooses a certain type of girl? I bet she looks at the parents, too.

I doubt about certain type of girls because well, Tsurskaya. While she is thin, she is quite tall, and her parents are very tall too, so it was kinda obvious she wouldnt end up a shortie.

But now that you said it... I think that Eteri does some selection by mentality. Well, first of all most her ladies are fighters =)
Also, she kinda looks like someone who won´t try to find a personal approach to each skater, and spend her time convincing them to work hard and do their best, finding a way to motivate them etc, more like "either you work hard and do youre best or youre out" type.

 

[silverfoxes]

How comes that when Rika jumped 3A and 4T everybody was all over the place writing posts about how amazing it was but when Russian girls do something awesome it's suddenly wrong. Did you criticise Marin in Japanese ladies thread as well? Right now 14 years old junior boys jumping 1-2 quads is nothing surprising. Gogolev trained by Brian Orser is 12 and has 4S and I haven't seen a single post questioning his methods. As far as I know boy's bodies can be damaged too. Nathan Chen is 17 and his FS included 5 quads

Russian ladies' fields is deeper than any other field in the world. They now they have to be one step ahead of their opponents to have a chance to perform internationally

Stephen Gogolev actually landed 4S at 10 years old, and I questioned it plenty (and not only me), but I do not think it makes Brian a bad coach with "abnormal ego-inflation." I don't think the genie is going back into the bottle; this is the progression of the sport, and we can only hope that skaters, parents, and coaches all are informed & train responsibly.

 

[LRK]

I think people should just give up hoping... er, I mean, fearing... that Evgenia is going to be "hit by the puberty monster." It could happen, of course, but personally... I won't be holding my breath.

 

[MaiKatze]

I doubt about certain type of girls because well, Tsurskaya. While she is thin, she is quite tall, and her parents are very tall too, so it was kinda obvious she wouldnt end up a shortie.

But now that you said it... I think that Eteri does some selection by mentality. Well, first of all most her ladies are fighters =)
Also, she kinda looks like someone who won´t try to find a personal approach to each skater, and spend her time convincing them to work hard and do their best, finding a way to motivate them etc, more like "either you work hard and do youre best or youre out" type.

I think I read on Goldenskate that Zagitova was short of being thrown, cried a lot. That she lives alone at 14 to be able to train with Tuberidze. I think that you have to grow up fast in that environment. I don't envy these girls at all, they need to be tough and ambitious. And not all of them will make it.

 

[MaiKatze]

I think people should just give up hoping... er, I mean, fearing... that Evgenia is going to be "hit by the puberty monster." It could happen, of course, but personally... I won't be holding my breath.

Puberty doesn't always show only through the physical changes you go through. Sometimes I think it has a lot do to with a certain switch. You know technically, you can land these jumps, but then you suddenly start to doubt. The older you get, the more "adult" you get, the more you start to think, to overthink. To be mentally strong is equally as important as your body.

 

[andromache]

I think people should just give up hoping... er, I mean, fearing... that Evgenia is going to be "hit by the puberty monster." It could happen, of course, but personally... I won't be holding my breath.

She's grown a ton since her first senior season, and it's pretty amazing how well she has adapted. Her competitive costumes are still very girlish and young-looking, and can really make her body seem that way too, but in her Sailor Moon EX at WTT you can see that the girl has got curves. She probably isn't finished growing, but as long as she continues to adapt well (as she already has), she's going to be fine.

Puberty doesn't always show only through the physical changes you go through. Sometimes I think it has a lot do to with a certain switch. You know technically, you can land these jumps, but then you suddenly start to doubt. The older you get, the more "adult" you get, the more you start to think, to overthink. To be mentally strong is equally as important as your body.

I think this is true, to a certain extent. Growing up and becoming an adult means plenty of distractions, both in the world around you and in your brain. Stress, anxiety, insecurity, pressure, etc., all begin to feel more and more difficult as you become an adult. Evgenia seems to be very, very good at coping with this shift, and I bet Eteri plays a role in managing it and sheltering her as well. Evgenia is also lucky that she has experienced her "coming of age" in the pre-Olympic years, which has given her time to mentally acclimate to her status of best in the world (Yuna Kim, too).

Yulia, for example - even if she hadn't had major jump/body issues after Sochi - probably still did and would've experienced an abrupt, scary mental shift after the huge burst of fame she had at Sochi.

 

[atsumiri]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPZOWLmZ73U&feature=youtu.be - Anna Shcherbakova 4T-3T-3Lo

 

[Lana05]

Panenkova has another body shape from all other girls. She is not like Evgenia or like Polina. There is no real formula because without hard work nobody will achieve anything

 

[Ares]

She's grown a ton since her first senior season, and it's pretty amazing how well she has adapted. Her competitive costumes are still very girlish and young-looking, and can really make her body seem that way too, but in her Sailor Moon EX at WTT you can see that the girl has got curves. She probably isn't finished growing, but as long as she continues to adapt well (as she already has), she's going to be fine.



I think this is true, to a certain extent. Growing up and becoming an adult means plenty of distractions, both in the world around you and in your brain. Stress, anxiety, insecurity, pressure, etc., all begin to feel more and more difficult as you become an adult. Evgenia seems to be very, very good at coping with this shift, and I bet Eteri plays a role in managing it and sheltering her as well. Evgenia is also lucky that she has experienced her "coming of age" in the pre-Olympic years, which has given her time to mentally acclimate to her status of best in the world (Yuna Kim, too).

Yulia, for example - even if she hadn't had major jump/body issues after Sochi - probably still did and would've experienced an abrupt, scary mental shift after the huge burst of fame she had at Sochi.

There is one thing that I disagree with some regarding Evgenia ... that her jumps are terribly muscled, they're not. If you want to check what muscled jumps are you can look for ... Medvedeva's junior programs (2014 year in particular). Or for Sakhanovich, maybe Gubanova as well.

 

[tars]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPZOWLmZ73U&feature=youtu.be - Anna Shcherbakova 4T-3T-3Lo

I've always liked this girl, but considered her as more of an "artistic" type with nice edges, posture and musicality rather than a jumper. And now this... :shocked:

 

[lavoix]

I've always liked this girl, but considered her as more of an "artistic" type with nice edges, posture and musicality rather than a jumper. And now this... :shocked:

That looked unreal, that 4T looked like a 3T.

Would judges credit that?

 

[atsumiri]

That looked unreal, that 4T looked like a 3T.

Would judges credit that?

Why wouldn't they? its 4 rotations. And clean landing.
Btw base value for this combination is 19.7

 

[tars]

That looked unreal, that 4T looked like a 3T.

It's because of her insane rotation speed.
Rika Kihira's 3A does that to people's eyes too.

 

[moriel]

Why wouldn't they? its 4 rotations. And clean landing.
Btw base value for this combination is 19.7

well, they said both quadsters will try adding quads to their programs next season. Hopefully this is doable because well, if she can do this combo, she could probably have a stable-ish 4T as a single jump, for example.
Juniors will be interesting.

 

[puremagic]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPZOWLmZ73U&feature=youtu.be - Anna Shcherbakova 4T-3T-3Lo

:shocked: This kid can't stop amaze me.

Now we definitely need Polina's 4Lz!