2018 Olympic Season: Ice Dance

[Anyasnake]

y'all are thinking I said PCs programs are just downright easy. I did not say that. I do not think that. I think they are easier compared to what other teams are doing but in no way think they are just plain easy. I love their stationary lift. I do not like their curve lift or straight line lift or their lift from the SD. It's my opinion, I understand others have different opinions and that y'all aren't going to agree with me. But oh well. Lets all just live with the fact that others have different points of view and we're not going to change them by bickering on the internet.

I understood that personally, and I disagree, but of course we can have a different opinion ! What would be left for debate otherwise ! As long as we are all respectful of each other :agree:
It's just that I heard that for 3 years from many people on the internet, but never from coaches, other skaters or judges. Also, commentators always points out the difficulty of their program and that they make it look so easy. SO it's not easier than another team, especially if everything is designed for level 4. It's way too hard to trick the judges.

 

[Purv]

y'all are thinking I said PCs programs are just downright easy. I did not say that. I do not think that. I think they are easier compared to what other teams are doing but in no way think they are just plain easy. I love their stationary lift. I do not like their curve lift or straight line lift or their lift from the SD. It's my opinion, I understand others have different opinions and that y'all aren't going to agree with me. But oh well. Lets all just live with the fact that others have different points of view and we're not going to change them by bickering on the internet.

I think she/he knew what you meant.That they are doing easier stuff then the rest..
I d love to see w/p shibs or c/b in french's FD from last year or v/t in Moonlight sonata

 

[ChanClan]

I think she/he knew what you meant.That they are doing easier stuff then the rest..
I d love to see w/p shibs or c/b in french's FD from last year or v/t in Moonlight sonata

And I'd love to see PC doing Moulin Rouge. idk... I just find that everyones FD are getting boring after a couple/few years of doing similar stuff. I personally like exciting and unexpected which I don't find happened a lot this quad compared to previous quads.

 

[Purv]

And I'd love to see PC doing Moulin Rouge. idk... I just find that everyones FD are getting boring after a couple/few years of doing similar stuff. I personally like exciting and unexpected which I don't find happened a lot this quad compared to previous quads.

I mean Technically. so yes they would that in ease, maybe not those lifts but who knows how high gabriella could jump

 

[Anyasnake]

And I'd love to see PC doing Moulin Rouge. idk... I just find that everyones FD are getting boring after a couple/few years of doing similar stuff. I personally like exciting and unexpected which I don't find happened a lot this quad compared to previous quads.

You're not the only one who said that, but for sure no one is going crazy over the Olympic year that was expected. I think you'll get a lot more unexpected next season, since post-Olympic season is here for that. But trends changes from quad to quad, I'll admit the difference between pre-2014 and post-2014 was something (I really enjoyed it). We'll see ! Especially since a lot more teams will have to step up their game to stay in the talks or to knock on the top 10 doors.

 

[ChanClan]

You're not the only one who said that, but for sure no one is going crazy over the Olympic year that was expected. I think you'll get a lot more unexpected next season, since post-Olympic season is here for that. But trends changes from quad to quad, I'll admit the difference between pre-2014 and post-2014 was something (I really enjoyed it). We'll see ! Especially since a lot more teams will have to step up their game to stay in the talks or to knock on the top 10 doors.

oh yeah, I'm not surprised or mad about people going with what they are comfortable with for the Olympics I just wish that in the last years there were more people doing different styles for their FDs.

 

[Mango]

I just want to say I too think Volosozhar/Trankov are cool but since this is an ice dance thread we may want to talk about Virtue/Moir.

 

[shine]

It's so funny that some seem to think just because two programs tend to be kind of lyrical they must be the same style. That's some very superficial generalization of music and performing styles. Even within one program (e.g. Moonlight Sonata) I see much varied expression, level of intensity and rhythm.

Do they also think all impressionist paintings are the same?

 

[VIETgrlTerifa]

I don't care so much about pushing boundaries so much as teams giving us programs that they themselves sincerely feel and want to present. I appreciate the honesty that comes out when a team is proud of their program when they perform it. I think there's something to be said about doing something similar but finding new depths and new angles and new ways to bring out nuanced and at times complicated emotions. To me, a team that "does the same FD season after season" doesn't fail by simply doing something similar, but if they fail, it's because they don't discover something deeper or newer with the maturity they should have gained by exploring similar themes previously.

I think pushing the boundaries also shouldn't be forced but should be something a team wants to do because it simply feels right to them at that moment in time. There are also little ways in pushing the boundaries that inspires others and it doesn't have to be something obvious. IMO, simply skating to different genres of music or cycling through the accepted/recognized ballroom rhythms (Latin one season, tango the next, lyrical the next, waltz next, etc.) to me may show an attempt at versatility and also may be desired if we fans start becoming bored, but I don't think it's pushing the boundaries per se. Also, some times a classically done routine can be pushed to the edge. It all depends on the elements, how it's choreographed, and how the skaters are portraying the music/character.

Anyway, this thread isn't really fun right now, and I hope we can have passionate discussions without biting each other's heads off.

 

[tzazu]

This thread is going really boring

My favs for bronze are Weaver/Poje, Shibs, Hubbell/Donahue, Capellini/Lanote , Gilles/Poirier...too many:hpull:. There is only one medal,so...Shibs...or Weaber/Poje, I have a weak spot for them :hopelessness:

 

[skylark]

I don't care so much about pushing boundaries so much as teams giving us programs that they themselves sincerely feel and want to present. I appreciate the honesty that comes out when a team is proud of their program when they perform it. I think there's something to be said about doing something similar but finding new depths and new angles and new ways to bring out nuanced and at times complicated emotions. To me, a team that "does the same FD season after season" doesn't fail by simply doing something similar, but if they fail, it's because they don't discover something deeper or newer with the maturity they should have gained by exploring similar themes previously.

All of the things you articulated in this paragraph are making me think of Madison Chock and Evan Bates' FD at CoC. I really love it, from Imagine to Lennon's voice to the waltzy violin interlude. (I'm not crazy about the female singer's voice, but she had to sing in John Lennon's key, so it was a fairly tough ask. I think a better soprano voice could be found, but Madi and Evan must have chosen her for a reason.)

Anyway, I had the feeling, that what we saw was a very early version of that dance. I'm really looking forward to seeing it revealed ... and how it will evolve. I'm convinced there are more depths and nuances in Christopher Dean's choreography, and I trust Madi and Evan to explore them and really be something special by Olympics time. :luv17:

 

[asunta]

I don't care so much about pushing boundaries so much as teams giving us programs that they themselves sincerely feel and want to present. I appreciate the honesty that comes out when a team is proud of their program when they perform it. I think there's something to be said about doing something similar but finding new depths and new angles and new ways to bring out nuanced and at times complicated emotions. To me, a team that "does the same FD season after season" doesn't fail by simply doing something similar, but if they fail, it's because they don't discover something deeper or newer with the maturity they should have gained by exploring similar themes previously.

I think pushing the boundaries also shouldn't be forced but should be something a team wants to do because it simply feels right to them at that moment in time. There are also little ways in pushing the boundaries that inspires others and it doesn't have to be something obvious. IMO, simply skating to different genres of music or cycling through the accepted/recognized ballroom rhythms (Latin one season, tango the next, lyrical the next, waltz next, etc.) to me may show an attempt at versatility and also may be desired if we fans start becoming bored, but I don't think it's pushing the boundaries per se. Also, some times a classically done routine can be pushed to the edge. It all depends on the elements, how it's choreographed, and how the skaters are portraying the music/character..

VIETgrlTerifa, I think many people find in your post something to agree with.

As for versatility vs. "repeating" your own style my two cents.

It's ok for me if ice dancers want to try different genres, but I wouldn't call it pushing the boundries, in retrospective it's quite mainstream approach. So called versatility usually means quite predictable "figure skating repertoire": classics, rock/pop medley, ballroom dance, musical, popular opera/ballet.

I prefer a more musical approach in general, that's why I like Papadakis/Cizeron FD's a lot. From my point of view, their assiduous development of more abstract and refined concepts it's refreshing and appealing. I really do not expect from them typical for ice dance "crop rotation" - we did already contemporary so next year we need to do a musical (as a genre), movie soundtrack, tutu ballet.....ect.

 

[nocturnalis]

Also, this sport isn't just about the artistry, it's also about the technical side and imo, I think VM have a better technique, mostly because they've been around a lot longer. To me, the sport of ice dance isn't just what they can make me feel or how fluidly they glide across the ice because at the end of the day it's still a sport. It still requires the technical part and while I love PCs FD and style in general, some of the lifts they are doing are really easy compared to the lifts that other teams do. They flow nicely with the program but leave me feeling disappointed because I expect the top teams to push their own boundaries and imo, I just don't think they are doing that. I just don't think those lifts should score the same. But before anyone comes at me, I know that all their lifts satisfy the requirements to be scored the same and that they execute them extremely well so deserve the high GOE they get on them, I just don't agree with the rules on how scoring the technical elements goes.

Virtue and Moir were better technically when they were younger than P/C.

 

[Cherry blossom]

Virtue and Moir were better technically when they were younger than P/C.

Amen

 

[alain06fr]

Virtue and Moir were better technically when they were younger than P/C.

Yeah of course, better than P/C better than D/W better than anyone else, right?

 

[Lester]

It's so funny that some seem to think just because two programs tend to be kind of lyrical they must be the same style. That's some very superficial generalization of music and performing styles. Even within one program (e.g. Moonlight Sonata) I see much varied expression, level of intensity and rhythm.

Do they also think all impressionist paintings are the same?

Well, they are the same general genre. And there are so many others to pick from, that's the point.
It does get boring when a team never dares to venture outside their most successful genre for years in a row, even if they skate the divinest programs with great depth and nuance.

 

[Purv]

Yeah of course, better than P/C better than D/W better than anyone else, right?

They were gods at 10

 

[KKonas]

The programs were done with a theme : latin, waltz, theatrical... D/W were "lucky" that they loved Scheherazade, they're the ones who picked it, it fitted the mood/Russian classics in Sochi. V/M (well Tessa) wanted Bride&Prejudice (also Romeo&Juliet I think ? correct me if I'm wrong ! ) Marina said no (and this year she gave that out to the German team ).
But a lot of the top teams picked their own music this season (Shibs have almost 100% of creative music control). I'd rather see that, because they are some coach that can have some crazy ideas for their students... At least everyone have their own identity and it's so much better. However, I understand coaches picking up music for the SD because it can be harder for, let's say, a Polka.

Actually D&W decided to use Scheherazade for the Olympic season about 2 years prior to the 2013-2014 season

 

[KKonas]

y'all are thinking I said PCs programs are just downright easy. I did not say that. I do not think that. I think they are easier compared to what other teams are doing but in no way think they are just plain easy. I love their stationary lift. I do not like their curve lift or straight line lift or their lift from the SD. It's my opinion, I understand others have different opinions and that y'all aren't going to agree with me. But oh well. Lets all just live with the fact that others have different points of view and we're not going to change them by bickering on the internet.

Lifts done from a low-lying position from the man are more difficult technically to execute than lifts done from an upright position.

 

[Anyasnake]

Actually D&W decided to use Scheherazade for the Olympic season about 2 years prior to the 2013-2014 season

Yep, that's why I meant. D/W loved the music and wanted to save it for the Olys and Marina agreed.
(My post is unclear I'll change it a bit)