Gracie Gold: Can she medal at JW (and beyond)?

[R.D.]

^ This could be a turning point for Christina herself, though. She's kind of plateaued and Gracie has overtaken her. She's college-age now. She may remove herself from the equation. It can't be much use financially to have a lot of fifth-place finishes (and worse).

I hope not because she's so talented - just saying it's not really a matter of other people giving up on her. She may have some tough decisions.

It will come down to one simple question: How bad does she want it?

 

[DianaSelene]

Lots of skaters train a bit in ballet without the results being clear. The most likely reason? They don't do enough of it. Not enough so that it's automatic and entrenched in their movement. It may also be because they didn't start doing it young enough. Or their ballet instructors aren't disciplinarian enough. Or it could just be that some people aren't ever going to absorb the ballet aesthetic.

I am OK with that though. I don't think one needs to be genuinely balletic to be graceful, moving, elegant and entertaining on ice. And I think a lot of ballet's philosophy of movement simply wouldn't work in skating, where the physics is different.

I only know of two examples, but so far I like what training in modern dance has done for skaters more so than ballet training. Savchenko/Szolkowy did some modern dance, and it comes off beautifully in their FS, but especially well in their exhibition number to Lang Lang. And modern dance training has especially improved Patrick Chan, whom I find a lot more expressive with his entire body now. I think the benefits of traditional ballet training, with its emphasis on line and posture being the most applicable to skating, is something that can be conveyed just as well on ice. On the other hand, modern dance, where its emphasis is more on expressing oneself, digging in and reaching out emotionally, can really help skaters become more honest in their movement.

So rather than ape ballet, which may or may not be the right style for Gracie, I'd rather see her get some form of dance training that helps her find her own style. I think that will help her reach the audience the most.

I agree about modern dance. I think that Gold should just take a lot of dance lessons, no matter what type because it helps. However, you should remember that a lot of modern dance still takes some basics from ballet.

 

[Olympia]

That's a very interesting proposition, modern dance instead of ballet. I don't know enough about what modern dance takes from ballet in terms of posture, but I'm sure it builds flexibility and fluidity of movement. What about extensions? Hmmm. I'd love to hear more from those of you who have expertise in this matter. My one claim to knowledge is that I've read Agnes DeMille's autobiography, Dance to the Piper. I remember she talked a bit about moving from ballet to modern, but she was active when Ruth St. Denis and Ted Shawn were teaching, in the heyday of Martha Graham...something a little more up-to-date would be a good deal more helpful. Speak up, GS experts!

Also, does anyone know of other skaters who have studied modern dance? I'm pleased that Savchenko and Szolkowy have, and I'm kind of not surprised; it seems to suit their aesthetic and that of Ingo Steuer. Interesting to hear about Chan. Who else?

 

[pangtongfan]

While I agree about pushing other talents over Gao at this point, I'd be careful to give up on her so quick.

Well Agnes and Gold are younger than her and both much better. Wagner, Zhang, and Nagasu arent much older than her. It isnt 100% too late for her but she had better decide she wants to make some MAJOR improvements since minor tweeks will get her nowhere at this point. As it stands now she is nowhere near good enough.

 

[AmuChan363]

Someone like Rachael should not get two GP events. Or maybe someone like Christina Gao should be cut back to just one GP. Gracie did better in her one JR Worlds appearance then Gao has in the last three years.

Don't you think thats a bit harsh? Mind you Rachael WON JW in the sole season that she entered it, not to mention the 2010 us nationals, and came 7th at the olympics. Sure, she just started university and she's taking a very hard major and workload, and after one of the best skates, finished in 6th this year at nationals. I know that Gracie hasn't really been out there on the competition stage but I find that quote about Racheal just plain mean.

Just because a skater had a bad season doesn't mean that they should cut how many competitions they enter, I think they should be trying for MORE competitions. And this year being Christina's first senior GP season I think she didn't do terribly - it's a step up from juniors and she had a bad skate at JW this past week, so what? Even though she hasn't moved up a ranking (5th at nationals 3 years in a row) she's not going DOWN in rankings, or fluctuating like Alissa/Caroline (that being said, are both amazzzzing skaters)

 

[AmuChan363]

Well Agnes and Gold are younger than her and both much better. Wagner, Zhang, and Nagasu arent much older than her. It isnt 100% too late for her but she had better decide she wants to make some MAJOR improvements since minor tweeks will get her nowhere at this point. As it stands now she is nowhere near good enough.

Everyone's body is different, this especially for ladies as puberty really screws up your body and how you are able to perform difficult elements. Remember, gracie won JUNIOR nationals, and medalled at JUNIOR worlds. Wagner won this year SENIOR nationals and 4CC, Zhang was 3rd, and considering her skating THIS season compared to the last two seasons its a 10000000% improvement. Nagasu won nationals at 14, and was 4th at the olympics. how many people can say that about themselves? lol

So yes, she still has a way to go, but i'm not surprised if she's on the podium at us nationals, just because she is post-puberty(ish) and from what i can see has good technique.

 

[AmuChan363]

i actually just found it...icenetwork's article after the LP yesterday.

"Gold, who competed in just one Junior Grand Prix last fall, is undecided on what her immediate future holds.
'I will pass the senior test soon, but we have not decided yet if I keep junior or move to senior,' she said. "It would be cool to get a senior Grand Prix."

crossing my fingers she'll move up.

Well, I could see her move to senior in nationals but stay junior internationally, because with her talent I could see her making the JGP Final and easily winning junior worlds, she doesn't risk the chance of what puberty could do to her, and assuming that the russian talents are moving up to the senior gp she doesn't have much competition, hell I could see her with vanessa lam and zijun li on the podium next year if it happened!

 

[bekalc]

Well, I could see her move to senior in nationals but stay junior internationally, because with her talent I could see her making the JGP Final and easily winning junior worlds, she doesn't risk the chance of what puberty could do to her, and assuming that the russian talents are moving up to the senior gp she doesn't have much competition, hell I could see her with vanessa lam and zijun li on the podium next year if it happened!

Julia will not be eligible for Senior Worlds and so will likely do Junior Worlds next year. Not to mention the Russians have MORE young talents waiting to debut next year.

Elena Radionova
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rXlV8GdeFk

Evgenia Medvedeva
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWriPD-MtCk

Yes, Julia trains with Shelepen and Medvedeva every day.

Yes they have babies to replace their babies. Their talent pipeline isn't letting up anytime soon. The one thing I wonder is with so many to choose from I wonder how the Russians are going to be able to pick which ones to really push.

 

[DianaSelene]

Julia will not be eligible for Senior Worlds and so will likely do Junior Worlds next year. Not to mention the Russians have MORE young talents waiting to debut next year.

Elena Radionova
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rXlV8GdeFk

Evgenia Medvedeva
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWriPD-MtCk

Yes, Julia trains with Shelepen and Medvedeva every day.

Yes they have babies to replace their babies. Their talent pipeline isn't letting up anytime soon. The one thing I wonder is with so many to choose from I wonder how the Russians are going to be able to pick which ones to really push.

Well, the ones that are eligible for Sochi are Lipnitskaya, Shelepen, Sotnikova, Tuktamisheva, Korobeynikova, Biryukova, Leonova, and Makarova. Forgive me if I forgot someone. So these will have a very short time to show that they are the best to send to the olympics. But Medvedeva and Radionova are still young and may only think about 2018. So it's great that at least these two will have to wait.

All of the girls will have to push themselves to become better than their competition. Whoever is victorious will go to Sochi.

 

[bekalc]

Well, the ones that are eligible for Sochi are Lipnitskaya, Shelepen, Sotnikova, Tuktamisheva, Korobeynikova, Biryukova, Leonova, and Makarova. Forgive me if I forgot someone. So these will have a very short time to show that they are the best to send to the olympics. But Medvedeva and Radionova are still young and may only think about 2018. So it's great that at least these two will have to wait.

All of the girls will have to push themselves to become better than their competition. Whoever is victorious will go to Sochi.

We weren't talking about Sochi. We were talking about whether it would be an easy time next year in Juniors. Those two girls say not really.

 

[DianaSelene]

We weren't talking about Sochi. We were talking about whether it would be an easy time next year in Juniors. Those two girls say not really.

Sorry that I misunderstood. But yeah, these girls will also make a splash next year. I also hope that Anna Shershak will have a good season next year in juniors. I really like her mature skating.

 

[pangtongfan]

Don't you think thats a bit harsh? Mind you Rachael WON JW in the sole season that she entered it, not to mention the 2010 us nationals, and came 7th at the olympics. Sure, she just started university and she's taking a very hard major and workload, and after one of the best skates, finished in 6th this year at nationals. I know that Gracie hasn't really been out there on the competition stage but I find that quote about Racheal just plain mean.

Just because a skater had a bad season doesn't mean that they should cut how many competitions they enter, I think they should be trying for MORE competitions. And this year being Christina's first senior GP season I think she didn't do terribly - it's a step up from juniors and she had a bad skate at JW this past week, so what? Even though she hasn't moved up a ranking (5th at nationals 3 years in a row) she's not going DOWN in rankings, or fluctuating like Alissa/Caroline (that being said, are both amazzzzing skaters)

Please Rachel should retire altogether, and if she doesnt she is in danger of becoming the next Fumie Suguri a full decade younger. It is clear her best days are in the past, and she should go to school full time now. Absolutely Gracie Gold, the U.S future (most likely) should be given priority over either Flatt or Gao, neither who at this point even figure in the U.S top 6 contenders to make the Sochi Olympic team. If the USFSA doesnt they are foolish.

 

[feraina]

Well, I could see her move to senior in nationals but stay junior internationally, because with her talent I could see her making the JGP Final and easily winning junior worlds, she doesn't risk the chance of what puberty could do to her, and assuming that the russian talents are moving up to the senior gp she doesn't have much competition, hell I could see her with vanessa lam and zijun li on the podium next year if it happened!

There's no guarantee that Gold's puberty woes are definitively behind her. Look at Caroline Z and Rachael F. Growing girth is worth than height, and that typically happens in late teens or even early 20's. For Caroline, her worst was at 17, and for Rachael, apparently now when she's 19 (and when/if she'll get back into peak form again).

Nevertheless, I think Gold should move up to senior GP's, as she should have as much senior international experience as possible, if Sochi is her goal. Same with Zijun Li, though I would've loved to see her get a JW medal. She's China's best hope for Sochi, even if she personally could use another year on JGP to get more mature/fit.

 

[sky_fly20]

Julia will not be eligible for Senior Worlds and so will likely do Junior Worlds next year. Not to mention the Russians have MORE young talents waiting to debut next year.

Elena Radionova
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rXlV8GdeFk

Evgenia Medvedeva
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DWriPD-MtCk

Yes, Julia trains with Shelepen and Medvedeva every day.

Yes they have babies to replace their babies. Their talent pipeline isn't letting up anytime soon. The one thing I wonder is with so many to choose from I wonder how the Russians are going to be able to pick which ones to really push.

Medvedeva is only 12, I think she was born in August so she will wait for
2013-2014 season but Radionova is now 13 so she can do JGP

 

[Skater Boy]

I think Gsquared has a reasonable chance to medal later in life. But puberty and changing desires, emotions all play a role. Also, sometimes it is about timing ie retirements and who will rise at the right time. Ms. Gold has great jumps and is young enough to gain some strength and power in her skating and develop more fully her artistic side. But there are a lot of good American ladies as per usual - the question is who will break from the crowd and can any of them show some consistency ie. the rotation of Mirai, Rachel, Ashley, Alyssa and it seems now Caroline

 

[mskater93]

Gracie is one of the most consistent skaters I've ever seen (and that includes practices and lessons). Once she "gets" something, she more or less has it. She went from mess to 3F+3T in about a month and a half. She isn't likely to grow much more if at all - she's slightly taller than her mom and her dad's not that tall. She's already gone through the hard parts of puberty. She commands every session she's on - you better get out of her way. She works really hard on the ice, even when it's HS final exam time. I suspect they will go in a different direction next season presentation-wise and really show off her personality.

 

[Jammers]

Plus i don't see that petrified look on Gracie that we see all to often with some of the Senior Ladies like Mirai or Alissa for instance. Gracie seems to thrive on challenges and getting better. She doesn't seem willing to back down.

 

[mskater93]

She has the right team in place for what she wants, I suspect.

 

[christinaskater]

I agree modern dance and ballet lessons can be very helpful. Gracie has it, she is only in her juniors shifting to seniors so we still have to remember that. I do believe that she has a really great team so all the best to her. I am really proud of her and her achievements this year!

No matter what hue of medal she gets, her name and looks are good as gold!

I believe the glamorous and gorgeous look (beauty points), maturity, wonderful and humble attitude will work for her. The next key is to connect to the audience using the most effective choreography (by doing more dancing), incorporating more transitions, attaining consistency- more clean run-throughs, exquisite and glorious music to compliment her personality and beauty - skate from the soul (feel the music). She should video her performances- look at the small details on how to improve further a move like this and that. Nitpicking in short. I believe Gracie is a perfectionist and has learned that life is not perfect all the time and carries this wonderful attitude to go with it- but she still seeks for perfection like all skaters do.

For a lot of skating connoisseurs , especially the purist, figure skating is the ballet on ice! So it's an absolute joy to see someone who fuses ballet and skating perfectly. In reality figure skating is totally different from ballet- but ballet training and I guess modern dance nowadays can really make a difference in a performance and in the judges scores!

 

[brightphoton]

Figure skating isn't ballet on ice. It really isn't. Don't understand why people are always so eager for ballet to have a monopoly on the words graceful, elegant, good posture, lines, etc. As if it were the only source of those things.