2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating | Page 39 | Golden Skate

2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

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I think PCS scores should be judged based on how the skater did (as you said with Kostner - missing the jumps doesn’t exactly mean you’re performance was off the charts in PCS). However, skating skills and transitions aside, part of the PCS score is based on interpretation of music, program composition, and performance execution. Thus, “artistry” of some kind is needed, whether you prefer the program or not!

I don’t think that a skater with a Celine Dion program Or a flirtatious program means they deserve high PCS scores. That being said, I can’t deny enjoying some of their programs! I’d prefer Ashley Wagner’s Sweet Dreams program any day over Trusova’s Game of Thrones program because Ashley’s charisma, ability to perform, and ability to project to an audience captivated me. I think this is where judges give skaters with those type of programs higher PCS scores, as judges are members of the audience! But, like you said, the Russians that aren’t as “artistic” in that sense can easily combat that “performance charisma” with their speed, transitions, and, of course, amazing jumps and spins, which also excite the audience!

This is why skaters like Kostornaia are so hard to beat. She has it all! She has difficult jumps, amazing skating skills and transitions, and a performance ability that is off the charts!

Edit: I would only prefer Ashley’s program on a performance level, Trusova’s quads crush Ashley technically :)

Well, the problem is that "art" or "artistry" is so subjective that it is hard to come to a widely accepted agreement what is artistic and what is not. There are tons of definitions and hundreds of other theoretics would explain why the art can't be properly defined.

For me, the essence of the art/artistry (ability to express/perform art) is something that enriches me in rational nor in emotional way, helps me to think, to feel, sometimes to re-evaluate (from this angle one of the biggest artistic contributions was Lipnitskaia's olympic free program, because it made me to re-evaluate what I thought about figure skating till that time :biggrin:). Also, for me, there always should be some significant level of aesthetics (which once again shows how the perception of art/artistry is subjective, because there would be many supporters of that kind of art that finds pleasure in disgustingness and hideousness). But above all else, I have to believe in honesty of the creator/performer that he means it seriously, and with this part I never have a problem with russian ladies/girls. It's partially a matter of training to feel the performance and to understand it, and not just training of the actual program, but general education in art and aestetics. I think it can be seen that many russian ladies and girls have ballet training that helps not only with the range of movements but also with the understanding art (eternal glory to Lyudmila Borisovna and other ballet coaches of the russian figure skaters). And partially it is a thing of one's nature, the part that can't be trained, that a person gets in genes.
 
Seems like you completely missed the point. My point is that I wouldn't post it in such a condition or pretend that it's a good 4Lutz. In general, it's a criticism of Plushenko(for posting a video of it), not Trusova.

the caption was only "we are working", so i'm not sure where anyone (even Plushenko) said it was a good lutz :confused2:

i'm sure he posted it just to show how resilient she is and how well she's doing with such little time back on the ice.
 
Speaking of Lutzes. I wonder if we will see a decline in Lutzes now when the points are lowered to the same as Flips.
 
Most definitely. Why do a harder jump and risk edge calls if you get no reward.

Because doing flip and lutz is more than just doing one of them. There is only certain amount of jumps one can repeat, so having different jumps is always preferable.
 
My prediction:

Ladies, who did two Lutzes and two Flips in the free program, will do them still probably, unless they gain another element ;)

Ladies, who did two Lutzes and one Flip, may reverse that.

Ladies, who did one Lutz and two Flips, will be happy.
 
No doubt Rozanov is promising for the future, though from the previous words I would expect at least Lambiel for Sasha... :scratch2:

Now?

Plyushenko got a permission for Lola, surely he could've gotten one for Averbukh (or that choreographer from Bolshoi that was announced as well) too, so they'd come to Kislovodsk.

Plyushenko could've also tried not to brag too much, but that would be hoping for something nearly impossible :)

How the hell could anyone go to Kislovodsk in the epidemic? 1600 km from Moscow ? If you weren't so malicious, you would remember Plushenko told to the media his plans on May 15 a week later they found out where they could go to training camp. If they stayed in Moscow, anyone could have helped, even from the Bolshoi. ;)
 
Would love to see both, but if I had to choose, I would vote for Nastya.

I would vote for Nastya T. also, but if I know the federation, they would choose Konstantinova to submit (no shade to her, in any other country both of them would get spots). But they could each end up getting one spot if it went something like this:

2 spots to Trusova, Kostornaia, Shcherbakova, Zagitova, Medvedeva, Tuktamysheva, Sinitsyna (these 7 are all but guaranteed)

2 spots to Samodurova (also very likely at this point as she's so high on the WS list)

This leaves two spots. I'd say they go to a combination of Konstantinova and Tarakanova. Maybe the fed will submit both of them and they'll each get one.
 
That's so simply during one week :thumbsup: you would have done it :hap10:

Where is the need to do the programs during one week. I say that it would have looked different if Plushy would have originally said "the programs will be done by Rozanov because I know his work and do believe him" instead of "I will find best choreographers in the world and in Russia for Sasha." To me this now sounds phoney, and remember he didn't say it some time before the qurantine etc., it was already during the situation we still have.

Though, Rozanov is still better variant than some of the choreographers people were hoping for :devil:
 
Thouigh, Rozanov is still better variant than some of the choreographers people were hoping for :devil:

In any case, the current development explains why in my dreams Eteri, after Sasha has won, not only bites the edge protector, but also hits onother one on Daniil's head.:laugh2:
 
Where is the need to do the programs during one week. I say that it would have looked different if Plushy would have originally said "the programs will be done by Rozanov because I know his work and do believe him" instead of "I will find best choreographers in the world and in Russia for Sasha." To me this now sounds phoney, and remember he didn't say it some time before the qurantine etc., it was already during the situation we still have.

Thouigh, Rozanov is still better variant than some of the choreographers people were hoping for :devil:

I can agree with this. I definitely don't think Rozanov has enough experience yet to be considered one of the best choreographers in the world, but I'm willing to give him a chance. As far as I know, he mostly choreographed for the novices so we really haven't seen what he's capable of with a senior skater like Sasha yet. I'm actually quite excited to see the programs and how Sergei's choreographic style differs from Daniil's :)
 
Where is the need to do the programs during one week. I say that it would have looked different if Plushy would have originally said "the programs will be done by Rozanov because I know his work and do believe him" instead of "I will find best choreographers in the world and in Russia for Sasha." To me this now sounds phoney, and remember he didn't say it some time before the qurantine etc., it was already during the situation we still have.

Thouigh, Rozanov is still better variant than some of the choreographers people were hoping for :devil:

so boring...
 
Because doing flip and lutz is more than just doing one of them. There is only certain amount of jumps one can repeat, so having different jumps is always preferable.

Yes of course you can't just suddenly do 5 flips. But there will be a decline.
Again, I really think all of these recent rule changes is the ISU showing what kind of skating they wanna see and which skaters they favor. All these rules go against 4s, girls that repeat Lz a lot etc aka against the likes of Sasha and Anna.
And this is not a conspiracy it's just plain obvious.
I favor Alena so I can be delighted that my fave gets all that help from the rules, but still.
 
Good to have dreams, bad to live in them.
That depends. If I look at how doggedly and unfavorably many self-proclaimed "realists" act, the relaxed view of a dreamer seems decidedly more desirable to me. :biggrin:
 
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