Jason Brown

el henry

Fangirl of men’s spirals and split jumps
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Country
United-States

sdwyer52

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
So while I agree that there’s no guarantee Jason will make the team this year (see 2018 ☹️) I don’t think it’s quite as simple as one of the up and comers having a great skate at Nats and being selected over him because quads (see again 2018, Adam over Ross). Unless they change things this time due to the pandemic,“body of work” will be taken into account in making the selections.

In 2018, Jason’s problem was that in addition to bombing his FS at Nats and ending up 6th, he had looked shaky all season. And he looked particularly shaky at his last two comps before Nats - GPF and NHK. That outweighed his strong showing at 2017 Worlds.

As of now, we don’t know what kind of season there will be in 2021-22. If summer comps, challengers, and the GP are all disrupted, the panel may think it’s not fair to consider body of work, and may just go top 3 at Nats. I guess time will tell. But one thing to remember is how highly Jason scored at Nats in 2020 without a fully rotated quad (about 292) - I could be wrong but I don’t think anyone else besides Nathan has ever scored that high, including Vincent. So I really think what he needs to do this year depends on a lot of stuff.

Since we have been talking about whether Jason should have left Kori sooner, I thought now might be an interesting time to go back to the retrospective we started about a year ago but never finished, but this time we could focus on his year by year progression since the 2014 Olympic season to now. I thought we could look first at all the SP and then all the FS. Since a lot of programs have been pulled off YouTube, I thought maybe we could just look at one SP and one FS for each season. But if anyone wants to post additional versions, that’s totally fine! So to begin:

In 2013/14, his SP was Prince, Question of U. Here’s my favorite version, from 2013 TEB (ie GP France):

Love this program and how happy he was skating it. That footwork is wonderful!
 

sdwyer52

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
So while I agree that there’s no guarantee Jason will make the team this year (see 2018 ☹️) I don’t think it’s quite as simple as one of the up and comers having a great skate at Nats and being selected over him because quads (see again 2018, Adam over Ross). Unless they change things this time due to the pandemic,“body of work” will be taken into account in making the selections.

In 2018, Jason’s problem was that in addition to bombing his FS at Nats and ending up 6th, he had looked shaky all season. And he looked particularly shaky at his last two comps before Nats - GPF and NHK. That outweighed his strong showing at 2017 Worlds.

As of now, we don’t know what kind of season there will be in 2021-22. If summer comps, challengers, and the GP are all disrupted, the panel may think it’s not fair to consider body of work, and may just go top 3 at Nats. I guess time will tell. But one thing to remember is how highly Jason scored at Nats in 2020 without a fully rotated quad (about 292) - I could be wrong but I don’t think anyone else besides Nathan has ever scored that high, including Vincent. So I really think what he needs to do this year depends on a lot of stuff.

Since we have been talking about whether Jason should have left Kori sooner, I thought now might be an interesting time to go back to the retrospective we started about a year ago but never finished, but this time we could focus on his year by year progression since the 2014 Olympic season to now. I thought we could look first at all the SP and then all the FS. Since a lot of programs have been pulled off YouTube, I thought maybe we could just look at one SP and one FS for each season. But if anyone wants to post additional versions, that’s totally fine! So to begin:

In 2013/14, his SP was Prince, Question of U. Here’s my favorite version, from 2013 TEB (ie GP France):

 

Bookseller

Final Flight
Joined
May 28, 2018
Country
United-States
So while I agree that there’s no guarantee Jason will make the team this year (see 2018 ☹️) I don’t think it’s quite as simple as one of the up and comers having a great skate at Nats and being selected over him because quads (see again 2018, Adam over Ross). Unless they change things this time due to the pandemic,“body of work” will be taken into account in making the selections.

In 2018, Jason’s problem was that in addition to bombing his FS at Nats and ending up 6th, he had looked shaky all season. And he looked particularly shaky at his last two comps before Nats - GPF and NHK. That outweighed his strong showing at 2017 Worlds.

As of now, we don’t know what kind of season there will be in 2021-22. If summer comps, challengers, and the GP are all disrupted, the panel may think it’s not fair to consider body of work, and may just go top 3 at Nats. I guess time will tell. But one thing to remember is how highly Jason scored at Nats in 2020 without a fully rotated quad (about 292) - I could be wrong but I don’t think anyone else besides Nathan has ever scored that high, including Vincent. So I really think what he needs to do this year depends on a lot of stuff.

Since we have been talking about whether Jason should have left Kori sooner, I thought now might be an interesting time to go back to the retrospective we started about a year ago but never finished, but this time we could focus on his year by year progression since the 2014 Olympic season to now. I thought we could look first at all the SP and then all the FS. Since a lot of programs have been pulled off YouTube, I thought maybe we could just look at one SP and one FS for each season. But if anyone wants to post additional versions, that’s totally fine! So to begin:

In 2013/14, his SP was Prince, Question of U. Here’s my favorite version, from 2013 TEB (ie GP France):

I agree with your analysis. If Jason has a good season, he will be a serious consideration for the Olympic team. His international track record, in general, is good. The up and comers don't have that track record. So a good season and a good skate at Nationals will keep him in consideration. I know that he'll work hard and do his best to be in that situation. While it was painful to see Ross overlooked in 2018, his international track record was dismal. The committee wasn't considering him at all, no matter how he skated.

And thank you for starting the retrospective over again. It will be very interesting to see his progression.
Disrupting the conversation a little bit. The ISU has launched a lovely article about Jason's skills in Japanese.
Nice article. It's very Jason!
 

sdwyer52

Rinkside
Joined
Oct 19, 2019
Seeing he's planning a quad salchow in the short, I can kinda see him including a 4S and a 4T in the long if the 4T will be as good as the 4S in practice. I don't know how having an axel as the fourth jump will turn out for him though.
We must be positive on this page. I know I’m fairly new to it, but remember everyone can read it. Jason is in a good place with USFS and I believe he will do a great job this year. I hope he can complete At many events.
 

Bookseller

Final Flight
Joined
May 28, 2018
Country
United-States
As to the Trophee Bompard Question of U video, that is a great version of that program. His personality comes through, his spins look really good. Jumps mostly looked good. The PC score surprises me. He still hadn't built his reputation for those skills and he was underscored. It does show how far he's come. GP France does seem to be a good venue for him. He does well there. The thing that I noticed is that his speed is so much slower than what he does now. The music is languid and his skating fits the music, but he skates so much faster now and his transitions are much more intricate. But that was a really nice skate and a good program for him.
 

Tavi...

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
I adore this program, and I especially love the step sequence! Regarding PCS, the announcer was also surprised it was so low. But actually, he got the third highest PCS, behind only Patrick Chan (46+) and Yuzu (42+). His GOE was also kind of stingy, especially on the spins. As you said, @Bookseller, it’s a classic example of reputation scoring - which is not supposed to be a thing but obviously is. 🙄
 

Bookseller

Final Flight
Joined
May 28, 2018
Country
United-States
I adore this program, and I especially love the step sequence! Regarding PCS, the announcer was also surprised it was so low. But actually, he got the third highest PCS, behind only Patrick Chan (46+) and Yuzu (42+). His GOE was also kind of stingy, especially on the spins. As you said, @Bookseller, it’s a classic example of reputation scoring - which is not supposed to be a thing but obviously is. 🙄
It's definitely a thing. His spins were very good, so he should have gotten higher GOEs on them. But he gets them now. Jason's skating was pretty unique in 2015. After a couple of years of seeing Jason get high PCs for his skills, a lot of the higher level skaters, Yuzu included, starting upping their PC game. Seeing Jason score high without a single quad was a wake up call. That step sequence was really good, but much slower than what he does now. Still the clarity and complexity were very notable.
 

el henry

Fangirl of men’s spirals and split jumps
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Country
United-States
Now we are starting to see Jason. I thought the step sequence was very similar to what we see today: the crisp movements, the attention grabbing transitions, the high kick, and to think it was the first time that many folks probably really saw Jason.

And Jason earned each and every one of those so-called reputation points he gets now, because like everyone else said, he was lowballed then. Even in good company. :)
 

kan01

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Country
Romania
If by some chance Vincent manages to put it all together and one of the up and comers skates clean, Jason sadly won't be going to the Olympics. I hate that there is so much emphasis on quads (oh wait, how many times have I said that???)
Even if a newcomer skates clean it will be a Ross Miner situation. They would rather send Jason than a newcomer. It's not only about placement at the US Nationals, it's also about body of work. And Jason has that. He also has the first half of the season to further cement the body of work. I don't see US Nationals being such a big factor if he falls on some jumps. In 2018 Adam Rippon was not great and 4th at Nationals I think and they sent him. He had only one quad also if I'm not mistaken.
 

kan01

On the Ice
Joined
Dec 15, 2019
Country
Romania
We must be positive on this page. I know I’m fairly new to it, but remember everyone can read it. Jason is in a good place with USFS and I believe he will do a great job this year. I hope he can complete At many events.
I was not being negative. Just saying it would be tiring to jump a triple axel as the fourth jump in a FP if he includes that 4T he's been training besides the 4S. But he can pull it off if he gets into that start-of-2020 consistency. Being a Jason fan, I worry about different scenarios. And I totally agree, no need to be negative on this thread. I remember reading the posts in here before NHK 2019 and cringing so hard at all the negativity and superstitions, everyone fearing about Jason doing bad at NHK that year. Which in the end was the case, but I did not like the posts either way, better to stay positive. So I get where you're coming from, but I wasn't meaning to be negative towards Jason, just a concerned fan talking about Jason and quads. If he plans to include a quad in the short, he clearly doesn't want to hold back even if the scores and consistency are very good as they are--at least the short. If he trains both 4S and 4T, it's only natural he would want to include both at one point in the long.
I try to be an optimist and a realist, never a pessimist before the situations actually unfold.
As a side note, it's not the first time I'm being accused of doing stuff other people (including sometimes the ones who are accusing me) are doing on GS. I guess it's normal on forums. :)
 
Last edited:

karne

in Emergency Backup Mode
Record Breaker
Joined
Jan 1, 2013
Country
Australia
As to the old discussion about when Jason should have left Kori, it is pointless. As I have said before, it had to be Jason's choice and Jason's choice alone, or it would never have worked.
 

Tavi...

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
So here for those interested in looking at how these programs have progressed over time, are all the SPs from 2013/14 on:

2013/14 Prince: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x178kmb

2015 Love is Blindness: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WCvYNGUnuVU

2016 Appassionata: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qnme3TO_-oU

2017 Writings on Wall: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CSEKVUV8bBI

2018 Hamilton: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8z_FesDvAI0

2019 Love is a B*: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7dlAd8Wa8NE

2020 Can’t go on without you: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=naEncCHKeLc

2021 Sinnerman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naEncCHKeLc

Thoughts?
 

el henry

Fangirl of men’s spirals and split jumps
Record Breaker
Joined
Mar 3, 2014
Country
United-States
So here for those interested in looking at how these programs have progressed over time, are all the SPs from 2013/14 on:

2013/14 Prince: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x178kmb

2015 Love is Blindness: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=WCvYNGUnuVU

2016 Appassionata: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qnme3TO_-oU

2017 Writings on Wall: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CSEKVUV8bBI

2018 Hamilton: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8z_FesDvAI0

2019 Love is a B*: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7dlAd8Wa8NE

2020 Can’t go on without you: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=naEncCHKeLc

2021 Sinnerman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=naEncCHKeLc

Thoughts?

A Jason anthology.... the Senior Years

Love is Blindness and Appassionata, the blasts from the past. :biggrin: Definitely haven't rewatched those recently (as opposed to the, um, several times I've watched Sinnerman....)
 

DreamSkates

Rinkside
Joined
Dec 12, 2015
While I think Kori was a great coach for the beginner Jason, at some point even she must have realized that she was out of her depth with him and that he needed to move on. Would it have made a difference had he left her much earlier? Who knows! But clearly his move to TCC has made a huge difference so one can only surmise an earlier move would have been good for him. It may end up that Jason's legendary contribution to figure skating will be pushing other men to improve their presentation skills and not just be jumping beans. The more I watch Jason and skaters like Kevin Aymoz and even Camden Pulkinen, I have less tolerance for the men who just twiddle twaddle their way between jumps and don't care about how they present their programs. We're all wishing Jason could get "that quad" but quite frankly, he needs more than one quad and he really needs them in both the short and free. As it is, he needs to get help from other skaters to medal. Nathan is a given. If by some chance Vincent manages to put it all together and one of the up and comers skates clean, Jason sadly won't be going to the Olympics. I hate that there is so much emphasis on quads (oh wait, how many times have I said that???)
If Jason does well this coming year, and does well at Nationals even if he ends up say, in 4th, I think he'll still be on the team given his remarkable abilities and "body of work" that the up and comers don't have.
 

Tavi...

Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2014
A Jason anthology.... the Senior Years

Love is Blindness and Appassionata, the blasts from the past. :biggrin: Definitely haven't rewatched those recently (as opposed to the, um, several times I've watched Sinnerman....)
I thought it was interesting to see the similarities between Juke, Gatsby, and Hamilton, and how that real dance oriented style has morphed into something much more mature in Sinnerman.
 
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