- Joined
- Jul 1, 2007
The score Evan received for Interpretation is truly one of the most retarded displays of judging I've ever seen.
Mens Free Skate
- Thread starter Vicky458
- Start date
The score Evan received for Interpretation is truly one of the most retarded displays of judging I've ever seen.
I'll throw in my once a season two cents worth. Johnny's quality of skating was superior to Evan's. Evan flailed around like big bird, his knees were wobbly and his ankles looked collapsed on his jump landings. Frankly, he just looked gangly and inelegant. I guess they don't look at real artistry anymore. Evan scoring a personal best based on this FS was a crock. I have seen him skate cleaner and score lower. So much for the "unbiased" system.
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
Totally agree!!!!!!!!! This is one of the reason that is bringing this sport down!
I rooted for Johnny this year and last year. I can honestly say that last year, Evan deserved the win, but this year he is not!
Evan had been held up in both SP and LP.
I am proud of Johnny for skating like what he did after Evan. He is a different skater compared with his last year. Way to go, Johnny!
- Joined
- Jun 21, 2003
To me, it was one of those "whole versus sum-of-the-parts decisions". Just watching without trying to keep score, Johnny's performance was smooth, effrtless (until the last two jumping passes), and coherent. Evan's was helter-skelter, this is good, that was bad, is he trying to be Zorro? (no that was yesterday). Johnny won, hands down.
But when I looked at the protocols just now, I couldn't really find much to nit-pick (except all those +3's for Lysacek's footwork. I liked Melissa Buganhui's better, LOL.)
Evan had 61.58 in base values for his jumps. Weir, 58.08 -- but it would have been 60.83 if he hadn't doubled the second jump if his Lutz combo.
Johnny won the program component battle, 79.14 to 78.72.
Johnny got a total of +3.15 GOE on his jumps, Evan only + 0.57. Evan was properly docked on his quad combo, 3A combo, and solo 3A.
Add it all up, that's how it came out. C..O..P.
BTW, given that both skaters were destined to end up isomewhere in the 240s (and similarly, mutatis mutandis, for the other disciplines), a tie should happen in one of the four disciplines at Nationals about once every 250 years.
Come back in the year 2258 and check it out!
But when I looked at the protocols just now, I couldn't really find much to nit-pick (except all those +3's for Lysacek's footwork. I liked Melissa Buganhui's better, LOL.)
Evan had 61.58 in base values for his jumps. Weir, 58.08 -- but it would have been 60.83 if he hadn't doubled the second jump if his Lutz combo.
Johnny won the program component battle, 79.14 to 78.72.
Johnny got a total of +3.15 GOE on his jumps, Evan only + 0.57. Evan was properly docked on his quad combo, 3A combo, and solo 3A.
Add it all up, that's how it came out. C..O..P.
BTW, given that both skaters were destined to end up isomewhere in the 240s (and similarly, mutatis mutandis, for the other disciplines), a tie should happen in one of the four disciplines at Nationals about once every 250 years.
Come back in the year 2258 and check it out!
- Joined
- Mar 22, 2004
Foolish Mathman, there is no 'whole' in CoP, there is only the sum-of-the-tricks.
I was very disappointed with the result of the mens competition. Johnny was better. Evan was shaky and a bit sloppy. I think Johnny is in a good place going to Worlds. I hope he can perform like this there. Perhaps a international panel will appreciate his very classic and pristine style. Way to go johnny!
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2004
It was all very exciting & interesting. I think I'm stuck in the past as to judging. I prefer to see the beauty shine on the ice rather than the number of points a skater can rack up. I agree Johnny needs a little more difficulty but for me he's the better skater. I, also, preferred Bradley's skates over Abbott's. Ryan can always put a smile on my face & Johnny can put tears in my eyes.
Do you agree with the margin of victory here, Mathman? I think it is too small.mathman said:
I loved the quote from http://www.iceskatingintnl.com/current/content/senmen08.htm
- Joined
- Jul 1, 2007
This right here is the biggest problem. It's not even a half-point difference between the two.
Ridiculous.
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2006
Whew, good to get a reality check at GS. I can't pretend to be unbiased but just the fact of Evan getting a PB for that wobbly performance is enough to discredit the results, IMO. There's no way this program beat last year's.
Tonight leaves me very puzzled as to why skating commentators (supposedly experts) are so ******* polite about judging. Do they EVER question the judges' calls? Why the heck not?
However, I'm proud of Johnny for his gorgeously confident skate and his calm public comments so far.
I'm sure he can figure out how to add some technical "insurance" to make it harder for biased judging to take away his win. Onward and upward!
Tonight leaves me very puzzled as to why skating commentators (supposedly experts) are so ******* polite about judging. Do they EVER question the judges' calls? Why the heck not?
However, I'm proud of Johnny for his gorgeously confident skate and his calm public comments so far.
I'm sure he can figure out how to add some technical "insurance" to make it harder for biased judging to take away his win. Onward and upward!My thoughts: though I've never loved Weir, IMO he should've won tonight. In partic I respect that he did a quad, even if it was 2 footed. This will only help him down the line, just as it's helped Evan to be trying quads since last year (both of them are doing what I always wished Todd would do). After watching them both I said to myself Johnny had to have won bec Evan did have several scratchy landings. OTOH, flailing arms and all, he did look like he had the better footwork sequences and his spins seemed faster and maybe a bit more centered. National comps are historically overmarked for everyone and I think both Johnny and Evan received inflated scores. The fact that it ended in a tie IS amazing though, you gotta admit that. Oh yeah, I agree with whoever said that Abbott was better than Carriere.
- Joined
- Oct 31, 2006
I SO agree with you on Jeremy Abbott.
The PCS scores between him and Stephen should not have been anywhere close to one another. I really wish Jeremy could have won bronze and his 1st trip to senior Worlds. Oh well, I'm really looking forward to watching him skate more and to see how he continues to develop.Quote:
In comparing the style and finesse of the two performance [sic] back to back, Lysacek's program was like butchering hogs, while Weir's was neurosurgery.
This said it perfectly.
The only fault I could see why Johnny's skate was his spins looked a *little* slow. Johnny won in my eyes. I'm so proud of him for holding it all together!
He is a far more pure skater.
In comparing the style and finesse of the two performance [sic] back to back, Lysacek's program was like butchering hogs, while Weir's was neurosurgery.
This said it perfectly.
The only fault I could see why Johnny's skate was his spins looked a *little* slow. Johnny won in my eyes. I'm so proud of him for holding it all together!
He is a far more pure skater.
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
To be fair, I thought that Evan got higher LP score at Nationals last year. So I went to the GS archives. Here is the copy of Evan's last year's LP performance at the Nationals. I still think that this year Evan should not get over 160 for his LP.
Evan Lysacek: "Carmen"
4T-3T. 3A. 3R. 3S. Flying sit change sit. Death drop to sit. 3A-3T. 3F-2T-2R. Circular steps. 3Lz. 2A. Combination spin. Straightline steps. Losing steam. Combination spin. Great skate for Evan!
Tech: 91.13
Comp: 76.76
Total: 169.89
Competition Total: 248.88
Evan Lysacek: "Carmen"
4T-3T. 3A. 3R. 3S. Flying sit change sit. Death drop to sit. 3A-3T. 3F-2T-2R. Circular steps. 3Lz. 2A. Combination spin. Straightline steps. Losing steam. Combination spin. Great skate for Evan!
Tech: 91.13
Comp: 76.76
Total: 169.89
Competition Total: 248.88
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2006
Thanks for that. So the commentators made a mistake saying this was his PB. Seems like his technical score was appropriately lower this year... but can anyone explain why his component scores are higher this year than last year? (78.72 this year; 76.76 last year)
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
I agree. From Scott's answer to turn down the comment about judging, I felt that the commentators have a lot of opinions about it, but they don't want to say it publicly.
I enjoyed Ryan Bradley's routine to "Charlie Chaplin" a lot (as well as his Godfather SP). Abbott reminded me of John Curry in terms of line & overall grace & body type. I was a bit surprised with the bronze medalist, even moreso than Evan winning the gold. No one routine stood out to me, unlike the ladies last night. Yet, I would have to say that Johnny's was the cleanest of all the men I watched tonight.
In the past, I always thought that Johnny was better artistically than Evan, but Evan is catching up, though I don't particularly care for his long grasshopper look, as it looks too gangly & uncontrolled to me. Too bad Johnny didn't play to his strength, that is a routine that would emphasis his qualities, and easily break a potential tie.
Here's wishing the Men's World Team all the best!
***& may Johnny have a better program next year***
In the past, I always thought that Johnny was better artistically than Evan, but Evan is catching up, though I don't particularly care for his long grasshopper look, as it looks too gangly & uncontrolled to me. Too bad Johnny didn't play to his strength, that is a routine that would emphasis his qualities, and easily break a potential tie.
Here's wishing the Men's World Team all the best!
***& may Johnny have a better program next year***
There are things Johnny can do, and needs to do, to get more points in his LP but he should have won anyway.
Lysacek didn't get properly deducted for the mistakes he made, plain and simple.
Also, according to these judges, Lysacek's straight-line footwork sequence is the BEST FOOTWORK SEQUENCE THAT HAS EVER BEEN PERFORMED.
