2021-22 Russian Women's Figure Skating

[Amei]

When she skates well, the crowd really gets behind her and she gets super confident/smiles, so I don't know if that is totally 100 percent true. Look at her SP at this years channel one cup.

Agree, when she's on she performs well, when she makes a mistake though its all over her face, 1 of Shcherbakova‘s greatest assets is that most of the time errors don't impact how she performs or her facial expressions

 

[Trusova4Ever]

Well Kostornaia I think is a different situation, there was obviously conflicts between how they coach and either what works best for her or what she wants from her coaches, either way the relationship wasn't working. I've never gotten that sense from Khromykh that there was friction between her and her coaches.

I guess your right, I think Eteri actually has a bit of a soft spot for her. There are some videos online of her reaction when Maiia skates, like at the Russian cup stage where she landed her two quads, Eteri was happy for her, copied her ending pose (She does this for a few skaters) and smiled when she came off the ice. At the Italian GP, she started to kind of cheer and clap when she was doing that mock-Biellmann catchfoot camel spin variation, and the crowd kind of followed with her, it was really nice to see. Danny G also kind of did this.

 

[alexocfp]

"Bad season of Maiia..."

Well I wonder where do people go for such claims... Internationally she had only one competition that would not provide her a medal at the last "worlds". Her "bad" in Russia is still one of the best internationally and at her international appearances she was only defeated by other Russians.

She is not stable, but even the best of nonrussian skaters are not. Maiia defeated Loena Hendrickx twice, she defeated Mariah Bell, Mai Mihara, Kim Ye-lim, Lindsay Thorngren and others, about whom the same people would surely not say they had a "bad season". Again, it amazes me how people can have so very different standards based on their prefecences.

Wow, just went back to look at her record this year.

Date	Event	SP	FS	Total
2021–22 season​
21-26 December 2021	2022 Russian Championships	9 69.36​	8 147.82​	8 217.18​
26–28 November 2021	2021 Rostelecom Cup	5 64.72​	2 154.97 ​	3 219.69​
17–20 November 2021	2021 CS Warsaw Cup	1 69.24​	2 124.78​	1 194.02​
5–7 November 2021	2021 Gran Premio d'Italia	2 72.04​	2 154.31​	2 226.35​
14–17 October 2021	2021 Budapest Trophy	2 72.82​	1 152.09​	1 224.91​

Besides the Russian Championships, and the Channel 1 trophy, it wasn’t a bad season by any means. Sometimes perception is reality.

It‘s no secret that I really believe in her and think her ceiling is a lot higher.

 

[alexocfp]

The show that Shcherbakova is skating in tomorrow (or today depending on where you are in the world) is apparently going to b e livestreamed on YouTube. Valieva, Medvedeva and Tuktamysheva are skating there as well

Will be good to see Anna finally able to relax and go out there with zero pressure.

And 2 Maxim cover girls at the same place at the same time. Hope the ice is able to handle that. Haha

 

[Azikin]

On the other hand, when people talk about the expiration, whether they mean Eteri's team (boys or girls) or the russian skating, to be honest I think it's not that rare, I saw more US, japanese or korean skaters who were quite promising and then disappeared/did not fulfill the expectations/got injured etc., and if some of them are still active they usually take the lower positions in their countries. Just not so much attention was paid to them to be talked about "expiration dates".

There are many myths created about "evil" Eteri, it's inevitable

Wow, just went back to look at her record this year.

Date	Event	SP	FS	Total
2021–22 season​
21-26 December 2021	2022 Russian Championships	9 69.36​	8 147.82​	8 217.18​
26–28 November 2021	2021 Rostelecom Cup	5 64.72​	2 154.97 ​	3 219.69​
17–20 November 2021	2021 CS Warsaw Cup	1 69.24​	2 124.78​	1 194.02​
5–7 November 2021	2021 Gran Premio d'Italia	2 72.04​	2 154.31​	2 226.35​
14–17 October 2021	2021 Budapest Trophy	2 72.82​	1 152.09​	1 224.91​

Besides the Russian Championships, and the Channel 1 trophy, it wasn’t a bad season by any means. Sometimes perception is reality.

It‘s no secret that I really believe in her and think her ceiling is a lot higher.

Good season of Maiia!

 

[Scott512]

Well it doesn't make sense to compare her with international skaters of course, there will be no international competition for quite a time with russian skaters anyway. two different ballgames. You of all should know that.

But her season wasn't stellar, no real progress and eteri doesn't have endless places in her rink. Decisions will need to be made

Decisions have to be made? Why are you on Mayas case? She's 15 and by now probably the tallest Russian lady. it takes time. She's probably 4 in taller than Anna there's no way she can be consistent like Anna. Maya's results last season were okay. Bradie is very tall and it took her into her early twenties to become world-class. Mariah too. There is no need for Maya to rush.

Yes it takes time look at Anastasia. it's taken her five years to get to this world-class level.

And what's this about no International competitions for some time? Do you work for CAS? They will make that decision in time probably this summer. And if you think it's because one country recently invaded another okay is that new? it's very tragic but it happens. I'm pretty sure that has happened a few times this century and no country's athletes were EVER canceled because of that. Because if they were canceled because of invasions or what their leaders do we would not know a lot of great athletes. This point will be made to CAS by the Russian lawyers when CAS hears the case with the ISU about not letting the Russians skate next season. Actually it won't be the Russian lawyers it will be the Swiss lawyers and they win cases.

If the Russian still don't skate next season internationally do they start their own league like the WSU the worldwide skating union and invite skaters from other countries like Georgia, Belarus, China and Korea to compete and then have their own world championship in March? Hmmmm. I like it. Maybe it's tme to think out-of-the-box.

 

[Trusova4Ever]

Decisions have to be made? Why are you on Mayas case? She's 15 and by now probably the tallest Russian lady. it takes time. She's probably 4 in taller than Anna there's no way she can be consistent like Anna. Maya's results last season were okay. Bradie is very tall and it took her into her early twenties to become world-class. Mariah too. There is no need for Maya to rush.

Yes it takes time look at Anastasia. it's taken her five years to get to this world-class level.

And what's this about no International competitions for some time? Do you work for CAS? They will make that decision in time probably this summer. And if you think it's because one country recently invaded another okay is that new? it's very tragic but it happens. I'm pretty sure that has happened a few times this century and no country's athletes were EVER canceled because of that. Because if they were canceled because of invasions or what their leaders do we would not know a lot of great athletes. This point will be made to CAS by the Russian lawyers when CAS hears the case with the ISU about not letting the Russians skate next season. Actually it won't be the Russian lawyers it will be the Swiss lawyers and they win cases.

If the Russian still don't skate next season internationally do they start their own league like the WSU the worldwide skating union and invite skaters from other countries like Georgia, Belarus, China and Korea to compete and then have their own world championship in March? Hmmmm. I like it. Maybe it's tme to think out-of-the-box.

Great idea, love it!

 

[Scott512]

Great idea, love it!

Thanks. If you have any suggestions to add to it please do so.

 

[Amei]

Shcherbakova really loves the light up dress

 

[Aimee-01]

The show that Shcherbakova is skating in tomorrow (or today depending on where you are in the world) is apparently going to b e livestreamed on YouTube. Valieva, Medvedeva and Tuktamysheva are skating there as well

Is this a show?

 

[macy]

Samodelkina is wearing Kostornaia's old dress in this show.

 

[Amei]

Is this a show?

Yes, livestreaming on YouTube right now

 

[Jumping_Bean]

If the Russian still don't skate next season internationally do they start their own league like the WSU the worldwide skating union and invite skaters from other countries like Georgia, Belarus, China and Korea to compete and then have their own world championship in March? Hmmmm. I like it. Maybe it's tme to think out-of-the-box.

This won't happen. Or at least not for as long as the top skaters from these countries want to be allowed to compete in ISU competitions, including the Olympics.

Skaters are only allowed to compete in ISU-affiliated international competitions, national competitions and non-competitive show appearances or risk losing their eligibility to compete in ISU competitions for up to a year following the first breach of rules and up to 2 years for each subsequent breach of rules. (Rule 102, page 87 onwards)

And, by the way, this rule would still apply to Belarussian and Russian skaters. Despite them not being allowed to compete in international ISU competitions, they would also lose their eligibility if they competed in non-ISU affiliated international competitions and wouldn't be able to return even after the ban is lifted.

 

[Jumping_Bean]

Supposing there will be international events for russian skaters (for which I hope but of course we must be prepared for the opposite eventuality), I think Maiia's potential assignments should not be endangered IMO. She's among 24 best in worlds standings. I don't knowwhat will be the status of the upcoming russian seniors (Samodelkina, Petrosian, Muravieva, Zinina) will be assigned as not having JGPF and not attending junior worlds. Who come into mind overally apart from the juniors:
Anna
Sasha
Aliona
Liza
Kamila (still not sure about the result of investigation)
Daria (if she's healed and in competitive form again)
Maiia

Those - and we are not sure if all of them would compete - will be probably accompanied with the upcoming seniors, but I'm definitely not sure they will all receive two spots at GP. From the international perspective Maiia's chance is bigger. Again, if they even will be allowed to compete internationally.

Based on the ISU GP series announcements in the past seasons, the main ways to qualify for GP spots are the following (I crossed those out that do not apply this season for the Russian due to cancellations and the ban):

Place in the top 12 at Worlds (Guarantees two GP assignments)
Place in the top 24 in World Standing (Guarantees one GP assignment)
Place in the top 24 in Season's Best Score (Guarantees one GP assignment)
-> These assignments are not additive, placing in the top 24 in both will not guarantee two GP spots.
Medalists from Junior Worlds and the gold medalist from the JGPF are included in the selection process
Additionally, returning skaters and skaters expressing a desire to move into Seniors will also be considered for GP spots

Of course, there is a limit of 3 skaters from one ISU member per discipline per event, so a maximum of 3x6=18 spots per country. (If they wanted to send all of their skaters to 2 events, that would mean a maximum of 9, but generally, at least a few Russian skaters receive a single assignment each season.)

So, let's see who is definitely in the conversation for GP spots, should Russia be allowed to compete internationally next season:

Anna Shcherbakova (WS 1, SB 2)
Alexandra Trusova (WS 2, SB 3)
Elizaveta Tuktamysheva (WS 5, SB 5)
Kamila Valieva (WS 7, SB 1) -> Depending on when her case is decided and what the result is
Alena Kostornaia (WS 9, SB 8)
Maiia Khromykh (WS 20, SB 7)
Daria Usacheva (SB 12)
Sofia Muravieva (SB 17)
Adeliia Petrosian (SB 18)
Anastasia Zinina (SB 23)
Kseniia Sinitsyna (SB 24)

Both Nastya and Kseniia have scored around 206 and could be overtaken by some of the skaters competing at the JWC (the only competition left this season, at which skaters can gain personal and season's best scores) and thus fall outside of the top 24. Sofia Samodelkina is currently sitting in 25th in season's best, so she's also not out of the conversation yet but doesn't fulfill the clearer criteria given by the ISU.

As things are currently standing, Russia would have more skaters than they have spots. In the past, RusFed has kept skaters in juniors or otherwise held back spots from skaters on the lower end of these lists in order to give other skaters 2 assignments. That might not be necessary, depending on who stays in the top 24, and who recovers from injuries in time (or manages to avoid injury), but it's important to keep in the back of our minds when thinking about who might receive assignments if Russian skaters are allowed to return to international competitions.

 

[Scott512]

This won't happen. Or at least not for as long as the top skaters from these countries want to be allowed to compete in ISU competitions, including the Olympics.

Skaters are only allowed to compete in ISU-affiliated international competitions, national competitions and non-competitive show appearances or risk losing their eligibility to compete in ISU competitions for up to a year following the first breach of rules and up to 2 years for each subsequent breach of rules. (Rule 102, page 87 onwards)

And, by the way, this rule would still apply to Belarussian and Russian skaters. Despite them not being allowed to compete in international ISU competitions, they would also lose their eligibility if they competed in non-ISU affiliated international competitions and wouldn't be able to return even after the ban is lifted.

Yu mentioned top skaters Bean. The skaters I'm thinking of the most part are not the top skaters.

I don't think the ISU should be harsh to skaters for instance who don't skate in ISU competitions. Or who have not in a year or 2. They need to come up with an alternative or something additional to the ISU. Too many skaters are sitting around doing nothing. I'm thinking of Amber Glenn Eunsoo Lim and many Russians like Guliakova Konstantinova, Nugumanova etc. And something like the International Skating Association or ISA could keep great skaters around longer who get pushed out of the way as teenagers or early twenties by younger talent. Quite frankly there aren't enough competitions for all the talent in the world of figure skating. The skater's I named and many others rarely skate in ISU events. If they lost ISU eligibility so what? The handwriting is on the wall and they have nowhere to go other than domestic competitions. It's too bad. I think we need more figure skating not less. Maybe the challenger series can go from like August to February. If people consider that like the minor leagues of figure skating who cares?

When the Russian banishment is removed they still need to come up with something else to give these skaters more chances. Otherwise kids will be done in their teen years or early twenties. They put too much into their lives and careers for that to happen as often as it does. More opportunities would be better for figure skaters. I realize this is a long shot but why not look at some other options Is to make things better and get more opportunities out there?

And if there was another organization out there to make the ISU more proactive that would be good because they don't do enough in my opinion for the sport.

 

[Jumping_Bean]

Yu mentioned top skaters Bean. The skaters I'm thinking of the most part are not the top skaters.

I don't think the ISU should be harsh to skaters for instance who don't skate in ISU competitions. Or who have not in a year or 2. They need to come up with an alternative or something additional to the ISU. Too many skaters are sitting around doing nothing. I'm thinking of Amber Glenn Eunsoo Lim and many Russians like Guliakova Konstantinova, Nugumanova etc. And something like the International Skating Association or ISA could keep great skaters around longer who get pushed out of the way as teenagers or early twenties by younger talent. Quite frankly there aren't enough competitions for all the talent in the world of figure skating. The skater's I named and many others rarely skate in ISU events. If they lost ISU eligibility so what? The handwriting is on the wall and they have nowhere to go other than domestic competitions. It's too bad. I think we need more figure skating not less. Maybe the challenger series can go from like August to February. If people consider that like the minor leagues of figure skating who cares?
When the Russian banishment is removed they still need to come up with something else to give these skaters more chances. Otherwise kids will be done in their teen years or early twenties.

And if there was another organization out there to make the ISU more proactive that would be good because they don't do enough in my opinion for the sport.

Sure, that's possible for countries with a lot of depth (Japan, Korea, Russia and the US), but at least 2 of the countries you mentioned don't have that (Georgia and China), which is why I assumed you meant top skaters (of at least these countries).

And even within countries with a lot of depth, skaters will still be put into uncomfortable situations to choose between international competitions in this new league you proposed or retaining ISU-eligibility. In Russia, the top skaters are indeed far enough removed that it's almost impossible for skaters like Nastya Guliakova to catch up, but in Japan, Korea and the US, the technical level of the top skaters is not so much higher than that of the skaters ranked outside of the top 10. Gaining consistency and favour of the federation, as well as some of the top skaters retiring or going through a rough patch would be enough to allow previously lower-ranked to become top skaters in their country - And if they're not ISU-eligible, that could mean missing out on a once-in-a-lifetime chance of making it to the Olympics despite being competitive enough.

The thing is, there are tons of smaller ISU competitions that are open to anyone and allow unlimited entries per discipline for each ISU member, but many of the skaters just outside of the top 10 or 20 don't take advantage of these competitions (or at least not the Russian skaters). Instead, it is often skaters far removed from the top that show up here (I mean skaters that don't even make it to Russian Cup stages).

Do you think that lower-ranked skaters will be more willing to compete in this new league? Will they have to be baited by more exposure or better price money than those ISU competitions? From what it seems, one of your goals would be to allow as many skaters as possible the opportunity to compete internationally, but that could become really expensive (in price money and organisational costs) really quick.
And if everyone can enter, will lower-ranked skaters from other nations be interested in competing in this new league when they'll have to compete against the top Russian skaters and/or an unlimited number of very good Russians (because the depth in Russian skating is extremely deep)?

Don't get me wrong, it's not necessarily a bad idea, but there would definitely be big obstacles in the way to creating such a parallel organisation to the ISU.

 

[alexocfp]

This won't happen. Or at least not for as long as the top skaters from these countries want to be allowed to compete in ISU competitions, including the Olympics.

Skaters are only allowed to compete in ISU-affiliated international competitions, national competitions and non-competitive show appearances or risk losing their eligibility to compete in ISU competitions for up to a year following the first breach of rules and up to 2 years for each subsequent breach of rules. (Rule 102, page 87 onwards)

And, by the way, this rule would still apply to Belarussian and Russian skaters. Despite them not being allowed to compete in international ISU competitions, they would also lose their eligibility if they competed in non-ISU affiliated international competitions and wouldn't be able to return even after the ban is lifted.

That’s just paperwork. You can take care of these bans in court. Bring the lawyers and take them to school.

The ISU deserves no loyalty since they don’t show it back.

This is as good a time as any to break up this corrupt cartel and move the sport forward.

I was calling for Russia pull out of the ISU way before this situation. Stupid quotas and outdated rules and regulations.

Little did I know how much I would enjoy not having competitions spoiled by entrants that were there just because they were from a certain country and not because of skill or merit.

I never thought I would say this, but personally it will be a sad day when Russia gets back in with the ISU.

Get to enjoy my competitions like the St Petersburg championships without having to hear about doping, tough training methods or how evil Eteri is, or whatever other nonsense comes to mind. It’s beautiful. A mutually beneficial divorce.

 

[Jumping_Bean]

That’s just paperwork. You can take care of these bans in court. Bring the lawyers and take them to school.

The ISU deserves no loyalty since they don’t show it back.

This is as good a time as any to break up this corrupt cartel and move the sport forward.

I was calling for Russia pull out of the ISU way before this situation. Stupid quotas and outdated rules and regulations.

Little did I know how much I would enjoy not having competitions spoiled by entrants that were there just because they were from a certain country and not because of skill or merit.

I never thought I would say this, but personally it will be a sad day when Russia gets back in with the ISU.

Get to enjoy my competitions like the St Petersburg championships without having to hear about doping, tough training methods or how evil Eteri is, or whatever other nonsense comes to mind. It’s beautiful. A mutually beneficial divorce.

Taking someone to court doesn't mean you'll win. Maybe the Belarussian and Russian skaters would, considering they can't compete in ISU competitions (though even skaters banned for doping, retired skaters, etc. are explicitly covered in these rules), but skaters from other countries won't win in court. If skaters from other countries wouldn't be willing to compete and risk their eligibility and thus only Russians and Belarussians would compete, how would this significantly differ from a National competition?

Also, great that you as a spectator are so happy and willing to give up Russian skaters' chances at competing at European and World Championships and especially the Olympics. I'm not sure if many Russian skaters would agree to simply give up ever having the chance of competing at the Olympics despite the sport remaining an Olympic sport, considering how hard some other athletes (including Russians) have fought to have their sports be included in the Olympics.

 

[alexocfp]

Taking someone to court doesn't mean you'll win. Maybe the Belarussian and Russian skaters would, considering they can't compete in ISU competitions (though even skaters banned for doping, retired skaters, etc. are explicitly covered in these rules), but skaters from other countries won't win in court. If skaters from other countries wouldn't be willing to compete and risk their eligibility and thus only Russians and Belarussians would compete, how would this significantly differ from a National competition?

Also, great that you as a spectator are so happy and willing to give up Russian skaters' chances at competing at European and World Championships and especially the Olympics. I'm not sure if many Russian skaters would agree to simply give up ever having the chance of competing at the Olympics despite the sport remaining an Olympic sport, considering how hard some other athletes (including Russians) have fought to have their sports be included in the Olympics.

The Olympics are not what they used to be if we are honest.

Back then, it was one of the few chances you had to watch international skaters. Now we seem them every week.

It goes for all sports actually.

And the declining ratings back me up.

There is no guarantee the next generation of skaters will see value in the Olympics. Especially if they can make good money without them.

Plus, the ice skating part of the Olympics, with the dumb quotas, ensures that the best aren’t there.

Forget what a person that just watches the Olympics and no other skating thinks. The real pinnacle of ladies figure skating in 2022 is the Russian Championships.

 

[Scott512]

Shcherbakova really loves the light up dress

It suits her quite well. )

We probably won't see this a year from now so let's enjoy it while we can.