Mathman said:
I guess that's where the New Judging System comes in. It gives you points for what you do, but it does not take away any points for what you don't do.
In Mao's last performance she did not do a triple toe (4.0 points), but she did do a triple Axel (7.5 points).
She did not do a triple Salchow (4.5 points), but she did tack on four extra double loops to her 3Lo, 3F and 3Lz in the last half on the program, for a total of 6.6 extra points.
She did not do the world's most excellent and awesome triple Lutz (6.0 base + up to 3.0 GOE), but her two so-so, sort of OK, flutzy Lutzes gave her 12.6 points, with only a -0.4 GOE).
Do the math. With PCS mostly tracking the TES, if Irina retires after this season, who is going to challenge Mao in 2007?
MM
If Mao grows five inches and gains 20 LB (think Miki Ando) or gets injured before next season (think Naomi Nari Nam), lots of skaters could not only challenge Mao, or even roll right over her. This is nothing against Mao. I like her and would love to see her realize her potential. I'm just going by the potential of history.
Joesitz said:
The bottom line is all those posters who want to adhere to the rule on the basis that practicing high level jumps is dangerous for skaters under 16. It is not dangerous for skaters over 16? duh.
Actually, practicing high level jumps before the body's growth plates have fully developed into cartilage and bone is more dangerous and that development generally does not occur before the age of 16.
In lay terms, the growth plates are areas of still-growing tissue at the ends of the long bones. If they are damaged by high end-load pounding and pressure, the GPs either take years to recover or they are permanently damaged, depending on how severe the injury is. So, yes, there is a physiologic reason for having an age requirements for participation in senior Worlds and Olys. The problem is, I think they should be the same for the ISU as they are for the IOC. That is, if you're old enough to compete at senior Worlds you should be old enough to compete at the Olympics.
Another thing is that the junior level skaters are doing jumps that are just as difficult if not more so than the senior ladies. But perhaps the reason we don't see many senior ladies doing these difficult level of jumps and jump combos is that many of the "jumping juniors" don't ever make it to seniors because of injuries, such as to the growth plates.
ITA that until every country with a young skater of enormous potential has to watch the loss of that skater to permanent injury, ie, a "Tara," the super jumping will go on. A sad irony since much of the intention of the COP was to put more emphasis on skating skills other than jumps. But when a skater can rack up the kind of points Mathman noted in his post for certain combos, so much for Skating Skills and Transitions, to name just two PCS categories.
The "rock and a hard place" problem, IMO, is: How does the ISU reward truly diffiucult jumps and jump combos without encouraging young skaters to practice them to the point of injury? Even we go on and on about the need for great edges and great basics but what most of us are really impressed by is a great jumper.
What should the ISU do? Limit the number of combo jumps? (Don't they do that already?) Limit the number of jumps and jump combos per program? Increase the points for PCS categories? I don't know. Maybe they should do nothing. Before Roger Bannister broke the 4 min. mile it was thought by the best physicians of the day that the "heart would explode" under such stress. But better training techniques, nutrition from childhood, equipment such as shoes, etc. eventually made the 4 min. mile commonplace.
Right now, I think these difficult jumps and combos are taught and trained the same way jumps and combos always have been, with the exception of the use of the jump harness. When I heard that Sasha Cohen was quoted in IFS as saying she didn't know she could do off-ice weight training I was aghast. This is the same skater who was doing Pilates four years ago. Pilates isn't weight training but it does have it's advantages. The point is, IMO, today's coaches are still using yesterday's training techniques for tomorrow's jumps and jump combos. Not good.
Rgirl
