2016-17 State of Russian Men's skating | Page 10 | Golden Skate

2016-17 State of Russian Men's skating

Tutto

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
An interesting interview with Eteri where she explains why she finds boys harder to work with than girls. According to her boys need emotional support and go far as demonstratively falling hard from single and double jumps to get it. And she is just not good at any of that stuff. To girls you can give a task and they just do it and that's it.
http://rsport.ru/figure_skating/20170428/1119723063.html

Well I would not think Mishin is a softy but he seemed to do better with boys and preferred working with them as the article rightly mentions. So it must be Eteri's problem :). I think girls are more responsible & diligent thats why they do better at school as a rule, I can understand that but emotional support? Don't girls need that too? Or Eteri selects only certain type of girls. Survival of the fittest I think her group...
 

silverfoxes

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 16, 2014
Mishin's boys have not done any better than Eteri's in recent years...and he has said it's more challenging for him to work with girls, so does he also have a "problem"?
 

vorravorra

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 9, 2016
Well I would not think Mishin is a softy but he seemed to do better with boys and preferred working with them as the article rightly mentions. So it must be Eteri's problem :). I think girls are more responsible & diligent thats why they do better at school as a rule, I can understand that but emotional support? Don't girls need that too? Or Eteri selects only certain type of girls. Survival of the fittest I think her group...
I remember Alina's interview where she said it was pretty much either you shape up or ship out. She was actually told to go back home at one point. In her case the realisation that she is the only one to whom her success matters actually helped, she gritted her teeth and started working twice as hard. But I am not sure that the message "nobody really gives a damn" would have the same effect on other personalities, especially at that age. Nobody should expect endless handholding, however, wanting some emotional support is not a crime in my book. But I didn't get the impression that Eteri deliberately withholds it, she is just not that kind of person, and you have to do it on her terms I guess. As for boys - maybe they simply don't want it enough to put themselves through all that? To survive in Eteri's group you have to be not just tough but extremely motivated.
 

Tolstoj

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
Tips for Rusfed to choose GP assignments properly:

Send your weakest skaters to Skate America, Skate Canada. Judges have never been generous with them in the past few years: Pitkeev in particular (but also Menshov and Voronov) were really burned at Skate America in such a gross way.

Kolyada, Aliev, Samarin (and possibly Pitkeev if he recovers) should stay away from those competitions, everything else is fine including NHK.
 
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silverfoxes

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 16, 2014
The Russian Fed only gets to choose the skaters for Rostelecom, they can't control who the other ones invite to their own GPs.
 

silverlake22

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 12, 2009
I still expect the Olympic team to be Kolyada and Kovtun. I'd prefer Aliev over Kovtun but I don't think he has the tech arsenal to overtake him and same goes for Petrov. Samarin is a bit boring for my taste.
 

silverfoxes

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 16, 2014
I hope there will be some surprises next season, because there are several other men I'd rather see in Pyeongchang and none of their initials are "MK."
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Well, the rules are different at the Olympics and yes Japan wont' be able to win or even medal due to their pairs and ice dance. In its spirit however WTT was the last 'rehearsal' of the team event at the Olympics and I think the RusFed took it very seriously.
WTT was of course less important than Worlds but with all the top men except Javi present there it was hardly unimportant either.
I am not sure why you think Kovtun some sort of a victim. When he is doing well he gets his credit e.g after his silver at Euros this year the general sentiment was that he'd turned the corner, his work with a psychologist started paying off etc etc which pretty much lasted till his next showing. I do feel sorry for him, I re-watched his LP in Saitama and though it was not a perfect skate (Gosh he did pop jumps even back then) he looked so much different - more assured, there was a fight & drive in him, even his posture was better. RusFed really knows how to 'break' athletes...

His "next showing" at Worlds wasn't bad. His SP was almost 90 points and his FS still had him landing 2 quads and 2 triple axels. He made critical pops and a zayak that cost him points but he almost cracked the top 10, and his actual technical difficulty wasn't bad.

Of course, WTT was a bust but I'm pretty sure people here are putting wayyyy more stock into that competition than the Russian fed is. Russia lost to Japan, and placed 2nd, and were well ahead of Canada and US - their only real competitors once all the teams are full strength and Team competition scoring goes into effect.

It seems at this point people are just out for blood and want to use WTT (of all competitions, the fun fluff-fest! :laugh:) as an excuse to scapegoat Kovtun because they don't like him. If Kovtun had skated well at WTT I'm certain they would say "oh, well it's just a fun competition, and he still didn't crack top 10 at Worlds."

Oh well. I hope Kovtun skates well next season not just for himself, but also so I can enjoy watching his haters losing their minds over him being successful. :laugh:
 
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Tolstoj

Record Breaker
Joined
Nov 21, 2015
I still expect the Olympic team to be Kolyada and Kovtun. I'd prefer Aliev over Kovtun but I don't think he has the tech arsenal to overtake him and same goes for Petrov. Samarin is a bit boring for my taste.

Aliev is by far the most artistic male skater in Russia (even better than Kolyada), i hope judges will give him proper components as they did at juniors.

Then we've already seen a FS with two quads from him, so he can beat Kovtun, but i think the GP assignments are key here: depending where they send you, the goal cold range from a bronze/silver medal to nothing even with two clean skates.

Samarin was the worst this season: last year he was trying to focus on everything, even the components, this season was clearly all about the jumps and nothing else (not even stsq since he lost levels there sometimes)
 

Krunchii

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Joined
Mar 27, 2014
I'm not even Kovtun's fan but didn't he have a bad fall in the warm up at Worlds? It's a pity for him he couldn't crack the top 10 and then proceeded to flop at WTT but it doesn't seem like he's at risk of losing his jumps or anything so I don't see any need to write him off, he just pops and pops mostly. Even if Japan won WTT, the country itself still hasn't qualified the full team yet for Olympics.

As for the Olympics team, I like the young bloods, Adian Pitkeev (please come back soon!), Alexander Petrov (saw him live, liked him a lot), Dmitri Aliev is nice too, it was good to see him get that Junior World medal this season. I also like the old uncle, Sergei Voronov haha, I seem to like the extremes. But I do think, barring any injuries, it will probably Mikhail and Maxim at this point, but ice is slippery, who knows.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

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Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Yeah he hasn't lost his jumps and his quads are actually getting more GOE. The issue is with his other jumps and errors he makes. Regardless, he's popping less jumps these days and seems to be happier. I have a feeling he knows his Olympic goal is wavering so I wanna see if he's able to control his destiny and make the team. He can certainly do it - I don't think Aliev and Samarin are so advanced that he can't hold them off but a lot can happen in a summer.
 

gmyers

Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
kovtun biggest threat is Aliev Samarin or Petrov becoming the new kovtun. Combining good gp performances and Russian nationals performance with his underperforming. Voronov was certainly building up to Vancouver and then bad free skate at nationals and horrible euros and all of a sudden borodulin!
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
kovtun biggest threat is Aliev Samarin or Petrov becoming the new kovtun. Combining good gp performances and Russian nationals performance with his underperforming. Voronov was certainly building up to Vancouver and then bad free skate at nationals and horrible euros and all of a sudden borodulin!

Yeah it was so random. I feel bad for Voronov. I mean I'm torn between wanting Voronov to get his Olympic moment or Kovtun to silence the ongoing haterade. I don't know if the juniors can sweep in. I also find Petrov rather bland and his elements need improvements to increase GOE - he doesn't have that IT factor yet. I had hopes for Pitkeev but he seems to have fizzled. It's rather unlikely he will make the team, but I'd love to see Gachinski have a good comeback season.
 

Skater Boy

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Joined
Feb 24, 2012
Russia's men are a bit like the American ladies - lots of potential but someone needs to step up and own it. A good skate here a bad skate there doesn't help a lot = it is like rolling a dice and closing your eyes hoping for the best. I think Kolyada is the best hope and then throw a dice.
 

CanadianSkaterGuy

Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
I'd like to see if Kolyada is capable of a stronger early season. It's all good that he can peak at Worlds and WTT, but he'll need to step things up for the Olympics if Russia is gonna have a chance to defend their team gold.
 

tennisguy

Rinkside
Joined
Apr 23, 2017
I'd like to see if Kolyada is capable of a stronger early season. It's all good that he can peak at Worlds and WTT, but he'll need to step things up for the Olympics if Russia is gonna have a chance to defend their team gold.

I feel like this season Kolyada will do better because his World Championship performance in 2016 really came out of nowhere and I don't think he was ready for the extra attention and pressure that must have come from being the Russian #1 male. He seemed to have gotten things back together by Worlds this year and I think he's in a place now where he can build going into next year.
 

Weathergal

Medalist
Joined
May 25, 2014
I feel like this season Kolyada will do better because his World Championship performance in 2016 really came out of nowhere and I don't think he was ready for the extra attention and pressure that must have come from being the Russian #1 male. He seemed to have gotten things back together by Worlds this year and I think he's in a place now where he can build going into next year.

I would add that I think Kolyada needs two fresh, well-choreographed programs. His quirky SP was fun last season but got tired this season. I think that was exacerbated by the fact that his FP had a similar feel. I believe the Russian Fed didn't like his SP at the test skates so Kolyada had to re-use his SP, which wasn't his team's original intention. He is musical and has an interesting look on the ice, but he needs to have better and more varied vehicles. He also needs more consistency, of course, but I am hopeful that will come. He seems to have a good attitude, a strong work ethic, and a supportive coach so I think that he has a strong base for success.
 

vorravorra

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 9, 2016
I would add that I think Kolyada needs two fresh, well-choreographed programs. His quirky SP was fun last season but got tired this season. I think that was exacerbated by the fact that his FP had a similar feel. I believe the Russian Fed didn't like his SP at the test skates so Kolyada had to re-use his SP, which wasn't his team's original intention. He is musical and has an interesting look on the ice, but he needs to have better and more varied vehicles. He also needs more consistency, of course, but I am hopeful that will come. He seems to have a good attitude, a strong work ethic, and a supportive coach so I think that he has a strong base for success.
Message to the Fed: if you want to have control over skaters' programs, do not wait till just before or even until the test skates, for crying out loud. Especially not with your top skaters.
 

vorravorra

Record Breaker
Joined
Apr 9, 2016
I feel like this season Kolyada will do better because his World Championship performance in 2016 really came out of nowhere and I don't think he was ready for the extra attention and pressure that must have come from being the Russian #1 male. He seemed to have gotten things back together by Worlds this year and I think he's in a place now where he can build going into next year.
And also because his off-season last year was rather busy with non-skating related matters and he didn't get much rest either. Which shouldn't happen this season.
 
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