Yuzuru Hanyu: 2021-22 | Page 8 | Golden Skate

Yuzuru Hanyu: 2021-22

Is there any video of him landing other jumps in practice? I want to see how well his right ankle is working without the 4A attempts.
 
pianistliz said:
I thought his last jump was q and 2ft but def not downgraded.
Click to expand...
sorry, it was literally forwards.
People on twitter going crazy saying its 'q' and its spreading like wildfire, but at the point of landing his feet are forwards.
watch in slow motion.
That being said I heard he was going for stability over rotation. Possibility he can improve on rotation with adrenaline and not putting free foot down.

To clarify, here are photos taking at point of landing for the jumps: https://imgur.com/a/f6W4INi
 
kolyadafan2002 said:
sorry, it was literally forwards.
People on twitter going crazy saying its 'q' and its spreading like wildfire, but at the point of landing his feet are forwards.
watch in slow motion.
That being said I heard he was going for stability over rotation. Possibility he can improve on rotation with adrenaline and not putting free foot down.

To clarify, here are photos taking at point of landing for the jumps: https://imgur.com/a/f6W4INi
Click to expand...
I thought you were speaking of the two first jumps in your previous message.
The first was downgradable, the second much underrotated but maybe not to the point of DG, the third was q or < depending on the tech panel (clearly over 90° but we see sooo many < jumps called as q from some skaters...)
I have seen this last one under several angles and I got sure that it was very far from 180°. It looks 2ft to me but I read that his free leg didn't really touch the ice.
He said in his interview that his objective was only to get the right axis depending on the ice quality, not to fully rotate, that he wouldn't have tried to fully rotate at the end of a practice and that he was satisfied depending on his objective.
He's likely to show a real one during his RT at FS practice after the SP.
 
The earlier attempts were def downgraded but the last one looks on the quarter to me (and everyone who was in attendance at that practice). I think in comp it should get < (and -2 GOE for 2ft and flow out) but not <<. But yeah, he said he wasn't really going for the full rotation at that practice anyway. Regardless, huge improvement from the attempts in April! Hopefully he takes another step forward in the free skate!
 
DizzyFrenchie said:
I thought you were speaking of the two first jumps in your previous message.
The first was downgradable, the second much underrotated but maybe not to the point of DG, the third was q or < depending on the tech panel (clearly over 90° but we see sooo many < jumps called as q from some skaters...)
I have seen this last one under several angles and I got sure that it was very far from 180°. It looks 2ft to me but I read that his free leg didn't really touch the ice.
He said in his interview that his objective was only to get the right axis depending on the ice quality, not to fully rotate, that he wouldn't have tried to fully rotate at the end of a practice and that he was satisfied depending on his objective.
He's likely to show a real one during his RT at FS practice after the SP.
Click to expand...
I've taken the point of landing from each one, they were all forwards.
The reason the last one looked q is he landed forwards on the toe, put his other blade down, then went back up on toe, whipped to q, then went out on an edge.
The second one, also forwards, whips to underrotated in similar way.

This isn't hanyu cheating or anything, it's simply because the rotation is so fast that it'll have the tendency to whip quickly to backwards no matter where he lands. He's not trying to hide it or anything, he's simply going for stability rather than rotating.

Slow mo each jump, and stop it at the point the toe touches the ice. Each one is forwards landing.

It's still impressive, but I won't lie and say its "q" or anything.

Edit - this is the last jump that was posted in the video showcasing all the 4A on twitter: https://imgur.com/a/qwGDdWR
As you can see, the right foot came down forwards, and the left foot (free foot) came down round about q - this could be another reason for his confusion.
The reason this happens is he is turning his hip out and trying to take the leg out for landing to stick a safe landing. If he doesn't do this, he might go to < instead of <<
 
vimeo.com

Japan Nationals 2021 Yuzuru Hanyu SP (SUBBED)

Yuzuru Hanyu's Short Program "序奏とロンド カプリチオーソ" for Japan Nationals on 24th December 2021 The song is (apparently) an original composition mix by a Japanese pianist made for Yuzuru's program. Yuzuru said he wanted the song to feel like "you can't skate to it unless you're Yuzuru Hanyu". I've...
vimeo.com



New links.
 
Last edited:
kolyadafan2002 said:
I've taken the point of landing from each one, they were all forwards.
The reason the last one looked q is he landed forwards on the toe, put his other blade down, then went back up on toe, whipped to q, then went out on an edge.
The second one, also forwards, whips to underrotated in similar way.

This isn't hanyu cheating or anything, it's simply because the rotation is so fast that it'll have the tendency to whip quickly to backwards no matter where he lands. He's not trying to hide it or anything, he's simply going for stability rather than rotating.

Slow mo each jump, and stop it at the point the toe touches the ice. Each one is forwards landing.

It's still impressive, but I won't lie and say its "q" or anything.

Edit - this is the last jump that was posted in the video showcasing all the 4A on twitter: https://imgur.com/a/qwGDdWR
As you can see, the right foot came down forwards, and the left foot (free foot) came down round about q - this could be another reason for his confusion.
The reason this happens is he is turning his hip out and trying to take the leg out for landing to stick a safe landing. If he doesn't do this, he might go to < instead of <<
Click to expand...
Let's be clear, I'm not pretending it was a real q. To me it was clearly not. I just say some skaters would have had a q call instead of < and the q is not defined precisely. I really think it was moderately < but I admit I couldn't slow down and enlarge the feet as much as I'd like, I'm rather an IT dummy, and the unusual two feet respective positions is indeed confusing.
Also, the forwards (backwards for an Axel) notion is for prerotation, not underrotation. For underrotation it's more precise, it's 180°.

Not in this angle debate but still on this 4A, someone compared motion captures of his WTT'21 best attempt and of yesterday practice:



FHUvnG0VQAwQmTT
 
DizzyFrenchie said:
Let's be clear, I'm not pretending it was a real q. To me it was clearly not. I just say some skaters would have had a q call instead of < and the q is not defined precisely. I really think it was moderately < but I admit I couldn't slow down and enlarge the feet as much as I'd like, I'm rather an IT dummy, and the unusual two feet respective positions is indeed confusing.
Also, the forwards (backwards for an Axel) notion is for prerotation, not underrotation. For underrotation it's more precise, it's 180°.

Not in this angle debate but still on this 4A, someone compared motion captures of his WTT'21 best attempt and of yesterday practice:
Click to expand...

When I trained triple jumps, whenever I downgraded one my coach always called it "forwards" when I downgraded them. Fans nowadays may use whatever terminology, but that's what we used when training, and I've heard other coaches use the same.
Even though its not about degree of UR, in the picture you posted 4 hanyu frames from the end you can see his foot touchdown forwards (180° if that's preferred terminology).

now, my analysis of the two:
Hanyu seems to be taking more speed from his 4A entrance, and that's converted to length within the jump. This arc probably makes the jump more comfortable for him.
In his sp today, the height of his triple axel was insane (to the point where the 3A must have felt uncomfortable). If anything, it seemed higher than his 4A attempts (probably as he was taking time to get into rotation).

For all we know, the timing might "click" and he could be much closer on the 4A tomorrow (if you combine the 3A from today with the rotation from 4A practice).
Either way, I'm no longer worried about Hanyu breaking his ankle on this jump, as the landing looks safe even if rotation isn't quite there.
 
kolyadafan2002 said:
When I trained triple jumps, whenever I downgraded one my coach always called it "forwards" when I downgraded them. Fans nowadays may use whatever terminology, but that's what we used when training, and I've heard other coaches use the same.
Even though its not about degree of UR, in the picture you posted 4 hanyu frames from the end you can see his foot touchdown forwards (180° if that's preferred terminology).

now, my analysis of the two:
Hanyu seems to be taking more speed from his 4A entrance, and that's converted to length within the jump. This arc probably makes the jump more comfortable for him.
In his sp today, the height of his triple axel was insane (to the point where the 3A must have felt uncomfortable). If anything, it seemed higher than his 4A attempts (probably as he was taking time to get into rotation).

For all we know, the timing might "click" and he could be much closer on the 4A tomorrow (if you combine the 3A from today with the rotation from 4A practice).
Either way, I'm no longer worried about Hanyu breaking his ankle on this jump, as the landing looks safe even if rotation isn't quite there.
Click to expand...
In fact I'm not an old FS fan and don't know old rules and terms, and even if this was recent it doesn't seem surprising that your coach spoke of forward, anyway in a skating lesson that's what it amounts to. In addition to that, given TP interpretation of q (which mathematically should be hardly less frequent than sextuple jumps if one follow ISU definition) an easy extrapolation gives a freer interpretation of the rule (p.19).

Thank you for your speed explanation. I could see his axis has become vertical and his entry changed completely.
He already had 70cm 3As in past seasons but someone noted that his LMEY 3A was "only" 63cm. I think he's adjusting his 3A taking into account his 4A to find a new balance in it. It's probably more difficult than with quads. It's true that it now looks akin to his delayed Axel. I don't know if it's his new 3A or if it will evolve in time. It's well known that after giving birth mothers need some time to recover their figure and often the new figure is different.
 
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