2018 Lake Placid Ice Dance International

[SnowWhite]

I may be the odd one out, but I actually prefer P/P's programs. I felt no connection between C/M in the RD and I found the free a bit boring. The choreo is great, but I found the music really one note. I have never been a huge fan of the Parsons, but I really like their RD. They seem to be taking a more playful approach to the tango and I think it works. As for their free, I think they could have chosen a different song. The choreo has some similarities to last year's, so it kind of feels like another song could have been applied for the same feel. It seems like they are going for a more modern dance look and I think it works for them, but they lost SO much speed by the end. That may just be because it was their first outing, but the last spin almost came to a halt.

Overall, both teams seem to be heading in the right direction, but they both really need to work on their lifts. A lot of the positions are really awkward and don't look fluid.

I also preferred P/P's tango. I wasn't sure how they'd do with it, but I thought it worked quite well for them. On the last spin, apparently it's a new variation and Michael put his foot down in the middle of it, so it definitely didn't go as planned. Someone watching speculated that he was still thinking about that and was distracted, hence the footwork fall.

 

[La Rhumba]

On first viewing of the top 2 FDs: Loved Lorraine & Quinn! Though in truth if you've heard one Yann Tiersen composition, you've heard them all, but they interpret it beautifully, more romantic, light connection than I've seen from them before. And their Lifts are so impressive, considering what a slightly built guy he is, he lifts her effortlessly in interesting positions. I see a progression in this couple's work whereas the Parsons are doing much the same we've seen from them before.

 

[Ice Dance]

Last year, protocols came up on the ISU site prior to the Lake Placid home page. If that is the case, the protocols may be posted first here:

https://isu.org/events/eventdetail/11837/-/lake-placid-ice-dance-international?templateParam=11

I did check the "entries & results" section & there are only placements posted at this time. I'm just curious about the protocols because this is our first international dance event with the new system.

 

[composer]

My thoughts that nobody asked for lol

M/C RD: looked a bit tentative and unpolished to me, especially the first part. I felt like they had a better connection to the music in the second half. That lift looked really awkward and I hope they fix it. Definitely has room to grow here.

M/C FD: beautiful dance from them. Agree with whoever said it was their movements that defined the dance and not the music.

P/P RD: more polished than M/C I think.

P/P FD: I actually love the parts where they move in sync. They are so similar in size and build that it really stands out (in a good way) when they rise and fall and skate in unison.

Off topic but ... I miss the Shibs' super extra twizzles from last season. The twizzles here are so tame in comparison.

 

[NoNameFace]

Finally I watched Parsons and McNamara/Carpenter FDs.

I have to say that indeed Rachel and Michael look good with that sort of repetoire with emphasis more on feel in movement that certain character and they look best in synchronized sequences. Their holds at this point are looking a tad laboured for me and lifts are looking too heavy for that music. Watching this program, 'Bittersweet Symphony' by The Verve crept to my mind - and I have to say that this would be for me much better, powerful choice for them to explore. With the right edit and choreo it could shine. But I am curious how this program will develop.

Lorraine and Quinn - for me, they have a winner on their hands: the music is a canvas for their movement and feelings they input into it. There is some freshness there and lyrical quality that engages, catches eye. Absolutely in love with musical sensibility in choreography bits, especially twizzles, first lift and spin, that slow-motion time perfectly with music into the spin is so far my favourite thing in any new program. And I love that there are more such little details in this FD that build on uniqueness.

 

[markovai]

For the record:

The ISU site does have full protocols for:

2015 Lake Placid Ice Dance International: https://isu.org/events/eventdetail/10887/-/lake-placid-ice-dance-international?templateParam=11

2017 LPIDI: https://isu.org/events/eventdetail/11143/-/lake-placid-ice-dance-international?templateParam=11​

The ISU link for 2016 LPIDI protocols was alive and well within a few days after the event, although it now is dead.

https://www.isu.org/media/369068/lake-placid-ice-dance-international_protocol-report.pdf

https://www.goldenskate.com/forum/s...hampionships&p=1460416&viewfull=1#post1460416​

The ISU site does have full protocols for:

2015 Philadelphia Summer International: https://isu.org/events/eventdetail/10885/-/philadelphia-summer-international?templateParam=11

2017 Philadelphia Summer International: https://isu.org/events/eventdetail/11472/-/philadelphia-summer-international?templateParam=11

(Philadelphia Summer International did not take place in 2016.)​

And … I can say that the club website does/did have 2017 Philadelphia Summer International full protocols:

2017 Senior Men: http://iceworkssc.org/psic/results/2017/2017 PHL_INT Senior Men Combine Result.pdf

2017 Senior Ladies: http://iceworkssc.org/psic/results/2017/2017 PHL_INT Senior Ladies Combine Result.pdf

2017 Junior Men: http://iceworkssc.org/psic/results/2017/2017 PHL_INT Junior Men Combine Result.pdf

2017 Junior Ladies: http://iceworkssc.org/psic/results/2017/2017 PHL_INT Junior Ladies Combine Result.pdf​

2017 PSIC ended on Aug 6, and protocols were on the club website by Aug 8.

(The club website's overall link for its 2017 results page now is dead. But the individual 2017 PDF links above still work.)​

Yes, it would be great to have live results.

Meanwhile, for non-live results, I for one am happy to give credit where credit is due.

The organisers of each international competiton are required by ISU to send the official consolidated protocol from the entire competition to ISU. So, sooner or later the protocols appear on the ISU website. But I am not interested now in the protocols from 2015 or 2016. People are interested in the detailed protocols from this year's competiton as this is the first international of the new season, with changed rules, new GOEs, new rhythmic dance, and many more new things. Five days after the end there is no way to find these detailed results. So, you should give up and admit that the organisation of this competiton is by far not the best.

 

[ice coverage]

... So, you should give up and admit that the organisation of this competiton is by far not the best.

I never once said that the organization of LPIDI is anything close to "the best".

You previously made at least one statement that was not true -- and after two of us pointed out that it was not true, you subsequently admitted that it was not true.

(I would add that on the issue of live results, you are choosing to hold the non-Challenger LPIDI to a higher standard than Challengers that do not post live results.)

And I said that I see the glass as half full. I will continue to do so. YMMV.

 

[Andrea82]

I understand not updating results live. I believe that no live results happen quite frequently in International competitions below Challenger level but I admit I don't have stats on it.

However, not publishing a pdf file with protocols after a week is indeed pretty poor.

I suppose ISU have them by now though or will they arrive in 14 days togehter with the Referee report, etc? Given the results have been uploaded on the ISU webpage, ISU itself could have added the protocols in that zip file, couldn't they?

 

[ice coverage]

… I suppose ISU have them by now though or will they arrive in 14 days togehter with the Referee report, etc? Given the results have been uploaded on the ISU webpage, ISU itself could have added the protocols in that zip file, couldn't they?

:agree: We do not know the reason for the lag in posting protocols by the ISU. If(??) the ISU has the protocols but has not posted them, then the ISU lag would have nothing to do with whether USFS and/or the LOC are doing an adequate job of running LPIDI.

 

[Andrea82]

:agree: We do not know the reason for the lag in posting protocols by the ISU. If(??) the ISU has the protocols but has not posted them, then the ISU lag would have nothing to do with whether USFS and/or the LOC are doing an adequate job of running LPIDI.

I now checked the rule book. They need to send the protocols to ISU Secretariat "not later than one week after the completion of the event".

 

[ice coverage]

I now checked the rule book. They need to send the protocols to ISU Secretariat "not later than one week after the completion of the event".

Thank you.

Regarding the speed -- or lack thereof -- of the ISU in updating its website, an anecdotal observation re Asian Open Figure Skating Trophy, which is a Challenger event:

As of Jul 29, the host federation had added the Parsons to the entry list for Asian Open Trophy.

It is now more than three days later, and the ISU has not yet updated the entry list on the ISU site, which remains unchanged since July 25.

Per the Announcement:

4.2.1 Entries of Competitors

The Entries by names must be made via the ISU Online Registration System (ORS):

https://fms.sportresult.com/isu​

and will be submitted via the ORS simultaneously to the:

Figure and Speed Skating Association of Thailand
286 Ramkhamheang Rd, Huamark,
Bangkapi, Bangkok, 10240, Thailand​

tel / fax: +66 2 186 7555
e-mail: [email protected]​

and to:

ISU Secretariat
fax: +41 21 612 66 77​

e-mail: [email protected]​

not later than: Friday, July 20, 2018 – 20:00 h (Local time Bangkok) ​

(Not clear whether the ISU Online Registration System would have been used also for late entries.)

Just sayin'.

[The Parsons really are there in Thailand, per their social media:

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bl5zxajjeTV/?taken-by=michaelap95 (Jul 31)
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bl-ScZnj9G5/?taken-by=michaelap95 (Aug 2)]​

---

ETA (on Aug 2):

I should and do acknowledge that USFS unfortunately has not updated its assignment page either.​

 

[La Rhumba]

[The Parsons really are there in Thailand, per their social media:

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bl5zxajjeTV/?taken-by=michaelap95 (Jul 31)
https://www.instagram.com/p/Bl-ScZnj9G5/?taken-by=michaelap95 (Aug 2)]​

[/INDENT]

Nice pics. Sincerely hope the Parsons weren't watching the latest Skating Lesson video on the plane. Or Lorraine & Quinn. Sheesh!

 

[WeakAnkles]

I'm telling you, the footwork is incredible. The way it travels around the full rink. You think it is going to go one way, and it travels another. Unexpected & creative. Plus their trademark speed throughout.

The footwork is quite interesting, particularly as you noted above. But the music is so noodly I was just bored. They've upped the ante on their dance spins, which to me were the most interesting and fresh part of both of their programs. What concerns me is they appear to have deliberately toned down their quirkiness, and it is precisely their quirkiness which is (for me at least) their greatest strength. I would love them to push the avant more and be less on guard.

 

[Ice Dance]

What concerns me is they appear to have deliberately toned down their quirkiness, and it is precisely their quirkiness which is (for me at least) their greatest strength. I would love them to push the avant more and be less on guard.

This from the poster who was advocating Popova be more subtle only a season or two ago.

But enough teasing. I agree that the quirkiness is one of M&C's greatest strengths. The drama as well. And the power. Most of all, the storytelling. If they have a story, they can tell it. I would hate for them to be pushed into the traditional North American mold. But there is quirkiness in this year's FD, even if it is lyrical. I think that's why it works. It feels like them.

As for the tango, I'm just so glad to see how different it is from last season's. Last year's was successful, and I worried they might just repackage it as an SD, which wouldn't allow for growth. But this has a completely different feel. It's also not Libertango, Adios Nonino, Cell Block Tango, Assassin's Tango, Tango de Roxanne, or even Piazolla. It's unique. (Knock on wood). Even if someone else winds up selecting the music, it's not something we've seen a million times before. It's something that was developed to be M&C's own, and I'm good with that. Really, the tango is something that I think comes pretty naturally to their dynamic.

They're a young team and learning. This year's material addresses a lot of the critiques they faced last season, and sometimes you have to prove you can skate that way before people will acknowledge your own strengths.

But I love your comment above because I feel it's also true. This year's material is a stepping stone. But M&C's unique strengths & personality are so important. That, in combination with great skating, is what gets a team to the top.

 

[Andrea82]

Hebemus Protocols!!

https://isu.org/docman-documents-li...id-ice-dance-international-2018-protocol/file


Panel of Judges

Senior Ice Dance

Referee:Ms. Jenny MAST (USA) *ISU status
Technical Controller: Ms. Halina GORDON-POLTORAK (Poland) *ISU status
Technical Specialist: Ms. Kristen FRASER-LUKANIN (Azerbaijan) *ISU status
Assistant Technical Specialist: Ms. Lauren SENFT (Canada) *ISU status

Judge#1: Ms Patty KLEIN (Canada) * International status
Judge#2: Mr Eric HAMPTON (USA) * International status
Judge#3: Mr Jeroen PRINS (Netherlands) *ISU status
Judge#4: Mr David MUNOZ (Spain) *ISU status
Judge#5: Ms Kathaleen CUTONE (USA) * International status


Junior Ice Dance

Referee: Ms. Halina GORDON-POLTORAK (Poland) *ISU status
Technical Controller: Ms. Janis ENGEL (USA) *International status
Technical Specialist: Ms. Galit CHAIT (Israel) *ISU status
Assistant Technical Specialist: Ms. Lauren SENFT (Canada) *ISU status

Judge#1: Mr Eric HAMPTON (USA) * International status
Judge#2: Mr Jeroen PRINS (Netherlands) *ISU status
Judge#3: Mr David MUNOZ (Spain) *ISU status
Judge#4: Ms Patty KLEIN (Canada) * International status
Judge#5: Ms Kathaleen CUTONE (USA) * International status

____

In the FD the Parsons got a Music requirements violation called by 4 judges (Klein, Prins, Munoz, Cutone). That's a -2
The same judges called it also to Sales/Wamsteeker.
Monaghan/Fourati had the music requirements violation called by Hampton, Prins, Munoz and the referee