Michelle

[Joesitz (RIP)]

We'll see what happens. But in any entertainment venue, you have to give the people what they want. On this very forum, on the front page of The Edge there are 300 (now 301) posts about various aspects of the Marshall's event.

I think what people want are more NASCAR Racing, Football and Golf. I think most fans of figure skating are not interested in the sport but in the movement over the ice because it mimics ballet and acrobatic dancing.

Do you really think the Edge is a representative sample of the Public at large? Geraldo Rivera opened up a safe and got millions of viewers. It was a one time thing. I doubt anyone would tune in for another stunt.

By contrast, on the thread on the lades free skate in the NHK trophy shown on TV last night, there are exactly two posts -- yours and mine.

Exactly. Just proves my point that even with 'die hard fans of figure skating' the interest is in a local Ladies exhibition skate to be judged by the public; and those votes you counted are the sum of the people who are interested minus the ones who voted more than once.

Joehwell:

 

[mzheng]

Mzheng

Well not me - you bet I got my vote in -wanna guess who? LOL But the rest of California?

Well, I know MS missed the vote......See not all Kwan fan gets on the vote. They are no MKFers.

 

[Linny]

minus the non-live viewers

About 20% of television viewers use recording devices and watch commercial television after the actual broadcast... at least that was the percentage I last heard. So, the actual number of viewers is quite a bit more than just the number of votes minus the number of people who voted multiple times.
Linny

 

[BronzeisGolden]

Exactly. Just proves my point that even with 'die hard fans of figure skating' the interest is in a local Ladies exhibition skate to be judged by the public

I don't think that is the case. We got pages and pages of discussion on Marshalls because of the new format and some of the other circumstances surrounding it (Michelle's injury and debut, Sasha's "R&J" revamp, etc.). I expected this type of discussion to draw quite a bit of attention from posters. It is (obviously) a highly controversial format, and people want to discuss that. That doesn't necessarily mean they value this type of competition over a traditional one. It simply means there was more to debate and discuss about this particular one.

 

[Mathman]

Well, my point is, why does it have to be an either/or? Why not something for everyone?

The mission of the ISU is to regulate and promote the sports of competitive figure skating and speed skating. To this end they hold "serious" contests such as the Grand Prix, Junior Grand Prix, various other international events and world championships. Good for them.

But in addition to (not instead of) all this, if some entrepreneur wants to get up the money to put on a cheesefest, or a professional show with or without the presence of actual competition, or a tour -- hey, rock on to you all, too. A pay day for the skaters and maybe they can even attract enough public interest to cover their expenses and make a profit. We purists can sneer, but there it is, even so.

When professional figure skating was popular in the 1990s, the ISU and the USFSA made a conscious effert to grab a bigger peice of the pie by making it profitable for Olympians and world champions to stay in the amateur side of things. This worked to the extent that it did kill off profession skating (no new blood), but it also backfired in that ISU-sactioned events were not able to pick up the slack in terms of public interest.

The current model seems to be these faux-competitive galas which hope to ride the coattails of a tiny handful of beloved and well-hyped stars. Well, OK, one beloved and well-hyped star. Now that this era, too, is drawing to a close, I think eveyone is working hard to come up with new ideas -- however hokey -- to keep the ship afloat.

MM

 

[Mathman]

PS. BTW, as Joe points out above, there is surprisingly little discussion underway on the Internet message boards about the actual vote. I think this is because us Michelle fans are kind of in hiding right now.

If Michelle won any prize money by getting 59% of the popular vote, she should do the right thing and fork it over to Sasha.

MM

PS. Then Johnny and Mike should give theirs to Matt.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

Mathman and BronzeGolden - Since we all knew that the contest was being judged by audience response, were you biting your nails for the outcome?

Everyone knew who would win, and the winner skated poorly - fact! Is there any feedback that the audience was composed of other than fs fans, and MK fans in particlular?

Would you have wanted to see this sort of thing again with Ando and Nakano? You could have if you turned to the NHK showing on TV. and it was judged by the interntional judges. good competition.

However, they just may have a Who Could Be the Marshall Model based on looks and taste in clothing, skating is optional.

Joe

 

[jesslily]

Michelle did skated poorly at the Boston Cheesefest. Part of the reason is her injury
is still not recoverd. The other part might be if she is really committed to compete in Italy. She has pursued the dream twice for 17 years and did not realize it. Now with injurd hip, few other competitior so well trained, is she still in the spirit to fight for the glory? She may not know herself, even she put a smile on her face all the time.

 

[Doggygirl]

Mathman and BronzeGolden -
Would you have wanted to see this sort of thing again with Ando and Nakano? You could have if you turned to the NHK showing on TV. and it was judged by the interntional judges. good competition.

Joe

Hi Joe!! Just so you know I've been a good little figure skating fan I watched as much of the live NHK coverage as I current during the event via the CCTV feed, and watched a number of video downloads as soon as they were available from the video site. And you are right - it was a great competition!! Of course the TV video / sound quality are always a bit better, so of course I have the TV coverage on Tivo. But since I've already seen more skaters than were included in the ESPN broadcast, I haven't gotten around to watching the Tivo TV version yet.

Anybody else in the same place?

DG

 

[yelyoh]

Michelle did skated poorly at the Boston Cheesefest. Part of the reason is her injury
is still not recoverd. The other part might be if she is really committed to compete in Italy. She has pursued the dream twice for 17 years and did not realize it. Now with injurd hip, few other competitior so well trained, is she still in the spirit to fight for the glory? She may not know herself, even she put a smile on her face all the time.

Simply but beautifully put.

 

[mpal2]

We'll see what happens. But in any entertainment venue, you have to give the people what they want. On this very forum, on the front page of The Edge there are 300 (now 301) posts about various aspects of the Marshall's event.

By contrast, on the thread on the lades free skate in the NHK trophy shown on TV last night, there are exactly two posts -- yours and mine.

MM

Silly Mathman....Michelle wasn't at NHK. Of course those threads are empty when there was so much to cry/gloat/cheer/worry about on the Marshall threads.

Or.. people just decided to go to bed and talk about NHK later.

 

[kyla2]

Soogar/Kwanford

Hmmm, Sturm and Drang, talk about over the top. Look, Michelle is not in competitive form for a very good reason. She did the best she could under the circumstances. Can she pull it out for Nationals? I hope she can for her sake, but I am not counting on it. One month is NOT alot of time even though some of us seem to think so. I know she will do her best to make it to Nationals and deliver a medal worthy performance if there is any way possible. This is not Sturm and Drang, but a very tough situation for the greatest figure skater of all time who has one last chance at an Olympic gold medal. I also hated the fact that she had to stand there and listen to commentary from Peggy, Peter and Dick under these circumstances. Sure she knew the format. But knowing the format, and experiencing it live in front of all those people are two completely different things. If you didn't feel any sympathy for her at while she stood there listening to them, then I wonder what you would feel sympathy for. Even that rock, PHIL HERSH, said he felt sorry for her.

 

[cianni]

I think Michelle is smart enough to make a decision right for her. My bet is she will see in a few wks. if she can compete without causing permanent injury and if not will bow out with grace. I dont know if she would go to the Olys if given a bye but I sure hope she would. I know an extra mon. can make a big difference in her type of injury. I didnt like the judging either for any of the skaters it was demeaning and insulting to the sport. However the fans spoke loud and clear and I think the experts got a well deserved slap in the face. I think a lot of people were uncomfortable with that gushing gushing and leaving the other 3 just standing there. Give good feedback but not the over the top gushing. I did enjoy the show and expected nothing so I wasnt disappointed.

 

[Kwanford Wife]

Hmmm, Sturm and Drang, talk about over the top. Look, Michelle is not in competitive form for a very good reason. She did the best she could under the circumstances. Can she pull it out for Nationals? I hope she can for her sake, but I am not counting on it. One month is NOT alot of time even though some of us seem to think so. I know she will do her best to make it to Nationals and deliver a medal worthy performance if there is any way possible. This is not Sturm and Drang, but a very tough situation for the greatest figure skater of all time who has one last chance at an Olympic gold medal. I also hated the fact that she had to stand there and listen to commentary from Peggy, Peter and Dick under these circumstances. Sure she knew the format. But knowing the format, and experiencing it live in front of all those people are two completely different things. If you didn't feel any sympathy for her at while she stood there listening to them, then I wonder what you would feel sympathy for. Even that rock, PHIL HERSH, said he felt sorry for her.

Please. Like I posted two days ago, Michelle is a grown woman who's been competeing at the highest levels for a very long time... I'm sure she's heard worse than the comments of Sunday... (and one day, someone, anyone will tell me what telecast I missed so I can see this whole "you were good, but now you're a sucky suckerton!" part that I must have missed....)

Look, it boils down to this... Michelle is an athlete, not a fairy princess. She's the greatest of all time because she's tough as nails and a fighter... Its disrespectful to her legacy for her fans to sit around and wring their hands and cry foul everytime someone doesn't worship at her feet. Its also silly to assume that she couldn't push through & use this month to tighten up her game in time for Nationals.

As for my sympathy levels... I feel sympathy for her getting injured at this time, just like I feel tremoundous sympathy for Irina & her health issues. HOWEVER, my level of fandom goes beyond looking at pretty girls doing pretty tricks on blades. My fandom for both comes from their ability to win inspite of... Kwan is strong. So no, I don't feel sorry for her. What I feel is the "whoa" factor, awe and respect because of her fight. (THAT's what makes her great, not her coe spiral...)

Yes, she's injured. No, a month isn't a very long time, but you know what? Life is not fair.

I acknowledge her strenght and feel confident that if she shows up at Nationals & the Olympics, she feels she can win & if we all know one thing about LaKwan is that if she feels she can win, then she probably can & will. And that's what I root for... Now, if you feel that it makes you a more sympathetic & truer fan to say that if she's injured, she should quit then go right ahead...

You root for the icon & I'll root for the athete... Different strokes for different folks.

ETA: I don't give a damn what Hersch says... he changes his opinions more than I change my boots...

 

[Mathman]

Look, it boils down to this... Michelle is an athlete, not a fairy princess. She's the greatest of all time because she's tough as nails and a fighter... Its disrespectful to her legacy for her fans to sit around and wring their hands and cry foul everytime someone doesn't worship at her feet. Its also silly to assume that she couldn't push through & use this month to tighten up her game in time for Nationals.

As for my sympathy levels... I feel sympathy for her getting injured at this time, just like I feel tremoundous sympathy for Irina & her health issues. HOWEVER, my level of fandom goes beyond looking at pretty girls doing pretty tricks on blades. My fandom for both comes from their ability to win in spite of... Kwan is strong. So no, I don't feel sorry for her. What I feel is the "whoa" factor, awe and respect because of her fight. THAT's what makes her great, not her coe spiral...

Not that there's anything wrong with her coe spiral...

http://sfgate.com/c/pictures/2005/12/12/sp_marshalls_challen.jpg

WHOA!

MM

 

[kyla2]

Kwanford Wife

Look she isn't an icon to me. She a real live breathing human being who is the greatest female figure skater of all time. Period. Of course she's tough or she wouldn't be where she is and who she is, but I hate to see her (or anyone for that matter) subjected to that kind of format. It's demeaning (and I am not alone in thinking that) and it is a symptom of a sport with problems. She did not look comfortable at all while they were talking to her. Who would? She has meant too much to the sport to be subjected to that kind of a format. It's not what they said, it's how it was done. Can you imagine Michael Jordan standing in front of some judges and having them tell him how well or poorly he played the game?? I don't think so. She did agree to do it. But I would bet money she had no idea how it would look or feel to actually be a part of it.

 

[klykhorkina]

JAJAJAJA..... You'll hate me but.... is imposible to her to win anything from now on....JAJAJA

 

[havanamesa1]

Hmm... was there ever a claim that this "competition" was made to recognize the best performance of the night? Wasn't it very clear from the outset that this was a fan voting event, ergo, a popularity contest? The most popular skater won, as the event was intended to do (in addition to whatever the USFSA's hidden intentions were), so what's all this flak about MK skating poorly and not deserving to win, etc. etc.? This event was not about who the better skater was, but who the most POPULAR was. Everyone thinking that this was supposed to be a real skating contest giving the crown to the best performance of the night watched the wrong show.

 

[R.D.]

Can you imagine Michael Jordan standing in front of some judges and having them tell him how well or poorly he played the game?? I don't think so. She did agree to do it. But I would bet money she had no idea how it would look or feel to actually be a part of it.

Folks are comparing the wrong sports, IMO- a better comparison would be a panel of judges telling a gymnast how she performed.

 

[Joesitz (RIP)]

JAJAJAJA..... You'll hate me but.... is imposible to her to win anything from now on....JAJAJA

I really can't spend my valuable time on hating you or anyone like you.

What is this with your Spanish laugh?

Joe