2017-18 State of Russian Ladies skating

[Miller]

So far the situation looks like whoever is not on top 24 SB list won't get a GP assignment (with the exception of Anna with her WR), so Konstantinova and Fedichkina won't be much of a factor when they move up, they will get Challengers events and a host spot at Rostelecom if lucky. This can change for Stasya as she still has one CS event to improve her scores (unless they send her to JW again with placing her above first year juniors at JNats, I hope not), but she needs two clean or at least almost clean skates which is unlikely.
With Gubanova, Panenkova, Samodurova and maybe even Gulyakova, a lot will depend on if they make it to Junior Worlds and how they place there if they do. Gubanova needs to make it to JW AND to get top 24 SB scores there to move up as she is not age eligible yet to get her SB on Challengers events. Even if the RusFed won't stop her, I doubt she and her coach want to move up when not guaranteed any GP assignment and with a chance to get JGP. Same with Gulyakova. As for Samodurova and Panenkova, I think it's up to their coaches to decide with the federation having a word too, but I doubt they will stop either of them as both are consistent, Panenkova is Eteri's girl wich means a big scoring potential, and Samodurova is Mishin's main hope

Think that if Samodurova/Panenkova/whoever get a guaranteed GP slot they should always grab it while they can, they may be like gold dust in coming seasons. Also it opens up the world of further ranking points because they may be able to do 2 GPs. Ranking points are very useful but as far as I can see you'll never get enough on the challengers to get a top 24 WR e.g. if you were to win 4 in 2 years you'd get 1020 ranking points after taking account of the 70% reduction for the previous year (600 + 600 * 0.7), but 1500 or so was needed this year. However start doing GPs and there's more chance of points available even if you don't reach the Championships and the really big points on offer there.

Incidentally it may be that Anna P is not as guaranteed a WR slot as you may think. This year Angelina Kuchvalska just missed out on a GP slot (I was doing predictions so saw exactly what happened) and she had just over 1500 points (hasn't gained any this year so you can how many she had), but Anna after the 70% reduction will only have just over 1400 so she isn't guaranteed at all. Also Mao Asada wasn't removed from the World Rankings before the selection meeting even though she'd already announced her retirement, so it may be that that retirees after the Olympics won't be removed, we'll have to see, any retirements may be a little more notice though. Also points have been more spread out on the GP series this year as more and more ladies come through so it may be less points are needed this year than in previous, but as I say Anna isn't necessarily guaranteed at all.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Whatever became of Alsu Kayumova?

 

[hanca]

Whatever became of Alsu Kayumova?

Retired of course. She didn’t have a chance to compete with the current wave of ladies.

 

[Resa]

I love Tarakanova's Programs!
I think if Liza Tuktamysheva would have trained under the same coach Tarakanova does, she would have a similar style to her

 

[tars]

I love Tarakanova's Programs!
I think if Liza Tuktamysheva would have trained under the same coach Tarakanova does, she would have a similar style to her

Ouch!

 

[Tolstoj]

I read somewhere a different version re: Mishin and Nugumanova. I read he asked her to leave because she had an attitude problem. From similar reason she wasn’t allowed to compete at the senior nationals last season, even though she qualified.

Because she is a queen (with her ego) and Mishin can't have queens.

It was already so strange to see Nugumanova being an OG Mishin student: even 3-4 years ago she already had the charisma, beautiful spins and the passion but her lutz edge was so wrong, the exact opposite of the typical Mishin's ideal skater.

To be honest i think she needs to join CSKA, or even a foreign coach like Lambiel would be perfect for her (or even Raf), someone who really cares about artistry in figure skating.

But because she is from SPB and RusFed doesn't care of SPB ladies much (unfortunately), she will end up staying with these minor russian coaches with no influence from the federation. At least she is going for the fully backloaded SP this season, that's a thing. Hope for the best.

I'm worried even for Gubanova: she is already a successful skater in juniors but she bombed two major events (junior nationals last season and JGP Austria), so she won't be seen as a top skater at junior nationals, and that could mean no junior worlds and next year she is in seniors.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Because she is a queen (with her ego) and Mishin can't have queens.

It was already so strange to see Nugumanova being an OG Mishin student: even 3-4 years ago she already had the charisma, beautiful spins and the passion but her lutz edge was so wrong, the exact opposite of the typical Mishin's ideal skater.

To be honest i think she needs to join CSKA, or even a foreign coach like Lambiel would be perfect for her (or even Raf), someone who really cares about artistry in figure skating.

But because she is from SPB and RusFed doesn't care of SPB ladies much (unfortunately), she will end up staying with these minor russian coaches with no influence from the federation. At least she is going for the fully backloaded SP this season, that's a thing. Hope for the best.

I'm worried even for Gubanova: she is already a successful skater in juniors but she bombed two major events (junior nationals last season and JGP Austria), so she won't be seen as a top skater at junior nationals, and that could mean no junior worlds and next year she is in seniors.

I highly doubt that Gubanova would go to junior worlds even if she skated beautifully at Jr. Nats.
There's Alenka, Sasha, Nastya Tarakanova, Dasha, Sonya, and Nastya Gulyakova in addition to possibly Stasya if she does well at Jr. Nats. There's no room for Gubanova even if she performs well there and if she doesn't, then she's done. Also I think her odd technique will not help her in the future.

 

[Ares]

Because she is a queen (with her ego) and Mishin can't have queens.

It was already so strange to see Nugumanova being an OG Mishin student: even 3-4 years ago she already had the charisma, beautiful spins and the passion but her lutz edge was so wrong, the exact opposite of the typical Mishin's ideal skater.

To be honest i think she needs to join CSKA, or even a foreign coach like Lambiel would be perfect for her (or even Raf), someone who really cares about artistry in figure skating.

But because she is from SPB and RusFed doesn't care of SPB ladies much (unfortunately), she will end up staying with these minor russian coaches with no influence from the federation. At least she is going for the fully backloaded SP this season, that's a thing. Hope for the best.

I'm worried even for Gubanova: she is already a successful skater in juniors but she bombed two major events (junior nationals last season and JGP Austria), so she won't be seen as a top skater at junior nationals, and that could mean no junior worlds and next year she is in seniors.

I am even more worried for Gubanova's jumps in the future. How will they hold up at all? She looks like she has that not viable for post-puberty technique but fitting for little jumping beans one that gives her problems even though she's not yet fully developed.

What a shame because her artistry on its own is one of the strongest in current crop of juniors worldwide.

 

[lavoix]

I love Gubanova, but she is not consistent. She needs to work on that and her PCS (which for some reason keeps scoring low).

I think if she makes a good impression at senior nationals and junior nationals, she will make a strong case for herself. But she needs to compete against the Eteri girls and do well!

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

I love Gubanova, but she is not consistent. She needs to work on that and her PCS (which for some reason keeps scoring low).

I think if she makes a good impression at senior nationals and junior nationals, she will make a strong case for herself. But she needs to compete against the Eteri girls and do well!

She hasn't made a mistake in two straight events? Why does everyone always harp on her? I don't get it.

Sorry......I'm not trying pick on you but I keep reading this stuff and if we look at her last few events her jumps look good and she is delivering a great presentation.

 

[hanca]

She hasn't made a mistake in two straight events? Why does everyone always harp on her? I don't get it.

Sorry......I'm not trying pick on you but I keep reading this stuff and if we look at her last few events her jumps look good and she is delivering a great presentation.

Because she is less consistent than the others and the last two seasons had the unfortunate mistakes in the most important competitions - Russian nationals, which decides about going to junior worlds and this season her JGP event. The fact that she doesn’t make mistake on other competitions doesn’t really matter that much, if she messes up when it is really important. I love her and I hope she will sort out the consistency because as the JGP events this season showed us, there is so many great skaters in Russian junior ladies that the federation doesn’t give second chances. Anything less than perfect and they are at risk of not having another opportunity. And in her case that would be a real pity.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Because she is less consistent than the others and the last two seasons had the unfortunate mistakes in the most important competitions - Russian nationals, which decides about going to junior worlds and this season her JGP event. The fact that she doesn’t make mistake on other competitions doesn’t really matter that much, if she messes up when it is really important. I love her and I hope she will sort out the consistency because as the JGP events this season showed us, there is so many great skaters in Russian junior ladies that the federation doesn’t give second chances. Anything less than perfect and they are at risk of not having another opportunity. And in her case that would be a real pity.

Any talk of her going to Plushenko or Mishin? I feel like if she had more political clout her scores would improve. She nailed it in the FS at Nationals and the judges hardly noticed.

 

[moriel]

Any talk of her going to Plushenko or Mishin? I feel like if she had more political clout her scores would improve. She nailed it in the FS at Nationals and the judges hardly noticed.

Honestly i[m not sure if Mishin and Plushenko have any PCs weight. Mishin skaters arent really getting sky high PCs. Mishin also is not known at all for being a PCs coach, if anything, its the opposite.
Plushenko is yet unproven as coach, and i highly doubt judges will randomly support his students. Also, he himself was always treated more as an athletic skater, rather than artistic one.

For PCs, I`d say Eteri or Buyanova.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Honestly i[m not sure if Mishin and Plushenko have any PCs weight. Mishin skaters arent really getting sky high PCs. Mishin also is not known at all for being a PCs coach, if anything, its the opposite.
Plushenko is yet unproven as coach, and i highly doubt judges will randomly support his students. Also, he himself was always treated more as an athletic skater, rather than artistic one.

For PCs, I`d say Eteri or Buyanova.

I was thinking St Petersburg coaches and I do think Mishin or Plushenko carry more weight then her current coaches. She doesn't actually need coached on PCS aspects either. Just the illusion of a high profile coach will do and someone who can help find more stable jumps in the big events. Her 3f-3t looks great right now. It would be a shame if she isn't successful.

 

[hanca]

Any talk of her going to Plushenko or Mishin? I feel like if she had more political clout her scores would improve. She nailed it in the FS at Nationals and the judges hardly noticed.

I don’t think lack of political clout is her problem. The difference between you and the federation is that you are telling us how she managed the FS at the nationals and no one even noticed it, whereas the federation doesn’t look only at the FS but also at the SP. and if someone messes up the SP whereas ten others have full technical difficulty and skate clean, it is not surprising that the skater who messed up dropped like a stone in the result order. And if you then start FS with huge point deficit, it is hard to make that up. Yes, she was clean, but so where some of the others.

Look at Mao Asada at the last Olympics - messed up the SP, and despite a very strong FS, did not manage to get enough points for a medal. At the GP this season, when Zagitova messed up the SP, the only reason why she managed to get to gold place was that the field was very limited, and only a few from the field (2-3 skaters) wer potential threat to her point-wise. Her biggest threat, Osmond, has made a huge mess of her FS. But at Russian junior nationals the field is not limited, there is possibly at least 10 ladies and possibly more who will be fighting for the medals, and any loss of points will be impossible to make up.

 

[noidont]

For me Gubanova and Kostornaya are on the same level presentation-wise. The rest of the junior field only ticks the boxes.

 

[moriel]

I was thinking St Petersburg coaches and I do think Mishin or Plushenko carry more weight then her current coaches. She doesn't actually need coached on PCS aspects either. Just the illusion of a high profile coach will do and someone who can help find more stable jumps in the big events. Her 3f-3t looks great right now. It would be a shame if she isn't successful.

Oh, she doesnt need to be coached in PCs indeed, but she needs a coach who got students who get high PCs, imho. Because having a high profile PCs coach is what probably would make her PCs rise.


And yep, I also agree with hanca.
The fed has tons of talented skaters, so i dont see them propping someone too inconsistent despite coach or everything.

 

[Lucky Star]

I think Gubanova's coach made a wise decision with going to as many competitions as possible after disastorous JGP. She did very well and proved being in good shape mentally and physically, so if she is clean at Junior Nationals (and especially if she is clean at both Nationals), I see no problem for her to earn that spot for Junior Worlds. But she does have to be perfect, maybe even add some more rippon jumps. I cross my fingers for her, my dream JW team would be Gubanova, Trusova and Kostornaya even though I like other girls too

 

[plushyfan]

Honestly i[m not sure if Mishin and Plushenko have any PCs weight. Mishin skaters arent really getting sky high PCs. Mishin also is not known at all for being a PCs coach, if anything, its the opposite.
Plushenko is yet unproven as coach, and i highly doubt judges will randomly support his students. Also, he himself was always treated more as an athletic skater, rather than artistic one.

For PCs, I`d say Eteri or Buyanova.

Who is a artistic skater? Who can't jump? For ex Brown? So if anybody can jump or he had every jump that is not artistic skater? Did you forget Plushenko has more 6.0s for his presentation as any other skaters including Michelle Kwan? Oh, I'm so tired of it! Did you forget his Carmen, Adagio, Moonlight Sonata, Tango and Flamenco, Nijinski, etc programs? He is powerful but so perfect and expressive! Or that is an artistic skater who skates like a woman?

THe TRs is another thing he didn't prove how much he takes it seriously..But he undertsands the new system and the FS in general. (That is another thing what did he wants to do in his programs, what did they want to do with Mishin...) Probably he knows without TRs there is no good results today. So I think his students will be well-prepared in every aspect.

 

[Miller]

I think the skater to compare Anastasiia with is Alisa Fedichkina. I think we'd all agree that Anastasiia is a stronger skater than Alisa, yet Alisa (who is a 1st year senior like Anastasiia will be next year) is getting backing from the Russian Federation e.g. she's been able to skate Cup of Nice and 2 Challenger Series events in an attempt to get a really high Seasons Best/International Senior experience.

I see no reason why Anastasiia shouldn't get exactly the same sort of treatment even if she doesn't get to go to Junior Worlds for example.

The most important thing for all these young ladies is to get the chance to score an international season's best of about 195 points or so that will get them a Senior GP slot and the chance for their career to really take off. It will be no good slogging away for years on the Challenger circuit if you can't get a Senior GP, but get that and suddenly you have the chance to be in the mix.

Also I think that the Russian Federation has been doing an excellent job giving all these young ladies their chance. There was a bit of a mis-step with Valeria Mikhailova but even then she did well, plus Stanislava has been given numerous opportunities on the Challenger circuit since. Hence, even though Challenger spots will become a bit more precious in future years I see no reason why Anastasiia shouldn't get the chance at some time next year, and if she does happen to get to/do well at Junior Worlds then she may get to do Senior GPs next year rather than maybe the year after.