2020-21 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[Spirals for Miles]

While she is a good skater overall, (and as you are saying her Lz edge was wrong, not even unclear), i also noticed at Russian Nationals she had problems to fully rotate jumps, and all Russian panel called some of her jumps in free as UR. So rotation on some jumps can be her weakness, too. (All of that while being a Mishin skater, who would say :dev3

Added! I'd be interested in knowing what others think of all the skaters (and many more!) as well

Thank you, Spirals for Miles! This is fantastic to read, and very helpful for me! I shall be keeping these observations in mind when watching their skates in future. I remember Anastasia Tarakanova from the JGP, and she is indeed passionate and powerful; I hope she gets to go senior whenever we next have a season. Elizaveta Nugumanova had a pretty nice free skate at Nationals, really fun to watch, though she definitely stalled a bit coming out of some of her jumps, and I finally understood (or I think I did!) what Ted Barton means when he talks about the jumps being tight, when she landed one of her combos and virtually turned on the spot, she had so little momentum, instead of flowing out of it, the way the stronger jumpers did.

I can't actually remember anything about Ksenia Tsibinova or Anastasia Guliakova from their Nationals free skates, except that I thiiiiink Guliakova skated in the final flight. Clearly will have to rewatch their programmes. And I did not know that Serafima Sakhanovich was working on a quad salchow! If she does succeed in learning the quad and landing it in competition consistently, I imagine she will shoot up through the standings, and maybe even be a contender for a team spot? Still very much a conditional, though. I do wonder whether the longer break from competition will help the skaters who are working on getting quads (I would very much like to see the rumoured potential quad salchows of Aliona and Evgenia both in the future, and am now adding Serafima to the list).

Going back to the not-team-members, though, if I want to see these skaters in competition, will they be found at challengers and domestic competitions? It really is a pity that they can't more of them compete internationally, as they are so good.

Yes, Guliakova skated really well there and made the top 7! She was in the final flight for the FS since she placed 6th in the SP

Serafima's 4S is very much a work in progress, I think, but I hope to see her compete it someday!

It's most likely that we'll see the non-team-members at challengers and domestically, in my opinion, though Guliakova does have a shot at the Rostelecom host spot if the GP happens. Hopefully, we will also see more challenger assignments, especially for those who wouldn't be seen on the GP . It really is such a pity that they can't all be on the GP

 

[flanker]

Well, if you want to convince yourself of what you’re saying, there’s nothing I can say that’ll make you think otherwise. You can defend whoever you want to, and I can have my opinion, that will totally not change because you made a passionate text.

If people keep saying those things about Alina it’s because these problems are not addressed by her coaches and she doesn’t seem to improve on them from one season to the other. Fans insist on things and, sometimes, these things become more well known to the judges and the general public, and more fair competitions can happen because of this.

And if you’re talking about the coaching changes, you can keep busy looking for the times when I started liking one skater more or less because of their coach, it doesn’t make a difference to me.

Let’s talk about the time after test skates when I came to this forum to praise Alina and say she was the absolute best at Test Skates 2019. Because I think she was. Then, Kostornaia got the triple axel and became a judges favorite, but until Aliona’s triple axel, Alina still was a huge contender last season and she had my favorite programs so far. And that’s a HUGE compliment, considering I don’t like Daniil’s choreography.

But guess what, by your standards, I’m an Alina hater. Can I ask you something, try to say who’s my favorite skater based on what I write here, I really doubt you’ll be correct.

It's long-time experience with people, nothing more.

The persistency and amount with what Alina was submitted to scrutiny for any move/step/bend was absolutely incomparable with anything else here during the recent years and it just continues. Any obvious flaw of any other skater never received so much "research".

I don't have and never had any idea about your favourite skater, because that simply is nothing of my interest. The only thing why I started to react to your posts was your self-confidence about your statements and your imagination of yourself being somehow an authority in a matter of skating skills, esp. those of Alina, and the continuing with all the scrutiny mentioned above. As I've said before, "I honestly never ever read anything specific, objective and verifiable that would truly show any conflict between the ISU rules and those bashed skaters skating". Just many dull words. No "problems (that) are not addressed by her coaches". Or "fair competitions" thanks to that. What a delusion.

Of course, that’s exactly what I meant but couldn’t put into words. It’s such a petty that Alina decided to retire when she was just starting to show her entire capacity. And her programs were good too, Daniil did a good job with them last season. Carmen and POTO were sufferable to me, but Cleopatra and Me Voy (even with the screaming nobody likes but that don’t bother me) were great programs. Alina was the most distinguished russian skater last season, so adult and beautiful, improved, it’s so sad...


Enviado do meu iPhone usando Tapatalk

Just for a record: Alina didn't retire. Above I've mentioned the experience with people. This is what exactly fits the experience, BTW...

 

[Mathman]

The persistency and amount with what Alina was submitted to scrutiny for any move/step/bend was absolutely incomparable with anything else here during the recent years...

I think it depends of what we mean by "recent years." Patrick Chan was mercilessly crucified on a daily basis back in the day. Canadian Golden Skate members alternated between trying to defend him and raging against Golden Skate for hating Canada. A few years back the entire Yuzuru Hanyu fan fest quit Golden Skate en masse in high dudgeon over posters picking on their guy. Mao Asada, during her rivalry with Yuna Kim, was blamed for everything from flutzing to being personally responsible for wartime atrocities committed during World War II.

I guess we skating fans are just a passionate group.

 

[Skatesocs]

Mao Asada, during her rivalry with Yuna Kim, was blamed for everything from flutzing to being personally responsible for wartime atrocities committed during World War II.

I guess we skating fans are just a passionate group.

Amazing lol. I need to get there in the archives then

 

[flanker]

I think it depends of what we mean by "recent years." Patrick Chan was mercilessly crucified on a daily basis back in the day. Canadian Golden Skate members alternated between trying to defend him and raging against Golden Skate for hating Canada. A few years back the entire Yuzuru Hanyu fan fest quit Golden Skate en masse in high dudgeon over posters picking on their guy. Mao Asada, during her rivalry with Yuna Kim, was blamed for everything from flutzing to being personally responsible for wartime atrocities committed during World War II.

I guess we skating fans are just a passionate group.

I can't say how elsewhere, but I think I can say hardly any threat has over 1000 pages every year as the RLT (according to the current number of posts per page), and half of it was some fighting about Alina, Eteri's team, or as a related topic Evgenia (which all are communicating vessels).

Though I would say I'm mostly indifferent about the negativity concerning skaters (till some level), I understand there will be always people who simply don't like particular things. But through time the saying "I'm a fan/not hater, but" became synonyme of an unhonest comment. As I've repeated mnany times, I just don't belive a person who says that he's a fan but you never hear a single positive thing about a skater he criticizes. It's just a tool how to make a comment sounding more "objective". If the comments would be "those are good sides, this is what I consider weak sides", that I could consider objective, but claiming objectivity and then talking only about negative things (some positive notes added ex post after objections in some cases don't look convincing) doesn't sound honest. And the experience tells me how people who are making such posts write completely differently about other skaters.

BTW I'm aware of Mao Asada case. I admit that's a level of its own.

Though, this was about who wrote what and how, now back to ladies.

 

[Fluture]

But through time the saying "I'm a fan/not hater, but" became synonyme of an unhonest comment.

I wouldn‘t say dishonest. It‘s very easy to be called a “hater“ in threads like this, I guess it‘s often partly a way of trying to clarify that the following criticism is not meant as... well, hate. Usually, it goes both ways.

Also, since you‘re so bothered by the whole ”I‘m a fan but..“ followed by criticism, why don‘t we try and turn it around for a change? “I‘m not a fan but“ followed by praise. I think this could be nice. And more peaceful.

So, here goes nothing:

I‘m not a fan of Alina but she has beautiful spins and showed some serious artistic growth last season in her Me Voy SP. It was mature, vulnerable and expressive. Also, the way she saved her 3Lz+3Lo at the Olympics was a boss move and she deserves all the credit for that. How she came back after the RusNats and Euros disappointment last season and went on to win Worlds is truly inspiring.

I‘m not a fan of Sasha Trusova but I love her for her tenacity and strength. Her bravery in which she tries what no one has done before is truly admirable. She also seems like a humble girl despite already being in the history books multiple times. She‘s got a champion‘s character.

I‘m not a fan of Anna Shcherbakova but she‘s a beautiful artist and sensitive skater who not only hears the music but really feels it. How she handled a nearly career ending injury and showed up the next season with even more of a fighting spirit than before is inspiring. She also has a way of winning when people last expect her to, proving that time and again the last two seasons.

I‘m not a fan of Liza Tuktamysheva but how she came back so strongly after many disappointing seasons is a testament to her character. She also has fantastic jumping technique, an impeccable lutz jump. Her landing a quad as an adult women makes her an inspiration to other skaters trying to do the same.

Got the idea?

(also, to clarify what being a fan constitutes for me: I see it as fan coming from “fanatic“, so while I cheer and care for all the ladies mentioned above, I won‘t be fanatic enough to get up in the middle of the night to watch their performances, pacing nervously all over the room while they skate. And luckily so, as it‘s barely manageable for the few true favorites I do have. )

Added! I'd be interested in knowing what others think of all the skaters (and many more!) as well

Well, I guess I‘ll give it a try.

Sima Sakhanovich:
+ strong and high jumper, nice rippons, fast spins, strong expressions, good combo jumps
- lack of flexibility, inconsistency, weak 2A and lutz

Anastasia Gulyakova
+ nice rippons, 3A landed in practice, relatively consistent
- weak programs and choreography, prone to UR, lack of expression, mediocre spins

Anastasia Tarakanova
+ SPEED, skating skills, effortless cross overs, can be passionate performer if given the right vehicles, great jump technique (beautiful lutz!), no edge issues, nice rippons
- inconsistency, frequent change of coach, lack of expression in recent programs

Kseniia Sinitsyna
+ good jumping technique (like most Panova students), nice spins, great skating skills, subtle yet interesting choreography
- inconsistent towards the end of the season, occasional lack of expression

Anastasiia Gubanova
+ musicality, skating skills, good flow
- has somewhat lost her old performance quality, inconsistency, weird lutz and flip technique, unreliable jumping technique in general

Elizaveta Nugumanova
+ interpretation, musicality, elegance, great spins, good performer, wide artistic range
- constantly and absolutely hammered by URs, inconsistency

Anna Frolova
+ no flutz or lip
- nothing that makes her stand out yet, bland programs, lack of expressions, lack of speed, sometimes loose air position, rather inconsistent

Stanislava Konstantinova
+ nice expressions, passionate performer, beautiful SP last season, nice spins
- the very definition of inconsistent, helicopter tano, prone to UR, lutz (and flip?) edge issues

Cannot comment on Tsibinova and Shulskaya as I‘ve only seen them once or twice and don‘t remember who is who (sorry!).

 

[Flying Feijoa]

Amazing lol. I need to get there in the archives then

Or just check out Twitter I suspect a lot of extremist former GSers may have migrated there...

 

[Mathman]

I‘m not a fan of Liza Tuktamysheva but ...

You're not a fan of Liza Tuktmysheva???!!!!! She's got sass, she's got class; just hearing her name announced puts a smile on my face.

 

[Scott512]

I wouldn‘t say dishonest. It‘s very easy to be called a “hater“ in threads like this, I guess it‘s often partly a way of trying to clarify that the following criticism is not meant as... well, hate. Usually, it goes both ways.

Also, since you‘re so bothered by the whole ”I‘m a fan but..“ followed by criticism, why don‘t we try and turn it around for a change? “I‘m not a fan but“ followed by praise. I think this could be nice. And more peaceful.

So, here goes nothing:

I‘m not a fan of Alina but she has beautiful spins and showed some serious artistic growth last season in her Me Voy SP. It was mature, vulnerable and expressive. Also, the way she saved her 3Lz+3Lo at the Olympics was a boss move and she deserves all the credit for that. How she came back after the RusNats and Euros disappointment last season and went on to win Worlds is truly inspiring.

I‘m not a fan of Sasha Trusova but I love her for her tenacity and strength. Her bravery in which she tries what no one has done before is truly admirable. She also seems like a humble girl despite already being in the history books multiple times. She‘s got a champion‘s character.

I‘m not a fan of Anna Shcherbakova but she‘s a beautiful artist and sensitive skater who not only hears the music but really feels it. How she handled a nearly career ending injury and showed up the next season with even more of a fighting spirit than before is inspiring. She also has a way of winning when people last expect her to, proving that time and again the last two seasons.

I‘m not a fan of Liza Tuktamysheva but how she came back so strongly after many disappointing seasons is a testament to her character. She also has fantastic jumping technique, an impeccable lutz jump. Her landing a quad as an adult women makes her an inspiration to other skaters trying to do the same.

Got the idea?

(also, to clarify what being a fan constitutes for me: I see it as fan coming from “fanatic“, so while I cheer and care for all the ladies mentioned above, I won‘t be fanatic enough to get up in the middle of the night to watch their performances, pacing nervously all over the room while they skate. And luckily so, as it‘s barely manageable for the few true favorites I do have. )



Well, I guess I‘ll give it a try.

Sima Sakhanovich:
+ strong and high jumper, nice rippons, fast spins, strong expressions, good combo jumps
- lack of flexibility, inconsistency, weak 2A and lutz

Anastasia Gulyakova
+ nice rippons, 3A landed in practice, relatively consistent
- weak programs and choreography, prone to UR, lack of expression, mediocre spins

Anastasia Tarakanova
+ SPEED, skating skills, effortless cross overs, can be passionate performer if given the right vehicles, great jump technique (beautiful lutz!), no edge issues, nice rippons
- inconsistency, frequent change of coach, lack of expression in recent programs

Kseniia Sinitsyna
+ good jumping technique (like most Panova students), nice spins, great skating skills, subtle yet interesting choreography
- inconsistent towards the end of the season, occasional lack of expression

Anastasiia Gubanova
+ musicality, skating skills, good flow
- has somewhat lost her old performance quality, inconsistency, weird lutz and flip technique, unreliable jumping technique in general

Elizaveta Nugumanova
+ interpretation, musicality, elegance, great spins, good performer, wide artistic range
- constantly and absolutely hammered by URs, inconsistency

Anna Frolova
+ no flutz or lip
- nothing that makes her stand out yet, bland programs, lack of expressions, lack of speed, sometimes loose air position, rather inconsistent

Stanislava Konstantinova
+ nice expressions, passionate performer, beautiful SP last season, nice spins
- the very definition of inconsistent, helicopter tano, prone to UR, lutz (and flip?) edge issues

Cannot comment on Tsibinova and Shulskaya as I‘ve only seen them once or twice and don‘t remember who is who (sorry!).

Interesting and intriguing post. Thank you for putting so much into it.

You used to be a fan of Alina. But I understand your point about fan and fanatic. I like how you make the point how if you're not a big fan of somebody you can still support them and like them.

You didn't do a report on Zhenya and Aliona a or at least I didn't see one.

I also think you wrote that Nastya lost some of her old qualities as a skater. I can only surmise that's puberty hitting her hard the last three years and perhaps going from 85 lbs to 120 pounds. I hope Nastya has passed puberty and can I regain some of her old wonderful skating qualities. I still love to watch her skate with her wonderful artistry musicality and interpretation. I hope she gets two really good programs this season. I hope she gets Challengers this year and she's going to have to fight her way into Nationals again. Nastya is spending her second season with her new coach and she hasn't been with any coach for more than one season in a few years. Her coaching changes looking back we're not the best moves for her career.

I really wish with more Eteri Angels coming to Nationals this year that they expand the field by 5. I know most people only talk about the top girls here but just to make ladies Russian Nationals this year will be a nice accomplishment and then making the top 10 will be great for most girls.

As for Nugumanova she's such a likeable skater but is mistreated by the Federation as badly as anyone and scored or in her case underscored as badly as anyone I've seen in recent years. They go crazy with her under rotations but they don't do that with others. So not fair. On a side note I think Little Liza would be perfect for pairs. She has artistry musicality spins and is very light I would make a great partner for any top Russian guy.

I also hope Stasya gets off to a good start in her new situation with a new coach in a new city. But she loves her hometown of St Petersburg so much I wonder if the transition to Moscow will be hard for her. Stasya has beautiful lines and is a beautiful girl. She could probably be a model if she wanted to. I hope plushenko and his staff are good for her.

 

[Scott512]

Oh, I like this idea! I'll start with a few now, and may add more later. Here are my opinions:

Ksenia Sinitsyna
- Strengths: wonderful, fluid skating skills; good jump technique (also no wrong edges on flip or lutz); programs that showcase her performance ability and strengths (interpretation, musicality, etc.); incredible spins; backloaded all three combinations; good flexibility and choreo sequences
- Weaknesses: no "ultra-C" element (also took out 3Lz-3Lo); consistency has not been the best recently

Anna Frolova
- Strengths: good jump technique (also no wrong edges on flip or lutz); mental strength increased after moving to Davydov
- Weaknesses: could use more development in skating skills, interpretation and musicality; had somewhat bland programs last season (in my opinion); could work more on spins

Valeria Shulskaya
- Strengths: extremely consistent; good jump technique (especially on lutz); performs to her music well
- Weaknesses: also could use more development in skating skills and interpretation (I believe her StSq at Nationals was also called at a level 2); had programs that did not fully play to her strengths (especially the SP); could work more on spins

Anastasia Guliakova
- Strengths: has solid jumps (except the Lutz) that look visually appealing; really gained consistency last season; good spinner (maybe except layback); pretty good skating skills and step sequences; working on triple axel
- Weaknesses: warhorse programs don't give her individuality; sometimes performs "through" her music; lutz edge and all combos in first half (if I remember correctly); edit - sometimes URs jumps

Elizaveta Nuguamnova
- Strengths: musicality, interpretation, and skating skills; wonderful spins; has -3Lo combos (she even did a 3F-3Lo once in 2017!)
- Weaknesses: prone to UR; needs more consistency

Anastasia Tarakanova
- Strengths: amazing skating skills; passionate and devoted interpretation; solid jumps (good technique also on both flip and lutz); fast, centered, spins
- Weaknesses: consistency could be improved; musicality is sometimes lacking

Ksenia Tsibinova
- Strengths: consistency; solid jumps (good technique especially on lutz); backloaded all three combinations
- Weaknesses: needs to develop more in skating skills, interpretation, and musicality; programs were somewhat bland

Serafima Sakhanovich:
- Strengths: ripponed jumps with tight air position; extremely fast and centered spins; has regained much of her consistency; interpretation; working on quad salchow
- Weaknesses: lutz edge; double axel (though it, and the lutz edge, is much improved!); flexibility; could use more musicality

You did a report too! Great read. Thanks.

 

[Skatesocs]

Or just check out Twitter I suspect a lot of extremist former GSers may have migrated there...

I don't know the first place to check to see which users are calling Mao Asada out for war crimes.

ETA: I really don't care about those other two factions.

 

[colormyworld240]

Well, speaking for myself, I love wonderful skating skills, musicality, spins, spins, spins, and jumps. And jumps are last.

And I love singles' skating more than dance, so I will continue to prize those elements of figure skating that I like in singles, and argue that too much emphasis is given to jumps.

And no, although I like ice dance, I do not care to watch it exclusively. We all like what we like

Everyone is free to like whatever they want. However, the issue is that many posters attribute what they like to who is the more "deserving and better skater". But the best skater, under the competitive rules of the sport, is whoever scores the highest.

For example in the free, SS and musicality ie. interpretation only account for a maximum of just under 40 points (2 PCS components + step sequence). A quad jumper can get that with just 2 of their highest scoring passes, a triple jumper 3, and so on. And the rules allow for 7 passes. The scoring system values jumps (not just quads but also triples and doubles) so much that they score many times more than SS + musicality. Spins are worth even less. So from a numbers perspective the only way to equate jumps to SS + musicality is to only allow for two quad or three triple jumping passes in the free given their current values. Where as in the ice dance discipline, SS is more more valued as it is integrated into most of their elements. That's what separates the two disciplines in terms of SS.

Like it or not, the only official measurement of who the "best skater" is, or which skater is better than the other, is the competitive scoring system under the ISU. That's the system everyone knows and willingly participates in, whether they're skating, coaching, or just watching. We all have things we like but the only measurement of who is better is the official results. That's why these skaters are competing under the ISU instead of just doing shows for fans or learning skills without competing them. It's what matters most to them as well.

Skating skills is 1 component of the sport and doesn't determine who is the better skater. Using the example of Alina who is constantly criticized for her skating skills, I can also say she had some of the best spins last season. But in no way do her spins make her the best skater last season. She was clearly outjumped by Alena/Anna/Sasha, so even though she had the best spins, she wasn't the best. Just like how not having the best skating skills doesn't make you the worst.

 

[lopsilceci]

Just like how not having the best skating skills doesn't make you the worst.

It doesn't even make you a bad skater... unless you're an ice dancer, then skating skills become (almost) everything

 

[Mathman]

Like it or not, the only official measurement of who the "best skater" is, or which skater is better than the other, is the competitive scoring system under the ISU. .

Well, that is the whole issue in a nutshell. But to me, that's the question, not the answer.

Some people don't like it, as is their right. Those people in fact go on message boards and say that they don't like it. Some people say that they think X is a better skater than Y even though the ISU says otherwise. Some people are not overawed by the word "official." The ISU isn't my daddy. The fact that the ISU encourages and rewards jumps over all other aspects of skating is not necessarily sacrosanct and above criticism. Speak Truth to Power. :yes:

For example in the free, SS and musicality ie. interpretation only account for a maximum of just under 40 points (2 PCS components + step sequence).

True, but that doesn't make it "right." Furthermore, even in the current IJS point system SS plus Interpretation plus Choreography plus Performance plus GOEs do add up to a substantial percentage of the point total. This is obscured by the fact that ISU judges do not discriminate very well between skaters who are outstanding in these areas and those who are just pretty good.

 

[Fried]

I wouldn‘t say dishonest. It‘s very easy to be called a “hater“ in threads like this, I guess it‘s often partly a way of trying to clarify that the following criticism is not meant as... well, hate. Usually, it goes both ways.

Also, since you‘re so bothered by the whole ”I‘m a fan but..“ followed by criticism, why don‘t we try and turn it around for a change? “I‘m not a fan but“ followed by praise. I think this could be nice. And more peaceful.

So, here goes nothing:

I‘m not a fan of Alina but she has beautiful spins and showed some serious artistic growth last season in her Me Voy SP. It was mature, vulnerable and expressive. Also, the way she saved her 3Lz+3Lo at the Olympics was a boss move and she deserves all the credit for that. How she came back after the RusNats and Euros disappointment last season and went on to win Worlds is truly inspiring.

I‘m not a fan of Sasha Trusova but I love her for her tenacity and strength. Her bravery in which she tries what no one has done before is truly admirable. She also seems like a humble girl despite already being in the history books multiple times. She‘s got a champion‘s character.

I‘m not a fan of Anna Shcherbakova but she‘s a beautiful artist and sensitive skater who not only hears the music but really feels it. How she handled a nearly career ending injury and showed up the next season with even more of a fighting spirit than before is inspiring. She also has a way of winning when people last expect her to, proving that time and again the last two seasons.

I‘m not a fan of Liza Tuktamysheva but how she came back so strongly after many disappointing seasons is a testament to her character. She also has fantastic jumping technique, an impeccable lutz jump. Her landing a quad as an adult women makes her an inspiration to other skaters trying to do the same.

What a wonderful contribution. May it fall on fertile soil.

 

[Skatesocs]

The ISU isn't my daddy.

... Did you really have to?

 

[flanker]

I wouldn‘t say dishonest. It‘s very easy to be called a “hater“ in threads like this, I guess it‘s often partly a way of trying to clarify that the following criticism is not meant as... well, hate. Usually, it goes both ways.

Also, since you‘re so bothered by the whole ”I‘m a fan but..“ followed by criticism, why don‘t we try and turn it around for a change? “I‘m not a fan but“ followed by praise. I think this could be nice. And more peaceful.

So, here goes nothing:

I‘m not a fan of Alina but she has beautiful spins and showed some serious artistic growth last season in her Me Voy SP. It was mature, vulnerable and expressive. Also, the way she saved her 3Lz+3Lo at the Olympics was a boss move and she deserves all the credit for that. How she came back after the RusNats and Euros disappointment last season and went on to win Worlds is truly inspiring.

I‘m not a fan of Sasha Trusova but I love her for her tenacity and strength. Her bravery in which she tries what no one has done before is truly admirable. She also seems like a humble girl despite already being in the history books multiple times. She‘s got a champion‘s character.

I‘m not a fan of Anna Shcherbakova but she‘s a beautiful artist and sensitive skater who not only hears the music but really feels it. How she handled a nearly career ending injury and showed up the next season with even more of a fighting spirit than before is inspiring. She also has a way of winning when people last expect her to, proving that time and again the last two seasons.

I‘m not a fan of Liza Tuktamysheva but how she came back so strongly after many disappointing seasons is a testament to her character. She also has fantastic jumping technique, an impeccable lutz jump. Her landing a quad as an adult women makes her an inspiration to other skaters trying to do the same.

Got the idea?

(also, to clarify what being a fan constitutes for me: I see it as fan coming from “fanatic“, so while I cheer and care for all the ladies mentioned above, I won‘t be fanatic enough to get up in the middle of the night to watch their performances, pacing nervously all over the room while they skate. And luckily so, as it‘s barely manageable for the few true favorites I do have. )

Actually I believe I've already said something like that about some skaters (and not just me)

 

[Baron Vladimir]

Some people don't like it, as is their right. Those people in fact go on message boards and say that they don't like it. Some people say that they think X is a better skater than Y even though the ISU says otherwise. Some people are not overawed by the word "official." The ISU isn't my daddy. The fact that the ISU encourages and rewards jumps over all other aspects of skating is not necessarily sacrosanct and above criticism. Speak Truth to Power. :yes:

The question of the any sport/figure skating competition is not who is the best skater/athlete, but who is the best competitor. On one exact day at one exact competition. Skaters are not sending videos what they can do with their blades on ice on some random day, how they are dancing, or their best jumps in practice. They come to the competition following same exact rules, trying to showcase their best at that moment. People can claim that skater X is better than skater Y. That doesn't mean that skater X will win over skater Y in one exact competition. Kendra Harrison is current 100m hurdles record holder, so she is the fastest in the world in that discipline. Yet she never won a major competition. World No1 tennis player never won Olympic games. Best soccer players in the world didn't win the soccer tournament etc etc In order to win a sport/figure skating competition, we should 'judge' skaters in relation to that sport competition with its own rules. Judging skaters outside of it using our own subjective preconception of what something is, or it's not, or what something should be, is just not sportish, and wouldn't be call a sport competition or an Olympic sport. For other things, as for a skater with best skating skills, skater with best musicality or choreography, best jumper etc etc there are other types of 'competitions' - as ISU skating awards, for example.

 

[Fluture]

You didn't do a report on Zhenya and Aliona a or at least I didn't see one.

You‘re right, I didn‘t do one. That‘s because Zhenya and Aliona are my absolute favorites so it would defeat the whole purpose of the exercise, wouldn‘t it? The point was to say something nice about someone you‘re not explicitly a fan of. I could say tons of nice things about Aliona and Zhenya. But that would mostly be boring everyone to death here.

I also think you wrote that Nastya lost some of her old qualities as a skater. I can only surmise that's puberty hitting her hard the last three years and perhaps going from 85 lbs to 120 pounds.

I disagree on Gubanova and I frankly don‘t feel comfortable discussing her weight. Why should that have anything to do with her qualities as a performer? It doesn‘t and it‘s not the point. Rather, if I had to speculate I‘d say it‘s that the frequent coaching changes, the constant adjusting to new environments and more time being spent on technical stuff made her work less on her artistry. Also, the stress and pressure of not living up to past success can‘t have helped. She started out way above most other skaters but then stagnated. There was a time when even when her jumps began to fail her she still performed beautifully.

Case in point:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rWMiMalrdiw

She bombed the jumps but her musicality and the way she gently emphasized even the small notes and changes of the music - especially in the first part of the program - is astounding. I haven‘t seen that from her in a while. In fact, before I saw these old programs (her FS at the JGPF being another one), I never understood why so many were praising her artistry so much.

I really wish with more Eteri Angels coming to Nationals this year that they expand the field by 5.

Agreed here. It‘s long overdue. Eteri‘s “angels“ (don‘t let Plushenko hear that lol) will have no problems getting to Nationals. It‘s skaters like Sima and Gubanova who will struggle with that. And with the way we might not have a GP or Challenger season, making Nationals is even more important if they want to have any chance at competing at all this season.

As for Nugumanova she's such a likeable skater but is mistreated by the Federation as badly as anyone and scored or in her case underscored as badly as anyone I've seen in recent years.

I wouldn‘t say the UR calls are not warranted. They are. She really does underrotate the majority of her jumps and it‘s been a problem ever since she was a novice. Her and Gubanova were all the rage in 2015-16, with people here on goldenskate saying they’d be the best Russian skating would produce in years. I watched some of Nugumanova‘s old programs recently and her artistry and spins really were outstanding for a 12 year old but even then, the majority of her jumps were cheated.

That‘s not to say that she isn‘t underscored. She is, just not on the jumps. Her spins deserve way more GOE and her PCS are way too low. She‘s a beautiful skater but sadly, in Russian ladies skating that‘s not enough if you don‘t have the jumps.

Also agree she would make a good pairs skater in principle but I doubt it‘s that easy. Pairs skating is - in many ways - even more difficult than singles as it requires placing a high amount of trust for your physical well-being into another person‘s hands. It’s scary getting thrown into the air and having to rely on someone else catching you lol. Not everyone can do that, it takes a special character. Vasilieva has recently tried it, let‘s see what she can do.

I also hope Stasya gets off to a good start in her new situation with a new coach in a new city.

I wish her good luck, too, I quite liked her programs last season. What she, imo, needs right now is for someone to tell her to ditch the tanos and rippons and focus on landing the jumps consistently. She‘s probably the biggest head case in Russian skating and it‘s such a shame as she has tons of potential, was given tons of chances, and could have won much more than she did. Maybe Plushenko can help her, who knows.

 

[Skatesocs]

The question of the any sport/figure skating competition is not who is the best skater/athlete, but who is the best competitor. On one exact day at one exact competition.

You have misunderstood Mathman. He didn't say the best skater no matter how they do in a competition should be winning. Just that people are free to disagree who skated better in a competition.

For other things, as for a skater with best skating skills, skater with best musicality or choreography, best jumper etc etc there are other types of 'competitions' - as ISU awards, for example.

So you agree they aren't really judged in a competition, too! :yes: