This and That: 2015 Skate Canada Recap

[flutzy13]

I stopped Aunt Joyce because I was starting a new job and felt that I had done everything I could do creatively with that medium. I enjoy creating and growing. It felt stunted.
.

Aunt Joyce was one of my bookmarks when it was around but totally understandable why you stopped it. I'm glad you've been able to infuse a little gymnastics into TSL on occasions so I feel like it lives on a little. I hope we'll see more of that as time permits, especially next skating off season as the fight for Rio is ramping up.

Re Karne's comment above- I have never seen you guys as bandwagon fans. At all. You call it like you see it as many fans do. Some weeks my favorite skaters are amazing and I love them, sometimes they make me want to set my laptop on fire. Your comments come from a place of appreciating the sport as a whole and wanting the best for it. I think the skaters see this and the unprecedented access they've given you guys is a testament to that.

The Adam Rippon interview was really great. His perspective on the Olympics post 2014 was especially interesting.

I'm surprised and intrigued that you think the. Shibs could upset at Nats. I think it will be close to try to position the Shibs for a world bronze but I don't see US judges not giving it to C/B as they're the gold medal hope for Boston. Perhaps if C/B are 3rd or lower at the final, I'll start to see this as more of a battle.

 

[AmEagle3313]

Dave (and Jenny), I want to thank you for The Skating Lesson. The lack of mainstream coverage has made it difficult for a relatively casual fan (such as myself) to connect with the skaters, programs, and competitions over the last few seasons. I don't always agree with the opinions of the two of you, but that's actually a great thing. I would typically have just watched a program and made a determination, but now I have your feedback to refer to, and I go back and watch a program again (sometimes many times on Youtube). You both provide enough information and feedback that in those instances, I can watch the program again with Jenny's comments about lack of transitions in the back of my mind, and then decide if I agree or not. Without the two of you, I'd still that 6.0 gut feeling regarding whether the performance had 'it' or not...which in the COP matters far less. The interviews are also terrific, as you both get much more out of skaters than the three-minute fluff piece on NBC and touch on areas that the media doesn't have the time for or interest in. Thanks again...it's much appreciated.

Anyway, in response to your questions:
Who was your best dressed? - Ashley, mostly because of her improvement in her fashion choices.

What was your moment of the week?

Who has better skating skills, Hanyu or Chan? Chan, hands down. Hanyu is excellent, but Chan is honestly in a class by himself. The way he flows and moves across the ice...nobody can match it. I'm not a Chan fan by any means, but I definitely respect his talent.

What would it take for the judges to allow the Shibutanis to win U.S. Nationals? - A miracle, honestly, or international judges starting to place them higher. I think if on the GPs they started consistently scoring higher, then possibly the US judges might consider them more at that level. They have improvements to make, sure, but it's much more of a lock then I feel it should be.

Do Maia and Dice need to give more facial expressions? - Maybe...a better connection to the music would help, and the facial expressions may help.

Anyway, thanks again for all your coverage and work...it's greatly appreciated.

 

[apgold]

I'm doing my MBA in Marketing.

I have an MBA in Marketing, too! I hope you can apply what you are learning to build out the TSL brand. With the new sponsor, adding e-commerce and more content, I think you are well on your way.

Thanks for the Adam interview - I enjoyed how candid he is about everything. I loved his insights on Mirai as a competitor vs. performer. She really needs to combine the two aspects when she competes.

 

[TSLDave]

Aunt Joyce was one of my bookmarks when it was around but totally understandable why you stopped it. I'm glad you've been able to infuse a little gymnastics into TSL on occasions so I feel like it lives on a little. I hope we'll see more of that as time permits, especially next skating off season as the fight for Rio is ramping up.

Re Karne's comment above- I have never seen you guys as bandwagon fans. At all. You call it like you see it as many fans do. Some weeks my favorite skaters are amazing and I love them, sometimes they make me want to set my laptop on fire. Your comments come from a place of appreciating the sport as a whole and wanting the best for it. I think the skaters see this and the unprecedented access they've given you guys is a testament to that.

The Adam Rippon interview was really great. His perspective on the Olympics post 2014 was especially interesting.

I'm surprised and intrigued that you think the. Shibs could upset at Nats. I think it will be close to try to position the Shibs for a world bronze but I don't see US judges not giving it to C/B as they're the gold medal hope for Boston. Perhaps if C/B are 3rd or lower at the final, I'll start to see this as more of a battle.

Thank you for your kind words. I think you have misunderstood my last point. I don't think the Shibs could win Nationals, but I think they could deserve to win Nationals with two good skates. It is why I made the point of asking Jenny that question. I can't always play the bad cop in every episode

 

[Dark_Ace88]

Who was best dressed?

The Shibs LP

Moment of the week

Yuzu and Liza's combacks in the LP

Hanyu vs Chan?

I think most of us agree that Chan does have the better SS but I think Yuzu beats him out on the rest of the PCS. Watching the LP again Yuzu Transitions are slightly better than Chans and as far as the rest Patrick you could replace his music with any other and it wouldn't matter so I fail to see how he scored that high for Interpretation,presentation and choreography.

What would it take for the Shibutanis to win Nationals?

I personally like the Shibs better the C/B I think they are better skaters plus I like there material this more than C/B. I never understood how and why C/B ever came ahead of them but at this point they aren't going to let their #1 team silver medal at their own Nats no matter how good the Shibs perform.

Do Maia & Dice need more facial expressions?

Maia does need at little more but without overdoing it. As for Dice he could defiantly use a bit more life in his programs.

 

[ice coverage]

... ... Unfortunately, we can't talk about everyone per episode. We have to make editorial calls for time reasons. We try to strike a balance with the optimal time lengths.

... Calling her "my daughter" or "my girl" was for entertainment value. ...

... There are a lot of things that fans of skaters don't necessarily want to hear, but we do shoot from the hip.

Sincere request:

Please clarify how you and Jenny see yourselves in your TSL offerings: Do you consider yourselves entertainers? Pundits? Journalists? And/or ...???

I ask because I do not want to have unreasonable expectations of what you have set out to do.
Seems to me that you are well-informed pundits who like to be entertaining and sometimes gossipy.
But it would be helpful to know how you perceive yourselves.

I have watched some of your videos, but by no means all of them.
My impression is that your goal is to provide commentary that is both substantive and "juicy" -- without abstaining from playing favorites. Doesn't mean that you never criticize your favorites, but your favorites also receive extra positive attention.
So I don't think you make any pretense of being hard-core journalists, although your broad scope includes in-depth interviews and some original reporting.​

My two cents regarding the topic of video lengths (not a complaint, but an observation):

I do believe that many viewers appreciate the entertainment value of your videos. That said, the bits of time spent on off-topic banter and joking and interjections do add up.
Obviously it's your prerogative to determine the duration of your videos, but I will say that I skip over some of your longest videos solely because they are so long. So as you say, it's a balancing act.
I hope I don't sound unsupportive. What I am trying to say is that less can be more. I would watch more of your videos if they were shorter.​

 

[TSLDave]

Sincere request:

Please clarify how you and Jenny see yourselves in your TSL offerings: Do you consider yourselves entertainers? Pundits? Journalists? And/or ...???

I ask because I do not want to have unreasonable expectations of what you have set out to do.
Seems to me that you are well-informed pundits who like to be entertaining and sometimes gossipy.
But it would be helpful to know how you perceive yourselves.

I have watched some of your videos, but by no means all of them.
My impression is that your goal is to provide commentary that is both substantive and "juicy" -- without abstaining from playing favorites. Doesn't mean that you never criticize your favorites, but your favorites also receive extra positive attention.
So I don't think you make any pretense of being hard-core journalists, although your broad scope includes in-depth interviews and some original reporting.​

My two cents regarding the topic of video lengths (not a complaint, but an observation):

I do believe that many viewers appreciate the entertainment value of your videos. That said, the bits of time spent on off-topic banter and joking and interjections do add up.
Obviously it's your prerogative to determine the duration of your videos, but I will say that I skip over some of your longest videos solely because they are so long. So as you say, it's a balancing act.
I hope I don't sound unsupportive. What I am trying to say is that less can be more. I would watch more of your videos if they were shorter.​

We are columnists/commentators, meaning we report and give informed opinions. It is the same category as Phil Hersh, Christine Brennan and people who commentate on TV. It is also largely the way the news industry has gone since the advent of cable news. Also, we criticize everyone. We joke about Jillian and Bob, but we said they needed more transitions in their free skate and need to work on it if they want to compete with the Russians and the Chinese. We said Alexa and Chris need more transitions in the free. We just discuss what we see, how we see it.

And many of our viewers like the joking nature. Our show isn't for everyone. We try to make skating relevant, light-hearted and still be informative. At the end of the day, it is just figure skating. We can all calm down.

 

[ice coverage]

... We can all calm down.

Thank you for your reply.

I do not need to calm down, as my previous post was perfectly calm. I bent over backward to be respectful -- at the same time that I was calling 'em as I see 'em, just as you and Jenny do.

Are we having fun yet?

 

[TSLDave]

Thank you for your reply.

I do not need to calm down, as my previous post was perfectly calm. I bent over backward to be respectful -- at the same time that I was calling 'em as I see 'em, just as you and Jenny do.

Are we having fun yet?

I wasn't implying you need to calm down. I was saying that in general, as a community, skating fans need to put it into perspective that it is just skating and not cancer research.

 

[Alex D]

I think it is always good to have more people involved when promoting the sport, therefore I wish you both a lot of luck and power to keep going, its not always an easy task, but as far I can see from your videos, you are doing pretty well and have support from the ISU and Skaters, which is the most important.

As for the questions, I do not want to write it all down again, so I will just put a link to my column here, if its not appropriate, I can just remove it, I don't want to look like a promoter here

http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...nces-SC-2015&p=1270720&viewfull=1#post1270720

As a TLDR since not everyone likes to read so much,

My favorite program in the short was by Isabelle Olsson, I felt it was a very mature skate and emotional. I am not too fussed about making the best jumps or hardest lifts, having the best SS - I see Figure Skating as a bit more than that, so she got my vote there.
As for the LP, Ksenia Monko / Kirill Khaliavin were my favorite, in general the ice dance competition was ace, each program in the Free Dance was amazing, also the return by Bobrova & Soloviev made my day, I love them since years for all the creativity that they have.

The favorite moment was definitely when Kaetlyn performed her "human" performance, at the Gala. I felt she did create a very special & emotional moment, similar to Julia a week before.

As for the event itself, I was missing the huge crowds from other competitions, but I am used to it by now, from our own in Germany. People just stay home, which is also the fault of those who report about skating, not making it attractive at all or too complicated, if its covered in TV at all. Patrick at the Press Conference was fun, what he said about the puppies

So ya, good luck and I am sure we will run into each other at one or the other event, in future.

 

[Daniskates93]

For those mentioning that Daisuke looked sad in the K&C, I think it would be worth it to note that in the press conference he did mention looking sad and then said something along the lines of "but then I thought about it an realized I was on the podium with the Olympic Gold and Silver medallists and I got over the disappointment pretty quickly" and everyone in the press conference laughed and clapped, so I wouldn't worry about him beating himself up too much!

 

[TheGrandSophy]

Are we having fun yet?

Well, I am, thanks!

Dave, love the ideas you are putting forward for future content. I really enjoyed the videos that gave a look at IJS criteria a while ago. Videos with choreographers discussing the decisions they have made for a well known programme of the past would be great!

 

[Mrs. P]

Thank you Dave for taking the time to chat on the forum. It sounds like you're juggling a busy schedule, so you (and Jenny's) willingness to put in the time to create fresh new content is appreciated.

It's good to get some insight in what make you and Jenny tick as well.

 

[gsk8]

I wasn't implying you need to calm down. I was saying that in general, as a community, skating fans need to put it into perspective that it is just skating and not cancer research.

Indeed you were not I for one appreciate your candidness and honesty in this thread.

just a friendly reminder to folks that the intent of this thread is to give feedback on the video itself pertaining to Skate Canada as well as listing you favs regarding the questions Dave posted in his first post

While "this and "that" may not be everyone's cup of tea, this thread is for those who enjoy it and would like to participate in the discussion regarding respective videos

On another note, great interview on Adam Rippon that was uploaded today!

 

[ice coverage]

I wasn't implying you need to calm down. I was saying that in general, as a community, skating fans need to put it into perspective that it is just skating and not cancer research.

OK, gotcha.

I hope that your previous post will be helpful not only to me, but also to others as well.
In past GS threads, mini-debates have popped up from time to time as to where you belong -- and where you want to belong -- on the spectrum of journalism|commentary|entertainment/gossip.
And now we have your answer straight from the horse's mouth. Thanks again.

---

p.s. Although the focus of the thread is your Skate Canada recap, I was taking you up on this offer:

... If you do have any legitimsate TSL, Dave Lease and/or Jenny Kirk questions, we can do a bit of a Q+A here as well.

 

[el henry]

A procedural question, as this partnership goes forward:

will Dave or the mods start a new thread with each new TSL entry? Or will we keep posting in Skate Canada?

And substantively (somewhat related to the first query)

Loving, loving, loving:luv17: the interviews. It has made me appreciate TSL. And I'm loving Adam more now. Adam is self-aware, sassy and outspoken. (I was going to medal at Finlandia absent a blackout. I wanted lyrics so I would have skated to books on tape. The Chinese boy with all the jumps, Oh honey...) I understand better why he keeps harping on that quad lutz, even though I think it detracts from enjoyable programs.

A minor aside too, but as someone who has actually been to Clarks Summit, and who lives 60 miles south, Adam has lost *all* trace of a Wyoming Valley accent. Guess he couldn't get out of NE Pennsylvania fast enough

However, Alexa is the still best interview; TSL was right to lead off with her.

 

[gsk8]

A procedural question, as this partnership goes forward:

will Dave or the mods start a new thread with each new TSL entry? Or will we keep posting in Skate Canada?

Thats the plan, but if some catches it first, feel free to start it (I.e. Adam Rippon)

 

[thedybbuk]

just a friendly reminder to folks that the intent of this thread is to give feedback on the video itself pertaining to Skate Canada as well as listing you favs regarding the questions Dave posted in his first post

While "this and "that" may not be everyone's cup of tea, this thread is for those who enjoy it and would like to participate in the discussion regarding respective videos

Am I the only one who is kind of bothered by this? There was obviously some kind of behind the scenes cross promotion/business deal going on between GS and TSL. And now we're getting what amount to sponsored posts. We're also getting these, which are "friendly," but also vaguely threatening in that they seem to say that these sponsored posts are meant to be completely/almost completely positive. "This thread is for those who enjoy [This and That]" sounds a lot like dissenting opinion is not tolerated, or only tolerated to a very small degree. It's concerning to me because it's starting to feel like what people can and cannot say about TSL is changing.

The more cynical part of me feels like this is a PR move in the face of some criticism that has been going on about TSL in the past week or two, so it's "changing the narrative" so to speak. Go to a very popular skating forum and do big puff threads about how great TSL is, with hints that disagreement is not tolerated, or only nominally tolerated.

 

[solani]

Am I the only one who is kind of bothered by this? There was obviously some kind of behind the scenes cross promotion/business deal going on between GS and TSL. And now we're getting what amount to sponsored posts. We're also getting these, which are "friendly," but also vaguely threatening in that they seem to say that these sponsored posts are meant to be completely/almost completely positive. "This thread is for those who enjoy [This and That]" sounds a lot like dissenting opinion is not tolerated, or only tolerated to a very small degree. It's concerning to me because it's starting to feel like what people can and cannot say about TSL is changing.

The more cynical part of me feels like this is a PR move in the face of some criticism that has been going on about TSL in the past week or two, so it's "changing the narrative" so to speak. Go to a very popular skating forum and do big puff threads about how great TSL is, with hints that disagreement is not tolerated, or only nominally tolerated.

I'm not bothered by that and I'll try to explain why, because I get what you mean. I think that everyone who watches "This and That" disagrees with the opinions presented there often. I do. But this doesn't mean that I don't enjoy it. But if someone doesn't like the concept of the show it's likely that the criticism won't be constructive. It's nice to have Dave here and this thread imho, in the end we all want FS to be more popular than it is right now. So cross promotion/business deals etc. are necessary means to an end.

 

[Tavi...]

Umm. Did you happen to notice the big old announcement that TSL and GS are cross-promoting? There was nothing underhanded about it. Did you also happen to notice that many people are delighted to be able to engage directly with Dave? And are you aware that Gsk8 is the forum owner? So maybe it's okay that she reminds posters to stay on topic?