Figure skating Quota for 2018 Olympics

[Heleng]

Thanks for your explanations, Crossover and NanaPat! Makes sense now. I was going by an interview w D/B (posted on their fan page) that said they were hoping to finish top 16 at Worlds in order to go to the Olympics. I hope they qualify at Nebelhorn!

 

[Warwick360]

For the first time Israel has 2 spots in men ! Thank you, Alexei ! :yes2:

Actually glad that Daniel didn't go to the Worlds, even though I wished for it before the Worlds happened. Even greater chance for him to go to the Olympics now, hopefully.:hap57:

 

[Warwick360]

Korea: 2 Ladies

Didn't think it possible before Worlds, but I am very very pleased. :hap93:

 

[breadstal]

Korea better get more spots :hopelessness: I still can't get that Japan will have only 2 ladies at Olympics, bye. Canada slayed, USA too (sad that they won't have 2 pairs for Olympics).

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Give Japan their 3rd lady back! American their 2nd pair! Down with stupid qualification rules!! What does Worlds 2017 have to do with Olympics 2018?!?!

Well, as much as I'd love to see a 3rd Japanese lady... (a 2nd American pair not so much since neither D/F or K/OS are top 10 material, so they'd just be showing up), Worlds prior to the Olympics is the only major event that can serve as a barometer for the state of the international field as a (pretty much) whole in order to determine Olympic spots. I suppose with Satoko's injury, the overall calibre of Japanese ladies was misrepresented and they would have gotten 3 spots had she been there. But all countries are playing under the same rules, and it would be unfair to give preferential treatment. 13 or less is easy to get if country is legitimately strong in a discipline, in which case, they deserve the maximum representation -- I would feel bad though for country A if they got 6th and 8th (getting 2 spots), and another country B only had 1 entry and got 1st/2nd or had 2 entries and got 1st and 12th (getting 3 spots).

I never quite understood why if only 1 entry was at Worlds and they got 1st or 2nd, that country would be granted 3 spots. In the case of Yu Na Kim (at the time she skated to win Worlds 2013), getting 3 spots seemed a bit like over-representation (nothing against Haejin and SoYoun), and they were "lucky" that 2012 Worlds meant only 1 Worlds 2013 spot, so only 1 South Korean entry was sent to 2013 Worlds - who inevitably got 3 spots, when 2 entries likely would have gotten 2 spots.

But overall I'd say it's pretty fair, and it's nice that there is a cap on representation along with Nebelhorn to give the less-popular skating nations a chance to be represented.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Really hoping Canada grabs the team gold, lol.

That's be nice! It's an Olympic gold, but it's also a bit of an easy medal (and really, it comes down to timing if you are the best in all 4 disciplines for a particular Olympic year).

I'm also really hoping that it isn't a top 3 of US, Russia, Canada again... I'd love for a country like Italy to play spoiler. If anything the team event showcases just how deficient some countries are in certain disciplines. I mean, this quota says it all.

 

[[email protected]]

I'm also really hoping that it isn't a top 3 of US, Russia, Canada again... I'd love for a country like Italy to play spoiler. If anything the team event showcases just how deficient some countries are in certain disciplines. I mean, this quota says it all.

Interesting, which one of the big three you see off the podium? If Russia, I am against. If USA or Canada, well, I shall be sad but may survive it.

 

[NanaPat]

Because USA gets the last 16th spot for the Olympics as skaters can obtain 16 qualification tickets in total for Olympics at Worlds before Nebelhorn Trophy in September where 4 tickets are given to countries without any ticket for the Olympics.

3 spots (3 spots x 3 countries = 9 tickets)
1. China (1+4=5)
2. Russia (3+5=9)
3. Canada (6+7=13)

2 spots (2 spots x 3 countries = 6 tickets)
4. Germany (2+18=20)
5. Italy (9+13=22)
6. France (8+18=26)

1 spot (1 spot x 1 country = 1 tickets)
7. USA (10+18 = 28) * USA could've gotten 2 spots as Scimeca and Knierim placed within 10th, but in that case, the total tickets exceed 16 as the country standing is right behind France. If they placed above France (if Sc/Kn in 8th, Jamese/Cipres in 10th), USA could've gotten 2 spots while France could've gotten 1 spot.

9 + 6 + 1 = 16 tickets
--------------------------------

B/D's chance of getting 1 spot from the World was either they would've placed within 10th in the final standing or the big countries in pairs should've bombed. Both scenarios didn't happen in reality.

I didn't know how tenth would have made them, qualify, but finally worked it out. If they'd been 10th, with everything else relatively the same, only Italy and US would have been affected. Italy would have been 9 + 14 = 23, still 2 spots, but US A would have been 11+18=29, no multiples. There would have been 1 spot left after all the multiples were taken, and they would have grabbed it.

 

[CanadianSkaterGuy]

Interesting, which one of the big three you see off the podium? If Russia, I am against. If USA or Canada, well, I shall be sad but may survive it.

It's hard to say... USA is probably most vulnerable due to weak pairs and average men/ladies. Canada is vulnerable due to average men/pairs. Russia is vulnerable due to average dance and average/weak men.

However, looking at other countries:
France - weak ladies/men, average pairs,
Italy - very weak men, average pairs
China - very weak dance, weak ladies
Japan - very weak pairs, very weak ice dance

If you were able to drop your worst placing discipline, you'd see a lot more even ground in the team competition.

 

[[email protected]]

It's hard to say... USA is probably most vulnerable due to weak pairs and average men/ladies. Canada is vulnerable due to average men/pairs. Russia is vulnerable due to average dance and average/weak men.

However, looking at other countries:
France - weak ladies/men, average pairs,
Italy - very weak men, average pairs
China - very weak dance, weak ladies
Japan - very weak pairs, very weak ice dance

If you were able to drop your worst placing discipline, you'd see a lot more even ground in the team competition.

I think it is going to be very interesting. I bought tickets for team FS and quite excited about it.

 

[narcissa]

It's hard to say... USA is probably most vulnerable due to weak pairs and average men/ladies. Canada is vulnerable due to average men/pairs. Russia is vulnerable due to average dance and average/weak men.

However, looking at other countries:
France - weak ladies/men, average pairs,
Italy - very weak men, average pairs
China - very weak dance, weak ladies
Japan - very weak pairs, very weak ice dance

If you were able to drop your worst placing discipline, you'd see a lot more even ground in the team competition.

I feel like even though Patrick is "average," everyone who could technically place above him isn't really in the mix for a medal (Japan, China, Spain - are these countries even going to qualify for the free skate? or even the event?). I hope he skates both the SP and FS. I guess the only one who could challenge is Nathan.
And D/R being 2x world champions could regain their form/Radford's injury could heal. I feel like Canada has the best shot, US I think has no chance for anything other than bronze, and Russia has average everything except ladies compared to their main rivals.

 

[sc8]

And if it were not for some rather quirky rule, the US would have had 1 more Pairs spot which means it would have tied with Canada for the most.

Please help explain if you get a moment. I thought a top 10 finish secured two teams, so I was initially excited that they placed 10th (after my disappointment at how close they were to a top 5 finish if they didn't have the mistake at the end). I know about the top 2 placing 13 or less, but am unfamiliar with the "quirky" rule that's preventing a 2nd pair.

Thank you in advance.

 

[karne]

Please help explain if you get a moment. I thought a top 10 finish secured two teams, so I was initially excited that they placed 10th (after my disappointment at how close they were to a top 5 finish if they didn't have the mistake at the end). I know about the top 2 placing 13 or less, but am unfamiliar with the "quirky" rule that's preventing a 2nd pair.

Thank you in advance.

tl;dr: there are only 16 pairs Olympic spots available at Worlds. They would have gone down the list in the order that the first pair from each country finished, done the numbers and handed them out that way (so China = 3. 16-3 = 13. Germany = 2. 13-2 = 11. and so on.) By the time they got to 9th and 10th, there were only three spots left. France finished higher than the USA, so France got the two, leaving only 1 for the US.

The remaining four spots will be fought for at Nebelhorn, which the US cannot (and SHOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO before anyone suggests that evil idea) fight for Olympic spots at.

 

[sc8]

Because USA gets the last 16th spot for the Olympics as skaters can obtain 16 qualification tickets in total for Olympics at Worlds before Nebelhorn Trophy in September where 4 tickets are given to countries without any ticket for the Olympics.

3 spots (3 spots x 3 countries = 9 tickets)
1. China (1+4=5)
2. Russia (3+5=9)
3. Canada (6+7=13)

2 spots (2 spots x 3 countries = 6 tickets)
4. Germany (2+18=20)
5. Italy (9+13=22)
6. France (8+18=26)

1 spot (1 spot x 1 country = 1 tickets)
7. USA (10+18 = 28) * USA could've gotten 2 spots as Scimeca and Knierim placed within 10th, but in that case, the total tickets exceed 16 as the country standing is right behind France. If they placed above France (if Sc/Kn in 8th, Jamese/Cipres in 10th), USA could've gotten 2 spots while France could've gotten 1 spot.

9 + 6 + 1 = 16 tickets
--------------------------------

B/D's chance of getting 1 spot from the World was either they would've placed within 10th in the final standing or the big countries in pairs should've bombed. Both scenarios didn't happen in reality.

Thank you, Crossover. I was trying to figure out how this happened that we had only 1 pair.

 

[sc8]

I feel like even though Patrick is "average," everyone who could technically place above him isn't really in the mix for a medal (Japan, China, Spain - are these countries even going to qualify for the free skate? or even the event?). I hope he skates both the SP and FS. I guess the only one who could challenge is Nathan.
And D/R being 2x world champions could regain their form/Radford's injury could heal. I feel like Canada has the best shot, US I think has no chance for anything other than bronze, and Russia has average everything except ladies compared to their main rivals.

I think the gold will be a battle between Russia and Canada and US, unless something dramatic or drastic happens, should get bronze. It'll be fun to see it unfold. WTT will give us a preview of sorts, but hard to tell since some strong skaters are skipping.

 

[Ice Dance]

I think the gold will be a battle between Russia and Canada and US, unless something dramatic or drastic happens, should get bronze. It'll be fun to see it unfold. WTT will give us a preview of sorts, but hard to tell since some strong skaters are skipping.

Some strong skaters will skip the event at the Olympics as well. Pang & Tong and Savchenko & Szolkowy never went up in the team event at the last Olympics. And a lot of the star athletes (Volosozhar & Trankov, Chan, Hanyu, Kostner, Asada, Cappellini & Lanotte) only did the short & never went up in the free program.

 

[NanaPat]

The remaining four spots will be fought for at Nebelhorn, which the US cannot (and SHOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO before anyone suggests that evil idea) fight for Olympic spots at.

Suppose it had gone slightly worse for the US pairs and they had gotten 0 spots. In that case, they should (and I believe would) be able to try for one pairs spot at Nebelhorn.

 

[karne]

Suppose it had gone slightly worse for the US pairs and they had gotten 0 spots. In that case, they should (and I believe would) be able to try for one pairs spot at Nebelhorn.

That is correct and by the rules. What I am protesting against is the suggestion (and I have seen it more than once) that one of the Nebelhorn spots be STOLEN and given to the US.

 

[NanaPat]

That is correct and by the rules. What I am protesting against is the suggestion (and I have seen it more than once) that one of the Nebelhorn spots be STOLEN and given to the US.

Well, I absolutely agree with you there. There's always somebody who "just missed". Canada "just missed" 3 men's spots. The US "just missed" 2 pairs spots. In ladies and ice dance, somebody "just missed" one spot. Nobody is suggesting giving it to them (except maybe for the US pairs).

 

[Ice Dance]

That is correct and by the rules. What I am protesting against is the suggestion (and I have seen it more than once) that one of the Nebelhorn spots be STOLEN and given to the US.

The rules are the rules. I have no problem with the U.S. being the odd team out. However, I would also have no problem with a U.S. pair having a chance to compete for a second spot at Nebelhorn alongside the Australians, Czechs, Japanese, North Koreans, and other pairs teams that will be there. Since, technically, the U.S. had a team in the top ten, which is traditionally enough to earn two places. (Also, it would seem fair that the U.S. might get that spot should another top country throw one back, which is not the way the rules work now either). Allowing a team to compete at Nebelhorn would be a reasonable compromise for similar future situations, IMO, which might involve athletes from any country in the world. And could also have involved a country with one team in the top ten & another top eleven. As it is, I am very glad that China/Russia/Canada can send all three of their teams, unlike 2014 when--due to injuries in 2013--the Olympic pairs event excluded Sui & Han, a team that earned the fifth highest pairs SB during the Olympic season.