Was it wise for Sotnikova to skip Worlds?

jaylee · Apr 7, 2014

Sam-Skwantch said:
Really?? I'd much rather her come out and just say Adelina was over scored. I mean if she is thinking it then she should just say it. That's much more respectable in my book. I never ever thought I would have a doubt in my mind about Yuna. I'm really saddened by this and honestly hope it's not true or out of context. For the sake of her many devoted fans...she should take five minutes and see what has them callusing their finger tips!

Seriously, saddened?

Nadya said:
Since you're bringing it up, I'll just come out and say that I don't believe any skaters who claim they haven't watched their competitors skate. Of course they did, with a fine-tooth comb too.

...You guys are REALLY reaching here. IIRC, she was asked if she had seen Adelina's skate either the night of the free skate or the day after, and the answer was no at that time. And yes, it's completely possible that skaters don't watch the competitors before they take the ice, and after the competition is over, you have the flower ceremony and the press conference.

I have no idea if she's seen it since then. Probably, but she still hasn't commented on Adelina's scores in any way.

cooper · Apr 7, 2014

Sam-Skwantch said:
Still...she's not blind to the drama unfolding. It's kind of disingenuous to just say sorry...I never took the time to watch that. Kind of a cop out. That doesn't seem like her to me. I would expect her to say she saw Adrlina's skate and compliment it honestly. This seems out of character to me and more like something a politician would say, I've always considered Yuna like a wise owl who makes her own way. This seems odd is all.

for your information.. she was asked about adelina as a skater.. she did complement her.. she said that she's a natural talent and a hard worker.. and also said she had her luck in her side.. the same words that yuna described her win in vancouver that she was lucky.. before you start making an assumption..

nguyenghita · Apr 7, 2014

qwertyskates said:
It was posted by some of her fans here that Yuna said she was "confused by the results" and so i assumed they weren't making this up. I didn't think that was a good thing for Yuna to say, especially when Adelina is getting abuses and threats.

Here you are, so what's wrong with Yuna feel confused by herself? The result was indeed so ridiculous, lol. In fact Yuna didn't said anything more than "I feel confused at first, but just move on", that's all she said. She never mentiond anything about others, although interviewer asked her again and again. Why she must consider how "the winner" dealt with her winning at that time? She didn't care as well as no need to care, that's not her bussiness :rolleye:

I find many of the Yuna fan base abusive even here, the ones who say Adelina deserves the hate for robbing Yuna, etc. It is WRONG to do this to any skater, to wish for harm upon Adelina's person. It shows very poor sportsmanship.

Adelina not deserve the hate for sure, but she alone is responsible for her own words. Not because she robbed Yuna's anything (the judges instead) but because she show disrepecfull to Yuna, that's not show great sportsmanship either.

qwertyskates · Apr 7, 2014

cooper said:
you are really good of making something.. and twisted it.. like it's okay..

what some posters are trying to say here.. is that adelina attacked yuna's program... yuna NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT adelina's program.. but instead you make it sound like yuna should also be condemned by just saying that she's confused by the results.. and then trying desperately indirectly linking her to the behavior of the crazy bots bullying adelina online.. i don't know.. it's so typical..

No, Adelina was ANSWERING those who attacked her, she was asked to defend her win, and she did. She did not attack Yuna. Adelina was, however, viciously attacked by Yuna's fans. :rolleye:

jaylee · Apr 7, 2014

Nadya said:
I am allowed to have an opinion and my opinion is that any skater who claims not to have watched the performance of their nearest competitor is lying. I'm not saying they don't have good reasons to lie, or that lying in this case is a bad thing. I'm just saying that in my opinion, they are lying.

Your opinion is garbage. How dare you call a skater a liar with no proof whatsoever? Seriously, it seems like you're trying to detract from discussion of Adelina's interview by calling Yuna a liar over something that is totally irrelevant.

Do I really need to pull up tons of interviews by DIFFERENT skaters talking about whether or not they watch the performance of their nearest competitor? The answer is usually NO, especially when their competitors skate before them. Off the top of my head, I recall Michelle Kwan talking about being in the back, closeted away, while Sarah Hughes was skating in SLC 2002, and she said she could hear the audience reaction and knew she had done well--but she didn't watch. Mao did not watch Yuna Kim skate in the 2010 Olympics FS, did not hear the exact score but knew it was a big score. Kaetlyn Osmond talked about how she never watches her competitors skate. As soon as she was done with her FS at 2013 Worlds, she was taking off her skates.

I'm not sure if Patrick Chan watched Yuzuru Hanyu skate. I seem to recall a quote saying that he heard the score and knew it was beatable before he took the ice.

It makes more sense for a skater to have watched their competitors skate if they're already done, but Yuna was the last to skate.

jaylee · Apr 7, 2014

qwertyskates said:
It was posted by some of her fans here that Yuna said she was "confused by the results" and so i assumed they weren't making this up. I didn't think that was a good thing for Yuna to say, especially when Adelina is getting abuses and threats. Perhaps her fans posted falsehoods here.

You are TOTALLY distorting what Yuna said. If you didn't even bother to read the context of what she said, then you have no right to say that it wasn't a "good thing" for her to say. Adelina should NOT be getting abuses and threats but that doesn't give YOU the right to drag Yuna into this.

In the first place, Adelina was answering questions from a friendly press. I don't think Adelina attacked Yuna when she said Yuna had a technically weaker program and that was how she, Adelina, won. It is in fact an opinion shared by many, including most mainstream media. Did Yuna mention her own weaknesses, such as URs? If not then why must Adelina? Of course every winner would defend his/her win when challenged, it is only normal.

Yuna doesn't have to mention her own weaknesses because she's not the one criticizing or questioning anyone's programs, scores, or results.

On the other hand, I find it inappropriate, unclassy, and unsportsmanlike for Adelina to argue that Yuna had a weaker program to justify the result. Adelina, Tarasova, and others CLEARLY lack objectivity in their comments, they highlight weaknesses, and ignore strengths. It's disgusting.

Adelina can defend her win by focusing on her OWN unique strengths and her own abilities. But it's absolutely ridiculous for her to point out what Yuna didn't do when Yuna did plenty of things that Adelina didn't do. Yeah, Yuna didn't do a 2A/3T in the second half of her program in Sochi. But when has Adelina EVER done a real 3Lz/3T? NEVER. And she got credited for it in Sochi, too. When has Adelina ever done a real lutz, period? Why didn't she get a flutz call? It goes on and on.

It's inappropriate for coaches to point out weaknesses in a skater that is competing with their own, and they usually don't do it because if they do, then it immediately opens up their own skater to criticism and exposure of THEIR weaknesses. It's the same thing here. And by the way, I never heard Sarah Hughes say a single negative thing about Irina or Michelle post SLC. She never attacked anyone else in talking about her win. And her win was controversial too, and the Russian federation DID file a protest. Sarah Hughes and the US media and others just ignored any controversy, heck, didn't even acknowledge it. I wonder that Adelina and the Russian media can't do the same.

If there weren't such a great brouhaha over Sochi, Adelina wouldn't even have said anything about her program vs Yuna's, it would be like one of the hundreds of sport competitions resulting in disagreement over the verdict that eventually peter off. To escalate to the point of death threats, abuses, allegations of fraud, cheating, crime, that is simply unacceptable to do to ANY skater.

Death threats/abuses are unacceptable. I have no problem with Adelina addressing that. It is also completely acceptable to be less than impressed with Adelina's comments on the Sochi results in her recent interview.

Sam-Skwantch · Apr 7, 2014

I'm not sure why you guys are getting all snippy. I prefer Yuna to Adelina and that will never change. That is why it was saddening to hear Yuna give what I consider a politicians answer. I always thought she found better ways to respond. Thanks @Cooper for shedding more light on the subject. To be fair my assumption was that Yuna was better than to be so dismissive.

aa456 · Apr 7, 2014

Sam-Skwantch said:
Still...she's not blind to the drama unfolding. It's kind of disingenuous to just say sorry...I never took the time to watch that. Kind of a cop out. That doesn't seem like her to me. I would expect her to say she saw Adrlina's skate and compliment it honestly. This seems out of character to me and more like something a politician would say, I've always considered Yuna like a wise owl who makes her own way. This seems odd is all.

she's wise hence she's not going to comment on it. What's the point of commenting and fueling the media who will loop her comments on repeat 24/7? Also, whenever most skaters are asked about other skater's performances, most maintain the "I do my own thing, don't really watch the competitors." It's just being politically correct to avoid controversy.

I find all this hoopla over what either of the girls said just plain silly (not saying you're doing it. just stating in general).

I don't think Adelina meant to be disrespectful to Yuna. She seems like a blunt/direct person to me and probably ended up saying what's on her mind. She may come across as disrespectful to some but i honestly think she was just being matter-of-fact about it. I also don't want to generalize but it may be a cultural thing. Based on some interviews i've read of Adelina, Julia, Irina S. and Anna they've all seemed rather direct to me and don't care to be politically correct about their comments.

I also don't think there's anything wrong with Yuna saying she was "blaffled by it." again, never specified what "it" meant (correct me if I'm wrong). She was asked about Sochi and that's how she answered. and If she hasn't seen any of Adelina's performances then she hasn't seen them. what's so wrong about it? She clearly didn't see it in Sochi. Most skaters in final flight don't see their competitors' performances.

seriously guys, if one of them gives PC answers, ppl have a problem, and if one doesn't, people still have problem!!

Sam-Skwantch · Apr 7, 2014

^:agree:

qwertyskates · Apr 7, 2014

jaylee said:
You are TOTALLY distorting what Yuna said. If you didn't even bother to read the context of what she said, then you have no right to say that it wasn't a "good thing" for her to say. Adelina should NOT be getting abuses and threats but that doesn't give YOU the right to drag Yuna into this.

Yuna doesn't have to mention her own weaknesses because she's not the one criticizing or questioning anyone's programs, scores, or results.

On the other hand, I find it inappropriate, unclassy, and unsportsmanlike for Adelina to argue that Yuna had a weaker program to justify the result. Adelina, Tarasova, and others CLEARLY lack objectivity in their comments, they highlight weaknesses, and ignore strengths. It's disgusting.

Adelina can defend her win by focusing on her OWN unique strengths and her own abilities. But it's absolutely ridiculous for her to point out what Yuna didn't do when Yuna did plenty of things that Adelina didn't do. Yeah, Yuna didn't do a 2A/3T in the second half of her program in Sochi. But when has Adelina EVER done a real 3Lz/3T? NEVER. And she got credited for it in Sochi, too. When has Adelina ever done a real lutz, period? Why didn't she get a flutz call? It goes on and on.

It's inappropriate for coaches to point out weaknesses in a skater that is competing with their own, and they usually don't do it because if they do, then it immediately opens up their own skater to criticism and exposure of THEIR weaknesses. It's the same thing here. And by the way, I never heard Sarah Hughes say a single negative thing about Irina or Michelle post SLC. She never attacked anyone else in talking about her win. And her win was controversial too, and the Russian federation DID file a protest. Sarah Hughes and the US media and others just ignored any controversy, heck, didn't even acknowledge it. I wonder that Adelina and the Russian media can't do the same.

Death threats/abuses are unacceptable. I have no problem with Adelina addressing that. It is also completely acceptable to be less than impressed with Adelina's comments on the Sochi results in her recent interview.

Calm down. :rolleye:

There's no distortion, when you say you're confused by the results it means it doesn't seem right to you. It most certainly isn't at all conciliatory, and Yuna never said anything abut the death threats and abuses Adelina received.

Adelina skated the best skate I've ever seen from her at Sochi, so what if she didn't skate as well before? She brought her A game, and it should just be judged for what it was at Sochi. I agree with Stojko, Weir, Lipinski, and countless others about this result.

As I have said, IF ADELINA WASN'T ATTACKED the way she has been, if it weren't made into a huge controversy of national proportion, neither Adelina nor her coaches would be giving interviews to DEFEND against all these allegations of cheating and fraud. Of course she has to compare her skate to Yuna's, she needs to explain how she deserves to win gold, and Yuna silver. :rolleye:

There is no problem with disgreement, there is a problem with disagreeing in a violent, abusive way.

Nadya · Apr 7, 2014

jaylee said:
Your opinion is garbage. How dare you call a skater a liar with no proof whatsoever? Seriously, it seems like you're trying to detract from discussion of Adelina's interview by calling Yuna a liar over something that is totally irrelevant.

Do I really need to pull up tons of interviews by DIFFERENT skaters talking about whether or not they watch the performance of their nearest competitor? The answer is usually NO, especially when their competitors skate before them. Off the top of my head, I recall Michelle Kwan talking about being in the back, closeted away, while Sarah Hughes was skating in SLC 2002, and she said she could hear the audience reaction and knew she had done well--but she didn't watch. Mao did not watch Yuna Kim skate in the 2010 Olympics FS, did not hear the exact score but knew it was a big score. Kaetlyn Osmond talked about how she never watches her competitors skate. As soon as she was done with her FS at 2013 Worlds, she was taking off her skates.

I'm not sure if Patrick Chan watched Yuzuru Hanyu skate. I seem to recall a quote saying that he heard the score and knew it was beatable before he took the ice.

It makes more sense for a skater to have watched their competitors skate if they're already done, but Yuna was the last to skate.

I dare it just fine.

I didn't mean she didn't watch it right then. I meant that she would have watched it as soon as it was possible.

You don't really need to pull up tons of interviews, I wouldn't want any more mental strain on your delicate nerves, plus I'd think these skaters lied, too.

I also don't think calling people liars is a big deal since everyone lies. It's like calling them breathers. Lying isn't a bad thing. I'm sure people have told you that you looked fine on days when you'd rather not look in the mirror. The mirror wasn't lying, they were.

Nadya · Apr 7, 2014

aa456 said:
she's wise hence she's not going to comment on it. What's the point of commenting and fueling the media who will loop her comments on repeat 24/7? Also, whenever most skaters are asked about other skater's performances, most maintain the "I do my own thing, don't really watch the competitors." It's just being politically correct to avoid controversy.

I find all this hoopla over what either of the girls said just plain silly (not saying you're doing it. just stating in general).

I don't think Adelina meant to be disrespectful to Yuna. She seems like a blunt/direct person to me and probably ended up saying what's on her mind. She may come across as disrespectful to some but i honestly think she was just being matter-of-fact about it. I also don't want to generalize but it may be a cultural thing. Based on some interviews i've read of Adelina, Julia, Irina S. and Anna they've all seemed rather direct to me and don't care to be politically correct about their comments.

I also don't think there's anything wrong with Yuna saying she was "blaffled by it." again, never specified what "it" meant (correct me if I'm wrong). She was asked about Sochi and that's how she answered. and If she hasn't seen any of Adelina's performances then she hasn't seen them. what's so wrong about it? She clearly didn't see it in Sochi. Most skaters in final flight don't see their competitors' performances.

seriously guys, if one of them gives PC answers, ppl have a problem, and if one doesn't, people still have problem!!

Logically, how could Kim be baffled by scores without seeing the performance? She could be baffled by her own scores without seeing how others have skated, but I don't think you can be baffled by your placement without seeing how others have skated.

nguyenghita · Apr 7, 2014

Sam-Skwantch said:
Really?? I'd much rather her come out and just say Adelina was over scored. I mean if she is thinking it then she should just say it. That's much more respectable in my book. I never ever thought I would have a doubt in my mind about Yuna. I'm really saddened by this and honestly hope it's not true or out of context. For the sake of her many devoted fans...she should take five minutes and see what has them callusing their finger tips!

You show your saddess too long, lol :laugh:

Before you talking nonsense about how others should say out loud what they really think, you must watch yourself back, did you really say what you think about Yuna? Basically you just want to make her like "Oh guys, see, she didn't great like many thought, she just that's bad" :rolleye:

About Yuna, that's her way to avoid all crazy media around her, it's indeed the shortest way and she sometimes answer like that, nothing wrong here.

Also, she said that in her FAN MEETING event, not an official interview

aa456 · Apr 7, 2014

Nadya said:
Logically, how could Kim be baffled by scores without seeing the performance? She could be baffled by her own scores without seeing how others have skated, but I don't think you can be baffled by your placement without seeing how others have skated.

last time I read that interview, she was asked about Sochi and she said she was baffled by it. She never said what "it" was (her placement, her scores, or the controversy). Unless there has been some additional explanation since then, which someone can clarify, i wouldn't assume anything.

jaylee · Apr 7, 2014

qwertyskates said:
Calm down. There's no distortion, when you say you're confused by the results it means it doesn't seem right to you. It most certainly isn't at all conciliatory, and Yuna never said anything abut the death threats and abuses Adelina received.

Ok, you're just determined to believe the worst of Yuna and you're fabricating reasons to hate on her.

Nadya said:
I dare it just fine.

I didn't mean she didn't watch it right then. I meant that she would have watched it as soon as it was possible.

If she didn't watch it by the time she was asked about Adelina's performances, and answered that she hadn't seen it, then she was being perfectly honest. And you have no grounds for calling her a liar.

Nadya said:
Logically, how could Kim be baffled by scores without seeing the performance? She could be baffled by her own scores without seeing how others have skated, but I don't think you can be baffled by your placement without seeing how others have skated.

Interviews take place on different dates and different times. The quote about Yuna not seeing Adelina's performance came at the Olympics. The "It was baffling" quote came after the Olympics at some fan event. And in context, her reaction was that she was happy it was over.

Meoima · Apr 7, 2014

Fan of neither: :popcorn:

Oh please, don't look at me. Feel free to continue the drama. :biggrin:

People are thinking too much, don't they?

Sam-Skwantch · Apr 7, 2014

nguyenghita said:
You show your saddess too long, lol

Before you talking nonsense about how others should say out loud what they really think, you must watch yourself back, did you really say what you think about Yuna? Basically you just want to make her like "Oh guys, see, she didn't great like many thought, she just that's bad"

About Yuna, that's her way to avoid all crazy media around her, it's indeed the shortest way and she sometimes answer like that, nothing wrong here.

Also, she said that in her FAN MEETING event, not an official interview

You and I don't think alike. I would never try to make Yuna(one of my all time favorite skaters) look bad. I simply responded to a post here stating that Yuna claimed she hadn't even watched Adelina's skate. I'm not sure what you're driving at but you are losing focus on the topic here and just attacking posters. If people are going to use quotes its probably best to site the source and context. There is no reason to scream FAN MEETING at me. I didn't know. I had never heard such a quote and found it a little odd. Still kind of do.

samkrut@mail.ru · Apr 7, 2014

Nadya said:
Slavic character, on the other hand, prizes candor and bluntness that to other cultures may appear too direct and arrogant.

Yulia excels in directness. And she shows yet another common russian feature - self-irony and self-criticism. Here Adelina is more reserved if not provoked. I was smiling listening to Yulia's post worlds interview where she described her salchow fall using the word "долбанулась" which is childish slang for "hit oneself against something" used normally in mockery.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wOOdH1dggk

CanadianSkaterGuy · Apr 7, 2014

aa456 said:
last time I read that interview, she was asked about Sochi and she said she was baffled by it. She never said what "it" was (her placement, her scores, or the controversy). Unless there has been some additional explanation since then, which someone can clarify, i wouldn't assume anything.

I would assume she was baffled by the results. Kim knows she's a better skater than Sotnikova, and after skating perfectly, she must have assumed that she would win. Same with Plushenko assuming he had won in Vancouver, after skating cleanly, and knowing that he has a quad and the leader Lysacek doesn't. In their minds, they were superior on paper, but obviously Plushenko didn't maximize his points, and Kim failed to realise that Sotnikova was getting that gold the moment Sotnikova finished her FS.

Nadya · Apr 7, 2014

CanadianSkaterGuy said:
I would assume she was baffled by the results. Kim knows she's a better skater than Sotnikova, and after skating perfectly, she must have assumed that she would win. Same with Plushenko assuming he had won in Vancouver, after skating cleanly, and knowing that he has a quad and the leader Lysacek doesn't. In their minds, they were superior on paper, but obviously Plushenko didn't maximize his points, and Kim failed to realise that Sotnikova was getting that gold the moment Sotnikova finished her FS.

I don't know if you realize that the mindset you're describing is arrogance personified.

Was it wise for Sotnikova to skip Worlds?

jaylee

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qwertyskates

jaylee

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aa456

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