2022–23 Canadian Figure Skating

[BearryBear]

Any news about Canada sending anyone to the next challenger event? At least Fiona should go to get her minimums?

 

[Seven Sisters]

I know you love La Le, so that's not too bad of an alternative for you. I am happy they are getting that assignment too. Honestly, I am not too sure the battle is between C/B and G/P... I don't personally have the same feeling as let's say, P/C versus V/M or V/M versus D/W... C/B and G/P offer such different styles and are very polarizing teams that I feel that the battle is between judges and tech specialists.

I was just suggesting that it would be fun to see G/P and C/B take on each other at this particular competition. I have seen both skate more than once, but never at the same comp!

I actually believe that this will be a wonderful dance comp all the way round! I’ve never seen F-B/S live, and I can’t wait; we also have the US G/P—Green & Parsons—the one and only Daisuke Takahashi (plus Kana, who is lovely), CPom, and many more.

 

[4everchan]

I was just suggesting that it would be fun to see G/P and C/B take on each other at this particular competition. I have seen both skate more than once, but never at the same comp!

I actually believe that this will be a wonderful dance comp all the way round! I’ve never seen F-B/S live, and I can’t wait; we also have the US G/P—Green & Parsons—the one and only Daisuke Takahashi (plus Kana, who is lovely), CPom, and many more.

FBS are spectacular! You may be charmed beyond your expectations. Don't forget LaLa. You are in for a treat

 

[4everchan]

Any news about Canada sending anyone to the next challenger event? At least Fiona should go to get her minimums?

They haven't updated the assignment page on the website..

 

[rain]

Piper and Paul have apparently w/d from 4CC. La Le have been added to the roster.

So sad that Piper and Paul won't be there. If nothing else, I just wanted to see their spectacular programs a few more times this season.

But strategically this is smart, if they are not yet back to 100 per cent. Don't forget that 4CC is in the U.S. this year, and the U.S. federation seems to be pulling out all the stops to push the underwhelming Chock/Bates. Piper and Paul can't afford to show any weakness after the obvious political push we saw at the GPF that already lifted Chock/Bates a lot more than I thought possible this season.

I do hope that Piper and Paul have a chance to do another competition before worlds, though, to shake off any rust. Doesn't really matter what, just another chance to get out and perform. If they are listed as alternates, still, it indicates that they are physically capable of competing, so I imagine their recovery is progressing. But better to come back with a roar later than try to go out too soon, and against your biggest competition in their own backyard, where they can expect favours you will not be afforded.

 

[4everchan]

So sad that Piper and Paul won't be there. If nothing else, I just wanted to see their spectacular programs a few more times this season.

But strategically this is smart, if they are not yet back to 100 per cent. Don't forget that 4CC is in the U.S. this year, and the U.S. federation seems to be pulling out all the stops to push the underwhelming Chock/Bates. Piper and Paul can't afford to show any weakness after the obvious political push we saw at the GPF that already lifted Chock/Bates a lot more than I thought possible this season.

I do hope that Piper and Paul have a chance to do another competition before worlds, though, to shake off any rust. Doesn't really matter what, just another chance to get out and perform. If they are listed as alternates, still, it indicates that they are physically capable of competing, so I imagine their recovery is progressing. But better to come back with a roar later than try to go out too soon, and against your biggest competition in their own backyard, where they can expect favours you will not be afforded.

Let's also mention what happens with judging at Nationals... Many people say, it's normal to have higher scores at US Nationals... the judges are more generous etc...

I don't think it's just that... All year, the USA judges really favoured the American dancers... The difference at Nationals : there are only American judges... they are not really more generous than when on the international circuit but it adds up because the panel is entirely pro American at US Nationals... Imagine, 7 or 9 American judges together and you get how many 10s scores in the PCS??? and how many + 4 and + 5 ? Chock and Bates are great athletes, no doubt about that. But other teams are just as or even more deserving. How refreshing was it when FBS won gold at their second GP?

It is unfortunate for the sport really to see how panels and judges have so much power still.

 

[Colonel Green]

With Piper and Paul (and Kaitlin and Jean-Luc) out of Four Continents, Marjorie and Zach have the opportunity to end their season with an ISU championship medal, even if they don't get to go to Worlds.

Unrelatedly, Nadiia's nationals vlog is up:

 

[rain]

Let's also mention what happens with judging at Nationals... Many people say, it's normal to have higher scores at US Nationals... the judges are more generous etc...

I don't think it's just that... All year, the USA judges really favoured the American dancers... The difference at Nationals : there are only American judges... they are not really more generous than when on the international circuit but it adds up because the panel is entirely pro American at US Nationals... Imagine, 7 or 9 American judges together and you get how many 10s scores in the PCS??? and how many + 4 and + 5 ? Chock and Bates are great athletes, no doubt about that. But other teams are just as or even more deserving. How refreshing was it when FBS won gold at their second GP?

It is unfortunate for the sport really to see how panels and judges have so much power still.

Yeah, normally I just roll my eyes at the U.S. Nationals inflation, but it was eye-watering this year, and at the GPF how the American judge lowballed Piper and Paul...That's why I don't think it's really in their best interests, especially if they're not yet in top form, to compete in the U.S. right now. It's also at altitude, so even more difficult than normal.

 

[4everchan]

Yeah, normally I just roll my eyes at the U.S. Nationals inflation, but it was eye-watering this year, and at the GPF how the American judge lowballed Piper and Paul...That's why I don't think it's really in their best interests, especially if they're not yet in top form, to compete in the U.S. right now. It's also at altitude, so even more difficult than normal.

our young pairs and women better nail the sp or they will be buried.... i can see it...

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Show those who thought the sport was dead in Canada this summer

Apparently, it was mostly Canadians who were worried about their pairs discipline. I have always rooted for and have had faith in Deanna/Max, and I was hopeful Trennt would find a good partner quickly, which did happen. Brooke/Ben have been notably steady technically, and their youth bodes well for them to continue to grow aesthetically. It's also great fun seeing Nic Nadeau and his good friend, Emma Proft take so well to pairs. 👍

Skate Canada is no slouch when it comes to rebuilding. Plus, they are politically savvy. I don't see too many issues actually. I think Canadian fans sometimes worry too much needlessly.

Also, SC's difficult decision to not have their Nationals go forward in 2021 was a huge morale buster. It hurt the confidence and momentum of some of their athletes, even though the reasoning was understood, if debatable in some quarters.

This fear about 4CCs taking place in the U.S. is unwarranted. Remember Boston Worlds? Canadian athletes are fairly treated at competitions in North America. Whoever doesn't compete well, obviously won't get the scores. The U.S. is known for being fair to international athletes across disciplines. Russian pairs teams have often won over U.S. teams at Skate America, in tight contests.

That said, ice dance is very political, with extreme depth of talent. If 4CCs was in Canada, chalk one up for the home team. Obviously, with both U.S. and Canada having equally talented top ice dance teams, the political edge usually goes to the home team if both teams skate well. That's figure skating. Plus, even though the event takes place in the U.S., our fed is not good at politicking, and the judges will be international judges, not home-grown judges.

 

[4everchan]

Apparently, it was mostly Canadians who were worried about their pairs discipline. I have always rooted for and have had faith in Deanna/Max, and I was hopeful Trennt would find a good partner quickly, which did happen. Brooke/Ben have been notably steady technically, and their youth bodes well for them to continue to grow aesthetically. It's also great fun seeing Nic Nadeau and his good friend, Emma Profit take so well to pairs. 👍

Skate Canada is no slouch when it comes to rebuilding. Plus, they are politically savvy. I don't see too many issues actually. I think Canadian fans sometimes worry too much needlessly.

I could point out some fans from all over who are not Canadian and mentioned that Canadian skating was dead, especially pairs after the Olympics and even worlds... and following the retirements of J/R and MTM2.0 and leading into the summer months.

Nice that you mention that you remained hopeful for Trennt to find a new partner but what I am referring to happened way before Evelyn retired. You quoted my post : again, it says SUMMER Evelyn retired in the fall. It was a relative surprise because of the timing of her retirement.

Nic and Emma are a little more than good friends.

You are welcome to believe that Canadian fans worry too much needlessly, I will disagree with you on that. This thread is filled with support from the Canadian posters. Sometimes, concerns are expressed of course. We are mostly critical of Skate Canada for not sending out our athletes more. That's a legitimate worry based on facts, not opinions. Glad you appreciate some of our athletes but the naysayers do exist... and it's fine, but after Nationals, I personally felt so elated after the pairs SP and LP that I said what I said, and I don't think it was out of place

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

our young pairs and women better nail the sp or they will be buried.... i can see it...

Well, the contest includes top skaters from Korea, Japan, Australia, and China. It isn't just between the U.S. and Canada. LOL!

I get it. We all worry for the athletes we love doing well. And the judging can be dicey and unfair most of the time. It's been that way with figure skating since the very first competitions in the 1800s! Every competition will have issues that fans will debate. I hold out hope that solutions will be found to update and expand the competitive structure. It is not a fair sport in any aspect.

ETA:
Regarding Evelyn & Trennt, I suppose they were gung ho to continue during the summer. James/ Radford flirted with continuing too, but moved on. IMO, there was never any scenario where Evelyn/Trennt would be Canada's#1 team this season. Evelyn was having issues, even during show performances. I guess that's one reason why she decided to retire. Seriously, W/M had peaked. They had drawbacks in terms of higher level potential. Gritty, gutsy and they got along well, but they weren't physically, technically, or aesthetically well-matched.

Lia/Trennt are a much better match in all aspects. They just need time to get comfortable together under pressure situations. That's a learning curve for every new pairing.

Yep, I know Nic & Emma are a couple off-the-ice. In the competitive context, I just decided to refer to her as his good friend, which she surely is. 😉 Obviously, those in-the-know are aware of their close relationship.

 

[4everchan]

Nic and Emma are comfortable with thier relationship on social media.

I agree about your assessment of both judging in the sport and of evelyn and trennt. My posts about them have been lukewarm at best.

I like Nic and Emma better than Lia and Trennt in the long term but right now, Lia and Trennt are very impressive with how quickly they have mastered most elements but throws.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Nic and Emma are comfortable with thier relationship on social media.

I agree about your assessment of both judging in the sport and anojt evelyn and trennt. My posts about them have been lukewarm at best.

I like Nic and Emma better than Lia and Trennt in the long temr but right now, Lia and Trennt are very impressive with how quickly they have mastered most elements but throws.

Thanks for your response. 👍 Yep, Emma & Nic are definitely Instagram official, but I didn't want to focus on that, aside from the fact that their intimate connection might be used to good effect with certain types of music and programs. Plus, perhaps they benefit to some degree in understanding each other, getting along well and maybe as a result, learning faster.

Certainly, their long lines and Nic's affectionate fan following from his singles career may make them more appealing to some fans vs Lia/Trennt. At this stage, due to injury and having to get up to speed with pairs elements, Emma/Nic are behind Lia/Trennt in their current results. OTOH, Lia has a bit of youthful pairs experience, while Trennt is an established senior pairs guy. This is what makes the difference in their current faster progress.

It's impossible to predict what will transpire in the future for any promising team. There are too many factors involved, including both good luck and bad luck. One of the more magical and accomplished teams internationally over the past 5 years, Calalang/ Johnson, experienced a ton of undeserved bad luck. I wish U.S. fed had seen fit to provide them with incentives to continue, even if for only two more years. Alas!

There are a number of promising/ accomplished Canadian pairs teams I could also cite who ran into poor luck, which ended their careers. Anyway, fingerscrossed for better outcomes for all talented pairs teams over this next quad. 🤞

 

[4everchan]

Thanks for your response. 👍 Yep, Emma & Nic are definitely Instagram official, but I didn't want to focus on that, aside from the fact that their intimate connection might be used to good effect with certain types of music and programs. Plus, perhaps they benefit to some degree in understanding each other, getting along well and maybe as a result, learning faster.

Certainly, their long lines and Nic's affectionate fan following from his singles career may make them more appealing to some fans vs Lia/Trennt. At this stage, due to injury and having to get up to speed with pairs elements, Emma/Nic are behind Lia/Trennt in their current results. OTOH, Lia has a bit of youthful pairs experience, while Trennt is an established senior pairs guy. This is what makes the difference in their current faster progress.

It's impossible to predict what will transpire in the future for any promising team. There are too many factors involved, including both good luck and bad luck. One of the more magical and accomplished teams internationally over the past 5 years, Calalang/ Johnson, experienced a ton of undeserved bad luck. I wish U.S. fed had seen fit to provide them with incentives to continue, even if for only two more years. Alas!

There are a number of promising/ accomplished Canadian pairs teams I could also cite who ran into poor luck, which ended their careers. Anyway, fingerscrossed for better outcomes for all talented pairs teams over this next quad. 🤞

Lia only did pairs for one season when she was a kid... she kept in touch with Purkiss who called her when Trennt needed a partner... but really, hear experience is very limited. Of course, better limited experience than none. Nic and Emma have been together for quite a while and were having fun experimenting with lifts on the ground (on Instagram as well).... Nic's fan base was acquired because of his extremely charismatic personality on ice which is still there in pairs. I am so happy to see him smile because his injuries really nixed his singles career. We are tlaking about a guy who could land a quad lutz (instagram in training) quad loop (saw it at Nationals) quad toe and gigantic 3 axels until his ankle would not heal properly.
I am well aware that the future is bright but unforeseen for either of these pairs. Ruest Wolfe started with a bang and vanished (injuries.. interesting to note that he was an ice dancer and she was a singles skater... so again, no pairs experience). I am worried about Nic and Emma's health. Emma's injury seemed pretty serious (herniated disc).

I was a big fan of C/J... I wouldn't call them one of the more accomplished team internationally though. They have a silver at their home GP and a 4th place at 4CC... Let's just say they were potentially one of the more promising US teams for international success (BTW I don;'t think it's appropriate to discuss at length skaters from other nations than Canadians here... so that's as much as I will do in order to remain on topic of this thread)

And for the rest, yup... it's the nature of pairs... injuries, concussions... bad luck... The scene in Canada is pretty exciting at this point, we will have to wait and see how it develops over the course of the cycle.

 

[4everchan]

On Matte-Ferland.
Apparently, she suffered a stress fracture in her foot. It was healing well but then, starting to train again for Nationals, made it worse again. This is why they skipped Nationals and their GP this season. Hopefully it will fully heal by the spring and they will be back for summer competitions. While reading about them : they have been skating together for over 10 years. Amazing ! No wonder why they have such solid pair elements. I hope they regain their health and their flair ! Wishing them the best !

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

Lia only did pairs for one season when she was a kid... she kept in touch with Purkiss who called her when Trennt needed a partner... but really, hear experience is very limited. Of course, better limited experience than none. Nic and Emma have been together for quite a while and were having fun experimenting with lifts on the ground (on Instagram as well).... Nic's fan base was acquired because of his extremely charismatic personality on ice which is still there in pairs. I am so happy to see him smile because his injuries really nixed his singles career. We are tlaking about a guy who could land a quad lutz (instagram in training) quad loop (saw it at Nationals) quad toe and gigantic 3 axels until his ankle would not heal properly.
I am well aware that the future is bright but unforeseen for either of these pairs. Ruest Wolfe started with a bang and vanished (injuries.. interesting to note that he was an ice dancer and she was a singles skater... so again, no pairs experience). I am worried about Nic and Emma's health. Emma's injury seemed pretty serious (herniated disc).

I was a big fan of C/J... I wouldn't call them one of the more accomplished team internationally though. They have a silver at their home GP and a 4th place at 4CC... Let's just say they were potentially one of the more promising US teams for international success (BTW I don;'t think it's appropriate to discuss at length skaters from other nations than Canadians here... so that's as much as I will do in order to remain on topic of this thread)

And for the rest, yup... it's the nature of pairs... injuries, concussions... bad luck... The scene in Canada is pretty exciting at this point, we will have to wait and see how it develops over the course of the cycle.

Thanks for sharing more about Lia's pairs experience. I saw her mention in an interview last year that she'd skated pairs. I don't think many fans are aware that Lia has some prior pairs experience, however brief. It definitely is an advantage to have already learned and trained pairs elements. No matter that her competitive experience was brief and youthful, she still has a leg up in having already learned basic pairs elements. I think that advantage is what has helped Lia/ Trennt come together fast and compete well right away. The biggest hurdle is getting accustomed to each other under high pressure situations ( as it is for all newly paired teams).

I suppose you mean Nic & Emma have been together as a couple for quite awhile. Surely that helps in their learning process, and maybe having practiced lifts for fun previously, they will eventually excel in that aspect. Yep, it's nice to see Nic smiling a lot. It must be fun skating with a partner, especially with a girlfriend he's known for years. Sharing that can be better than competing alone on the ice while struggling with injuries. Speaking of which, staying healthy will be crucial for N&E. Over the next few seasons, it will be interesting to see how both of these new pairings evolve.

I personally feel much more awe for Canadian ice dance, after seeing the huge depth of talent the Cdn discipline possesses. Of course, Cdn pairs is definitely now on a solid footing, and in a fine position to increasingly improve. I'm going to temper my excitement until something truly exciting happens. Canada's teams, U.S. teams, and pairs in general, are in a transitional stage. There are a lot of unknowns right now. But I understand Cdn fans being stoked that pairs prospects have turned a significant corner north of the border.

I'll take my thoughts on C/J to an appropriate thread. Mainly, I was referencing their top-notch skill level on most elements, except sbs jumps. So, while not as decorated as the very top teams, their results were above average for a team who skated at their first U.S. Nats in 2019. Unfortunately, their momentum went kaput after Worlds was cancelled in 2020.

 

[4everchan]

I personally feel much more awe for Canadian ice dance, after seeing the huge depth of talent the Cdn discipline possesses. Of course, Cdn pairs is definitely now on a solid footing, and in a fine position to increasingly improve. I'm going to temper my excitement until something truly exciting happens. Canada's teams, U.S. teams, and pairs in general, are in a transitional stage. There are a lot of unknowns right now. But I understand Cdn fans being stoked that pairs prospects have turned a significant corner north of the border.

Ice dance in Canada benefits from the impact of Virtue and Moir right now. Seniors are deep but juniors too, even novice. It is exciting.
Pairs, as you know, and that is true everywhere, is trickier. Partnerships are harder to create and to keep going. Injuries can be very severe. At this point, we see the impact of Duhamel-Radford, starting to emerge. Helps that Meagan and Bruno are also very involved in coaching new pairs. What is different this time around is the spread of the wealth. The good coaching is not limited to one or two clubs but we saw competitors from several clubs compete at Nationals with success in both juniors and seniors. Pairs, for the longest time was centered in Quebec and in Ontario. There are up and coming pairs coming from Manitoba and Saskatchewan as well.
If BC started a good program, I bet there would be a lot of potential too.
The quick turn around triggered my own enthusiasm and then, what confirmed it is that the pairs scene is also expanding in Canada. For a small country, where skaters love to ice dance, it's amazing to see the discipline develop so quickly.

 

[BlissfulSynergy]

^^ Yeah, thanks for your insights. In regard to Cdn ice dance, I was referring moreso to the juniors I saw compete at Cdn Nats. Excellent teams with huge talent, one after another! When these teams come up to seniors, I can't see how the embarrassment of riches can be managed to give them all deserving opportunities, under the current competitive structure. Of course, they may not all stay together, which is the nature of juniors. Still, there are so many very good junior teams that so many could have made the Cdn junior podium.

The current competitive contrast and the cross-fertilization between pairs and ice dance is fascinating. How both disciplines evolved historically is intriguing and enlightening.

 

[4everchan]

^^ Yeah, thanks for your insights. In regard to Cdn ice dance, I was referring moreso to the juniors I saw compete at Cdn Nats. Excellent teams with huge talent, one after another! When these teams come up to seniors, I can't see how the embarrassment of riches can be managed to give them all deserving opportunities, under the current competitive structure. Of course, they may not all stay together, which is the nature of juniors. Still, there are so many very good junior teams that so many could have made the Cdn junior podium.

The current competitive contrast and the cross-fertilization between pairs and ice dance is fascinating. How both disciplines evolved historically is intriguing and enlightening.

This year, Skate Canada named a whopping 9 ice dance teams on the National team (senior)... that was unprecedented. I hope they make this a tradition and send the skaters to as many events as possible. On the junior scene, 10 teams were named in the Next Gen roster. It seems to me that Skate Canada intends to nurture the talent. Of course, moving to seniors is not easy.... Not all these teams will establish themselves as quickly as Lajoie and Lagha who are knocking the door already on the senior scene. We will just have to wait and see and remain hopeful.
Regarding pairs, young skaters watching Deanna, Emma and Lia transition successfully from singles to pairs (and prior to that Meagan and Julianne who did both up to seniors) might be inspiring.