This and That: 2015 Skate Canada Recap

[TheCzar]

A bit extreme and excessive statement. I get that you aren't Tukt's fan, but let's be real here..

Extreme? No. Real? Ok, let's be real. Liza's been around in the senior circuit how long? I'm not a fan but I have already said she's a great jumper and that deserves all the credit. However, she has been skating the same way since her debut in 2011 and aesthetically it has only gone downhill from there. Her posture never improved, her lines are awful, her flexibility is poor and her musicality is questionable. She has her own artistry, and though polarising, at least she has that going for her.

Those things are plain obvious. Skaters like Yuka, Satoko, Ashley, Evgenia have those aspects of their skating down to a pat and if you put them side by side with Tuk, the differences are glaring. But then they work on that probably because they know that someone will always be better on the technical side. Who knows. I don't get that from Liza, and I never have.

However, we do know that she's fast, she at least has charisma when the vehicle works for her, she's a terrific jumper, she has great stamina (as we saw last season) and she has focus. All the things that clearly worked in her favour, hence why she became a WC.

I think that's a fair assessment.

 

[chuckm]

Who was your best dressed?

Marissa Castelli - she always looks great

What was your moment of the week?

The Shibutanis freeskate - with Tim Dolensky's freeskate, it was the only other time the Canadian audience was completely enthusiastic about a non-Canadian competitor

Who has better skating skills, Hanyu or Chan?

They both have excellent skating skills. Chan exhibited superior speed at this competition because his technical layout was that of a junior skater. Hanyu had an extremely difficult layout including three quads and two triple axels and complex transitions between the jumps. It is far easier to demonstrate blade work when you are executing simpler jumps that don't require great height and ice coverage.

What would it take for the judges to allow the Shibutanis to win U.S. Nationals?

Food poisoning and a withdrawal for Chock/Bates after the SD, therefore a bye to Worlds.

Do Maia and Dice need to give more facial expressions?

Dice, yes, Maia, no. Facial expressions don't mean much in ice dance---it's the connection with the partner that counts.

 

[MK's Winter]

I actually was getting the robot dance moves from it, though karate chop is good too. Either way they were bizarre and didn't fit the music.

I was wondering if she should change the middle music cut. I like the beginning. I was thinking she could change someday I'll fly away to come what may. Maybe the ending could transition to the bohemian cut they all perform at the end. Just a thought. I wonder if skaters get sick to death of a program by the end of a second season with it.

 

[solani]

I was wondering if she should change the middle music cut. I like the beginning. I was thinking she could change someday I'll fly away to come what may. Maybe the ending could transition to the bohemian cut they all perform at the end. Just a thought. I wonder if skaters get sick to death of a program by the end of a second season with it.

It's probably worse for North American skaters, because they always have to do those full run-throughs.

 

[TheGrandSophy]

It's probably worse for North American skaters, because they always have to do those full run-throughs.

Don't all skaters?

 

[Sailinggirl]

I would have put the Shibs first, but it was difficult to imagine the judges would ever do that in Canada unless they were head and shoulders above the rest.

Why do you think this?

 

[solani]

Don't all skaters?

Moskvina said that the Russians don't because the intensity of the interpretation, feel and dedication gets lost if you repeat a program too often (or something similar to that, I don't remember exactly what she said). And wasn't Frank Carroll upset because Kostner wouldn't do full run-throughs?

 

[Mrs. P]

Don't all skaters?

I think it's in reference to the fact that European skaters, in general, tend to practice their programs in sections while North American skaters tend to do more full-run-throughs of their programs.

I don't think it's a hard-and-fast rule -- Kori Ade has her skaters do both, for example.

 

[ice coverage]

... Jonathan made sure we knew it was pronounced GraTz. ...

I've always pronounced it Grahtz (with an ahhhh sound) but I'm not a native speaker of German.

:agree: Agree with papagena. I have visited Graz, and the locals do pronounce it like "Grahtz" with the "ahh" sound, as well as the "tz" sound.

---

Jenny is weary of message boards from her competitive days, but I may be able to get her to post on here if we are having fun. ....

Thx for the reply. No pressure on Jenny to show up here. Compliments to both her and to you for your interviews. Loved the two-parter with Phillip Mills.

 

[TheGrandSophy]

Huh. Interesting. I don't know if it goes for all Japanese skaters, but Shoma certainly does full run throughs. He spoke about it here:

What were you training during the off-season?
I did a lot of program run-throughs. Since quads and triple axels require a lot of physical strength, I do as much as I can in practices to build that strength. I do about two clean run-throughs of my short program and free skate a day. If I miss my opening jumps, I would stop the music and do it over again. I can’t stop and get a redo in competition so the goal is not to make mistakes in competition.

x

 

[cheerknithanson]

I think it's in reference to the fact that European skaters, in general, tend to practice their programs in sections while North American skaters tend to do more full-run-throughs of their programs.

I don't think it's a hard-and-fast rule -- Kori Ade has her skaters do both, for example.

As a cheerleader, we do have to run through routines full-out (With a few run-throughs marking stuff except for a few stunts) because we have to practice like we perform it.

 

[solani]

:agree: Agree with papagena. I have visited Graz, and the locals do pronounce it like "Grahtz" with the "ahh" sound, as well as the "tz" sound.

Yes, the important thing is that the emphasis is on the "a", not on the "tz". You shouldn't hear the "h" in my opinion, but there are certainly many slightly different dialects in Styria.

 

[ice coverage]

Yes, the important thing is that the emphasis is on the "a", not on the "tz". You shouldn't hear the "h" in my opinion, but there are certainly many slightly different dialects in Styria.

Disclaimer: I am not a linguist. The point of my ersatz representation of the pronunciation was to indicate that Graz should rhyme with the English word "pots" -- as in pots and pans.
And should not rhyme with the English word "pats" -- as in pats on the back -- which is how Jenny and Dave pronounced it.

Hope I've got it close enough.

[I have no idea what you mean by emphasis on the a and not on the tz, but again, I'm not a linguist .]

 

[actualrealliveanna]

Hi Dave! Welcome (back??) to Golden Skate! I'm very excited to keep the discussion going here!

Who was your best dressed?
I really loved the Shibs' FD costumes, as well as Diva Wagner's new dress! The beading is stunning!

What was your moment of the week?
Tim Dolensky's FS, hands down! Such a great moment for him. Also loved the Shibs' FD and Kirsten and Michael's SP!

Who has better skating skills, Hanyu or Chan?
Chan!

What would it take for the judges to allow the Shibutanis to win U.S. Nationals?
I think if the Shibs win at NHK, I feel that they'd have a better shot at winning Nats. They'd do even better if Chock and Bates don't win in China, but I doubt that'll happen.

Do Maia and Dice need to give more facial expressions?
Dice, definitely, Maia, maybe. I feel like if she goes to overboard with it it won't match the mood of the FD.

 

[solani]

Disclaimer: I am not a linguist. The point of my ersatz representation of the pronunciation was to indicate that Graz should rhyme with the English word "pots" -- as in pots and pans.
And should not rhyme with the English word "pats" -- as in pats on the back -- which is how Jenny and Dave pronounced it.

Hope I've got it close enough.

[I have no idea what you mean by emphasis on the a and not on the tz, but again, I'm not a linguist .]

I'm not a linguist either. But I found something: http://de.forvo.com/word/graz/ click on the arrow next to "Aussprache von caracena (Weiblich aus Schweiz)" or "Aussprache von orientexpress (Männlich aus Österreich)". The first one is a female from Switzerland and slightly different than the male voice from Austria.

 

[mrrice]

As a cheerleader, we do have to run through routines full-out (With a few run-throughs marking stuff except for a few stunts) because we have to practice like we perform it.

Exactly! My Dance Team students were allowed to "MarK" until we did runs at the end of a rehearsal. At shows we'd warm up and do a full Run Through 20 minutes before we went on. After that, each dancer would go over what ever they felt they needed. Turns, Kicks, Tricks and time with their lift partner. Then 5 min cool down, 5min on deck, and then Perform!!

What often can dictate how we'd warm up, is the space we're given on the competition site. Gym light's vary and some are good and some are not. Bad lighting can even change the color of your costumes. My biggest concern was always the Gym Floor. Often at dance competition's they will have you warm up in the school Cafeteria. I never had my students go "All Out" in the Cafeteria as it provides no reference to the feel of a wooden gym floor.

 

[Tavi...]

Yes, the important thing is that the emphasis is on the "a", not on the "tz". You shouldn't hear the "h" in my opinion, but there are certainly many slightly different dialects in Styria.

Oh sorry, I didn't mean to imply there should be an "h" sound, just that the "a" is pronounced as it is in"father" [a:] and not as it is in "cat" [ae]. Clear as mud, right?!

ETA eg, it's the same "a" as in "aber."

 

[musicfan80]

Welcome @TSLDave! I enjoy listening to you guys' analysis because it verifies some things I think about when I watch figure skating as well as give another perspective on where we may disagree.

I was wondering if you and Jenny are going to give your opinion on the "let's compete almost nonstop this season cause it worked so well for Tuktamysheva" that seems to be happening - especially with some of Kori Ade and Tom Z's students. I'm assuming you guys will wait and see what happens at U.S. Nationals/Worlds.

 

[solani]

Regarding the skating skills question - we all seem to agree that Chan has the better skating skills.
Now I wonder wether it's possible for Hanyu to have the skating skills Chan has without gaining muscles. What do you think? And if Hanyu would decide to bulk up, would he get problems with his quads? He might lose rotational speed. :think:

 

[minze]

I am such a fan. I am so excited about you posting here. One of the things I love about you is the knowledge of the politics of the sport, especially Ice Dance. You predicted the rise of the French team before anyone