2016 World Championships Ladies Free Skate

[andromache]

It doesn't matter that Miyahara isn't doing 3-3s. She's still doing the same 7 triples + 2 double axels that all the top skaters are doing. Its just the permutation in terms of the combinations that are different from skater to skater. Evgenia does 3s-3t and 3f-3t and keeps her 2axels separate. Miyahara does 2a-3t, 2a-3t and does her 3flip and 3salchow on their own. The point value is basically the same. Although Miyahara actually has a BV of 62.96 versus 62.33 for Evegenia - Satoko repeats the 3lutz and 3toe, while Evgenia repeats the 3flip and the 3toe.

The fact that Satoko is earning basically same points for her non 3-3 layout as girls with one or two 3-3s shows why combos need some sort of bonus factored by the most difficult jump in the combination. Doing two 2A-3Ts with a standalone flip and salchow is obviously easier than 3F-3T and 3S-3T with separate axels.

Kudos to Satoko for maximizing the points with her strategy, but it shows why the system needs to reward combos differently.

 

[Shayuki]

Especially if Higuchi stays in juniors, I for some reason feel like juniors might be more exciting than seniors next season.

The fact that Satoko is earning basically same points for her non 3-3 layout as girls with one or two 3-3s shows why combos need some sort of bonus factored by the most difficult jump in the combination. Doing two 2A-3Ts with a standalone flip and salchow is obviously easier than 3F-3T and 3S-3T with separate axels.

Kudos to Satoko for maximizing the points with her strategy, but it shows why the system needs to reward combos differently.

I agree that we need bonus points for more difficult combos, like doing a 3-3 over 2a-3 and doing a 3-3-2 over 3-lo-3.

 

[artsciboy]

The fact that Satoko is earning basically same points for her non 3-3 layout as girls with one or two 3-3s shows why combos need some sort of bonus factored by the most difficult jump in the combination. Doing two 2A-3Ts with a standalone flip and salchow is obviously easier than 3F-3T and 3S-3T with separate axels.

Kudos to Satoko for maximizing the points with her strategy, but it shows why the system needs to reward combos differently.

Agreed - there should totally be a bonus factor depending on the relative difficulty of the combos attempted. That said, I don't think Miyahara will be negatively impacted by such a rule since she consistently does the 3lutz-3toe in her SP. I think the 2a-3t is just a stronger element for her in terms of distance and heighth and gets her slightly higher GOEs than her 3z-3t.

 

[Lipea]

I agree with a lot of what others said. It was very different seeing them skating live rather than on TV.

Although I was not a particular fan of Japanese ladies before, watching it live they impressed me the most.
Mao - she is simply amazing, stands out of everyone else by her maturity of the interpretation (comparable only to Ashley) and skating skills. I don't agree that she was slow - to me she seemed very fast and very light, and her speed did not drop drastically by the end of the program unlike most of skaters. Her movements are wide but airy; I loved how the dress looks there too; she definitely should have had higher PCS scores.

Rika - this girl was soooo entertaining and fast! Fantastic energy, great program; I could not care less about her shoulders. Deserved a bigger score too.

Satoko - she is Miss Elegance: what an impressive lines, movements, musicality, flow! Her body is like plastic, she makes the choreography breathing. The tiny jumps looked very sophisticated - it was simply fascinating to see how fast she rotates. Definitely underscored in PCS.

Russian girls are true fighters, but they are all very young and it shows on the ice.
Elena - despite I feel bad for her - she must be very upset being only 6th with two almost clean programs, - I did not find her skating very appealing. She is pretty but lacks lines, refinement, posture, which could be compensated by a good program (like last year) and extreme commitment that she has. But when the program is bad and cheasy it just does not work, because everything lacks any degree of sophistication. Wish her to remain as strong mentally and physically as she is now, read and listen to more high-quality music, and put good programs for the new season.

Evgenia - opposite of Elena: very polished and has fantastic program. Definitely a winner, but her PCS should not have been as high as they were because her SS are not great. It was predictable though - after pair event Russia put all the influence they could to have a winner in ladies event, and since Evgenia was #1 and had a great routine she had the highest chances to outscore Gracie if the latest skated clean. If Evgenia skated after Gracie then her scores probably would not have been as high, because she clearly would not need them to win.

Anna - out of all three, she looked the best on the ice. The program is great, Rimsky-Korsakov is fantastic, and, as always with Anna's programs, her music cuts are very good. She was a little overly concentrated I think, but very fast, great spins, jumps, musical accents. Her arms could be more elegant though. I am so happy for her to medal here!

Others:

Ashley - despite the URs I think her silver was absolutely deserved one. What a great performer she is! She expresses emotions with not just face but whole body: it is a joy to watch. It was a great choice for a final performance of the competition! During "show must go on" part the crowd got crazy. I totally loved it.

Gracie - not impressive at all. I think people cheered for her too much and it probably overstressed her. Maybe she'd do better if she performed in the first half of that group. Anyway, the program does not work for her. There are a couple of cool moments but that's about it. Jumps looked low, which was not what I expected, esp. for her height.

Elizabet - this little birdie has great speed! She is also very musical, has beautiful arms, nice lines, great spins. IMO should have been scored higher.

Alaine - probably the fastest one, very energetic. I had a feeling she overpracticed on the warm up? She obviously got tired by the second half of the program, which might be why the things went wrong. Anyway, she can be one of the tops with her great jumps and unique spins, if learns how to be consistent.

Angelina - beautiful program, very beautiful and artistic skater. Has a big potential, will be interesting to watch her in the future.

Da Bin - I think this girl should be someone to watch for 2018 Olympics. Seriously, she looks so determined: as determined as Evgenia! Her skating is very child-like yet, but I am sure it will change as she will grow. She has technique and consistency, which is very important. Whereas So Youn is completely opposite - very nice SS, elegancy, but tech is not there.

Overall, what a fantastic competition! Looks like it is the strongest Worlds so far, and it really shows the progress in ladies figure skating. The placement seemed right except Gracie should have been below Mao or even Rika; therefore everyone above would move up a spot.

 

[Lipea]

Now my little woulda ... coulda ... shoulda - I think that Gracie could have saved that opening combo - her landing after 3 toe-loop in combination is most of the time rushed & scratchy but usually she's able to get out herself from the trouble. She should not be so hard on herself - it's tough but this is sport, she's still so young and she will have chances to redeem herself in the future. It was not a total meltdown either that some expected. On the bright side I would say that I see potential in Gold getting ... Quad Salchow. She has athletic gifts for that and her triple sal was / is impressive.

I think that Gracie simply should compete more often. More B-competitions where she would have no pressure but to do it at the best she can - in order to gain consistency and manage her nerves.

 

[Skater Boy]

Oh please. This isn't a "Fix". A fix is Adelina scoring 8 points higher than Mao in the Sochi LP.

If Zhenia pulls of an inspired 8-triple LP and is still scored way below a weaker Gold, then we can talk about fixes.

The fix was more in for the American ladies than the Russians at the olympics or at least equal. Let's be real. Had Gracie not fallen they would have found a way to get her on the podium and probably gold. you still have to deliver and gracie didn't - well in fairness normally it would ave been enough for the podium but not on a night when there were so many great skates. Still none of the amazingess of Yuna at the 2010 olympics or the magic of some of kwans great skates though to be fair kwan may not have done so well with the new system as herjumps should rightfully be downgraded in grades of execution and she lacked amplitude. in the end the right skater won.

 

[Skater Boy]

That is so true. She is utterly beautiful, captivating, lovely. She is one-of-a-kind and irreplacable.

i agree with her lp even with the urs and jump issues but her short was not so impressive - rather junior looking. However she barely held off her teammate. i wonder if she will be around much longer if Chan looked weak, vulnerable and unable to compete with the big boys where does that leave Mao.

 

[Skater Boy]

I love Ashley and I loved both her performances... but Anna was seriously robbed. Anna should have silver, I do not get the judging on her PCS. Ashley with a well deserved bronze would've been perfect.

i agree. though i think anna was robbed in the short especially. it reminds me of another Russian skater who did a slighlty easier triple jump out of foot work the loop versus the flip but the whole program was passionate, clean - even her spins where she usually bobbles. It was powerful, dynamic, musical, fierce and passionate. I would have had her second but i mean youu have to be happy for the us and Ashley. I can hear the words from Shemar moore and the streak is over. Ashle brought home a silver and it is well with the world order lol. i do wonder if this is the last we will see of mao despite a wonderful long her short really looked rather juniorish. The gorgeous long though was marred by jumping errors and she really looking second rate against Ashley and Gracie who really does not have to be embarassed about anything. She did very well and under normal circumstances would have stood on the podium . As i try to read all these post while it is lovely to see so much interest it is hard to read them all but so interesting nevertheless. it is amazing how many posters come out of the wood work during worlds but we don't see them during the rest of the year lol or they limit their selves to the fan posts or whatever. Daleman did well for Canada i am a surprised but i still find her programs and artistry lacking. Satoko and Radinova must be crushed as the did not skate badly and poor Rad has fought through puberty. i personally loved Ashley's free costume and Satokos short. But really disappointed in both of Gracie's dresses. if it was a Laboutin in the short in respect to thes ame designer as the shoes he should stick to shoes. the dress had the red flash (reminiscient of the Laboutin heel but really it looks lmost like a practice dress. Ashley looked so elegant as does Mirai though the color of her long does osrt of looked washed out.

 

[Skater Boy]

The right podium of the best skating ladies tonight! Bravo Zhenya, Ashley, and Anna!

Good night everybody or good morning, Moscow. It's 6 a.m. here but I am so excited! It is such a good final note to this disastrous for us WC! I remember now a funny GS member who said more than once that the state of Russian ladies is in trouble. It is better than ever!

The Russian ladies were wonderful as were so many other ladies. I am not sure they are so dominant because it is so close and despite thei ssues with Gracie and her confidence while I do think she is overrated in scores especially pcs it is not like the Russians ran away. Evgenia did in the long but for whatever reason the judges did not hold her up in the short though she was fine especially in light of the held onto triple lutz combo by Gracie and her stiff double axel. They do have a lot of depth but i think the point by some is they do not have a dominant lady who is the face of Russian skating. They keep switching in the past few years it was Julia to Adelina to Radinova to Liza to Evgenia. i wonder if evgenia will make the team next year lol considering the trend.

 

[Skater Boy]

Actually for many years Yuna hadn't the most difficult program technically speaking, even her spins weren't the best. Yuna became the star of FS thanks to a really solid technique, her consistency for that time (now most of the top contenders are that consistent), and the artistry.

Mao had the reputation of a great skater but cold, she was never rewarded in the artistry, despite some of her programs were surely the most demanding (i remember some insane Tarasova's footwork sequence)

Back in 2010 not everyone could do all the triples other than Joannie Rochette and some lesser competitiors. Mao had the axel but was missing other triples. yuna was missing the loop. Finding complete skaters with a complete arsenal isn't easy.

 

[Skater Boy]

Glad to hear a doctor address this. Is it true that girls in this period have a lower fat to muscle ratio than adult women? Also, are their bones still developing and less dense? Aren't these factors why jumps are easier? Also, it gives these girls this lithe quality - which only last 18 months to 2 years.

It's troubled me for years that we're handing out important metals to individuals who won't be able to do these things in 2 years. Also the lithe quality is lovely but is it artistry? How many other colors can a 15 yo bring to the performance? What makes Ashley's skating so powerful is the depth she brings to the material.

What do you think?

i have to say Ashley has great presence and edges at least of the current group - she will or should drop down the ladder with a thud when Carolina comes back. Sadly medals are well in some cases there one day and gone the next. So many one shot wonders. That's life. perhaps once can say for every step forward there is one or two back often. It seems like ie pairs is really pushing the technical elements but this seems to affect the performance and program and there seems to be injuries.

 

[MsLiinaLii]

I presonally don't see why people say Gracie has biggest jumps in the field.
For me they have become a lot smaller under Frank, and in the FS a lot of them looked low and heavy. Her 3T in combinations are quite unimpressive, which resulted in underrotationa and a fall on 3Lz3T

 

[matmuh]

Elizabet - this little birdie has great speed! She is also very musical, has beautiful arms, nice lines, great spins. IMO should have been scored higher.

wow, thanks for mentioning sth else other than how she looks like 5 years old! i agree that she looks pretty fast even on screen, its great to hear it from someone who watched her live :luv17:
and i agree everything you said about Satoko too

 

[Rissa]

Especially if Higuchi stays in juniors, I for some reason feel like juniors might be more exciting than seniors next season.



I agree that we need bonus points for more difficult combos, like doing a 3-3 over 2a-3 and doing a 3-3-2 over 3-lo-3.

Perhaps this us one of yhe reasons Satoko gets dinged in PCS. Judhes are not willing to throw points at her well-performed easier layout as easily as at a well-performed difficult layout.

 

[Mathman]

...They do have a lot of depth but i think the point by some is they do not have a dominant lady who is the face of Russian skating. They keep switching in the past few years it was Julia to Adelina to Radinova to Liza to Evgenia. i wonder if evgenia will make the team next year lol considering the trend.

I don't see this as a negative factor. Russia has many good skaters who keep pushing each other. Isn't this a good thing?

Sometimes young skaters do well one year, drop out of sight for a time, and then come back even stronger. (Sotnikova and Tuktamysheva, for instance). I expect to hear from Lipnitskaia again. Medvedeva will make the Russian team next years unless someone even better comes along to push her out.Russia doesn't have one "face of Russian skating," it has several. Other countries would be pleased to have such an abundance of riches.

 

[Yatagarasu]

I don't see this as a negative factor. Russia has many good skaters who keep pushing each other. Isn't this a good thing?

I think some of this is basic human nature, we get attached. I think it was the BESP uncles who were commenting about the need to have one lady in Europe, when talking about Medvedeva, that the audiences can get behind. It really is pure psychology, doesn't really take into the account what you are talking about.

 

[Violetti]

Yes, Ashley has not an Olympic title, but she has more than 10 years of reputation on the ice and just did so much more, for the sport, than someone who comes and wins, and is never seen again.

What might sound a bit sassy, is how I feel, we should appreciate the Ladies on ice and not write them off, just because they didn´t win in the previous years. Ashley just deserves credit for her legacy and she has done more for the sport than those who were unwilling to continue after their success.
:

I totally agree with this. Your texts are always interesting to read. I have loved most of Ashley's programs all these years. She has been one of those I always definitely want to see in competitions. Number one US lady for me during these years. For her getting silver doesn't change anything in my attitude towards her as I have always appreciated her but I am simply happy for her that she finally made it.

 

[lyndichee]

I presonally don't see why people say Gracie has biggest jumps in the field.
For me they have become a lot smaller under Frank, and in the FS a lot of them looked low and heavy. Her 3T in combinations are quite unimpressive, which resulted in underrotationa and a fall on 3Lz3T

100% agree! I miss the old Gracie combinations.

https://youtu.be/pHVFz8W9cWo?t=1m4s

She kind of goes into with some brute force but it looks more exciting to me. I also liked how her cute personality shown through in the choreography.

https://youtu.be/f44iy1dU2-M?t=1m10s

Her lutz has less height and the 3T is much smaller. Her jumps in general look smaller.

 

[Callycal]

Welcome to the forum. Thanks for joining us.

I don't understand PCSs at all either. To me, Mao was the most lovely and graceful, with Satoko second. But I guess other factors go into the scoring.

Thank you...I'm surprised GS is still around, I use to come on here, about 10-15 years ago.

MAO was beautiful, I was watching her programs in 2007-2008 and to see how she has grown....wow

 

[TryMeLater]

Back in 2010 not everyone could do all the triples other than Joannie Rochette and some lesser competitiors. Mao had the axel but was missing other triples. yuna was missing the loop. Finding complete skaters with a complete arsenal isn't easy.

Carolina Kostner also had a full arsenal of jumps (and world medals) but would let her nerves get to her.
Quite similar to Gold actually but I think Kostner was really affected by the pressure of the Torino Olympics.