2018-19 U.S. Men’s figure skating

[ice coverage]

Here's the field as I see it, though i put the caveat that I am not sure the official status of these skaters.

The likely 2019 U.S. Nationals Podium (remember it's 1-4 here) ....

9.) Camden Pulkinen. He is the JGPF silver medalist and helped the U.S men retain 3 spots at Jr. Worlds after Alexei was forced to W/D. He also has a great 3A and a great performance/skating quality, but we'll see whether he can integrate a quad during this upcoming season. I can see him sneaking in the top 5 or 6 quite easily. ...

Is Camden going to remain a Junior? I don't see him on any lists.

Don't know what lists you have in mind ... but Camden :luv17: is on Mrs. P's list on the previous page -- her early thoughts on 2019 Nats.

And Camden has been discussed quite a lot in this thread.

My two cents (and perhaps wishful thinking) are that it seems very much within the realm of possibility that Camden will compete both in the Peggy Fleming Trophy and the Aerial Challenge ... plus the Broadmoor Open men's competition.
Also the Philadelphia Summer International (once again as a senior -- although I do not know his overall plan for the new season).
Go, Camden. :yay:

In any case, in a couple of weeks, he will perform in the Skate It Forward show. Hope that videos will be available, as they were last year.

BTW, congratulations to Camden for his graduation from high school in Arizona today.

---

ETA:

Camden's JW performance was disappointing. Because he was 17th in the SP, he was 6th overall, finishing behind the Russians, Italians and Canadians, so the US won't get two men at every JGP event this fall. He did well to finish 4th in the FS, but it wasn't enough to overcome the SP debacle. ...

Yes, it's too bad about Camden's JW SP.

But the number of JGP spots are not all on him. Tomoki also could have skated better.​

 

[Ice Dance]

I would hypothesize that Camden will compete the JGP, do a late season Challenger if he has the scores, and then compete as a senior at Nationals. (Which seems to be a fairly common path for U.S. guys the year after they win Junior Nationals, provided they stay healthy).

 

[mrrice]

Don't know what lists you have in mind ... but Camden :luv17: is on Mrs. P's list on the previous page -- her early thoughts on 2019 Nats.

And Camden has been discussed quite a lot in this thread.

My two cents (and perhaps wishful thinking) are that it seems very much within the realm of possibility that Camden will compete both in the Peggy Fleming Trophy and the Aerial Challenge ... plus the Broadmoor Open men's competition.
Also the Philadelphia Summer International (once again as a senior -- although I do not know his overall plan for the new season).
Go, Camden. :yay:

In any case, in a couple of weeks, he will perform in the Skate It Forward show. Hope that videos will be available, as they were last year.

BTW, congratulations to Camden for his graduation from high school in Arizona today.

You always come through. I love it, thank you so much!!

 

[century2009]

Yeah, Nathan is locked for the top of the US Men obviously, and a battle for #2, with most likely Vincent next and then Jason but very close to each other.

Vincent needs to fix these jumps/underotations and do a program he is actually capable of. Throughout this past season, it is apparent that he cant do all these quads in the program consistently and he gets drained. He lacks the stamina and consistency. He should have focused on a few and work on getting that together. I dont know why his team didnt do that as the season progressed because it shows that he was just trying to catch the top guys but isnt capable of. However, he does have the potential so we will see how he develops next season.

Also his programs really lack performance. It does look like he skates from one element to the next with a music in the background. I hope he really works on this and not just an after thought.

For Jason, it is the other way around. He has good program with solid skating skills, but then he lacks the jumps. For the past 2 seasons, I have been waiting for Jason to get these quads together because right now he really lacks the technical and consistency. The coaching change is positive so I hope he finds what he looks for to improve technically. We probably would have to wait a while to see development if any at all in the next season.

The next season feels like a "settling in" period as Juniors become Seniors (Alex and Camden) and a lot of the major Seniors retire (Max, Ross probably, Grant probably, and Adam probably).

 

[Tavi...]

There are an awful lot of variables right now. Among other things:

- Scoring system: will all of the proposed changes be adopted, including a change in PCS factoring?
- Judges: will judges continue to automatically equate lots of quads with high PCS and GOE?
- Training Center in CS: with Tammy’s move, will the World Arena become a training center a la TCC, and if so, how will that impact Vincent, Camden, et al? Will they improve faster?
- Nathan: how will he adapt to skating as a Yale student?
- Vincent: was Worlds a fluke? Can he master his < problems and improve presentation in competition?
- Jason: will his ankle be fully healed by July? How much will learning a new jump technique impact him in competition?

Incidentally, Mrs P, I’m not sure that Jason’s goals are limited to mastering a quad or two and making another Olympic team. Although he’s never said it, I do think his goal is to be competitive for medals at the World and Olympic level.

 

[Mrs. P]

There are an awful lot of variables right now. Among other things:

- Scoring system: will all of the proposed changes be adopted, including a change in PCS factoring?
- Judges: will judges continue to automatically equate lots of quads with high PCS and GOE?
- Training Center in CS: with Tammy’s move, will the World Arena become a training center a la TCC, and if so, how will that impact Vincent, Camden, et al? Will they improve faster?
- Nathan: how will he adapt to skating as a Yale student?
- Vincent: was Worlds a fluke? Can he master his < problems and improve presentation in competition?
- Jason: will his ankle be fully healed by July? How much will learning a new jump technique impact him in competition?

Incidentally, Mrs P, I’m not sure that Jason’s goals are limited to mastering a quad or two and making another Olympic team. Although he’s never said it, I do think his goal is to be competitive for medals at the World and Olympic level.

Agree on the variables, which is why I think the field among the top men is open and there is plenty of room for some junior dark horses to play spoiler.

As for Jason's goals, yeah, I know he's far more ambitious then what he's letting on. My point is that he doesn't necessarily reach the absolutely top echelon of the sport, i.e. the Worlds/Olympic podium, but he still experiences some growth technically/artistically, then the coaching/training environment change did its job.

 

[oatmella]

Max himself (as far as I know) is nothing but supportive of his teammates and other skaters/competitors. I have never heard of him saying anything negative about others.

As for Vincent, he filmed a promo at the Honda Center (venue of 4CC) when SOI was on tour there. The only others I know of who filmed the promo were Hubbell/Donahue - so I think this says something about Vincent’s standing within the US.

 

[chuckm]

Vincent did great at the Olympics, finishing 6th there. While he didn't do well at Worlds, he did finish 5 places ahead of Boyang Jin, who'd finished 4th at the Olympics. Jin has received nothing but sympathy for his meltdown, while Vincent, who was in his first senior season and certainly not used to doing two major events back-to-back within a month's time, gets brickbats.

 

[skylark]

Max himself (as far as I know) is nothing but supportive of his teammates and other skaters/competitors. I have never heard of him saying anything negative about others.

As for Vincent, he filmed a promo at the Honda Center (venue of 4CC) when SOI was on tour there. The only others I know of who filmed the promo were Hubbell/Donahue - so I think this says something about Vincent’s standing within the US.

Vincent did great at the Olympics, finishing 6th there. While he didn't do well at Worlds, he did finish 5 places ahead of Boyang Jin, who'd finished 4th at the Olympics. Jin has received nothing but sympathy for his meltdown, while Vincent, who was in his first senior season and certainly not used to doing two major events back-to-back within a month's time, gets brickbats.

Puzzling, isn't it. And Vincent is one of the sweetest kids around.

 

[merrywidow]

I believe in Vincent just as I believed in Jason when he was 17. Some skaters find success when they are young, others (like Adam or Rudy Galindo) take longer to reach their potential. The final chapter hasn't been written for either Vincent or Jason so I'll continue to hope for the best, not just for them but for all our U.S. competitors.

 

[tosca]

Vincent did great at the Olympics, finishing 6th there. While he didn't do well at Worlds, he did finish 5 places ahead of Boyang Jin, who'd finished 4th at the Olympics. Jin has received nothing but sympathy for his meltdown, while Vincent, who was in his first senior season and certainly not used to doing two major events back-to-back within a month's time, gets brickbats.

Seriously.

 

[lichi]

Vincent did great at the Olympics, finishing 6th there. While he didn't do well at Worlds, he did finish 5 places ahead of Boyang Jin, who'd finished 4th at the Olympics. Jin has received nothing but sympathy for his meltdown, while Vincent, who was in his first senior season and certainly not used to doing two major events back-to-back within a month's time, gets brickbats.

Worlds was disastrous...

And, as for the sympathy for Jin, I think it was partially because of the judges lowballing his score.

 

[oly2018]

I don't think Vincent has gotten any unfair criticism. Yes, some skaters take time to reach their peak, but some of his meltdowns this year have looked straight dangerous. That's the other thing, there have been a few meltdowns. There is no doubt that his 6th place at the Olympics should be applauded, but I don't think it is wrong to also be concerned about all off the other performances. I am not his biggest fan, but I do want him to do well because I think he is talented, but that also means his team needs to be realistic about his growth. I don't blame Vincent entirely because he is only 17 and his team really should have recognized that his layout was not working. I think that is why it may seem like Jin received more sympathy. He has had his moments, but he usually can execute his content.

Vincent has already had his fair share of injuries for being so young and I think he really needs to be scaled back so that we can see him achieve what he is capable of.

 

[apgold]

Speaking of Vincent, he posted on IG that he's in Toronto. (Fueling rumors that he's joining TCC, like everyone else, lol).

Perhaps he's there getting choreography?

 

[chuckm]

Vincent would do well to get away from Tom Z, who is a great believer in pushing the jumps at the expense of everything else, including the skater's bodily health.

 

[oatmella]

Speaking of Vincent, he posted on IG that he's in Toronto. (Fueling rumors that he's joining TCC, like everyone else, lol).

Perhaps he's there getting choreography?

Who’s he getting choreography from in Toronto? I thought Lori is doing his programs (or maybe just one of them). Is Jeffrey Buttle still in Japan?

Maybe Vincent is visiting TCC . He did participate in that Brian Orser-produced show in Korea ...

 

[karne]

Vincent, who was in his first senior season and certainly not used to doing two major events back-to-back within a month's time, gets brickbats.

Funny, this didn't seem to be a problem the Vincent fans were worried about last year when people were advocating him doing the Junior-Senior double because obviously Vincent could deliver the third spot but Jason couldn't...

Speaking of Vincent, he posted on IG that he's in Toronto. (Fueling rumors that he's joining TCC, like everyone else, lol).

Perhaps he's there getting choreography?

Hope it's Buttle if so. I liked the look of the program Josh did for him, and Josh's style is quite similar to Buttle's.

I have always, no matter the skater, demanded that if "tech content" was to be considered an argument then it needed to be rotated. It is my view that the attitude of "throw it and who cares if you rotate it" is a dangerous one and one that the ISU needs to stamp out.

It's obvious that Vincent has talent. To me however so far his technique and his results have not made it obvious at all that he should be anointed US number two.

 

[SnowWhite]

Who’s he getting choreography from in Toronto? I thought Lori is doing his programs (or maybe just one of them). Is Jeffrey Buttle still in Japan?

Maybe Vincent is visiting TCC . He did participate in that Brian Orser-produced show in Korea ...

He said that Lori was doing one program and Jeff the other.

 

[karne]

He said that Lori was doing one program and Jeff the other.

Ooooh, that's great news. (About Buttle, I mean. Not about Lori. Lori is bad news.)

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

Vincent is probably visiting Lori for choreo, IIRC Jeff is still in Japan.