Jennifer Kirk - How skating gets its groove back

[visaliakid]

Jennifer Kirk's latest blog topic shows she is not a fan of IJS as it is currently constructed and implimented, and push come to shove whould prefer a return to the 6.0 system. She tackles the ills of the sport on this and other issues with her usual candor.

This blog has already stirred up the pot with comments on it at her Facebook page. Read it here, and have at it folks!

 

[Kwanford Wife]

As usual, Jennifer is spot on... if long-term, hard core fans can't tell what the heck is going on ice - even worse the announcers ala worlds 2008 - what exactly does the ISU think will happen to this sport?

I know there are fans who enjoy the CoP and feel that those of us who don't, are simply resistant to change and need to get with the program, but since the njs skating has lost its edge (HA! I'm puny) and continues to be more of the same...

 

[Medusa]

if long-term, hard core fans can't tell what the heck is going on ice - even worse the announcers ala worlds 2008 - what exactly does the ISU think will happen to this sport?

The announcer-reason is a difficult one. There were wuz-robbed announcers before COP (Hamilton...).

And one of the German commentators said after Nakano's freeskate at Worlds 2008, that he predicted a 4th place for her. He was spot-on.

Same goes for Chan's score in the SP at Worlds 2009, the British announcers were completely okay with the score and the placement.

 

[i love to skate]

I always find it interesting that people think just because the US is struggling with skating viewership the whole world must be and all sorts of problems need to be addressed. Well the whole world is not struggling. Asia is literally exploding with skating interest and it is the most popular sport. Canadians are now familiar with the names of Rochette and Chan. We have a skating version of Dancing with the Stars starting in October which pairs hockey players and figure skaters together which will garner even more interest for skating. When Worlds were held in Sweden in 2008 the stands were filled with extremely knowledgeable and appreciative fans.

In my opinion, it isn't that the scoring system needs to be overhauled or that the ISU needs to do this that and the other thing. Perhaps the USFSA is the one that should be responsible for fixing their country's problem. They should get a better marketing department and prepare their skaters better so that "star" can be born. Get some new announcers in the booth, run a segment on the NJS during broadcasts, emphasize the difficulty or athleticism of the skaters, get the skaters doing meet and greets and interviews. It doesn't seem too hard to me.

 

[Tonichelle]

the main reason it's not booming in the US as far as TV rights is because the ISU keeps upping the price, the ratings don't support what the networks are shelling out. So they don't sign up for it...

Scott Hamilton is not single-handedly responsible for the bad commentary in this country. None of the 'experts' outside of Paul Wylie (ABC) and Tracy Wilson (NBC) even seem to take teh time to understand it. The others just gripe and complain about it and fail to learn what's going on. It's different, so therefore it must be wrong - never mind they were all screaming for a new and improved system. Now they seem to have gotten it and they still aren't happy, because it's not what they're used to.

Problem for the average viewer who does not come online or research the sport on their own - chances are they don't remember Tracy or Paul from their skating days and so they come off as dry and boring (because that's how they're shown on the TV)... whereas skaters like Dick Button and Scott Hamilton are VERY well known and go hand in hand with skating in the mind of the viewer. So while Paul and Tracy can quickly show how the CoP works what sticks in the mind of the viewer is "Scott/Dick said it sucks, and they know what they're talking about."

It's correct to say this is an American problem more so than an International problem, and Asia's picking up the bill as far as teh ISU is concerned so they aren't seeing the pinch as much as the USFSA... *shrugs* it ebbs and flows. The US, IMHO, will NEVER see the ratings for skating that it did in the mid 90s.... unless another psycho whacks another girl in a pwetty pink dress... but I have a feeling it'd have there'd have to be blood shed to get the interest teh whack heard round the world got in 94....


there isn't one single thing that killed the interest in the sport of figure skating in the US... it is a multitude of things... we are a nation of the less than 30 second attention span (thank you Sesame Street)... skating's lucky to have that decade of glory.

 

[evangeline]

As much as I usually enjoy Jennifer's blog posts, I have to admit that I disagree with many of her points about CoP.

For instance, she says that "due to the technical requirements under the new system...the sport is starting to look more like girl's skating" as opposed to ladies' skating. I'm not sure if blaming CoP for making figure skating prepubescent is entirely correct. For instance, the last three Olympics under the 6.0 system saw the crowning of 3 teenagers (one of them being a fourteen-year-old) as Olympic champions. Ironically, the only Olympic competition under CoP was won by Shizuka Arakawa, the oldest ladies' champion in over 80 years at the grand old age of 24.

I do agree with her assessment about the dubious aesthetic quality of the frantic footwork and pretzel-positions we often see in CoP ladies' skating, but should the emphasis be on the "beauty of a skater’s performance, their edge quality, and maturity" instead of triple-triples and the like, as Jennifer says? Figure skating is still a sport, after all, and evaluating jumps is a whole lot less subjective than evaluating a skater's grace and maturity. That being said, edge quality, performance and the like are very important and I don't want to see figure skating devolve into some sort of soulless jumpfest. But it's not like 6.0 emphasized grace and maturity over jumping anyways.

And IA with whoever who said that this was more of an American problem as opposed to an international problem.

 

[zephyrskates]

I think that complaining about the COP is futile, there is no way that skating will regress and go back to the 6.0 system. Give the COP time, in a few years there will be more skaters and fans who will be more familiar with the COP than the 6.0.

The only thing that can be done right now is to explain the system better. I agree with the other posters that it would help the sport if the judging system be explained to viewers. I think that the commentators are trying their best and are actually getting better in explaining the system. Hopefully, newer commentators who are more familiar with the COP (Michelle, I love you, I cried, and exulted with you, but GIRL... Our commentating needs a lot of work!) will be able to take the reins from Dick and Scott.

Americans tend to not follow sports when they are not dominating, and we may hate to admit it but everything is getting more global. All sports are experience that ebb and flow. In tennis, the last men's grandslam champion from the USA was andy roddick in 2003. Swimming is booming because of Michael Phelps (I'm not a fan, but you have to admire his achievements). We can only cross our fingers and hope that the US can find its Phelps of skating.

 

[Tonichelle]

that's another problem with skating, most champions take it and run... Michelle Kwan being pretty much the only exception...

now, we have a world champion going into the games (Evan Lysacek) he'll end up with quite a bit of media attention from that alone... and he'll suffer GREATLY from the media if he falters (kinda like the backlash that hit Johnny after he didn't deliver in the long as he did in the short in 06) there's that 'great' saying "winning isn't everything, it's the ONLY thing" and Americans take that to heart... which is fine, it's a championship. there can only be one winner (2002 pairs being the exception)

but it's hard to get behind any of our kids that win because then they leave and we're back at square one.

 

[Particle Man]

The US, IMHO, will NEVER see the ratings for skating that it did in the mid 90s.... unless another psycho whacks another girl in a pwetty pink dress... but I have a feeling it'd have there'd have to be blood shed to get the interest teh whack heard round the world got in 94....

More America-bashing from Toni. What a surprise. I have news for you Toni, the braindead variety of Americans who fit your stereotype would NEVER watch skating. A momentary news frenzy in '94 came and went, and is meaningless. Hordes of young girls/fans didn't flock to skating because of a knee-whack. People flocked to skating in the 90's because we had superstars like Michelle Kwan.

I think that complaining about the COP is futile, there is no way that skating will regress and go back to the 6.0 system. Give the COP time, in a few years there will be more skaters and fans who will be more familiar with the COP than the 6.0.

Futile? Not futile to try to fix something that's horribly broken.

Regress? That implies going to a more imperfect form. In fact, 6.0 is perfect for skating, and CoP can never be. 6.0 just has to have controls. You know, the judging oversight that it needed and never got. Instead it got replaced with an abysmal mess. Yay for Jenny Kirk, I hope more skaters speak out against CoP.

Time? It's been in place since '03, and the sport dies more every year in the US. CoP isn't the whole problem but it's a BIG problem.

People need to focus on the real problem -- speedy. Get him OUT.

 

[Buttercup]

Entire post

Exactly. Some things in the current system certainly need to be reconsidered, but CoP doesn't seem to have had an adverse effect on public interest in other countries.

I'm not sure if blaming CoP for making figure skating prepubescent is entirely correct. For instance, the last three Olympics under the 6.0 system saw the crowning of 3 teenagers (one of them being a fourteen-year-old) as Olympic champions. Ironically, the only Olympic competition under CoP was won by Shizuka Arakawa, the oldest ladies' champion in over 80 years at the grand old age of 24.

Not only that, but many of the current top skaters are not particularly young. Yu-Na and Mao are teenagers, sure, but both will turn 19 next month. Joannie is 23, Caro is 22, the Finnish ladies are over twenty, as are Miki Ando, Sarah Meier, Yukari Nakano - it's a pretty long list. Many of them are elegant, graceful, and musical skaters. So Kirk's argument, in this case, fails for me.

The American ladies tend to retire young, often to go to college (which is great, of course). But this means that the US is the country most likely to be sending very young skaters into major events, and then there should be no surprise if skating is perceived as a sport for little girls. Not to mention all the hype around these young up and comers (e.g. Meissner a few years ago, Zhang, Nagasu).

It goes without saying, of course, that the competitors in the other disciplines are usually older than the ladies, but I'm not sure if the more casual fans in the US are even aware of this.

I do agree with her assessment about the dubious aesthetic quality of the frantic footwork and pretzel-positions we often see in CoP ladies' skating.

And sadly, this problem is not limited to the ladies.

Americans tend to not follow sports when they are not dominating, and we may hate to admit it but everything is getting more global. All sports are experience that ebb and flow. In tennis, the last men's grandslam champion from the USA was andy roddick in 2003. Swimming is booming because of Michael Phelps (I'm not a fan, but you have to admire his achievements). We can only cross our fingers and hope that the US can find its Phelps of skating.

My country is by no means a sports powerhouse, so I've never felt interest only based on whether "our" athletes are successful. But I realize this is not the case everywhere. The interesting thing is that again this appears to be more of an issue in the US - look at the reactions European and NA skaters get in S. Korea and Japan, clearly the fans there are interested in more than just Mao and Yu-Na.

 

[i love to skate]

Time? It's been in place since '03, and the sport dies more every year in the US. CoP isn't the whole problem but it's a BIG problem.

It wasn't fully implemented until 2005 though. So that is only four full years. If skating continues to struggle in the US then the USFSA needs to find solutions to their problems. COP isn't creating these issues in other countries.

 

[Olympia]

I reluctantly have to agree that the perceived slump in skating is largely an American phenomenon, not a skating phenomenon in general. Certainly Japanese skating, at least in singles, is flourishing, and we all benefit, because we get to see skaters like Mao Asada. Canada seems to be in fine fettle. And look at little South Korea, which can now attract skaters who don't even get televised in the U.S., all because skating is the biggest thing in Seoul since Internet cafes--and of course, because of YuNa. I can't begrudge it to them, though I certainly (in the nicest possible way) envy them deeply. I also envy Canada.

Since the sports that have replaced skating on American TV seem to be auto racing and some sort of loud-voiced wrestling, I can't be happy with the situation over here. As one of you mentioned, Americans don't tend to watch sports where Americans aren't at the top of the rankings. Thank goodness for YouTube! As for CoP, I don't understand it well enough to make a reasoned argument. I would point out that the incidence of quads done by men seems to have declined since the advent of CoP, though I don't know whether it is a result of the new system or just a coincidence--and an effect of Elvis Stojko having left the building.

 

[vlaurend]

I would point out that the incidence of quads done by men seems to have declined since the advent of CoP, though I don't know whether it is a result of the new system or just a coincidence--and an effect of Elvis Stojko having left the building.

The reduction in the number of quad attempts is definitely due to the new judging system, but on the other hand, the scandal at the 2002 Olympics was due to the old judging system so i wouldn't ever want to go back to that. I agree that figure skating does best in the U.S. when we have a female world champion. So we should work on that. Oh, we should also reduce the number of channels people have to choose from when picking which sports to watch, and we should make skating cheaper so more people can get involved in it and relate to it. . .

 

[Tonichelle]

More America-bashing from Toni.

wow... never thought I'd see THAT one on here

A momentary news frenzy in '94 came and went, and is meaningless. Hordes of young girls/fans didn't flock to skating because of a knee-whack.

Read my post again, dearheart, and fear not. I am not talking about little girls going to a rink to learn the sport. As long as they're allowed their tutus, skates, and leotards little girls will be flocking to all things girly (and there's nothing wrong with that, this tomboy just never had any need or want to do that sort of thing)... however RATINGS are what sells a sport to a network especially one of the three powerhouse "free" national networks that have - at one time or another - carried skating. ABC/ESPN dropped the sport.. after taking it up when CBS finally had their fill (CBS really made a bundle thanks to teh knee whack) which CBS took it from ABC IIRC... NBC took care of the serious professional competitions while FOX and CBS went for the cheesier ones...

it doesn't sell as much any more... the faces of the 90s are now the voices of the 2000s... they were charismatic on and off the ice (maybe not always in competition, Kurt Browning -to me- became an entirely different skater upon retirement) they were the ones that were on every single weekend in the winter... you could count on them

now we have skaters who last MAYBE four seasons and there's no where else for them to go but a couple of disson shows... pro skating was all but done away with thanks to the ISU taking it over with their dang pro-ams... so, yeah, there's a lot that's not good... but was it really any different before, say, 1989? or even 85?

The popularity of the sport amongst the diehards isn't what's going to put it back on the national networks in America... it will only happen when it becomes marketable for said networks... getting rid of the CoP is not going to solve the problem, they were having issues with ratings well before that.


There's something to be said about how ratings ebb and flow... Americans are teh ones watching and thereby deciding what will be on our national programming... and just like in politics, just because the masses vote/watch one way doesn't mean all of us will. I am not BASHING America -I could rant on for days about how you are so off the mark, but I fear that's what you're going for- I'm merely pointing out that it's not some bit of judging that caused the networks to let go.

 

[Tinymavy15]

Jenny is not the first to blame CoP for the drop in TV ratings, but I still don't find the argument convincing. Others have already mentioned that in other countries that popularity of the sport has in fact increased since 2003. It is not like 6.0 was easy for the causal fan to understand. If you didn't watch the short program, you were muddled by a a maze of A has to beat C in order for B to win, but D cannot beat C if A wants a medal. Not to mention all the political stuff (which has not stopped, but that is another story).

The argument that the sport is being overtaken by "little girls" is not really valid either since our national champion is in her 20's and Jenny herself said she has been receiving zero press while the "little girls" in other sports, Michelle Wie and Shawn Johnson received plenty of media in their respective sports compared with Caroline, Mirari and Rachel.

The fact is, americans were drawn into the sport with the nancy/tonya drama and had a decade long love-affair with Michelle Kwan. Both of those periods are over and a new Michelle has not risen up so the american public lost interest. They do not care about the sport as much as they were interested in one star, who is no longer there. I guess it is like how everybody was talking about swimming last year with Micheal Phelps. If Phelps does not race in 2012 and there is no young american phenom to take his place, americans will focus on another sport.

 

[Tonichelle]

you are dead on, Tiny... especially that last statement!

 

[antmanb]

Well I think the overall premise that COP is the evil end of skating days that she opens with is just sensationalist reporting (well she does want to be a journalist!). When you actually look at the number of things she says about the decline and what is needed to boost it - very little of it is COP specific.

The problem with viewing figures in the US could be to do with COP but IMO it has much more to do with lacking a superstar. In Europe the men are the superstars in skating (at least as much if not more so than the women). In the US is ladies and ladies only. The US lost it's third place at Worlds and Olys in the ladies field so that shows you how the interest much be going in the states.

Jenny mentions the education of the fans, but that has always been an issue. Casual fans not knowing a lutz from a toe-loop wouldn't be any different under 6.0 or under COP. they still need to know.

The integrity of the judging will, for me, always be in question for as long as the judes mark annonymously. This will not end for me until we see which judges gave which marks and are held accountable. Jenny mentions this but makes it sound like only a return to 6.0 can allow for this, when that is not true.

The COP still has some flaws that need fixing, but they could easily be ironed out in the course of the next few years.

Ant

 

[AmEagle3313]

I have a long comment about the popularity issue (focusing mostly on ladies, because I can remember their names right now):

I live in the U.S., and I do agree with some of the statements about people here focusing on sports where we have a legitimate shot at winning. Internally, we have a deep ladies field, as there are several who could walk away with the National Championship, but when those top two are placed into the Olympic lineup, their chances dim significantly. I don't think that's really the problem though...I truly believe it's the Code of Points (as it's set up now.) When I look back during skating's height in the 90's (at least in the US), there were several skaters who had the ability to win from a wide swath of the world. For the ladies, I remember watching Sato, Bonaly, Kwan, Bobek, Slutskaya, Szewczenko, and Chen Lu...all world medalists (off the top of my head). There were also the skaters who didn't win medals, but could (and should have), like Josee Chouinard, who still breaks my heart. If everyone skated cleanly, who would win from that group? It really depended on the year, and the program and music that they came with. It wasn't until the late 90's that the US had an absolute favorite (as Nicole Bobek was a surprise in '95, and Michelle Kwan to a lesser degree in '96), yet there was still lots of buzz surrounding the Worlds throughout those years because so many skaters COULD win in many of the disciplines.

Many 'iconic' programs came from those skating days...both musical and technically difficult. Now, the programs are MUCH more technically demanding, and there have been many great 'performances', but how many will be remembered years from now as great 'programs'? Yuka Sato was known for her footwork as she flew down the ice...but that wouldn't be rewarded now because she doesn't have the Morosov-flapping-arms. Do those make a great footwork sequence? Not necessarily...but that's what makes a high-scoring footwork sequence. To me, the Code of Points has put at odds that which is 'beautiful' or 'lyrical' against that which brings in the high scores. Change of edge spins are difficult, and I'm sure many of those ladies I mentioned previously would struggle, but again, does that make it better? Making something more difficult to accomplish doesn't inherently make it better for the viewer to watch.

Each year, it's like the skaters and coaches read through the COP revisions...and we have however many of the same spiral sequences, and however many of the same combination spins that will bring in the high scores...totally disregarding the music that is playing in the background. It's like a modern-day school figures session set to music. If the PCS truly rewarded beautiful interpretation of the music, THAT would draw interest back to figure skating...not just having a U.S. skater in contention.

 

[i love to skate]

Since the sports that have replaced skating on American TV seem to be auto racing and some sort of loud-voiced wrestling, I can't be happy with the situation over here.

By loud-mouth wrestling do you mean the UFC? If so, UFC is probably the best packaged and marketed sport in the world right now. They have reached their target audience - young males aged 18-34 - and also have drawn in numerous females. How did they do this?

Well they have made the events exciting for the guys; full of lights, music, ring side girls, bling, nicknames, etc. They have drawn in the females by creating reality TV shows filled with drama such as The Ultimate Fighter and PrimeTime. They also have engaging athletes who do meet and greets with the fans and lots of interviews. The athletes are charming - such as Georges St Pierre - who by the way is gorgeous - and French Canadian . Or the athletes are antagonistic and provide tension and a build up to fights.

I think skating in the US could learn a lot from UFC in terms of marketing and getting the sport "out there". UFC is a sport that gets "it".

 

[Tonichelle]

Jenny mentions the education of the fans, but that has always been an issue. Casual fans not knowing a lutz from a toe-loop wouldn't be any different under 6.0 or under COP. they still need to know.


Ant

'tis true, I've been a fan over 20 years now (almost 21!) and I still can't tell the difference when I'm watching (especially LIVE) doesn't stop me from enjoying or having an opinion about a skate, though...

we have a legitimate shot at winning. Internally, we have a deep ladies field, as there are several who could walk away with the National Championship, but when those top two are placed into the Olympic lineup, their chances dim significantly. I don't think that's really the problem though...

first off, welcome to the board. post often and long!

secondly, I think this just further's ant's post.. you list ladies and only ladies. Who cares if we don't have a strong ladies team. Last I checked we have a very strong mens team that is just as deep as well as flipping good (and competitive internationally, more so than our little girls). The US is all about the ladies skating and to heck with the rest. I can understand the feeling about pairs (we haven't really been all that strong) and until recently (anyone really think Tanith and Ben would be as far as they are, much less Davis and White, without the CoP?) Dance was a joke for the US viewers.

The men get their share of ribbing from the US viewer intent on blowing a few hours to watch teh olympics or what not, but at least we have a shot... If I were running NBC I'd focus my segments on our men's field... not keep it in teh shadows. They're not helping their ratings by continuing to push our ladies as being the top bill when it's obvious we're not going to win anything unless everyone else screws up BIG time. Granted this puts more pressure on Evan and Johnny... or whoever else makes the team... but it's better than "nothing"

THAT would draw interest back to figure skating...not just having a U.S. skater in contention.

RIIIIIIIIIGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHTTTTTTTTT because prior to 1994, that's how we got the big draw??? Nope, not buying it. Skating had it's time in the limelight. We're reverting back to where we were prior to. A few shows on TV, a competition here or there.... maybe a few less than normal but we have the ISU's money hungry leaders to thank for that...