2016-2017 State of U.S. Men Figure Skating

[chuckm]

Not just 4Lz, 4 Lz in combination with 3T!

And in the SP, Nathan got +GOE on the 4z+3t!

In the FS, he went for 5 quads. He landed only 3 of those (4z+3t, 4f, 4t+2t+2lo) but the 4t combo got +GOE. He fell on 4t and 4s, but both were rotated, so he still gained 11.85 points on those jumps, after the two -1 deductions were taken out.

 

[AsadaFanBoy]

So true. And Adam of all people has GORGEOUS spins...he just misses the levels.

I know Ashley in particular has talked about skipping her spins in run-throughs (which considering her age, makes some sense because some of those positions must hurt). I don't know how spin levels even work, and Nathan doesn't have awful positions. Anyway, this needs to be fixed by the GP. Boyang and Shoma (who I consider to be Nathan's peers and main competitors) don't lose points there.

Spin levels are not that bad if you put some time into it. Here's what I recommend:

Download the protocols from an event and watch one of the skaters (who you enjoy) and compare the spin(s) to the protocols.
http: // static.isu.org/media/1003/2000-sptc-sov-and-goe-2016-2017_revised-july-14[dot]pdf (since I'm not sure if we're allowed to post hyperlinks, I've used dot rather than . )

You can play and pause at your leisure. If you write down each spin and assign the features listed in Comm 2000, it becomes much easier to discern between a level 3 and level 4 spin. The thing that can be difficult to take into account is that difficult variations are only used to award levels once per program, but many skaters use difficult variations in more than one spin in a program (even though it is counted only the first time) because if it is performed well, it gains +GOE. This is also why scores can take sometime to come out even if a skater hasn't underrotated many (or any) jumps -- the levels on each spin have to be assigned correctly. The difficult variations are listed on page 9 and the features are listed on page 8 in the table.

And also, if you don't care to get a better grasp on spin levels, there's nothing wrong with simply watching skating for your own enjoyment. This is only a suggestion in case you'd like to get a better feel for how spin levels work.

 

[ice coverage]

Has this been posted before? US Figure Skating has a new promotion for Learning to Skate, essentially, called "We Get Up"

http://www.wegetup.com/

and an interview with Jason is featured, on how skating has influenced his outlook:

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/jason-brown-2/

although I tend to think his outlook would be optimistic regardless of skating; it may be the other way around.

Taking the liberty of copying el henry's post from Jason's thread. Thx for flagging the new site from USFS.

Some of the other short (and very enjoyable) videos on the same site are below.
Sorry if I missed other ones featuring U.S. men. (Most of these links seem to be buried on the site??)

- What do you want people to get out of your skating? (Jason)

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/jason-brown/​

- What do you want non-skaters to know about figure skating? (Max)

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/maxwell-aaron-2/​

- Do you ever use your skating moves on the dance floor? (Max)

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/maxwell-aaron/​

- What are some of your fondest memories of learning to skate? (Adam)

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/adam-rippon/ (With big respect to Adam's mother , I thought this one was delightful.)​

- What's your get up moment? (Adam)

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/adam-rippon-2/​

U.S. men's intermediate and juvenile champion TJ Nyman is the skater/actor who is cast in the fictional storyline video on the home page of the site.
An excerpt from the behind-the-scenes Q and A with him:

Is there a skater you admire?
TJ: Yeah, my friend Max Aaron, who is a national champion and a world competitor. He’s really good. I look up to him. He’s one of my buddies. He’s manly. He’s tough. He boxes. He works out a lot. People don’t see that side of it. They just look at the skating and go, ‘oh, he’s skating in a tight uniform.’ Figure skating is known as a girl’s sport because mostly girls do it. But they don’t understand that the sport is also very mentally tough and physically tough too, for both male and female athletes.
http://www.wegetup.com/behind-the-scenes/​

(TJ sometimes visits Colorado Springs to train with Tom Z.)

 

[karne]

- Do you ever use your skating moves on the dance floor? (Max)

http://www.wegetup.com/skaters/maxwell-aaron/​

He's fifty kinds of adorable.

I also note he's "Maxwell" again

 

[el henry]

Thx for finding all of these, @ice coverage.

Jason, Max, and Adam all bust (as well as Max busting out the moves ) the cuteness meter on these.

Adam is generally so sweet and soft-spoken in taped interviews, yet often doesn't across well (IMO, as an Adam fan) in other interview settings. This I like!

 

[Sydney Rose]

So apparently Nathan really has split from Rafael (per IFS Magazine).

Does that make Adam Rafael's top male skater now?

 

[ice coverage]

So apparently Nathan really has split from Rafael (per IFS Magazine).

Does that make Adam Rafael's top male skater now?

FWIW, Nathan's ISU bio -- which was updated yesterday -- still says that his coaches are Raf and MZ.
And that Nathan trains in California and Canton.

http://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00054124.htm​

In any case, I am a fan of Nathan (as well as of Adam), and I don't agree with the implication that Nathan ever has had clear-cut status as Raf's top men's skater.

 

[el henry]

So apparently Nathan really has split from Rafael (per IFS Magazine).

Does that make Adam Rafael's top male skater now?

Wasn't Adam was always Rafael's top male skater, since he was US champ and Nathan was not?

But I know what you mean, and I don't know who Rafael's other US male skaters are. At first I thought this was a great move, since Rafael said over a year ago in a TSL interview that he didn't feel it was his place to monitor whether Nathan was overtraining or had an injury, that Nathan (then 16) needed to tell him such things, that he was not Nathan's father. Based on that attitude, I wouldn't let Rafael walk my dog. Rafael then walked back that attitude in interviews *after* Nathan's injury, which I found a day late and a dollar short, to say the least. :sarcasm:

Now I am hearing, with absolutely no support, that it is Nathan's parents who were pushing the quads? Interesting. I want Nathan to be coached by whoever will address his needed areas of improvement, and keep him healthy. I hope Marina is that person.

 

[mrrice]

Wasn't Adam was always Rafael's top male skater, since he was US champ and Nathan was not?

But I know what you mean, and I don't know who Rafael's other US male skaters are. At first I thought this was a great move, since Rafael said over a year ago in a TSL interview that he didn't feel it was his place to monitor whether Nathan was overtraining or had an injury, that Nathan (then 16) needed to tell him such things, that he was not Nathan's father. Based on that attitude, I wouldn't let Rafael walk my dog. Rafael then walked back that attitude in interviews *after* Nathan's injury, which I found a day late and a dollar short, to say the least. :sarcasm:

Now I am hearing, with absolutely no support, that it is Nathan's parents who were pushing the quads? Interesting. I want Nathan to be coached by whoever will address his needed areas of improvement, and keep him healthy. I hope Marina is that person.

As a former student and coach I can tell you without the slightest doubt that coaches can not, and will not, push a skater beyond where the Parents will allow them to go. My skating career was ended by my Father but, it had NOTHING to do with my coach. There is a BIG possibility that Nathan's parents believe he needs a coach that doesn't have another skater who is in direct competition with their child. This happens all the time and it's completely understandable. We saw what happened with Scott, Tessa, Charlie, and Meryl. There was always a bit of tension around the rink when they were together and maybe Nathan isn't comfortable in that kind of environment. Watch an episode of "Dance Moms" and you can see the drama that comes with having 2 high level soloists in the same studio.

 

[Meoima]

As a former student and coach I can tell you without the slightest doubt that coaches can not, and will not, push a skater beyond where the Parents will allow them to go. My skating career was ended by my Father but, it had NOTHING to do with my coach. There is a BIG possibility that Nathan's parents believe he needs a coach that doesn't have another skater who is in direct competition with their child. This happens all the time and it's completely understandable. We saw what happened with Scott, Tessa, Charlie, and Meryl. There was always a bit of tension around the rink when they were together and maybe Nathan isn't comfortable in that kind of environment. Watch an episode of "Dance Moms" and you can see the drama that comes with having 2 high level soloists in the same studio.

But ISu still lists Rafael and Zueva as Nathan's coach at the moment.

 

[el henry]

As a former student and coach I can tell you without the slightest doubt that coaches can not, and will not, push a skater beyond where the Parents will allow them to go. My skating career was ended by my Father but, it had NOTHING to do with my coach. There is a BIG possibility that Nathan's parents believe he needs a coach that doesn't have another skater who is in direct competition with their child. This happens all the time and it's completely understandable. We saw what happened with Scott, Tessa, Charlie, and Meryl. There was always a bit of tension around the rink when they were together and maybe Nathan isn't comfortable in that kind of environment. Watch an episode of "Dance Moms" and you can see the drama that comes with having 2 high level soloists in the same studio.

I have no doubt about the not-so-great effect of stage parents, be they dancing or skating, and that could very well be the impetus. I wouldn't know because until yesterday, I had never heard that Nathan had such involved parents. But I did hear Rafael, quite convincingly, make me believe that it was his own idea to gave a hands off approach to Nathan. If it wasn't his idea, he needs a new PR agent.

And @Meoima, although the move may not be "official", TSL called Mariah's and Romain's move *to* Rafael before it was changed on ISU. Dave does seem to have his sources.

 

[Meoima]

And @Meoima, although the move may not be "official", TSL called Mariah's and Romain's move *to* Rafael before it was changed on ISU. Dave does seem to have his sources.

Oh really? Did TSL say anything about Nathan leaving Rafael?

 

[StitchMonkey]

I had never heard that Nathan had such involved parents. But I did hear Rafael, quite convincingly, make me believe that it was his own idea to gave a hands off approach to Nathan. If it wasn't his idea, he needs a new PR agent.

It also could be the Raf has a default hands off approach and that could be appealing to very hands on parents.

 

[el henry]

Oh really? Did TSL say anything about Nathan leaving Rafael?

I'm sorry, I think they just retweeted the IFS tweet. My mistake.

 

[mrrice]

It also could be the Raf has a default hands off approach and that could be appealing to very hands on parents.

Exactly! This goes both ways. There are students who are blessed with natural talent and their parents often have no idea what to do with it. My mother sang in church choir and my Father was in the Military. They had no idea that I would end up dancing as well as I did and were shocked when they dropped me and my sister off at an Audition and I ended up getting a part in my first play. I was an orphan in Peter Pan. After that, I auditioned for everything and after singing the National Anthem on TV my Father finally realized I had talent and hired an agent for me. The difference between my Father and what "Appears" to be Nathan's situation, is that my Father trusted my agent and didn't interfere. My skating career ended as DIRECT result of my agent telling my father that if I got injured, I'd miss several upcoming, very important auditions.

 

[andromache]

I'm fervently hoping that Nathan is staying, to some extent, with Raf. Raf helped Nathan get the jumps, and Raf can help Nathan keep the jumps. But Nathan needs Marina for everything else: spins, steps, musicality, skating skills, etc. Raf's other successful skaters - specifically Ashley and Adam - came to Raf with excellent performance experience and strong interest in the artistic side of the sport, which they have continued to pursue with choreographers of their choice. But Nathan needs guidance in that regard, and Marina could be just the guidance he needs.

That said, I also think Raf is an important part of Nathan's technical skills and his consistency and I don't want him excluded from the picture.

Who will be Marina's first elite lady skater? Like Dave Lease, I'm kind of rooting for Marina to become the Marta Karolyi that US skating needs. She's tough enough to do it.

ETA: Actually, while we're at it, let's send Adam and Ashley to Marina for help with their skating skills.

 

[ice coverage]

So apparently Nathan really has split from Rafael (per IFS Magazine). ....

Another FWIW:
At the time of High Performance Camp, IFS Magazine tweeted "news" about Virtue/Moir and Finlandia that turned out not to be true.

So I'm reserving judgment about the IFS tweet re Nathan. Might be true, but I don't feel sure yet.

My wishful thinking is that it is not true.
MZ is no saint, IMO.
Based mostly on how she treated Igor, I would feel quite apprehensive about entrusting my kid (esp. if just a teen) solely to MZ.

---

... I don't know who Rafael's other US male skaters are. ...

Up-and-comer Eric Sjoberg is one of Raf's skaters.
Eric is the 2016 U.S. men's novice champion. Competed in his first JGP this season.

I don't know about others.

---

... Jason, Max, and Adam all bust (as well as Max busting out the moves ) the cuteness meter on these.

Adam is generally so sweet and soft-spoken in taped interviews, yet often doesn't across well (IMO, as an Adam fan) in other interview settings. This I like!

Very cool that the U.S. men all are such good ambassadors for skating. Different personalities, each appealing in his own way.

I love all of them, but Adam's recollection of his boyhood eagerness to get to the rink very early each morning is esp. endearing. Microwaving bacon for his mother :luv17:. His mother being given a key to the rink ... and then even learning to drive the Zamboni for the sake of her child . Amazing and wonderful.

BTW, I forgot to include this "making of" shot of Adam's video shoot. I had noticed it at the time of Champs Camp and wondered what the shoot was for. Now we know .

https://www.instagram.com/p/BJbPBkqjT2Y/?taken-by=teaandwaterltd (Aug 22)
​

---

Once again, good luck to Adam, Jason, and Tim at Skate America :yay:.

 

[Shani]

Rules are a coach has to be registered as a coach to put a skater on the ice. Zoueva could not coach him at the event without being listed as one of his coaches. This is not that unusual.

 

[topaz emerald]

As a former student and coach I can tell you without the slightest doubt that coaches can not, and will not, push a skater beyond where the Parents will allow them to go. My skating career was ended by my Father but, it had NOTHING to do with my coach. There is a BIG possibility that Nathan's parents believe he needs a coach that doesn't have another skater who is in direct competition with their child. This happens all the time and it's completely understandable. We saw what happened with Scott, Tessa, Charlie, and Meryl. There was always a bit of tension around the rink when they were together and maybe Nathan isn't comfortable in that kind of environment. Watch an episode of "Dance Moms" and you can see the drama that comes with having 2 high level soloists in the same studio.

maybe you are right....remember plusenko and yagudin? At first they had the same coach, then yagudun left mishin to work with tarasova.

 

[mrrice]

maybe you are right....remember plusenko and yagudin? At first they had the same coach, then yagudun left mishin to work with tarasova.

Excellent comment and completely true!!