Repeating Programs - Pros and Cons | Page 7 | Golden Skate

Repeating Programs - Pros and Cons

The movie has a long list of songs for new music cuts.

still it will be a similar "theme"... no matter what the music cuts are...
if people are complaining that javi or anna and luca always have similar themes despite new programs and completely new music, i think it isn't unfair to call out yuzuru's choices here... especially after he's recuperated his chopin for a third year.

Personally, as a fan of the sport, I do think skaters should go with whatever makes them comfortable, as music, like the costumes are not what will make happen a quad or a triple axel... however, as a person who likes to be entertained and surprised, I am not really excited... but as I said... nobody cares if I am excited or not, as long as the athlete is happy and comfortable with their choice.
 
still it will be a similar "theme"... no matter what the music cuts are...
if people are complaining that javi or anna and luca always have similar themes despite new programs and completely new music, i think it isn't unfair to call out yuzuru's choices here... especially after he's recuperated his chopin for a third year.

Personally, as a fan of the sport, I do think skaters should go with whatever makes them comfortable, as music, like the costumes are not what will make happen a quad or a triple axel... however, as a person who likes to be entertained and surprised, I am not really excited... but as I said... nobody cares if I am excited or not, as long as the athlete is happy and comfortable with their choice.
You are correct. Nobody will care if some people are excited or not. Because this is the skater's dreams and pressure they will have to take, not some armchair audience on the internet.
 
TWO repeats for the two time world champion, record breaker, reigning Olympic gold medalist, arguably the athlete who has pushed the sport forward most in the past four years...as a huge fan I am BEYOND disappointed. I don't care how much "reworking" is done, this is ridiculous and I expected so much more.
 
2017-2018 Programs by Discipline

Well if having two repeats programs for the Oly season mean that he will be comfortable and that on a strategic point it's the best thing to do then I'm ok with it , and I don't care if he's the current oly champ , records breaker and anything that you want , because sorry but it's his dream and not our that is on the table here .
 
TWO repeats for the two time world champion, record breaker, reigning Olympic gold medalist, arguably the athlete who has pushed the sport forward most in the past four years...as a huge fan I am BEYOND disappointed. I don't care how much "reworking" is done, this is ridiculous and I expected so much more.

i think people often forget that yuzuru is sort of a warhorse junkie, with POTO, and two different versions of Romeo and Juliet; so I don't think we should correlate his influence on the sport of skating to the music he's chosen.
 
Well if having two repeats programs for the Oly season mean that he will be comfortable and that on a strategic point it's the best thing to do then I'm ok with it , and I don't care if he's the current oly champ , records breaker and anything that you want , because sorry but it's his dream and not our that is on the table here .

Totally agree. I think it's so ridiculous that many people go against him just because he reuses his old programs...
 
Totally agree. I think it's so ridiculous that many people go against him just because he reuses his old programs...

And well... he's going for Chopin and Seimei there are worse things in the world [emoji39]I already love that Chopin 3.0 and for Seimei I'm so glad that non skating fans will watch him skating THAT program at the Olympics , as patriotic as he is , it's just perfect .
 
In this thread....

When a skater I do not like reuses similar programs/themes/choreography: They have no artistic range and are taking the easy way out.

When my favorite skater reuses similar programs/themes/choreography: I'm so happy this skater is going with something they're comfortable with to give them their best shot at winning.

As for discussions whether or not a reused program will be very different than its original incarnation - if it was going to be THAT different, then it wouldn't require music from the same source.
 
As for discussions whether or not a reused program will be very different than its original incarnation - if it was going to be THAT different, then it wouldn't require music from the same source.

I don't see anyone saying very different, just to an extent. In fact, looking at the new layout, it is probably the second half that is going to be affected, considering the new quads. Overall, this is a sport, and I feel like whatever makes them comfortable, especially at the point of most pressure, which the Olympics are, is what they should do.

Personally, while I am very excited about a 'new' Seimei, I am also curious from the point of choreography and quad numbers. It's switching from 3 to 5 now, so how will the 'new' version compare to the old, and how much is potentially 'lost' due to the quad number. Also this type of music is better IMO for this conversion than say last season's Hope&Legacy, so it may also be a good indicator in general what works better for a higher quad number as the music can 'cover' partially the set-ups so help in overall impression. I really want to see what Shae has done with it, this month plus will go slowly.
 
I agree 100%. I'd rather he do Seimei and a new SP, but he's had so much success with both you can't really blame him.

I can. I can blame him for, in fact, not being a gutsy, original, artistic leader of the sport. Seimei is a great program. I would reuse it if I were him. It is the best thing he has ever done, IMO, which is sadly a quite limited repertoire for someone who has been in the sport this long. But combining it with Chopin for the third season. Nope. No forgiveness there.
 
I can. I can blame him for, in fact, not being a gutsy, original, artistic leader of the sport. Seimei is a great program. I would reuse it if I were him. It is the best thing he has ever done, IMO, which is sadly a quite limited repertoire for someone who has been in the sport this long. But combining it with Chopin for the third season. Nope. No forgiveness there.

https://media.giphy.com/media/G4ZNYMQVMH6us/giphy.gif
 
You are correct. Nobody will care if some people are excited or not. Because this is the skater's dreams and pressure they will have to take, not some armchair audience on the internet.

here is some food for thought.... what if reusing old programs was bringing some pressure? Yuzu will have to do the Chopin and Seimei at least as well as in 2015GPF.... anything less than that, and it will not be as successful.. there is always that danger too...

People said that about Patrick when he was perfect in TEB 2013 and wasn't later on in the season.... perhaps his Olympic performance was not as great as he had in mind the dream and possibility of repeating TEB 2013...

Time will tell how he will react but my post was more nuanced : I said, fine he feels more comfortable repeating that's what matters for every athlete...
but that doesn't mean that it will remain like this... I have said a similar thing about Patrick.... fine if letting his team choose the music lessens his emotional hold on his olympics... but sooner or later... olympics are olympics and new programs or not... chosen by the team or not... everyone will have to face the music.
 
I can. I can blame him for, in fact, not being a gutsy, original, artistic leader of the sport. Seimei is a great program. I would reuse it if I were him. It is the best thing he has ever done, IMO, which is sadly a quite limited repertoire for someone who has been in the sport this long. But combining it with Chopin for the third season. Nope. No forgiveness there.

What is a non-limited repertoire then?

As disappointed as I am with Chopin3 as well, I don't think it takes away from the gutsy, original choices Yuzu has shown so far. It's a bit funny when Seimei ist now considered such a safe choice, given that it was a big risk when he first went for it.
 
In this thread....

When a skater I do not like reuses similar programs/themes/choreography: They have no artistic range and are taking the easy way out.

When my favorite skater reuses similar programs/themes/choreography: I'm so happy this skater is going with something they're comfortable with to give them their best shot at winning.

As for discussions whether or not a reused program will be very different than its original incarnation - if it was going to be THAT different, then it wouldn't require music from the same source.

I must be different because I AM disappointed in my favourites when they repeat. I try to live with it, it's not like I can change it. I like Seimei so I'm not that disappointed, I'm more meh about him repeating Chopin for the third time as well. Seems like a repeat of a certain season, and I don't know if that's such a good idea for him.

Also, I don't know about repeating a program gives you the best shot at winning. The plus side is, you don't have to work on a program as much during the season, the interpretation is all there you're basically ahead of the competition who has new things to learn. But like 4everchan wrote, that can backfire, sure he adds new difficulties and what if the results are not as expected...what then? Two highly succesful programs, that can also end in disaster if you don't live up to them. Also the growth of a program, the process of it changing, becoming better during the season might not be as obvious as with someone who did something new. In the end I think it doesn't matter much. He could skate to silence and would win if he's clean. He could skate something completely new and would win if he's clean. It just depends on this, the program itself is just for the spectator in the end. Even the judges do not care.
 
TWO repeats for the two time world champion, record breaker, reigning Olympic gold medalist, arguably the athlete who has pushed the sport forward most in the past four years...as a huge fan I am BEYOND disappointed. I don't care how much "reworking" is done, this is ridiculous and I expected so much more.

Eh, who cares about your or any of our disappointment or expectations. GET THAT OLYMPIC GOLD YUZURU!

Also, Seimei DESERVES to be an iconic, legendary program (which hasn't happened because he imploded at Worlds 2016), which can only happen if it's done during the Olympics.
 
Also the growth of a program, the process of it changing, becoming better during the season might not be as obvious as with someone who did something new. In the end i think it doesn't matter much. He could skate to silence and would win if he's clean. He could skate something completely new and would win if he's clean. It just depends on this, the program itself is just for the spectator in the end. Even the judges do not care.

this! . I do not think he will be punished on the score for repeating programs, the problem he may face is that if Nathan, Javier or Boyang get fresh and good programs (I am not holding my breath), Yuzu repeting programs could make the programs of others seem more impressive and they can narrow the gap. But hey, there's nothing he can do about it (about others skaters getting good programs), apparently he and his team thought it was the best they could do this season.
 
Totally agree. I think it's so ridiculous that many people go against him just because he reuses his old programs...

I do not really think that 'people go against' Yuzuru 'just because' of programs - people actually have a right to feel disappointed and express it, but I do feel that the disappointment have nothing to do with going against Yuzuru in 'personal' sense, like turning backs to him at all.

What is totally unnecessary there (but totally expected tbh) is getting ballistic and war-mode over simple disappointment expressed by some over Yuzuru being back with both his already used programs - at some point, we have to realize that we all have some expectations, dreamy programs about skaters and with such figure as Yuzuru it's all so much more intensified and facing such announcement triggers disappointment, NOT necessary critique/negativity, but is received as such (wrongly).

Myself, I see Yuzuru as one of very few figures nowadays that gets the sport going - but it is due his work ethics, demeanor and perfection strive, not by his programs necessarily. Saying that, it depends what point of view we take on about voicing opinions over return of Chopin SP and 'Seimei' FS, because different people seeing him and feeling him differently as a skater, as a person. As a casual viewer, do I feel a pang of disappointment and kind of longing over the fact of old programs return? Yes, because I simply associate new season with chance to see something new, fresh, challenging from skaters and with Yuzuru - it's also connected with expanding his great interpretation talent regarding various types of music/themes. But do I 'go against' Yuzuru because that choices made? Absolutely not. People really have to understand that voicing a mere disappointment/critique over sole DECISION to re-use programs/music has nothing to do with going after skater who made that decision himself.

From my perspective, I respect Yuzuru's decision - even if feeling disappointed by it. My disappointment though is sourced more form the fact that this could be his last competitive season and would love to see a new stuff just for sake of 'utilizing' his musicality/interpretation talents, a stuff (hopefully) to re-watch and remember for many years; it's not really about perspective of seeing again Chopin SP and 'Seimei' FS, because those programs were very impactful and thrilling to watch as they already were. After all, this is an Olympic season and Yuzuru decided what was the best for him all factors considered, looking at his path after Sochi - he's conscious about himself by making those decisions and he probably is aware that such decisions alone won't make you fans, but the actual programs could. Let's wait. If I have a faith and confidence is something in that situation, it's Yuzuru.

And now it's more about if this announcement/decision made will overshadow people's reception of actual programs Yuzuru will present upcoming season - it's a thing Yuzuru himself has nothing to do.
 
I must be different because I AM disappointed in my favourites when they repeat. I try to live with it, it's not like I can change it. I like Seimei so I'm not that disappointed, I'm more meh about him repeating Chopin for the third time as well. Seems like a repeat of a certain season, and I don't know if that's such a good idea for him.

Also, I don't know about repeating a program gives you the best shot at winning. The plus side is, you don't have to work on a program as much during the season, the interpretation is all there you're basically ahead of the competition who has new things to learn. But like 4everchan wrote, that can backfire, sure he adds new difficulties and what if the results are not as expected...what then? Two highly succesful programs, that can also end in disaster if you don't live up to them. Also the growth of a program, the process of it changing, becoming better during the season might not be as obvious as with someone who did something new. In the end I think it doesn't matter much. He could skate to silence and would win if he's clean. He could skate something completely new and would win if he's clean. It just depends on this, the program itself is just for the spectator in the end. Even the judges do not care.

Bolded part, how are you so sure that it is a plus side? I think from interviews excerpt, Brian and Yuzuru is beg to differ that you don't have to work on a program as much during the season~ Brian has said that everything will be rework and different parts of songs from Seimei movie will be use. As well as the choreography will be rework as well. That doesn't sound like "you don't have to work on a program as much".

Also if I understand this decision might also a lesson learned from last Olympic experience where most of the skaters competing, top skaters especially quoted that the splatfest mainly due to the misplace time slot spend on with media, they have no day break in between unlike the ladies and the media session (interview and stuff) ended well late into the night that by the time they went to sleep they were exhausted at 2am or so and have to get up at earliest 5am. This factored into their training the next day. If a skater has a new program they will be very tentative and cautious with that hectic of schedule, it shook their composed mentality, became unsure if they have trained enough and anything can happen because that program is young, in normal condition yes it can achieve potential but Olympic has various challenges, however if one is very comfortable and so well familiar with their program that even if the same hectic schedule would not shook them up because they love that program and confident in it, which usually can only happen with program that you've done so many times and doing it well and if that means a repeated program then why not. Because afterall, Olympic is where you showed your utmost potential not introducing something new to the public who barely follows skating anyway.

By the way doing new programs makes little impression anyway because most of the Olympic-only crowd even commented that why are the skaters using the same song and wearing the same costume between team competition and individual competition that it gets bored. Conclusion is you can't satisfy everyone but let's not make assumption if it is easy or not to recycle a program :agree:
 
i mean, he's hardly playing it too safe by doing a Japanese program in Korea, and 5 quads, 3 of which are in the 2nd half with 2 3A's...
BTW: According to this interview translation (on tumblr), Yuzuru's plan is to repeat 4S and 4T, so only one 3A planned. But if he pops one of the aforementioned quads, he'll do 3A as his last jumping pass instead of 3Lz to make up lost points.
Smart planning & calculation.
 
Bolded part, how are you so sure that it is a plus side? I think from interviews excerpt, Brian and Yuzuru is beg to differ that you don't have to work on a program as much during the season~ Brian has said that everything will be rework and different parts of songs from Seimei movie will be use. As well as the choreography will be rework as well. That doesn't sound like "you don't have to work on a program as much".

Compared to working up a new program completely from zero, yes, it is less work. I don't know why we're even discussing a simple equation like that. :con3:
 
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