2017 GP Skate Canada Ladies SP

[Skater Boy]

Well, it's Canada...

But seriously the overscoring of Canadians here and in dance is laughable. Here, not only are Canadians overscored but skaters from other countries very underscored. Anna and Katelyn should have around the same PCS score.

I am going to step in . First of all you can't tell me all the judges are Canadians. Second, if the judges wanted to they could have given Kaetlyn in the high 70's and could have bumped Larkyn and Alaine up but they didn't. Third, it is an olympic year and scores tend to be higher Fourth, this kind of "whining" will only bring skating itno more disrepute and hurt its standing as a competitive sport. Our compalining actually may be part of killing our beloved sport. The scoring is not worse than last week and wait for Skate America. Anyways, isn't this suggestion of homecooking running thin.

 

[Sasha'sSpins]

Ot but I too hit a PB this Olympic season - 86 Thumbs UP notifications and counting!! Thanks to all who gave me the 'likes'! Just from the Ladie's and Men's SP threads!

Thank you Skate Canada!

 

[treeloving]

judge no.6 most be a big fan of Kaetlyn, she give her all 9s , anna 7s and the rest get 6s or below....

 

[jenm]

I'm so proud of Kaetlyn!!! Congratulations, love! TBH, after Rostelecom Cup, I find her SP really underscored. Should have been 79-80. In this time when overscoring is a norm, this event is like a unicorn. LOL
Apart from her, the only skater who has caught my attention is Marin Honda. God, her skating is absolutely beautiful. Don't care about the mistakes. Some skaters used only their feet/blade in the choreography but this girl uses her entire body to express, her edges are smooth, her turns are incredibly difficult, not to mention POISED like a ballerina on ice. Gorgeous!!!

 

[kevinVchicago]

Oh come on, Satoko and Carolina are getting just as much hate as Chan and a lot more than Duhamel/Radford and Kaetlyn. In fact, there isn't much hate for Kaetlyn at all.

Nobody better be mean to Satoko or else they're going to have to deal with me! [emoji35]

Maybe you haven't read the threads lately, but there has actually been a lot of hate directed toward Kaetlyn. I think especially since the beginning of this season. Can't compare with the hate Evgenia gets, but still.

 

[Tulipstar]

A lot of drama went on in this segment...

1. Kaetlyn Osmond: As much as I loved this program last season, I wanted to see something new this time. Nevertheless, Kaetlyn is an engaging performer and she did very well in a field where almost everyone else had major mistakes, so she definitely shined here. I’d have her score a couple of points lower, but it’s a very well-deserved lead.
2. Anna Pogorilaya: As soon as I saw her score on the results page (couldn’t watch this live), I breathed a sigh a relief. She was struggling so much in practice, but look at how well she did here! Of course, we still have the FS to go, but a clean SP is a good start. She didn’t have that much fire either, but I think that’s more due to her focusing on not falling, so the presentation will surely improve once she gains more confidence.
3. Maria Sotskova: So will Maria be keeping last year’s dress permanently for this program? I don’t think it really fits the theme. Anyway, solid performance from her as usual, but I think that her program is missing a sparkle. I ended up loving her boring (and unpopular) FS from last season because there were beautiful moments throughout, but this SP feels a bit empty.
4. Courtney Hicks: Like Anna, I’m relieved to see Courtney do well. I loved Wakaba’s SP to the same music last season though, so I can’t help but think of comparisons. Courtney has improved her presentation and her jumps look a little more stable now. I hope she can carry this momentum into the FS!
5. Karen Chen: She was a little overscored, but I did enjoy her performance. Like Maria, it seems that she’s keeping her last year’s dress. I hope that she can have a stronger performance tomorrow.
6. Rika Hongo: Why do the judges always underscore her? It’s really frustrating to see that they always inflate certain skaters’ scores but they also always lowball certain others too. Sure the TES may be fair considering her questionable jumps, but Rika sold that program well and the PCS should’ve been at least 31. Scoring aside, it’s great to see that Rika is not backing down yet.
7. Ashley Wagner: Exactly like Kaetlyn - she brought back a program that I absolutely loved, but I’m wanting to see something new. Seeing how she had jump problems today, I have a feeling that her TES problems will continue throughout the season again. Loved the exciting presentation as usual, but she needs to maintain her jumps.
8. Laurine Lecavelier: Very lovely program, and I thought her PCS should’ve been higher. She had jump issues like the others but made me forget about them because of how beautifully she performed that program. I’m excited to see how it will grow as the season goes.
10. Marin Honda: I want to say that I’m shocked...but I’m really not. As soon as I heard that she’d be doing a 3Lz-3T, I had a bad feeling. This new program is gorgeous (too much arms in the step sequence though), and I hope that we’ll be able to see a clean version of it next week at COC. Right now, she’s scheduled to skate first tomorrow, so I hope she can go all out.

Haven’t watched Kailani, Alaine, or Larkyn yet.

Nice summary. I agree with most of it, though I'm happy with Kaetlyn's score.
Laurine deserved a bit more, I agree. She's such an elegant skater.

And as for Marin; I think the hype put too much pressure on her. Kaori could train and live more outside the limelight, and it made for a better first outing. Let's see what Marin can do in the free.

Most important to me is that Anna did well. If she keeps this up in the Free, she can finally leave Worlds behind her a bit better. Now people will have something new to talk about when it comes to her.

 

[Tulipstar]

How is it possible that this thread has 96 pages??? I'm not reading that... sorry. I don't care if you guys figured out the whole chicken/egg thing. Its too much.

If I remember well, it already had 20+ pages before the competition even started

 

[Blades of Passion]

Very frustrating to see some of these tech panel calls, it's mind boggling how this crap still happens every competition. Kailani Craine's 3Loop+3Loop was NOT <<, not even close to that underrotated, talk about being held down. Her musical interpretation deserved to be scored in the top 4 here as well, the PCS are such nonsense. There is virtually no integrity to the judging.

As for Marin, yes she is pretty, has beautiful lines/extensions, facial expressions, and some lovely hand movements to capture the 'moments'. But when you say (including the BBC commentators) she has great skating skills, what skills are you actually referring to? I don't think she has the speed, deep edges, turns, and the overall ice coverage. Aside from the overall "loveliness", I don't see the hype. And the lack of the tangible skating skills is showing in her step sequence

Her skating skills are wonderful, very smooth and effortless. There are plenty of deep edges in there and she does the turns better than most anyone, not sure what you're looking at. The mistake she made in the step sequence was on a knee slide, LOL!

 

[beki]

Hmm, I enjoyed this segment very much, all of the ladies except the couple who had very rough outings. I thought Kailani was underscored and Karen was overscored. The little federation curse is real.

 

[TryMeLater]

Carol didn't call Russia cheaters out loud either. She said, weeell, that's Russia (referring to the scoring). I see no difference in her comments and that of the Russian commentators, who apparently said: 'In another country than Canada Kaetlyn would have gotten 74'. given the translation provided to us here is correct.

There is a difference. The Russians are all for "home-ice advantage", while Carol basically implied the Russian collude with judges behind our backs.

 

[Lester]

I loved Anna's performance here but burn that dress

 

[quadrupleaxel15]

I am really curious about the LP scores and how they will change things, current score table does not look right despite being correctly judged.

Kaetlyn deserved every point she got, maybe even a bit higher one considering the current inflation. But I am happy that the judges did their job and didn't hand out points just because. I personally don't like her music though, which is a shame because she performs really well but I will not be able to watch her performance over and over again with that music.

I am happy for Anna, she wasn't her best obviously, but after last season and the injuries she is dealing with, this was as solid as it can be. It scored well and she was happy after it, this was a good start to the season I guess. Except I absolutely hate the dress. WHY?

Maria desperately needs a new dress as well. She is known to be the boring skater, I know, but she has great skills which people probably miss because of the boring music-blonde pale girl in a blush pink dress- white ice combination. Someone had called her a skating Barbie previously, which I think has a point. Her programs and visuals need to make her skills shine, but it does the opposite unfortunately. She is a great skater and has considerably improved from the last season.

I don't know what to say about Ashley. I don't expect much from her techinally, she tends to make mistakes but still manages to offer a great show at the end of the day. This time she was bit off. The audiance didn't help much as well I guess, they were even delayed in the clapping part of the spin. Rafael wasn't extremely serious and angry-looking in the KaC, so I will assume things are okay for the beginning of the season.

Marin was lovely to watch, but that was it. We already knew debuting in the Olympic season will not take you far and these scores are helping the Japanese Federation in the difficult decision to come, except for the Honda fans.

 

[Lota]

Aw, poor Rika :sad21: I love that she's skating well again and there is more confindence in her skating, but I would get soooo discouraged if I saw scores like that every. single. competition. She used to get up to 70 and it's not like her skating's gotten that much worse. In comparison to how the others were scored tonight, she was definitely lowballed. I don't know why exactly she fell out of favour with the judges, she's not a direct threat to the lead, why do that to her? So that she "knows her place" among the Japanese ladies? Obviously skaters like Marin are on the rise and people root for them and want to see them win, but they'll be able to do that through their own skating, not through other skaters getting lower scores than they deserve. I'm just sad. I know that through consistent hard work Rika will get back to her pre-injury level and improve even more, but I'm not sure the scores will recover.

 

[sowcow]

I have a question why is it some skaters have such love - Yuna, Mao, Hanyu, Jason, Sui and Han, Satoko, Mai, Carolina, and y et almost hatred to Chan, Duhamel and Radford, Osmond (Canadians oddly) Focussing her on the ladies I thought Kaetlyn looked pretty good PC and style wise. And she has a great command on the ice.

yeah... some of us have had this question for a while.... but when we point out that they are all Canadian, we get told to stop playing the poor Canadian victims...

Oh come on, Satoko and Carolina are getting just as much hate as Chan and a lot more than Duhamel/Radford and Kaetlyn. In fact, there isn't much hate for Kaetlyn at all.

Ashley gets double as much hate as Kaetlyn. Gracie got more hate than Kaetlyn. Evgenia gets more hate than Kaetlyn. Rika gets more hate than Kaetlyn. Anna gets more hate then Kaetlyn. Heck, even Elisabet Tursynbaeva gets more hate then Kaetlyn.

Shoma gets more hate than Patrick nowadays too. Boyang gets more hate than Patrick. Yuzuru definitely gets more hate than Patrick, but he also gets more love, the reaction is just more of everything. Kovtun gets more hate than Patrick nowadays.

So you can stop playing Canadian's are the victims now.

Maybe you haven't read the threads lately, but there has actually been a lot of hate directed toward Kaetlyn. I think especially since the beginning of this season. Can't compare with the hate Evgenia gets, but still.

.

Maybe we Canadians feel like victims in part due to the notable increase in the number of 'shade-throwers' targeting certain (key) Team Canada members? I'd suggest a 2-part reason/explanation/theory for this increase in 'shade-throwers':

Reason 1: Team Canada's recent success

• For the 1st(?) time ever, SkateCanada has qualified the largest team for Olympics & Worlds; and Canada is the odds-on favourite to win the 'Team Event' at the Olympics (although, admittedly in close competition with Russia).
  • ⫸ Could Canada's (somewhat unexpected) recent World's success perhaps be a factor contributing to the seemingly enlarged group of 'shade-throwers'??⫷

Reason 2: Population size (vis-à-vis the other 'top-10' ISU federation countries)

• Canada has by far the smallest population compared to the other 'top-10' ISU skating federation member countries. In fact, with the exception of the Ukraine, all other 'top-10' federation countries have populations at least double (2×) that of Canada's - see 'multiple' column in table below.
• If we assume an equal % of skating fans in each country [yes, I know, a wildly unsubstantiated assumption]; and that the 'shade-throwers' (a.k.a. 'haters') of a particular skater (let's use Kaetlyn Osmond as example) are mostly comprised of fans from other countries (e.g. non-Canadian fans), and especially from those countries with 'top-5' world ranked competitive skaters in event disciplines that overlap with 'top-5' world ranked Canadians (...which for our example would include: Russia (4×), Japan (3×), and the U.S. (9×)); then this might help explain the seemingly over-sized group of 'shade-throwers' focused against certain Team Canada members.
  • ⫸ Could it be that the Canadian fans/defenders (who don't typically take-on the role of 'victim') are simply being overwhelmed numerically!?!⫷

Estimated country population sizes (as of July 1, 2017) for the 'top-10' ISU federations
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_population_(United_Nations)#cite_note-6
​

The 'top-10' list is comprised of those countries/federations that qualified for the "team competition" at the 2014 Sochi Olympics
* indicates those countries/federations that host annual Senior Grand-Prix Series events
​

​

[TABLE="width: 682, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]World[/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="colspan: 2, align: center"] Compared to CAN[/TD]
[TD="align: center"] 'Top competitor' event[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]Rank[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Country[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Population[/TD]
[TD="align: center"] % of 'Total'[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]multiple[/TD]
[TD="align: center"] overlap (vs. CAN)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]____[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]____________[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]_____________[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]_________[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]______[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]______[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]________________[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]1[/TD]
[TD]China*[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1,409,517,397[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]59.8%
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3849%
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]38
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Men, Pairs[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]3[/TD]
[TD]United States*[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]324,459,463[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]13.8%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]886%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]9[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Ladies, Men, ID[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]9[/TD]
[TD]Russia*[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]143,989,754[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]6.1%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]393%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]4[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Ladies, Men, ID, Pairs[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]11[/TD]
[TD]Japan*[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]127,484,450[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]5.4%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]348%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Ladies, Men[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]16[/TD]
[TD]Germany[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]82,114,224[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]3.5%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]224%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]Pairs[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]21[/TD]
[TD]Great Britain[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]66,181,585[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2.8%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]181%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]-[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]22[/TD]
[TD]France*[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]64,979,548[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2.8%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]177%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]ID[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]23[/TD]
[TD]Italy[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]59,359,900[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2.5%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]162%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]ID[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]32[/TD]
[TD]Ukraine[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]44,222,947[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1.9%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]121%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]-[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"]38[/TD]
[TD]Canada*[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]36,624,199[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1.6%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]100%[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]1
[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]-[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"]_____________[/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: right"]Total:[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]2,358,933,467[/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD="align: right"]World Total:[/TD]
[TD="align: center"]7,550,262,101[/TD]
[TD="align: center"][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[TD][/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

judge no.6 most be a big fan of Kaetlyn, she give her all 9s , anna 7s and the rest get 6s or below....

Poor Courtney couldn’t even get a mark into the 6’s from her. Her best mark from judge 6 being 5.75 and even a couple of 5.0’s. I think even after factoring this judge scored Courtney something like 17pts less than her own marks for 1st place in PCS alone. Yikes!! I think this judge is one that the ISU needs to evaluate and examine the thought process at play because to me it doesn’t reflect what I believe most people are seeing on the ice. I mean...she is out of line with most other judges marks for every other competitor except for her scoring of Kaetlyn who she gave very reasonable marks to.

I’m very curious as to what the more experienced posters here who have a strong grasp of how PCS is generally being awarded have to say about this.

 

[Interspectator]

The tech callers were strict this time around, but it doesn't take away from the enjoyment I got watching Rika Skate. She owns her style and seems to have her confidence back in this SP. And I loved her dress.
Delighted also for Anna, keep it together in the FS please!

 

[sowcow]

judge no.6 most be a big fan of Kaetlyn, she give her all 9s , anna 7s and the rest get 6s or below....

Poor Courtney couldn’t even get a mark into the 6’s from her. Her best mark from judge 6 being 5.75 and even a couple of 5.0’s. I think even after factoring this judge scored Courtney something like 17pts less than her own marks for 1st place in PCS alone. Yikes!! I think this judge is one that the ISU needs to evaluate and examine the thought process at play because to me it doesn’t reflect what I believe most people are seeing on the ice. I mean...she is out of line with most other judges marks for every other competitor except for her scoring of Kaetlyn who she gave very reasonable marks to.

I’m very curious as to what the more experienced posters here who have a strong grasp of how PCS is generally being awarded have to say about this.

Judge #6: Ms. Alison RYAN | (AUS)
​

Starting this year, the judging panel is no longer anonymous. The list of judges & officials is made public prior to the start of each competition segment. For example, here is the list of judges for the Ladies short program.

Or, go to the main results page for the event and click the "panel of judges" link (3rd column on the table) for the competition segment you're interested in.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Actually the judges names were disclosed last year too

I’m going to start a thread called Judges Hall of Shame 2017 so we can call out individual judges and give them the attention they deserve. Hopefully then we can alleviate some of the vitriol thrown at skaters.

 

[sowcow]

Actually the judges names were disclosed last year too

I’m going to start a thread called Judges Hall of Shame 2017 so we can call out individual judges and give them the attention they deserve. Hopefully then we can alleviate some of the vitriol thrown at skaters.

Yes the 'names' of those on the judging panel were disclosed last year; but did they also indicate which judge was judge #1, judge #2, etc?? [I thought the judges were still 'randomized' last year (so Judge #1 for skater A, was not necessarily Judge #1 for skater B)? And, I thought this year was the first year the names of the judging panel were known AND that that the judging list/order was no longer randomized between successive skaters??]

Or, am I simply 12-months behind the rest of world?? :shocked:

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Yes the 'names' of those on the judging panel were disclosed last year; but did they also indicate which judge was judge #1, judge #2, etc?? [I thought the judges were still 'randomized' last year (so Judge #1 for skater A, was not necessarily Judge #1 for skater B)? And, I thought this year was the first year the names of the judging panel were known AND that that the judging list/order was no longer randomized between successive skaters??]

Or, am I simply 12-months behind the rest of world?? :shocked:

They stopped randomizing them last season too because we were calling them out then.