2022 U.S. Nationals: Senior Men's Free Skate

[TontoK]

[
Twitter is horrible. I feel traumatized when I see Twitter. People seem to forget that they are talking about real humans with real feelings. I would like to give Vincent a hug. He isn't responsible for the judges scores. He also isn't responsible for the selection criteria.

And don't you just know, that whoever makes the team is going to have a bunch of nuts just WAITING and HOPING that he screws up so they can shout I TOLD YOU SO!!!

 

[invisiblespiral]

YOU CANNOT LEAVE VINCENT OFF THE TEAM WITHOUT VIOLATING THE USFS REGULATIONS FOR TEAM SELECTION.

 

[Dpbthomas1]

Yes. I sometimes wish the question would get turned around. Jason gets vilified for not jumping quads, but very few skaters get vilified for not being able to do what HE does. Very few - if any - of the top skaters could likely execute the complicated choreography that Jason accomplishes. It is why there are TWO sets of marks. In my opinion, they are not particularly fairly weighted.

YES!!!!! This sport is supposed to be about athleticism AND artistry. They should be more evenly weighted, but it's not even close. And speaking of references to Jason as is artistry is his only strength .. it's not. His skating speed, skating skills, spins and yes, jumps - all require great skill and athleticism. And just try to find someone with the stamina to perform jam-packed choreo that he does

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Top 5 is impossible for Malinin. The ISU judges will take one look at his spins and steps particularly in his FP and be like yeeeeah nooooo. Kagiyama is a prodigy with the PCS scoring and spins to match his technical ability at such a young age. We can’t compare his success to Malinin. Best case scenario for Malinin is place there same as Jason but he is a question mark and could do way worse.

There are guys in those last two flights that are capable of a couple of quads and mature downright fantastic spins and PCS skating. Ilia will stick out and not in a good way among them.

Top 5 is unlikely for Malinin - but looking at Brown's personal best of 274, even if you slashed 25 points from Malinin's Nationals score it would clear that.

A clean Malinin would score above 280 which is top 5 potential. But it's a big gamble to get him to replicate his US nationals performances with the pressure of the Olympics.

To me, it's more important to give valuable experience to a potential future superstar versus giving a victory lap to a current US superstar.

 

[cheerknithanson]

Me right now.....

 

[Baron Vladimir]

My prediction:
4CC - Brown, Pulkinen, Ma
Oly - Chen, Malinin, Zhou
Worlds - Chen, Zhou, Brown
JWorlds - Malinin

 

[invisiblespiral]

My prediction:
4CC - Brown, Pulkinen, Ma
Oly - Chen, Malinin, Zhou
Worlds - Chen, Zhou, Brown
JWorlds - Malinin

If Brown's not going to the Olympics he's the first alternate and should probably be there in case someone else gets COVID.

 

[Mista Ekko]

But, the men usually don't perform to their ability which is why Brown is usually in the top flight at Worlds. He could very easily outscore everyone but Hanyu and Chen in the SP. BV is important but it really doesn't tell the whole story.

I think easily is not the best description of something like that happening,

He could pretty consistently score around mid 90s in the SP, That could
have him in the back end of the final group if 2-3 of the top guys don't deliver

 

[Horsefeathers]

I'm going to throw out my own (probably unpopular) opinion that attempted but failed quad jumps (and by fail I mean FALL anywhere in the process) should NOT get more points than a successfully completed triple. Rewards shouldn't be handed out for landing flat on one's butt (or face, as is happening more and more). Even completing the rotation and falling is still a big distraction in the midst of performance, so I just don't get the scoring system that rewards splats.

 

[Dpbthomas1]

Top 5 is unlikely for Malinin - but looking at Brown's personal best of 274, even if you slashed 25 points from Malinin's Nationals score it would clear that.

A clean Malinin would score above 280 which is top 5 potential. But it's a big gamble to get him to replicate his US nationals performances with the pressure of the Olympics.

To me, it's more important to give valuable experience to a potential future superstar versus giving a victory lap to a current US superstar.

The Olys is not seen as a training ground for experience, but an accomplishment for athletic goals achieved.

Malinin has 4 years to gain experience.

 

[mrrice]

The difference between this and the situation with Ross is that Ross had the 2nd place finish
But Vincent had the federation longevity argument and multiple Quads on his side against Ross

Malinin has both the 2nd place finish AND the federation longevity argument and multiple Quads

Basically the only argument against him is that everybody loves Jason

Well, Ross did have 2 Bronze Medals and the Silver in 2018. Also, Ross did land a ratified quad in 2018. Personally, I love Jason because he is consistent and the only skater to break 100 in the SP without a quad. There is also no doubt that international judges really respect what Jason does.

 

[Dpbthomas1]

I'm going to throw out my own (probably unpopular) opinion that attempted but failed quad jumps (and by fail I mean FALL anywhere in the process) should NOT get more points than a successfully completed triple. Rewards shouldn't be handed out for landing flat on one's butt (or face, as is happening more and more). Even completing the rotation and falling is still a big distraction in the midst of performance, so I just don't get the scoring system that rewards splats.

AMEN!

 

[Horsefeathers]

Are they going to play games with the timing on team announcements like they did with the actual skating?

GET ON WITH IT.

 

[mrrice]

I'm assuming you meant Vincent's

And I'm afraid I can't at all get behind the idea of leaving Vincent off the team

The only argument could be Jason or Ilia

Yes I did...I'll have to fix that.

 

[ks777]

Well, Ross did have 2 Bronze Medals and the Silver in 2018. Also, Ross did land a ratified quad in 2018. Personally, I love Jason because he is consistent and the only skater to break 100 in the SP without a quad. There is also no doubt that international judges really respect what Jason does.

did Jason break 100 in the SP without a quad internationally?

 

[purplecat]

However this decision goes I'm going to be gutted for someone but happy at the same time for another someone

 

[yume]

My prediction:
4CC - Brown, Pulkinen, Ma
Oly - Chen, Malinin, Zhou
Worlds - Chen, Zhou, Brown
JWorlds - Malinin

If Malinin goes to olys it would be weird to send him to JWC after. That's like an huge step backwards. It isn't like Hendrickx or Kurakova who had to do both events for some years because they were the only ones able to win spots.

 

[taikwan]

Because the points he gets for CO, step sequence and choreo sequence, some skaters gets them or more with just two jumping passes. They get more in a more spectacularly way. People love showy spectacle. That's why Usain Bolt had more success and is more known than Kenenisa Bekele.

Which is the problem .....losing the heart of why we love this sport (speaking for we who love the artistry). Figure skating is not wrestling, is not basketball hoops/baskets, is not...well, it's one of the few sports (gymnastics being one of the other) that recognizes the ARTistry ingredient that makes this sport so special. It was inevitable that it would be MORE.....BETTER...MORE DIFFICULTY...because that's the nature of all sports but how about MORE ARTISTRY, or more recognition for the artistry that is there? The part of skating that makes your heart sing, that produces tears, that makes memories of how you....felt....when you saw this artist perform his/her/their "sport" in a way that made you recognize that it can be both: art and sport. No...now we have 4 passes in the floor routines.....now we have not only quads but how many and yes. let's go for a quad axle. Where the hell does this end? I'll tell you where - exactly where injured sports figures now rehab in the hope of walking normally again. This is all kinds of screwed up. Because we all know those skinny little girls will inevitably develop (naturally) hips etc as nature intended - to where they can't rotate as fast nor as many revolutions. and other scenarios for both guys and girls. MORE, FASTER, MORE and ....will they finally resort to no music because...what's the point of music interpretation when you can fit another tumbling pass in there, another triple/quad combination?

 

[cheerknithanson]

My heart is POUNDING

 

[mrrice]

Me right now.....