2024 Europeans Entries

[Dreamer57]

Spain
Women - Emilia Murdock (pending minimums - this might be worlds only)
Men - Tomàs-Llorenç Guarino Sabaté
Ice Dance - Sofía Val / Asaf Kazimov

https://x.com/fedhielo/status/1736824063262085183?s=20

 

[norwegianfairytale]

Spain
Women - Emilia Murdock (pending minimums - this might be worlds only)
Men - Tomàs-Llorenç Guarino Sabaté
Ice Dance - Sofía Val / Asaf Kazimov

https://x.com/fedhielo/status/1736824063262085183?s=20

Hmm I think it´s too late to get minimums for Euros now?

Waaaait, Olivia and Tim didn´t get the spot? I´m thrilled for Val/Kazimov but very surprised

 

[FlossieH]

Well, Kevin is going to Euros.

France:
Lorine Schild
Adam Siao Him Fa, Kévin Aymoz, Luc Economides
pairs: Camille and Pavel Kovalev; Océane Piegad/ Denys Strekalin
dance: Loicia Demougeot/Theo le Mercier; Marie Dupayage/Thomas Nabais; Evgeniia Lopareva/Geoffrey Brissaud

I was wondering who they were going to choose for their ladies entry. It has been so close between Lea and Lorine all season. Lorine is more consistent technically, but lacks experience (which shows in her presentation marks). Lea has better performance skills but is inconsistent and has always had a tendency to bomb in higher pressure events. I think their respective performances at nationals probably clinched it for Lorine, and I also think that it is right to send the national champion when it has been so close between them. It must be tough for Lea, though, especially with her having relocated to Germany to try to improve.

 

[FlossieH]

Spain
Women - Emilia Murdock (pending minimums - this might be worlds only)
Men - Tomàs-Llorenç Guarino Sabaté
Ice Dance - Sofía Val / Asaf Kazimov

https://x.com/fedhielo/status/1736824063262085183?s=20

Huh? What happened to Olivia and Tim? They won nationals and have had higher scores in ISU events? They must be eligible because neither competed last year and they were able to represent Spain already at the GP series?

 

[Andrea82]

According to Hielo Espanol, Spanish Fed decided for a selection criteria based on top 3 TES scores, without considering PCS.
Sum of Val/Kazimov's TES scores from Nate, Budapest Trophy and Bosphorus Cup is higher than sum of Smart/Dieck's TES scores from Nats, Skate America and GP France.

 

[norwegianfairytale]

According to Hielo Espanol, Spanish Fed decided for a selection criteria based on top 3 TES scores, without considering PCS.
Sum of Val/Kazimov's TES scores from Nate, Budapest Trophy and Bosphorus Cup is higher than sum of Smart/Dieck's TES scores from Nats, Skate America and GP France.

I don´t think that is fair at all since Bosphorus Cup seemed to have very inflated scores, and Smart/Dieck results were all from CS or GP with stricter judging and better teams.

 

[elektra blue]

since the total score combines both TES and PCS and sometimes PCS can get you a couple of place higher than your TES this totally doesn't make sense

 

[norwegianfairytale]

since the total score combines both TES and PCS and sometimes PCS can get you a couple of place higher than your TES this totally doesn't make sense

And like.... they don´t want two spots at Euros next season either? I feel really bad Olivia and Tim, I wonder if they regret now not skating for the German Fed

 

[elektra blue]

And like.... they don´t want two spots at Euros next season either? I feel really bad Olivia and Tim, I wonder if they regret now not skating for the German Fed

unless they split and we don't know yet

 

[Jumping_Bean]

Worse for S/D, the criteria for Euros/Worlds selection weren't released until November 16th - After the entry deadline for the last international Dance competitions before Euros had passed.

And no, using the TES from Bosphorus Cup and SkAm is not a fair comparison. Regardless of if you think the TES given at the other events used for selection have been fair or not.

 

[skatingguy]

unless they split and we don't know yet

They competed, and won Spanish nationals yesterday.

 

[Gia_Sesshoumaru]

Hmm I think it´s too late to get minimums for Euros now?

Yes, the deadline has already passed. If I'm not mistaken, it's 21 days before the first official practice. But this announcement does say Euros AND Worlds, so I suppose they're putting her down for Worlds.

 

[4everchan]

This beats everything so far this season. What a dumb thing to do. Or shall I say it's not a very Smart decision or would the pun be too soon to be made ? GOSH.... I thought some Feds were bad... this trumps it all.

 

[yuumagical]

This beats everything so far this season. What a dumb thing to do. Or shall I say it's not a very Smart decision or would the pun be too soon to be made ? GOSH.... I thought some Feds were bad... this trumps it all.

It's not too soon to use a pun that lame, lol. Then again, I really appreciate bad puns.

In all seriousness, I still think the KSU forcing its skaters to compete in a ranking competition to obtain funding and tournament spots despite their injuries is the worst decision of the season. Judging from the Spanish Nationals competition thread (I didn't see the skating itself), apparently Val/Kazimov have a case for being national champions instead of Smart/Dieck...

The TES criteria is admittedly pretty baffling...but perhaps Val/Kazimov's reward is a deserved one...

 

[icewhite]

I was wondering who they were going to choose for their ladies entry. It has been so close between Lea and Lorine all season. Lorine is more consistent technically, but lacks experience (which shows in her presentation marks). Lea has better performance skills but is inconsistent and has always had a tendency to bomb in higher pressure events. I think their respective performances at nationals probably clinched it for Lorine, and I also think that it is right to send the national champion when it has been so close between them. It must be tough for Lea, though, especially with her having relocated to Germany to try to improve.

I clearly prefer Léa, but I think there was no real case to be made for her here.

 

[icewhite]

It's not too soon to use a pun that lame, lol. Then again, I really appreciate bad puns.

In all seriousness, I still think the KSU forcing its skaters to compete in a ranking competition to obtain funding and tournament spots despite their injuries is the worst decision of the season. Judging from the Spanish Nationals competition thread (I didn't see the skating itself), apparently Val/Kazimov have a case for being national champions instead of Smart/Dieck...

The TES criteria is admittedly pretty baffling...but perhaps Val/Kazimov's reward is a deserved one...

The feds are really having a heated contest who's the worst of them and they come up with all kind of dirt to win.

I don't think there's a case to be made about V/K being better. They aren't. Maybe Smart/Dieck have been disappointing for the Spanish fed. There was a lot of hype in the beginning and so far they have not been stellar. Nonetheless they are a very good team. They have scored higher throughout the season than V/K. They are national champions. They have the better chance to win two spots for Spain.
The fed could have said they give Europeans to V/K to give them a chance or to S/D where they have to prove their level again or something and then decide on worlds. But no, they gave both events to the team that scored (partly much) lower and cannot be expected to score higher than S/D would.
It is mindblowing. The fact that they named the criteria pretty late in the season, almost after the fact, also adds shade.

The best explanation I see is that the Spanish fed wants to support their own coaching camp/spot. It's still all very weird.

 

[lilimum]

The feds are really having a heated contest who's the worst of them and they come up with all kind of dirt to win.

I don't think there's a case to be made about V/K being better. They aren't. Maybe Smart/Dieck have been disappointing for the Spanish fed. There was a lot of hype in the beginning and so far they have not been stellar. Nonetheless they are a very good team. They have scored higher throughout the season than V/K. They are national champions. They have the better chance to win two spots for Spain.
The fed could have said they give Europeans to V/K to give them a chance or to S/D where they have to prove their level again or something and then decide on worlds. But no, they gave both events to the team that scored (partly much) lower and cannot be expected to score higher than S/D would.
It is mindblowing. The fact that they named the criteria pretty late in the season, almost after the fact, also adds shade.

The best explanation I see is that the Spanish fed wants to support their own coaching camp/spot. It's still all very weird.

I think conisdering only the TES for ranking is reasonable and V/K had higher TES at the only event where both couples competed, Spanish nationals
I guess Spanish Fed is aware of the fact, that is difficult to compare GP with minor competitions, thats why the competitions for the ranking of the next to seasons are better defined. Of course I was courious If Spanish Fed really risk the better change for 2 spots in the following season, but that how the criterias defined.
Tim has been in 2021/22 in a similar situation but on the other side - being second in Nationals and going to Europeans and Olympics instead of Jen/Ben so he should be fine with the decisison.
Of course nobody knows what is going on in the background, e.g. Sara Hurtado is very present, very enganged in Spanish sports. And perhaps the fact that FC Barcelona decided to use the only ice rink in Barcelona as a football museum instead of a ice rink while Spanish Fed is working on establishing figure skating in Spain could be also an aspect.

 

[4everchan]

It's not too soon to use a pun that lame, lol. Then again, I really appreciate bad puns.

In all seriousness, I still think the KSU forcing its skaters to compete in a ranking competition to obtain funding and tournament spots despite their injuries is the worst decision of the season. Judging from the Spanish Nationals competition thread (I didn't see the skating itself), apparently Val/Kazimov have a case for being national champions instead of Smart/Dieck...

The TES criteria is admittedly pretty baffling...but perhaps Val/Kazimov's reward is a deserved one...

I guess I just don't even know who they are at the same time, I know very well who Smart/Dieck are and I don't like their programs this year. It's not working out quite yet for me. So they can just go back to the drawing board and get started on their new FD as I guess the RD rumour (movies) is still just a rumour. Maybe with more time, they will gel better next year. It's just a long time without earning ISU championship points for this team and if VK are as good as it seems, it could be very well be that SD lose again next year ....

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

Absolutely delighted that Sofía and Asaf have been selected for Europeans.

Justice has been served.

Those that were watching the Spanish Championships will know what I am talking about. When we eventually found out the results (there were no graphics on screen and the Entres / Results page had stopped working in the morning), there was a lot of anger over the outcome in the event thread.

That Olivia and Tim won the title was blatant jiggery pokery. Sofía and Asaf skated far better in both programmes. They were clean in both programmes, whereas Olivia and Tim had Twizzle issues in both programmes. But, whereas the Tech panel were being fair, the Judges clearly favoured Olivia and Tim, and were being overgenerous with them in both the marks for the elements, and in the PCS. And that was the case in both segments.

If you want to watch them to see for yourselves, here are the programmes within the archived livestreams (apologies for skipping over the other partnership that skated before them in both segments):

Short Dance (starts with Olivia and Tim at 58m 45s) - https://www.coe.tv/videos/111905-ca...je-artistico-y-sincronizado-2023-dia-2-tarde/
Free Dance (starts with Sofía and Asaf at 1h 30m 47s) - https://www.coe.tv/videos/112015-di...na-de-patinaje-artistico-y-sincronizado-2023/

Both partnerships had been very well matched all season. And those of us that had been following their progress were really looking forward to an epic showdown. But, we were robbed of a genuine battle.

So, I am glad that the Fed have stepped in and rewarded the partnership that should have won the title.

EDIT: Now that I have found out that Sofía and Asaf have been selected for Worlds too, I think the Fed have over-compensated for the controversial result. Given how well matched the two partnerships have been all season, they should have been given one assignment each.​

CaroLiza_fan

 

[CaroLiza_fan]

And just for reference, here is something I posted in Sofía and Asaf's Fan Fest a couple of weeks ago.

Looking at the absolute PB's for each partnership, there is not much in it:

Ice Dance​	SD Date​	Competition​	SD Score​	FD Date​	Competition​	FD Score​	Event Dates​	Competition​	Total Score​
Olivia SMART / Tim DIECK	07 Oct. 2023	Finlandia Trophy	72.56​	22 Oct. 2023	Skate America	108.71​	20–22 Oct. 2023	Skate America	180.67​
Sofía VAL / Asaf KAZIMOV	01 Dec. 2023	Bosphorus Cup	69.99​	02 Dec. 2023	Bosphorus Cup	106.37​	27 Nov. – 03 Dec. 2023	Bosphorus Cup	176.36​
Difference			2.57​			2.34​			4.31​

And here are their score progressions in graph form:

Short Dance: https://skatingscores.com/chart/?qu...8-unit_name=&form-8-unit_color=&submit=Submit
Free Dance: https://skatingscores.com/chart/?qu...8-unit_name=&form-8-unit_color=&submit=Submit
Overall: https://skatingscores.com/chart/?qu...8-unit_name=&form-8-unit_color=&submit=Submit

Oh, I can't wait until Nationals in a couple of weeks. If they keep going the way they are, Sofía and Asaf could well cause an upset.​

Note: The graphs have since been updated with the results from Nationals, but if you ignore the last dot and the line to it you'll see what I was showing.

CaroLiza_fan