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- Feb 4, 2012
I remember his score was high but 100? Wow....are the judges in Nationals from the country itself? I guess, that's a stupid question....maybe they should change that, haha.
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2013 Japanese Nationals Men
- Thread starter deedee1
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I remember his score was high but 100? Wow....are the judges in Nationals from the country itself? I guess, that's a stupid question....maybe they should change that, haha.
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- Jan 23, 2004
Thank you for the explanation. Let me see if I understand are you saying that if Dai was the favorite Hanyu would have been scored less and Dai more?
That does not sound fair to me. Thanks for your thoughts.
Wishing good cheer to all in the FS competition.
Hanyu tends to skate better when he is not in good shape. Probably he can save stamina more carefully. I don't think they will give Takahashi very generous scores this time. Hanyu can win with TES around 78.
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2003
I disagree. How was Hanyu strongly held up when he's been getting very similar scores at international events? If anything, Takahashi's scores were too high for URed 4t and an edge called on the 3lutz.
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- Mar 23, 2010
Great performance by Hanyu and Dai, and wow.... the amount of energy and excitement in the arena was palpable even behind Youtube!
I'd have them alot closer, maybe something like 4-5 points apart. It seems to me Hanyu had been a tad inflated, while Dai seems to have been held down for his short. Perhaps we shouldn't be surprised at the result consider Dai's SP is choreographed by Nanami Abe, Hanyu's old coach. How would it look on JSF if that program beat Hanyu's (star choreographer, coach) WR program at home. They'd certainly loose face.
In any case it seems JFS is determined to make Hanyu as their favs to Sochi (My dream for him last year lol), or hold him up in case he faltering in FS due Hanyu's stamina issues. Th boy looks tired and pale today, a bit worrying, hope he is going to be okay for his FS. For some reason in FS, I think Dai may have the upper hand this time, a bit or morozov voodoo magic can't hurt, even if I totally dislike the program itself.
Looking at the protocols, Hanyu gained so many 9s and 9.5 PCS including skating skills.. interesting. He used to get 7s to high 8s early in the season. But overall Dai got higher PCS which seems about right, but less generous with GOEs relative to what Hanyu received compare with their previous GPF outing.
I'd have them alot closer, maybe something like 4-5 points apart. It seems to me Hanyu had been a tad inflated, while Dai seems to have been held down for his short. Perhaps we shouldn't be surprised at the result consider Dai's SP is choreographed by Nanami Abe, Hanyu's old coach. How would it look on JSF if that program beat Hanyu's (star choreographer, coach) WR program at home. They'd certainly loose face.
In any case it seems JFS is determined to make Hanyu as their favs to Sochi (My dream for him last year lol), or hold him up in case he faltering in FS due Hanyu's stamina issues. Th boy looks tired and pale today, a bit worrying, hope he is going to be okay for his FS. For some reason in FS, I think Dai may have the upper hand this time, a bit or morozov voodoo magic can't hurt, even if I totally dislike the program itself.
Looking at the protocols, Hanyu gained so many 9s and 9.5 PCS including skating skills.. interesting. He used to get 7s to high 8s early in the season. But overall Dai got higher PCS which seems about right, but less generous with GOEs relative to what Hanyu received compare with their previous GPF outing.
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- Jul 26, 2003
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- Nov 21, 2010
I agree with this part and think Hanyu is not set to win. Remember he also had a 9.75 point lead over Kozuka at SA but still lost overall. Perhaps Hanyu won’t skate as bad as he did at SA, but Daisuke is not Kozuka and Daisuke can score much better than Kozuka in the FS on both TES and PCS. Hanyu should not make too many mistakes, or he may lose to Daisuke. I don’t like Daisuke’s FS either but I’m fine if he wins tomorrow.
I disagree with this part because I don’t know what does Abe have to do with Daisuke’s score?
At Japan Nationals, Daisuke got
____________TES_PCS
Daisuke Nats 43.39 44.65
Daisuke lost because of TES. If you compare with international competitions, the highest PCS Daisuke got was at GPF, the only time he was clean this season.
____________TES_PCS
Daisuke GPF 49.15 43.14
At home Japan Nationals he was not clean but his PCS increased to 44.65, which is 1.51 points higher than what he got when he was clean at GPF.
And the highest international PCS Hanyu got was at SA, his first GP outing, which is odd enough.
__________TES__PCS
Hanyu Nats 53.78 43.90
Hanyu SA_ 51.71 43.36
His PCS only increased by 0.54 points at Japan Nationals. Usually skaters get higher PCS as the season proceeds, but Hanyu’s PCS is not increasing much.
Then we compare with other skaters’ Japan Nationals scores and their highest international scores:
___________TES__PCS
Kozuka Nats 43.03 41.55
Kozuka GPF 46.64 40.75
Kozuka’s PCS increased by 0.8 points at home, more than Hanyu’s increase.
_________TES__PCS
Mura Nats 45.58 38.90
Mura TEB 41.15 35.50
Mura’s PCS increased by 3.4 points!
_________TES_PCS
Oda Nats 42.20 39.55
Oda SC_ 44.61 37.53
Oda’s PCS increased by 2.02 points despite his fall today.
__________TES_PCS
Hino Nats 37.53 30.75
Hino JGPF 38.20 29.35
Hino’s PCS increased by 1.4 points.
_______________________TES_PCS
Shoma Uno Nats_______ 35.16 32.40
Shoma Uno JGP Germany 33.62 29.86
Uno’s PCS increased by 2.54 points.
So besides Machida who had a total splat today, basically everyone’s PCS increased by more than Hanyu. If we look at everyone’s score today, then I don’t think JSF or anybody inflated Hanyu’s score.
I don’t know what you mean by Hanyu “used to get 7s to high 8s early in the season”? At SA, his first GP outing, he got
8.64 in SS
8.36 in TR
8.89 in P/E
8.68 in CH
8.79 in IN
At Japan Nationals, he got
8.85 in SS
8.50 in TR
8.90 in P/E
8.80 in CH
8.85 in IN
Not that much difference. If you look at others’ scores, you’ll find bigger differences.
I don’t understand this sentence either. Daisuke was the only one clean at GPF SP, but he made mistakes today which affected his GOEs. Hanyu, on the contrary, made mistakes and had a fall at GPF SP. He was clean today and earned GOEs similar to SA and NHK SP’s.
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- Apr 3, 2012
I just watched Akio Sasaki's SP - this guy rocks! :thumbsup:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ao4jO143DSg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ao4jO143DSg
- Joined
- Aug 15, 2003
I really like Mura. He reminds me of Takeshi Honda. I think Mura could beat Kozuka for the last spot on the world team.
From the vid I saw, Takahashi's UR in the 4T wasn't plainly obvious but detectable under slow motion replay. So it appears the Tech Panel made the right call here, though from the judges perspective, a UR that can't be detected without replay would be a rather minor consideration. The edge call on the 3Lz was also correct, though in this case, it was more a case of unclear edge as opposed an obvious Flutz. In the past, it would have been noted as a ! instead of e. Otherwise, the 3Lz+3T combo was solid. Again, any edge penalty here would have been minor. On the 3A, Takahashi got a little lucky as it appears to be slightly UR as well but perhaps not enough for the panel to call it as such. That could go either way so I see no evidence that the Tech Panel has been especially harsh with Takahashi on purpose here, they did their job fairly, not lenient nor harsh. Rather, Takakashi needs to watch out for his chronic tendency to UR jumps.
Other impressions : Although Mura landed a 4T+3T combo and a mostly clean program, I was a little surprised how much emphasis the Japanese judges gave to jumps with components more like an afterthought. In other words, I find Mura's program to be very basic for this level and his overall skating skills and use of the music is so far behind Kozuka and Oda. But it appears as though if you can land big jumps, you are going to be ahead at the Japanese Nationals - so much emphasis on the jumps, maybe too much. I would have switched the ranking between Oda and Mura but that's just me.
Other impressions : Although Mura landed a 4T+3T combo and a mostly clean program, I was a little surprised how much emphasis the Japanese judges gave to jumps with components more like an afterthought. In other words, I find Mura's program to be very basic for this level and his overall skating skills and use of the music is so far behind Kozuka and Oda. But it appears as though if you can land big jumps, you are going to be ahead at the Japanese Nationals - so much emphasis on the jumps, maybe too much. I would have switched the ranking between Oda and Mura but that's just me.
If he does beat Kozuka, it would certainly not be because of his skating skills or music interpretation. To be honest, even his 4T+3T combo in the SP was shaky. I would have given him a 0 for GOE on that combo seeing how he barely held down to the landing. So that's at most an advantage of merely 2 pts over Kozuka's stepped out 4T. With the rest of the elements and the overall package, you'd think Kozuka would have easily overcome that deficit but instead, he barely stayed ahead by 0.1 pt.
Like I said, I don't like how the Japanese skating philosophy overly focuses on jumps and relegates other aspects of the skating as secondary. As a result, the skaters they produce tend to have highs and lows at international competitions - that is when they bomb their jumps, you see their big names suddenly dropping to 9th-10th at Worlds like Kozuka, or Oda falling to even qualify for the main event or Takahashi falling all the way to 6th at Worlds in 2011. This boom or bust approach is not wisest thing in this sport where ice is always slippery. Given that you better believe the likes of Chan will not zayak again this year, it would seem the JSF approach is not the most conducive to their skaters' international success, just my honest take.
He looked quite pale, I hope he's alright :/
As a side note, in the vid I saw, Takeshi Honda commented on how Daisuke Takahashi indeed UR his 4T during the slow motion replay. I hope that will lay to rest any conspiracy theory that JSF has already fixed the results because if even the TV commentators can see the UR, not just the Tech Panel, then chances are the call was correct. The edge call was even clearer and Honda commented on that as well but I am not sure if he has access to preliminary protocol at that point or not. In any event, the unclear edge was quite irrefutable from what I can see.
http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...-Nationals-Men&p=691207&viewfull=1#post691207
http://www.goldenskate.com/forum/sh...-Nationals-Men&p=691207&viewfull=1#post691207
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- Joined
- Oct 25, 2012
Good for Hnayu!
But Takahasi is the guy I can watch all day long.
I can watch Yuzu all day! (Except I really shouldn't...)In addition to the < on the 4T and the e on the 3Lz, Takahashi got three Level 3s and one 4 while Hanyu got three 4s, one 3. Small difference (0.9 total difference in Hanyu's favor in BV for their non-jump elements), but every little bit counts.
Oh, and Hanyu had two jumping passes after the bonus mark while Takahashi only had one.
From BV to meeting the bullets for GOE, everything has been extremely well crafted with the goal of getting all those little points. The other guys are really going to have to step it up if they want to get close to Hanyu's TES.
Oh, and Hanyu had two jumping passes after the bonus mark while Takahashi only had one.
From BV to meeting the bullets for GOE, everything has been extremely well crafted with the goal of getting all those little points. The other guys are really going to have to step it up if they want to get close to Hanyu's TES.
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