2021 Skate America: Pairs Free Skate
- Thread starter dorispulaski
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Tarasova/Morozov had errors, but the fact that they rebounded with some of their best throws was really great to see. Their throws are huge. I'm not fully sold on their Aljona Savchenko imitation LP, but their quality is undeniable and it was a deserved win. They missed that throw 3flip at Finlandia, but did a beautiful one here.
Knierim/Frazier would, or at least should, have won silver if they had just done their usual SP. Brandon's uncharacteristic fallout out of the jump was counted as a fall and they had a lot of missed levels in the SP. The were in the first group for the LP, which didn't make it easier for them.
At the same time, I still felt like they did enough to win a medal. Boikova/Kozlovski only scored 6 points lower than them for a 2 fall LP. A couple judges gave them -4 for their throw fall instead of -5. It's not like there was something exceptional about the throw to warrant the -4; it wasn't as if Boikova nearly landed it. Someone mentioned Miura/Kihara scoring too high for their scrappy throw 3Lo, which was true. But throws seemed to be scored a bit high for all teams, so I wasn't as bothered by that.
Knierim/Frazier didn't do their best twist in either program-- it was better in the LP, but still not their usual, and they lost GOE they would normally get. Meanwhile, Boikova/Kozlovskii did a low twist and got nearly all +3s. Little stuff like this could have made the difference between K/F medaling or not. K/F had a medal worthy performance today. B/K were struggling through this competition.
Regarding Miura/Kihara, they are really good. Their coach and his wife (Meagan Duhamel) have been talking them up. And it's generating support from Japanese fans and North American fans who are glad to see Japan have a good pair team. I can't help but feel that's influencing their quick scoring boost a bit (or maybe that's just me overthinking). Other pairs have to wait longer to earn it and have to skate cleaner more times. M/K have never skated a clean LP yet, as far as I know. That was a huge crash today. They still deserved to medal, but I find their very quick rise interesting. I do have to give Kihara a lot of credit for transforming himself from a 3rd tier pair guy into a strong one. He has really persevered. It helps that Miura is so short and they have a great size differential.
Knierim/Frazier would, or at least should, have won silver if they had just done their usual SP. Brandon's uncharacteristic fallout out of the jump was counted as a fall and they had a lot of missed levels in the SP. The were in the first group for the LP, which didn't make it easier for them.
At the same time, I still felt like they did enough to win a medal. Boikova/Kozlovski only scored 6 points lower than them for a 2 fall LP. A couple judges gave them -4 for their throw fall instead of -5. It's not like there was something exceptional about the throw to warrant the -4; it wasn't as if Boikova nearly landed it. Someone mentioned Miura/Kihara scoring too high for their scrappy throw 3Lo, which was true. But throws seemed to be scored a bit high for all teams, so I wasn't as bothered by that.
Knierim/Frazier didn't do their best twist in either program-- it was better in the LP, but still not their usual, and they lost GOE they would normally get. Meanwhile, Boikova/Kozlovskii did a low twist and got nearly all +3s. Little stuff like this could have made the difference between K/F medaling or not. K/F had a medal worthy performance today. B/K were struggling through this competition.
Regarding Miura/Kihara, they are really good. Their coach and his wife (Meagan Duhamel) have been talking them up. And it's generating support from Japanese fans and North American fans who are glad to see Japan have a good pair team. I can't help but feel that's influencing their quick scoring boost a bit (or maybe that's just me overthinking). Other pairs have to wait longer to earn it and have to skate cleaner more times. M/K have never skated a clean LP yet, as far as I know. That was a huge crash today. They still deserved to medal, but I find their very quick rise interesting. I do have to give Kihara a lot of credit for transforming himself from a 3rd tier pair guy into a strong one. He has really persevered. It helps that Miura is so short and they have a great size differential.
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Well, it's their third season together. It isn't like they are newcomers or that their rise is as dramatic as P/C who were buried deep outside top 10 at big events then months later were beating seasoned and medaled teams.
This event reminded me you can't always measure success in medals. Knierim/Frazier have medaled at Skate America several times before with each other and their former partners. Yet this SA felt like their best one and they've truly never looked better. They are noticeably improved after skating together a full year, and they skated here with a lot of energy and more speed. Their free skate was really well performed with just small issues. She was protecting those throw landings a bit, and throws are usually big point getters for them. They also have done their twist better before. But the program was beautiful and it was great to see the audience stand for them. They should focus on all that and not the placement. It was a packed field and the judges went a little easy on Boikova/Kozlovskii- I know how skating works and I get it. But K/F looked medal worthy today. They've competed 3 times this season and have been over 200 points every time, and the more they get used to skating well and competing together, the less antsy/jittery they hopefully feel at bigger events. And then they can focus on squeezing more points out of their skates, because they have strong quality across the board and great potential.
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- Dec 5, 2015
I also feel if a team was overscored it was Boikova/ Kozlovskiii and not Miura/ Kihara. B/K were overscored for their pairs' elements and their individual elements in both the SP and FS. I'm not sure they deserved the bronze but reputation always matters even in pairs skating where the judging tends to be more logical.
In regard to Miura/ Kihara it should be noted the Kihara really has been struggling for a long time to build momentum. He skated with both Suzaki and Takahashi before partnering with Miura, but the dynamics of those partnerships never seemed healthy to me. So, he has been skating pairs for a very long time. This team's rise and, especially Kihara's rise, was not an instantaneous thing.
With some delay
Few thoughts
# The USA teams are the only ones who can say that weren't overscore... The other teams were overscore
# Congrats to T/M
# B/K -> the problem is in her head and all program is suffering ... because she is focus in the landings and not in the program. I think both programs can be great if she can deal with her head .. just given them time ( she pass a similar period in juniors if I remember correct before seniors) ...
# M/K --> I'm not going to question the silver medal ... but what I'm going to say is that they are the most political team (more than the russian) in the ice. Japan needs a pairs team to have a big shot in the team event (because ice dance is another problem ..).. they hadn't one ... they found a lovely one (easy to love by the fans) and now let's put all the influence out there a make them rise. That's the true. No team without previous victory ( or an previous great LP) the score would survive to a landing against the wall with other and other little imprecision ... and they haven't had one .. and fans are eager bury B/K by there mistakes and scores and glorify M/K like they were the perfection and every point was well deserve... they weren't far from that..
# Who will suffer by M/K being a political team? Mostly the USA teams because they don't have a true first team that the federation can pull (one got a good SP, the other a a good FP) and the third russian team
Few thoughts
# The USA teams are the only ones who can say that weren't overscore... The other teams were overscore
# Congrats to T/M
# B/K -> the problem is in her head and all program is suffering ... because she is focus in the landings and not in the program. I think both programs can be great if she can deal with her head .. just given them time ( she pass a similar period in juniors if I remember correct before seniors) ...
# M/K --> I'm not going to question the silver medal ... but what I'm going to say is that they are the most political team (more than the russian) in the ice. Japan needs a pairs team to have a big shot in the team event (because ice dance is another problem ..).. they hadn't one ... they found a lovely one (easy to love by the fans) and now let's put all the influence out there a make them rise. That's the true. No team without previous victory ( or an previous great LP) the score would survive to a landing against the wall with other and other little imprecision ... and they haven't had one .. and fans are eager bury B/K by there mistakes and scores and glorify M/K like they were the perfection and every point was well deserve... they weren't far from that..
# Who will suffer by M/K being a political team? Mostly the USA teams because they don't have a true first team that the federation can pull (one got a good SP, the other a a good FP) and the third russian team
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- Jan 7, 2016
After catching up and drying a lot of happy tears:
Boikova/Kozlovskii: It certainly wasn't Sasha's day. I feel sorry for them. They need something less stationay, more appealing and lots more energy. So far, Mishina/Gallyamov are much more exciting to me. Maybe they should consider a move to Mozer Team after alll... Moskvina and Minchuk then could go all out for M/G.
Miura/Kihara: Wow and triple wow! Another successful Marcotte project. Being unfazed by that fall! I love them! Best of all: the geniune happiness displayed by them!
Tarasova/Morozov: That's what they're all about! Fantastic! Back to quality. Love them, their costumes, and Danya's choreography. It looks already good when Eteri stands at the boards. Working with Team Tutberidze and Sliusarenko has certainly helped.
Boikova/Kozlovskii: It certainly wasn't Sasha's day. I feel sorry for them. They need something less stationay, more appealing and lots more energy. So far, Mishina/Gallyamov are much more exciting to me. Maybe they should consider a move to Mozer Team after alll... Moskvina and Minchuk then could go all out for M/G.
Miura/Kihara: Wow and triple wow! Another successful Marcotte project. Being unfazed by that fall! I love them! Best of all: the geniune happiness displayed by them!
Tarasova/Morozov: That's what they're all about! Fantastic! Back to quality. Love them, their costumes, and Danya's choreography. It looks already good when Eteri stands at the boards. Working with Team Tutberidze and Sliusarenko has certainly helped.
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- Mar 21, 2018
Why does it matter if their fall was one hitting the barrier or just a fall on the ice? They recovered from that well and did all the rest of their elements clean. They got all -5s for that fall and it shouldn’t affect the scoring of their other elements. The only place where they could have been losing out with the fall is the PCS, and they got the same components score as B/K, who were definitely not performing at their best and also had a fall.
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Agree. Miura/Kihara's rise just looks instantaneous to those who hadn't followed them. A few month after they teamed up in 2019, Jacky Wong, who saw them train with Bruno, tweeted they had a potential to be 10-15th at World. They beat Kayne/O'Shea, Knierim's and Della Monica/Guarise at NHK Trophy, their international debut. Then Worlds were cancelled for COVID and they couldn't compete at all in 2020-2021 until Worlds in which they finished 10th with lowballed PCS (because the judges didn't know them) and multiple mistakes (Riku cried in K&C and Ryuichi and Bruno comforted her). They had the potential from the very beginning.
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I find this bizarre. You claim that but then write an entire essay on how overscored and utterly lacking in presentation, skating ability, jumps, throws, twists they are compared to everyone else.
Like if you think a team's music sucks, their presentation sucks, their skating sucks then it IS personal.
If you don't like a team just say so. I honestly find it the height of hypocrisy to tear a team to shreds then innocently claim "Nothing personal". It's like prefacing something with "No offence".
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Babe, just ignore the trolls!
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Miura/Kihara are a great team. I am super impressed by their growth and improvement. Boikova/Kozlovskii have strong Technical elements, and are trying to up that score with their triple/Euler/Triple combo, but that is about it. M/K have gone from a pretty good team, to a great team. When B/K are on, their Technial side looks great.
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Some thought on Pairs after catching up
K/F: just like Alexa's energy and smile. Their skating looked a good deal better than yesterday. I think her throw-landings aren't as clean as they could/should be (judges were quite undecided on this, wide GOE spread from -2 to +3)
Cal/Joh their pair elements are great, pity about the jumps.
Miu/Kih Their charisma is endearing. Rikus nerves! After a nasty bounce into the barrier coming back with a 3S. IMO the placement is right.
Boi/Koz the best is Sasha's dress. Don't like her hunched shoulders. The choreography is not flamenco like. Just a few arm movments aren't enough. This program does nothing for me. I really liked them two seasons ago. They were radiant. Now, it's missing. Hope they find it again.
Tar/Mor are one of my favourite pairs and I'm so happy for them, that they delivered a good skate, it wasn't clean, but no falls. Their throws are just gorgeous. They don't own their music (yet?) For me it's still Aljona's and Bruno's music.
K/F: just like Alexa's energy and smile. Their skating looked a good deal better than yesterday. I think her throw-landings aren't as clean as they could/should be (judges were quite undecided on this, wide GOE spread from -2 to +3)
Cal/Joh their pair elements are great, pity about the jumps.
Miu/Kih Their charisma is endearing. Rikus nerves! After a nasty bounce into the barrier coming back with a 3S. IMO the placement is right.
Boi/Koz the best is Sasha's dress. Don't like her hunched shoulders. The choreography is not flamenco like. Just a few arm movments aren't enough. This program does nothing for me. I really liked them two seasons ago. They were radiant. Now, it's missing. Hope they find it again.
Tar/Mor are one of my favourite pairs and I'm so happy for them, that they delivered a good skate, it wasn't clean, but no falls. Their throws are just gorgeous. They don't own their music (yet?) For me it's still Aljona's and Bruno's music.
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I couldn't exactly tell if Alexa was putting her foot down on her throws a bit. That was probably what some of the judges thought. To me, it looked close.
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random comments:
Danny O'Shea is an amazing lifter
after Miura/Kihara's explosive success i hope japanese fed choose to develop pairs too and they won the gold again for best K&C reaction.
i hope Boikova/Koslovskii pull themselves together or else they'll get buried in the russian pairs field depth
Danny O'Shea is an amazing lifter
after Miura/Kihara's explosive success i hope japanese fed choose to develop pairs too and they won the gold again for best K&C reaction.
i hope Boikova/Koslovskii pull themselves together or else they'll get buried in the russian pairs field depth
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- Jun 6, 2018
I feel like the team that have suffered the most from the pandemic break have been B/K - it just totally stopped their momentum. I agree that it's a psychological issue for them right now though - I just wish she had her amazing confidence back because when they're on, they're so great. I believe he's been seen with a wrist injury recently too which can't have helped. She looked a million dollars here too - the dress and the make up was a stunning combo. Although it lost them the silver medal here, I hope they keep trying the 3S1E3S instead of the 3T2T2T because a) they'll need it if they want to win and b) as a fan, I think medalling with mistakes on elements that not many other teams are trying is totally fine - pushing themselves is admirable. Very intrigued to see where they'll go once Moskvina retires next year - the thing they need most is a confidence coach at this point.
I think M/K are gorgeous and floaty - I just wish that Marcotte was able to get the same out of M-T/M!
(too tired to type any more of my opinions before the FD - as much as I have missed the GP so much, I haven't missed the hours of missed sleep!)
I think M/K are gorgeous and floaty - I just wish that Marcotte was able to get the same out of M-T/M!
(too tired to type any more of my opinions before the FD - as much as I have missed the GP so much, I haven't missed the hours of missed sleep!)
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- Nov 24, 2006
Me too! Now that Japan has a competitive pair and with Takahashi in Dance, the Japanese Team could really challenge for a team medal.Yes, just woke up to this! T/M win, they held it together, and a M/K silver, wow....that team medal at the Olympics seems not that unreal now, does it! They might make the GPF!!!So happy with the result, will watch later.
I am happy for T/M and want to put the Candyman from 4 years out of my mind once and for all. I was happy for Knierim/Frazier too, and ecstatic for Jessica Calalang after being treated so horribly since USN. The pairs event was impressive, even though the danger of it all makes me enjoy it less.
I thought Boikova/Kozlovski were pretty blatantly overscored here compared to the other teams. I'm not sure why. I also thought it was pretty egregious in the SP. Don't get me wrong, I actually find them very entertaining and love their energy, but this was not their competition.
On another note, there's a lift I'd like to ban (or at least require it to get negative GOE, lol). The one where the woman is in a split position lying sideways hugging her knee. It is so, so ugly, with no redeeming qualities whatsoever — and here's the kicker for me — it seems like every single pair team is now doing this awful lift! I think the first team to do it, if I remember correctly was Savchenko/Solchowy back in the day. I thought it was awful then, and I think it's even more hideous now. Ban it, I say!
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