ISU publishes the list of AINs allowed to take part in the Olympic Qualification

[Mathman]

I still think that the drug issue is the most important part of these sanctions....

To me, it is a matter of scale. People have always found ways to cheat at sports. The Greek hero Hippomenes conspired with Aphrodite to fix a race against the fleet-footed huntress Atalanta, partisan of Artemis. I hope Zeus banned him from ever racing against a woman again. (Atalantis also defeated the father of Achilles in wrestling and sailed with Jason on the Argonaut.)

And people have also always been able to nurse grudges and avarice into warfare.

What are the consequences? A cheating athlete is awarded a laurel wreath that he doesn't deserve. A million people die.

IMHO, these considerations do not belong in the same conversation -- they are not in the same moral weight class. (By the way, the name Atalantis means "equal in weight" (to a man).)

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

After 2011 Japan earthquake it took Russia a few days to organize a whole new worlds! Making and saving the isu millions and millions! Getting 2 skaters for that is terrible! And that’s just one thing

Ohhh, right! They heroically salvaged Worlds a mere 14 years ago! How could we forget about that incredibly monumental, critical contribution to the world of figure skating as we know it.

In that case, they deserve 5 entries in every discipline, and we should just give them all the Olympic medals right now.

You earned it, Russia. Spasibo x 10000000!!!!

 

[saine]

The decision is being appealed to CAS apparently.

Российские фигуристы готовятся оспаривать отказ ISU в нейтральном статусе в CAS

Такая возможность сейчас прорабатывается, началась подготовка документов. По информации Спортса’‘, российская сторона обратилась за помощью к швейцарским юристам, которые изучают все возможности.

m.sports.ru

 

[4everchan]

The decision is being appealed to CAS apparently.

Российские фигуристы готовятся оспаривать отказ ISU в нейтральном статусе в CAS

Такая возможность сейчас прорабатывается, началась подготовка документов. По информации Спортса’‘, российская сторона обратилась за помощью к швейцарским юристам, которые изучают все возможности.

m.sports.ru

as expected.

 

[lariko]

Again, fighting the wrong fight, waisting resources on one athlete, one competition. It's like they never learn.

 

[thatdarncat]

I can't see them winning an appeal, I do think the ISU should publish why skaters weren't given neutral status though for transparency.

I am not sure Boikova/Koslovskii would have been granted neutral status as I read somewhere they are on the sanction list? Not sure if that true though, maybe M/G are sanctioned as well which is why they didn't pass neutrality.

 

[AlexBreeze]

The decision is being appealed to CAS apparently.

Российские фигуристы готовятся оспаривать отказ ISU в нейтральном статусе в CAS

Такая возможность сейчас прорабатывается, началась подготовка документов. По информации Спортса’‘, российская сторона обратилась за помощью к швейцарским юристам, которые изучают все возможности.

m.sports.ru

Chronology:

Communication 2680
It is the decision of the ISU Council to grant the status of AIN to Eligible Nominated Athletes and is subject to an appeal to CAS according to article 26 of the ISU Constitution.

Communication 2708
The current decision of the ISU Council on the AIN eligibility list is final with regard to all applicants and not subject to appeal. This reflects the exceptional and sensitive nature of the current process and aims to ensure procedural integrity and consistency across all applicants respecting their right to privacy.

They responded to the media that could not be appealed to CAS either.

Of course, ISU cannot ban a right to appeal to CAS. But I think there is just no chance to finish it by September.

 

[gmyers]

Again, fighting the wrong fight, waisting resources on one athlete, one competition. It's like they never learn.

Russia doesn’t have anything else to do in sports but sue! Are they flying athletes all over the world anymore for hundreds of comps? No. Are they hosting? No.

 

[lariko]

Russia doesn’t have anything else to do in sports but sue! Are they flying athletes all over the world anymore for hundreds of comps? No. Are they hosting? No.

I guess. But, like, I would rather they picked another fight I could get behind more. Like JGP for junior athletes. Now, that's a worthy cause. M/G and S/B going to the dead-end Olympics? Meh.

 

[gmyers]

The difference between this neutrality and previous neutralities are in that previous neutralities they could compete everywhere and with Russian judges present upping the median. Now you have a girl named Adelia Petrosian in front of an American judge in Beijing skating first. Any American judge gives an “Adelia Petrosian” they never heard of in their life skating first 5’s in pcs or lower.

Maybe a triple axel and 3lz+3lp impresses them and they boost it! I don’t know

 

[Mathman]

Any American judge gives an “Adelia Petrosian” they never heard of in their life skating first 5’s in pcs or lower.

I think there is a pretty good possibility that judges from various countries will have heard of Adelia Pretrosian. If not, I will be glad to send those judges the link to this thread to get them up to speed.

 

[lariko]

The difference between this neutrality and previous neutralities are in that previous neutralities they could compete everywhere and with Russian judges present upping the median. Now you have a girl named Adelia Petrosian in front of an American judge in Beijing skating first. Any American judge gives an “Adelia Petrosian” they never heard of in their life skating first 5’s in pcs or lower.

Maybe a triple axel and 3lz+3lp impresses them and they boost it! I don’t know

She has international scores (junior) as well as Gumennik from 2021. They can use it as a benchmark. Her score was around 210, Samodelkina was around 205. Given Samodelkina lost about 12 points since 2021, I guess she could still score around 200. What Gumennik could possibly score is anyone's guess. his best was 263 in seniors.

 

[Skating91]

Like... why would you take a drug/supplement if it is not beneficial? Your position makes zero sense. Russians were caught using it way after it was official and clearly banned.

They're high level athletes with an elementary school level education. They take something because they think or hope it might help. People take fish oil, apple cider vinegar, Chinese herbal medicine, nootropics, naturopathy because they think it works. In tennis Nadal would avoid touch a white line when he left the court because he thought something bad would happen if he touched it, Djokovic thinks not eating gluten and teaming up with spiritual guru Pepe Imaz made him the best in the world. They think it gives them an advantage!

These are the best athletes in the world but most have no education or critical thinking skills.

WADA is just as bad. They had no proof that Meldonium helped athletes when they banned it, simply their justification for banning Meldonium was that athletes had the intent of gaining an advantage when taking it. Of course they think taking something helps them. They take an energy gel between sets because they intend to gain an advantage they would otherwise not have.

Meldonium came under suspicion in February 2014. You will have to cast your mind what was going on in the world February 2014 to understand why this product that had been around since the 70's suddenly became this magic potion.

 

[Skating91]

Worse, ISU would remove American skaters from international competitions.

The ISU didn't 2001-21, why would they now?

 

[dorispulaski]

Omega Fish Oil is not AFAIK performance enhancing, but it definitely lowers triglycerides.

Fish oil

Understand how fish oil might improve heart health and the possible risks of taking too much fish oil.

www.mayoclinic.org

 

[Skating91]

The decision is being appealed to CAS apparently.

Российские фигуристы готовятся оспаривать отказ ISU в нейтральном статусе в CAS

Такая возможность сейчас прорабатывается, началась подготовка документов. По информации Спортса’‘, российская сторона обратилась за помощью к швейцарским юристам, которые изучают все возможности.

m.sports.ru

They at least need to know why they are being banned from the Olympics. They are owed that. They ISU should be transparent and held accountable.

For all we know the ISU have made a mistake.

Again, fighting the wrong fight, waisting resources on one athlete, one competition. It's like they never learn.

If the ISU release the reasons and evidence for why they should be banned from the Olympics, likely the appeal is dropped tomorrow. This is the ISU's fault for having zero transparency. They come off as untrustworthy by withholding proof and evidence.

 

[Arigato]

Rafa Nadal used routines with white lines to increase focus, not because he thought it gave him an advantage.

As for education in figure skaters, to suggest they're ignorant people with an elementary school education is as erroneous as can be and, frankly, an insult to all skaters around the world. Many skaters have already completed high school and are currently working on college degrees (or already have them) as they study right along with their sports training.

 

[gmyers]

I think there is a pretty good possibility that judges from various countries will have heard of Adelia Pretrosian. If not, I will be glad to send those judges the link to this thread to get them up to speed.

She did two tiny junior competitions 4 years ago. I just don’t know why anyone would know her aside from the people who judged those comps

They're high level athletes with an elementary school level education. They take something because they think or hope it might help. People take fish oil, apple cider vinegar, Chinese herbal medicine, nootropics, naturopathy because they think it works. In tennis Nadal would avoid touch a white line when he left the court because he thought something bad would happen if he touched it, Djokovic thinks not eating gluten and teaming up with spiritual guru Pepe Imaz made him the best in the world. They think it gives them an advantage!

These are the best athletes in the world but most have no education or critical thinking skills.

WADA is just as bad. They had no proof that Meldonium helped athletes when they banned it, simply their justification for banning Meldonium was that athletes had the intent of gaining an advantage when taking it. Of course they think taking something helps them. They take an energy gel between sets because they intend to gain an advantage they would otherwise not have.

Meldonium came under suspicion in February 2014. You will have to cast your mind what was going on in the world February 2014 to understand why this product that had been around since the 70's suddenly became this magic potion.

2016 that was the year of meldonium and they had to throw out a lot of the suspensions like for bobrova because of their ingorance of it being a placebo

I guess. But, like, I would rather they picked another fight I could get behind more. Like JGP for junior athletes. Now, that's a worthy cause. M/G and S/B going to the dead-end Olympics? Meh.

I thought they tried that

She has international scores (junior) as well as Gumennik from 2021. They can use it as a benchmark. Her score was around 210, Samodelkina was around 205. Given Samodelkina lost about 12 points since 2021, I guess she could still score around 200. What Gumennik could possibly score is anyone's guess. his best was 263 in seniors.

I believe vanishing for 4 years will matter! We’ll see

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

The difference between this neutrality and previous neutralities are in that previous neutralities they could compete everywhere and with Russian judges present upping the median. Now you have a girl named Adelia Petrosian in front of an American judge in Beijing skating first. Any American judge gives an “Adelia Petrosian” they never heard of in their life skating first 5’s in pcs or lower.

Maybe a triple axel and 3lz+3lp impresses them and they boost it! I don’t know

I mean, Adelia is a strong skater. But Adelia (outside of Russia) isn't exactly a 9's/70 PCS level skater, though other than maybe a perfect Levito and Sakamoto, I don't really think anyone should be getting 70+ PCS, IMO. But her tech content (with quads) should be enough for her to win if she hits it all. Any judge though is obviously being out of line if they give her 5's - which of course they won't. I can see a judge holding her to high-7's/low-8's if she makes errors. Russia of course will be pushing hard for her PCS, but there aren't really events that can boost her PCS throughout the season, so they'll likely have to judge her absolutely (imagine that!) rather than relative to other performances/scores they've seen.

Also given the anomalous nature of her competing, I highly doubt a judge wouldn't have heard or seen her. Whoever the Russian entry ended up being the fed would invest every effort possible sure that everyone knows who they are before the Olympics, and make every effort possible (well, hopefully not EVERY effort...) to make sure they win.

 

[FlossieH]

The difference between this neutrality and previous neutralities are in that previous neutralities they could compete everywhere and with Russian judges present upping the median. Now you have a girl named Adelia Petrosian in front of an American judge in Beijing skating first. Any American judge gives an “Adelia Petrosian” they never heard of in their life skating first 5’s in pcs or lower.

Maybe a triple axel and 3lz+3lp impresses them and they boost it! I don’t know

The judges will know who she is.