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- Aug 1, 2011
A whole lot of Jumping to Conclusions based on ONE SD for S/K and three programs for I/K.
2014 Rostelecom Cup Short Dance 11/14
- Thread starter dorispulaski
- Start date
I think you're being over critical of him. Skating with Victoria doesn't let him show how good he can be.
Maybe I didn't make my point clearly - I think if you let the top ice dancers in the world just skate around, showing edges, simple stroking, doing elements with no competitive pressure, Nikita shines. Watching I/K at practice or in the warm up at competitions you could really see the quality over the other couples around them. But when it comes down to the competitive environment, he loses something.
The paso doesn't suit S/K at all,, maybe they will be more convincing in their FD. I hope I/Z can bring some of the passion from yesterday to their free dance. It needs something to elevate it from what they did at CoC.
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Friends forever :agree:
My friend who was there during SD said that S/K were fastest yesterday. At least it seemed so live. And C/B were most synchro-perfect couple. Coomes/B were really shaky and jerky, and I/Z were over the top emotional during SD and seemed so happy after their SD. He even took a picture with them, and Evan Bates signed something for him. I'm so jealous OMG.
How would you rate Katsalapov before his split with Elena? He went from good skater to very bad? Or he just is bad all throughout? I mean, he "dumped" her and apparently permanently scarred her for life
So now he must be so bad, oh wait, he was bad already oh no he used to be good now is very bad, oh wait never mind he is bad then and bad now
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You are going overboard! Over the top! Miart? That's ridiculous. Yeah all Olympic and euro medals had nothing whatsoever to do with katsalapov. He was just the worst ever. No talent. Over the top and Ridiculous. They were both great at times but mostly a waste. This is just like when I/z were 4th in their ever first sd two weeks ago!! Miart?!? Absurd over the top! Miart?!?
Do you not know? Nikita split was all his fault, and because of that, his skating abilities began to vanish due to funny karma business, and if that's not enough, his previous skills were all a fake too, Deep edges and good knee bend in the past is now considered awful and wrong, but this only applies to those who initiate partner splits like Nikita.
http://redeemingfeminism.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/feminist-meme23.png
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How would you rate Katsalapov before his split with Elena? He went from good skater to very bad? Or he just is bad all throughout? I mean, he "dumped" her and apparently permanently scarred her for life
Everyone up their game this year -except Lanotte and him-... Look at Cizeron for example.
Where he was last year, where he is now? I'm not sure how we rank Ilinykh/Katsalapov's Katsalapov with those guys...Oh please
Last year I said Nikita's twizzles are bad, Katsalapov fans said Ilinykh didn't work with him enough, this is why they are bad. When I said his spread eagle/one foot lifts are scary, they said it is not natural position for him, Elena should work with him more. They are bad because she is lazy. (Watch his edges) She -supposedly- looked old next to him, no freshness bla bla... Please tell me who is shutting their eyes to truths then and now?
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I am not.
Tiffany Zahorski used to raise Miart's level so much everyone thought he was the best ice dancer of the two (not my words, the coaches). Then, when they saw him by himself, they realised how hard Tiffany worked to put him on track. And I can see similar things now playing with Nikita. That's all. It's similar. I wouldn't say Nikita is as bad as Miart, because he's not.
Tiffany being like Elena, the two best ice dancers nowadays with basics to die for.
Is Nikita a good partner ? I don't think so or he'd have brought Viktoria to a whole new level, and he hasn't. But he can learn, I sure hope he will redeem himself by not doing mistakes like he's used of doing and has been doing for years.
He has got the looks, the carriage. All he needs now is posture, edges and steadiness.
Oh please
Yeah but really, Elena made it hard to believe it was his fault with her diva attitude and over the top showings.
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And she looks strange, saying S&K are the best ever in the world, when the Shibs have to be demonstrating every day that S&K are not even the best in their own rink, especially in the SDSome
for Shib's SD!Oh, Yes!!!!
But it is still early in the season! I hope for them all to improve!
This is just the first ever competition dance for S&K. If Marina had not over-hyped the team, we would be saying what a respectable debut this was!
And Chock & Bates are significantly better here than in SkAm! Can they improve still more?
Ilinykh will get a lecture on proper paso face from Kustarova, and she too will have a better SD next time!
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Unfortunately this time poor camera angle stops from seeing all edges and steps…
Madison Chock & Evan Bates:
Twizzles Level 4:
…first Set nicely done…small ice coverage, almost no ice coverage in second and third Set…
…Madison made Piruette in both second and third Set of Twizzles – so it should be one Level reduction – they should get Level 3, not Level 4…
Paso Doble Pattern Level 3 (Key Point 2 and 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – Evan’s minor elevation of free leg, edges in first part looked very well, last two steps were not seen thanks to camera angle, Madison didn’t execute full extension in slight steps…
…Key Point 2 – Open Mohawk – opening edge hidden behind the board (but from body position it looked like the edge was done…second edge was slight…
…Key Point 3 – nicely done, only Madison’s last Step – Left Backward Inside edge was done after some time – she didn’t change into inside edge immediately…
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 2 (Key Point 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 and 2…not full extension of Madison’s Left leg, not visible elevation of Evan’s Right leg after slide steps…
…Key Point 3 – the camera showed upper body only…
Step Sequence Level 3:
…nice and very nice edges…
…Madison lost balance at the end of One Foot Section, but she kept the edge, another fight in last Double Twizzles by her…thanks to it this part of steps was out of synchro…
…GOE +2 from 6 judges…for Madison’s loss of balance and shaky last Double Twizzle?... the overall GOE for this element was 1.89 points (clean I&Z with better Skating Skills got overall GOE +1.73 points)…
As to presentation:
Madison was less expressive and Evan was more expressive than last time, so this time I saw both of them in the dance. Madison was playful, flirtatious and visibly in good mood. Evan looked to be enjoing the time with Madison and overall there was a good mood on the ice.
The fact that seeing Short Dance with good mood with no pasion, no tension and no drama is very surprising and well, we can say original – but it would be much more suitable for another dances, not Spanish dances. Because Spanish dance style IS full od passion, tension and drama. So overall very nice program which brings good mood but far away from anything what would remind Spanish dance style (only same Spanish kind of arms movement).
Madison Chock & Evan Bates:
Twizzles Level 4:
…first Set nicely done…small ice coverage, almost no ice coverage in second and third Set…
…Madison made Piruette in both second and third Set of Twizzles – so it should be one Level reduction – they should get Level 3, not Level 4…
Paso Doble Pattern Level 3 (Key Point 2 and 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – Evan’s minor elevation of free leg, edges in first part looked very well, last two steps were not seen thanks to camera angle, Madison didn’t execute full extension in slight steps…
…Key Point 2 – Open Mohawk – opening edge hidden behind the board (but from body position it looked like the edge was done…second edge was slight…
…Key Point 3 – nicely done, only Madison’s last Step – Left Backward Inside edge was done after some time – she didn’t change into inside edge immediately…
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 2 (Key Point 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 and 2…not full extension of Madison’s Left leg, not visible elevation of Evan’s Right leg after slide steps…
…Key Point 3 – the camera showed upper body only…
Step Sequence Level 3:
…nice and very nice edges…
…Madison lost balance at the end of One Foot Section, but she kept the edge, another fight in last Double Twizzles by her…thanks to it this part of steps was out of synchro…
…GOE +2 from 6 judges…for Madison’s loss of balance and shaky last Double Twizzle?... the overall GOE for this element was 1.89 points (clean I&Z with better Skating Skills got overall GOE +1.73 points)…
As to presentation:
Madison was less expressive and Evan was more expressive than last time, so this time I saw both of them in the dance. Madison was playful, flirtatious and visibly in good mood. Evan looked to be enjoing the time with Madison and overall there was a good mood on the ice.
The fact that seeing Short Dance with good mood with no pasion, no tension and no drama is very surprising and well, we can say original – but it would be much more suitable for another dances, not Spanish dances. Because Spanish dance style IS full od passion, tension and drama. So overall very nice program which brings good mood but far away from anything what would remind Spanish dance style (only same Spanish kind of arms movement).
Elena Ilinykh & Ruslan Zhiganshin:
Step Sequence Level 3:
…second edge in Counter in the first part of steps was lighter, Ruslan’s lighter second edge in Counter inside of One Foot Section = this was also the opening edge for Bracket…
…all other edges were great and most of them very deep…
…2 - 3 moments when the couple got slightly out of synchro…
…the best Step Sequence today…four judges gave GOE +1 only, why? I know that I&Z skated second in the first Group, but did judges really expect to see something better from other couples?
Twizzles Level 4:
…such ice coverage…thanks to poor camera angle it is not well seen, but they cover so much ice with those Twizzles…
…perfect synchro in the first Set, almost perfect in the Second and Third Set…
…two judges gave GOE +1 only, this is another misunderstanding…and funny thing is that while 7 judges gave GOE +2 to I&Z, and if the placement of judges in Protocols is the same for every couple, then the same six judges gave GOE +2 to Chock & Bates (I repeat Madison was doing a Piruette in both second and third Set plus they had small ice coverage)…do you really think that Twizzles of I&Z and C&B were equal???...
Paso Doble Pattern Level 2 (Key Point 1 counted):
…Key Point 1 – very good edges, during Step 11 in one moment Ruslan went on the back part of the edge but he was able to keep the edge and saved the step…
…Key Point 2 – great opening edge in Open Mohawk, I think that turn was not continuously done as to change of foot, but I am not sure with it, and once again camera cut with no edge visible in the second part of Mohawk…
…Key Point 3 – great cross steps, good swing movement of free leg, Lena changing into Left Backward Inside edge – it took a while like in Madison’s case (but C&B got this Key Point counted even with this a little bit later done edge)…so, I don’t know why Technical panel didn’t count this part…
…what is shocking…one judges gave GOE -2 for this part…I would like to hear an explanation why this judge thinks that this Paso Doble Pattern was much worse than Kim & Minov’s Pattern when team from Korea got the lowest GOE -1…this mark was the most ridiculous thing I saw yesterday, on the other hand it only proves that some judges are putting points for anything but skating.
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 3 (Key Point 1 and 2 counted):
…Key Point 1 and 2 - well done…
…Key Point 3 – Lena’s Left Backward Inside edge was not visible and her swing movement of free leg was not very good also…
Straight line Lift Level 2:
…Ruslan didn’t kept himself on one foot for 3 seconds, because he was balancing for longer then usual, so the Level dropped down into Level 2 (like in Cup of China FD)…
As to presentation:
At this competition this was the dance with the best presentation. The most passionate (until now I didn’t find any other couple who would be as passionate like I&Z and we already saw all couples), very dynamic, dramatic. So much fire in it. It doesn’t have sense to write anything more, watch it and you will see.
I noticed some disagreement with interpretation of I&Z. I disagree with those disagreements.
http://www.dancewestchester.com/paso-doble.html
As you can see a woman can play many roles, not only cape.
As we know the couple is performing to Carmen. Carmen was a seductress, femme fatale, a passionate woman. She gets bored with Don Jose, so she goes to flirt with Escamillo – the toreador. The couple also uses Toreador part of music.
And let’s jump on the ice and watch the action – the choreography is made by Antonio Najarro, a great Spanish dancer and choreographer and it is visible that a choreo is a masterpiece.
Lena like Carmen starts to flirt with Escamillo from the beginning, she smiles, moves with her skirt and does anything possible to force him to notice her and fall into her. Escamillo is very passionate and very masculine, but keeps serious and strict, he will decide what will his action be. And Carmen continuous to flirt, not only with him but with the audience also, she simply loves to be in the middle of attention.
For the whole dance Ruslan is a toreador = matador and he is strong and passionate leader, but doesn’t loose control over situation. While Lena is Carmen who wants to seduce him and play with him like she did with Don Jose. Lena’s part can be interpreted like she did not meet Paso Doble requirements smiling too much and flirting too much, but don’t forget that she is Carmen here. Their choreographer Antonio Najaroo perfectly connected Spanish dance style (showed perfectly by Ruslan and partly by Lena) with Carmen story (with bigger attention to Lena’s part).
Step Sequence Level 3:
…second edge in Counter in the first part of steps was lighter, Ruslan’s lighter second edge in Counter inside of One Foot Section = this was also the opening edge for Bracket…
…all other edges were great and most of them very deep…
…2 - 3 moments when the couple got slightly out of synchro…
…the best Step Sequence today…four judges gave GOE +1 only, why? I know that I&Z skated second in the first Group, but did judges really expect to see something better from other couples?
Twizzles Level 4:
…such ice coverage…thanks to poor camera angle it is not well seen, but they cover so much ice with those Twizzles…
…perfect synchro in the first Set, almost perfect in the Second and Third Set…
…two judges gave GOE +1 only, this is another misunderstanding…and funny thing is that while 7 judges gave GOE +2 to I&Z, and if the placement of judges in Protocols is the same for every couple, then the same six judges gave GOE +2 to Chock & Bates (I repeat Madison was doing a Piruette in both second and third Set plus they had small ice coverage)…do you really think that Twizzles of I&Z and C&B were equal???...
Paso Doble Pattern Level 2 (Key Point 1 counted):
…Key Point 1 – very good edges, during Step 11 in one moment Ruslan went on the back part of the edge but he was able to keep the edge and saved the step…
…Key Point 2 – great opening edge in Open Mohawk, I think that turn was not continuously done as to change of foot, but I am not sure with it, and once again camera cut with no edge visible in the second part of Mohawk…
…Key Point 3 – great cross steps, good swing movement of free leg, Lena changing into Left Backward Inside edge – it took a while like in Madison’s case (but C&B got this Key Point counted even with this a little bit later done edge)…so, I don’t know why Technical panel didn’t count this part…
…what is shocking…one judges gave GOE -2 for this part…I would like to hear an explanation why this judge thinks that this Paso Doble Pattern was much worse than Kim & Minov’s Pattern when team from Korea got the lowest GOE -1…this mark was the most ridiculous thing I saw yesterday, on the other hand it only proves that some judges are putting points for anything but skating.
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 3 (Key Point 1 and 2 counted):
…Key Point 1 and 2 - well done…
…Key Point 3 – Lena’s Left Backward Inside edge was not visible and her swing movement of free leg was not very good also…
Straight line Lift Level 2:
…Ruslan didn’t kept himself on one foot for 3 seconds, because he was balancing for longer then usual, so the Level dropped down into Level 2 (like in Cup of China FD)…
As to presentation:
At this competition this was the dance with the best presentation. The most passionate (until now I didn’t find any other couple who would be as passionate like I&Z and we already saw all couples), very dynamic, dramatic. So much fire in it. It doesn’t have sense to write anything more, watch it and you will see.
I noticed some disagreement with interpretation of I&Z. I disagree with those disagreements.
http://www.dancewestchester.com/paso-doble.html
As you can see a woman can play many roles, not only cape.
As we know the couple is performing to Carmen. Carmen was a seductress, femme fatale, a passionate woman. She gets bored with Don Jose, so she goes to flirt with Escamillo – the toreador. The couple also uses Toreador part of music.
And let’s jump on the ice and watch the action – the choreography is made by Antonio Najarro, a great Spanish dancer and choreographer and it is visible that a choreo is a masterpiece.
Lena like Carmen starts to flirt with Escamillo from the beginning, she smiles, moves with her skirt and does anything possible to force him to notice her and fall into her. Escamillo is very passionate and very masculine, but keeps serious and strict, he will decide what will his action be. And Carmen continuous to flirt, not only with him but with the audience also, she simply loves to be in the middle of attention.
For the whole dance Ruslan is a toreador = matador and he is strong and passionate leader, but doesn’t loose control over situation. While Lena is Carmen who wants to seduce him and play with him like she did with Don Jose. Lena’s part can be interpreted like she did not meet Paso Doble requirements smiling too much and flirting too much, but don’t forget that she is Carmen here. Their choreographer Antonio Najaroo perfectly connected Spanish dance style (showed perfectly by Ruslan and partly by Lena) with Carmen story (with bigger attention to Lena’s part).
Penny Coomes & Nicholas Buckland:
Step Sequence Level 3:
…One Foot section – Counter, Rocker, Bracket, Double Twizzle…first Counter – very well done, Rocker – opening edge great, almost no second edge – very very slightly done, in Bracket – Penny jumps from one to another edge and instead of second Right Backward Outside edge – she shows short Inside edge and immediately no edge action on Right Leg, Double Twizzle OK
…next Mohawk – I would say that Penny had slight opening edge and no second edge
….next Counter – lovely opening edge, lighter second edge…
…Double Twizzle OK…
…Chocktaw OK…
…last turn should be probably Rocker – but it missed any edge in second part…
…to get Level 3 both partners need 7 clean difficult turns, I counted 5 clean turns for Penny and another 2 turns under question whether to count it or not…well, the panel counted it all…
…what is shocking is the fact that the couple got overall GOE +2.04 point (I&Z got GOE +1.73 points)…why and for what? Since what time not clean turns and hoop in turn is counted like better execution than I&Z’s clean, deep and simply perfect edges?
Paso Doble Pattern Level 2 (Key Point 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – I would say that Penny lost a contact with the ice with her Left leg during second slide step…
…Key Point 2 – change legs not clean, edges looked light but executed…
…Key Point 3 – good…
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 3 (Key Point 2 and 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – Penny didn’t executed first slide step, she jumps into the final extension with her free Right leg, but whole part where Right leg was travelling on the ice into full extension was missing…
Key Point 2 – quite good…
Key Point 3 – good…
Twizzles Level 1:
…Group from Feature B – leg position, Penny fixed her leg position after second rotation in the first Set and kept this leg position for almost 2.5 rotations…but this position was not achieved in the first half rotation, so it can’t be counted…
…Group from Feature A – arm position – kept in the first Set for 3 rotations only…also arm position was not fully established during first half rotation…
…Feature from Group C – third set of Twizzles from different entry edge then previous ones was done…
…Penny did three turns in the second and third Set and Nick looked to execute three turns in the third Set…
…how did it happen that one judge gave GOE +2, four judges gave GOE +1, three judges gave GOE 0 and overall GOE was +0.34 points… but the real quality of execution was GOE -1, maybe also -2…
Very impressive lift at the end, although this lift looks to have no connection to Spanish music or the program itself.
Skating Skills with 7.86 points – only 0.21 points behind I&Z are not understandable.
As to presentation:
I was very suprised…by Penny. It was good! She was able to create some kind of tension in her dance, tried to skate passionately, not only with dynamics. I like the dress until it comes to neck, in this dress it looks like that Penny has head forward – which it very bad for posture especially in Spanish dances – maybe she really has such posture and maybe not, but the dress creates and supports such idea.
While I appreciated Penny’s effort, I didn’t like Nick at all. Very bad body posture with head forward, no tension, no passion, just some wild moves into the music which looked out of control sometimes. If I would put him into some wild Latin, it could look quite OK, but not in Spanish dance.
I liked Penny’s presentation more than Madison’s today, but Nick should improve dramatically to make this Short dance better.
Component score almost on the level of I&Z didn’t reflect the reality showed on the ice.
Step Sequence Level 3:
…One Foot section – Counter, Rocker, Bracket, Double Twizzle…first Counter – very well done, Rocker – opening edge great, almost no second edge – very very slightly done, in Bracket – Penny jumps from one to another edge and instead of second Right Backward Outside edge – she shows short Inside edge and immediately no edge action on Right Leg, Double Twizzle OK
…next Mohawk – I would say that Penny had slight opening edge and no second edge
….next Counter – lovely opening edge, lighter second edge…
…Double Twizzle OK…
…Chocktaw OK…
…last turn should be probably Rocker – but it missed any edge in second part…
…to get Level 3 both partners need 7 clean difficult turns, I counted 5 clean turns for Penny and another 2 turns under question whether to count it or not…well, the panel counted it all…
…what is shocking is the fact that the couple got overall GOE +2.04 point (I&Z got GOE +1.73 points)…why and for what? Since what time not clean turns and hoop in turn is counted like better execution than I&Z’s clean, deep and simply perfect edges?
Paso Doble Pattern Level 2 (Key Point 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – I would say that Penny lost a contact with the ice with her Left leg during second slide step…
…Key Point 2 – change legs not clean, edges looked light but executed…
…Key Point 3 – good…
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 3 (Key Point 2 and 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – Penny didn’t executed first slide step, she jumps into the final extension with her free Right leg, but whole part where Right leg was travelling on the ice into full extension was missing…
Key Point 2 – quite good…
Key Point 3 – good…
Twizzles Level 1:
…Group from Feature B – leg position, Penny fixed her leg position after second rotation in the first Set and kept this leg position for almost 2.5 rotations…but this position was not achieved in the first half rotation, so it can’t be counted…
…Group from Feature A – arm position – kept in the first Set for 3 rotations only…also arm position was not fully established during first half rotation…
…Feature from Group C – third set of Twizzles from different entry edge then previous ones was done…
…Penny did three turns in the second and third Set and Nick looked to execute three turns in the third Set…
…how did it happen that one judge gave GOE +2, four judges gave GOE +1, three judges gave GOE 0 and overall GOE was +0.34 points… but the real quality of execution was GOE -1, maybe also -2…
Very impressive lift at the end, although this lift looks to have no connection to Spanish music or the program itself.
Skating Skills with 7.86 points – only 0.21 points behind I&Z are not understandable.
As to presentation:
I was very suprised…by Penny. It was good! She was able to create some kind of tension in her dance, tried to skate passionately, not only with dynamics. I like the dress until it comes to neck, in this dress it looks like that Penny has head forward – which it very bad for posture especially in Spanish dances – maybe she really has such posture and maybe not, but the dress creates and supports such idea.
While I appreciated Penny’s effort, I didn’t like Nick at all. Very bad body posture with head forward, no tension, no passion, just some wild moves into the music which looked out of control sometimes. If I would put him into some wild Latin, it could look quite OK, but not in Spanish dance.
I liked Penny’s presentation more than Madison’s today, but Nick should improve dramatically to make this Short dance better.
Component score almost on the level of I&Z didn’t reflect the reality showed on the ice.
Victoria Sinitsina & Nikita Katsalapov:
Twizzle Level 4:
…Feature from Group B – leg position – in the first Set the couple is holding the blades, BUT while Nikita catches his blade slightly before he starts rotations, Victoria is going slowly into catching her blade…so it happened that she catched her blade after a half rotation – somewhere between 0.75 and 1.00 rotation – so she didn’t established her leg position during first half turn - so the Feature shouldn’t be counted…
…arm position in the first Set – no Feature and they both have different position of arms…
…Feature from Group A – arm position – hands clasped and extended away – in my understanding extension means that also elbow should be in extension, but maybe not…4 rotations in this position…the problem was that Nikita’s arm position was not fixed – he constantly changed the level of elbow and hand position (visible when you watch his action comparing the line of boards behind him – up and down, up and down, up and up – this action after every half rotation)...it looked like he tried to stabilise himself thanks to minor arm movements…this was not good enough to be counted…
…they crossed their pattern – Feature from Group C…
…third Set not cleanly done by Nikita, but he saved it…
…out of synchro in the first Set and in the beginning of the second Set, good synchro in the second part of the second Set and without Nikita’s mistake also third Set would have good synchro…
…from all Features also change of pattern was done, while arm position was not fixed by Nikita, and leg position was not established in the first half rotation by Vika…the couple should get Level 2 for fulfilling the criteria of having 1 Difficult Additional Feature (crossed Pattern) and minus GOE because of Nikita’s not sure execution plus mistake in the third Set…
…the couple got GOE +1 from two judges and 0 from four judges – visibly those six judge were looking at Victoria all the time and didn’t notice Nikita’s Twizzles…
Step Sequence Level 2:
…Counter – light opening edge by Vika, Nikita OK…
…One Foot section – Rocker, Bracket, Counter, Double Twizzle…no second edge in Rocker, this was also the opening edge for Bracket, light second edge in Bracket, which was the opening edge for Counter, no second edge in Counter by Nikita (Vika’s edges was not seen at camera), Double Twizzle OK…
…next turn – Chocktaw – Vika lost balance in the first part, edge in first part were very good and quite deep, both had no edge in the second part of it…
…Bracket – light opening edge by Vika, very good second edge by both…
…Double Twizzle - Vika went through toe pick twice during those two rotations…
…Rocker – very good opening edge by both, very light second edge by both…
…Counter – light second edge from Rocker was opening edge for Counter, no second edge here from both and Vika changed edge through the heel of blade…
…Mohawk – good…
…well, I must say that poor technicians Penny and Nick had better steps today…I counted 5 clean turns executed by Nikita (1 turn under question of counting or not), 2 clean turns executed by Vika and 4 turns under question of counting or not…
…One Foot Section with only 1 turn cleanly executed – Double Twizzle cleanly done – this is Level 1 (for Level 2 you need two clean turns in One Foot Section)…
…the couple can be very thankful to Technical panel and home competition, because there is probably no other place in the world where they would get Level 2 for such Step Sequence…
…getting the same overall GOE like I&Z proves me that judges much more believe Zueva’s words than their own eyes…
Paso Doble Pattern Level 3 (Key Point 1 and 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – not full extension of Left leg by Vika…Nikita DIDN’T ELEVATED FREE LEG after slide steps…and don’t be angry of me but no change of edge in the second part of Step 11, at least from Nikita – they started nicely with first edge in this step but in moment when blade should change the edge – nothing happened…how this Key Point could be counted, that is behind my understanding…
…Key Point 2 – Open Mohawk – almost no opening edge…not good change of legs…
…Key Point 3 – no edge by Vika in opening Right Forward Outside edge, very very light edge by Nikita at this place…next steps with better edges, final Vika’s edge was done after long while (Lena didn’t get counted Key Point doing this)…
…well, I have to repeat that the couple must be thankful, because this can happen at home only – this Paso Doble Pattern didn’t included any well done Key Point…in other country they would get Level 1 only…
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 1 (no Key Point counted):
…Key Point 1 and 2 – the same mistakes like in the Paso Doble Pattern, this time Vika did slight edge in the second part of Step 11, Nikita didn’t do…
…Key Point 3 – wrong swing movement by Vika – watch where her free Left leg starts to move from…
Rotational Lift Level 2:
…rotational lift – lifting partner must travell across the ice – Nikita travelled in first 3.5 rotations only…
…Level 2 requirements are:
OPTION 1.a) Lifted partner sustains a Difficult Pose through at least 3 rotations or
moves through a Change of Pose
AND
Lifting partner moves through at least 4 rotations
OPTION 1.b)
Lifting partner moves through at least 5 rotations
…Nikita travelled only 3.5 rotations – so the Level should go down to Level 1…
I now that judges have in mind that both S&K and I&Z changed partners, so the level of Skating Skills should be similar, but watching them with new partners now, this is completely not true. I&Z have great and deep edges, almost all of them clean and they both look very comfortable in edges work. S&K - many of their edges are light (not only Vika, but also Nikita executes many light edges), sometimes Vika’s turns are not clean. Many many mistakes in Paso Doble Pattern by Vika and Nikita.
Overall the difference between I&Z and S&K‘s Skating Skills is much more than 0.36 points. And judges can’t excuse themselves that they didn’t have an opportunity for straight comparison while the couples skated after each other. This is another compliment from judges towards Zueva. The real yesterday’s difference in Skating Skills was more than 0.60 points.
Just for fun – if the number of judges is the same in every couple’s Protocol then judge number 5 gave GOE -2 to I&Z’s Paso Doble Pattern, the same judge gave 7.75 points for Skating Skills, but S&K got 8.50 points for Skating Skills from this judge – out of reality, no?
As to presentation:
Vika is elegant and smooth, no tension, no passion. Nikita is dynamic sometimes, but no passion, but I saw tension in Twizzles – but probably not planned. Nikita’s posture misses that pride and determination of Spanish dancers…and once again head so much forward very often – it kills elegant image completely.
They are trying to catch Spanish arm movements – but the result is not done yet – some movements are Spanish, but sometimes it is hardly defined what it is.
Marina Zueva really tried to avoid some strong and dynamic music to give kids more space to concentrate on Paso Doble pattern, but then it completely looses its sense. They skate with elegance, but no pasion, no attack or fire and this kind of presentation given to Paso Doble pattern is much more Waltz looking than Spanish looking like.
Component score was generous to them.
Overall the first competive program is behind them. I can make a positive compliment that they skated without major mistakes. It was good beginning of their competive career.
They were careful (as expected at the first competition) and far to Spanish dance style. Their program had many and many small mistakes which caused drop of Levels (and it should drop much more and it would drop in another country).
I expect that they will correct mistakes and improve in Skating Skills, because right now, their level of Skills are behind all other 4 top Russian senior couples.
What I don’t like is the fact that they really look like a copy of Tessa & Scott. I take Canadian couple like great dancers, but I am persuaded that every couple should keep their own identity and their own face, not trying to be like somebody else. In case of Vika & Nikita – Zueva still doesn’t now them if she thinks that those style is theirs.
Twizzle Level 4:
…Feature from Group B – leg position – in the first Set the couple is holding the blades, BUT while Nikita catches his blade slightly before he starts rotations, Victoria is going slowly into catching her blade…so it happened that she catched her blade after a half rotation – somewhere between 0.75 and 1.00 rotation – so she didn’t established her leg position during first half turn - so the Feature shouldn’t be counted…
…arm position in the first Set – no Feature and they both have different position of arms…
…Feature from Group A – arm position – hands clasped and extended away – in my understanding extension means that also elbow should be in extension, but maybe not…4 rotations in this position…the problem was that Nikita’s arm position was not fixed – he constantly changed the level of elbow and hand position (visible when you watch his action comparing the line of boards behind him – up and down, up and down, up and up – this action after every half rotation)...it looked like he tried to stabilise himself thanks to minor arm movements…this was not good enough to be counted…
…they crossed their pattern – Feature from Group C…
…third Set not cleanly done by Nikita, but he saved it…
…out of synchro in the first Set and in the beginning of the second Set, good synchro in the second part of the second Set and without Nikita’s mistake also third Set would have good synchro…
…from all Features also change of pattern was done, while arm position was not fixed by Nikita, and leg position was not established in the first half rotation by Vika…the couple should get Level 2 for fulfilling the criteria of having 1 Difficult Additional Feature (crossed Pattern) and minus GOE because of Nikita’s not sure execution plus mistake in the third Set…
…the couple got GOE +1 from two judges and 0 from four judges – visibly those six judge were looking at Victoria all the time and didn’t notice Nikita’s Twizzles…
Step Sequence Level 2:
…Counter – light opening edge by Vika, Nikita OK…
…One Foot section – Rocker, Bracket, Counter, Double Twizzle…no second edge in Rocker, this was also the opening edge for Bracket, light second edge in Bracket, which was the opening edge for Counter, no second edge in Counter by Nikita (Vika’s edges was not seen at camera), Double Twizzle OK…
…next turn – Chocktaw – Vika lost balance in the first part, edge in first part were very good and quite deep, both had no edge in the second part of it…
…Bracket – light opening edge by Vika, very good second edge by both…
…Double Twizzle - Vika went through toe pick twice during those two rotations…
…Rocker – very good opening edge by both, very light second edge by both…
…Counter – light second edge from Rocker was opening edge for Counter, no second edge here from both and Vika changed edge through the heel of blade…
…Mohawk – good…
…well, I must say that poor technicians Penny and Nick had better steps today…I counted 5 clean turns executed by Nikita (1 turn under question of counting or not), 2 clean turns executed by Vika and 4 turns under question of counting or not…
…One Foot Section with only 1 turn cleanly executed – Double Twizzle cleanly done – this is Level 1 (for Level 2 you need two clean turns in One Foot Section)…
…the couple can be very thankful to Technical panel and home competition, because there is probably no other place in the world where they would get Level 2 for such Step Sequence…
…getting the same overall GOE like I&Z proves me that judges much more believe Zueva’s words than their own eyes…
Paso Doble Pattern Level 3 (Key Point 1 and 3 counted):
…Key Point 1 – not full extension of Left leg by Vika…Nikita DIDN’T ELEVATED FREE LEG after slide steps…and don’t be angry of me but no change of edge in the second part of Step 11, at least from Nikita – they started nicely with first edge in this step but in moment when blade should change the edge – nothing happened…how this Key Point could be counted, that is behind my understanding…
…Key Point 2 – Open Mohawk – almost no opening edge…not good change of legs…
…Key Point 3 – no edge by Vika in opening Right Forward Outside edge, very very light edge by Nikita at this place…next steps with better edges, final Vika’s edge was done after long while (Lena didn’t get counted Key Point doing this)…
…well, I have to repeat that the couple must be thankful, because this can happen at home only – this Paso Doble Pattern didn’t included any well done Key Point…in other country they would get Level 1 only…
Paso Doble Partial Step Sequence Level 1 (no Key Point counted):
…Key Point 1 and 2 – the same mistakes like in the Paso Doble Pattern, this time Vika did slight edge in the second part of Step 11, Nikita didn’t do…
…Key Point 3 – wrong swing movement by Vika – watch where her free Left leg starts to move from…
Rotational Lift Level 2:
…rotational lift – lifting partner must travell across the ice – Nikita travelled in first 3.5 rotations only…
…Level 2 requirements are:
OPTION 1.a) Lifted partner sustains a Difficult Pose through at least 3 rotations or
moves through a Change of Pose
AND
Lifting partner moves through at least 4 rotations
OPTION 1.b)
Lifting partner moves through at least 5 rotations
…Nikita travelled only 3.5 rotations – so the Level should go down to Level 1…
I now that judges have in mind that both S&K and I&Z changed partners, so the level of Skating Skills should be similar, but watching them with new partners now, this is completely not true. I&Z have great and deep edges, almost all of them clean and they both look very comfortable in edges work. S&K - many of their edges are light (not only Vika, but also Nikita executes many light edges), sometimes Vika’s turns are not clean. Many many mistakes in Paso Doble Pattern by Vika and Nikita.
Overall the difference between I&Z and S&K‘s Skating Skills is much more than 0.36 points. And judges can’t excuse themselves that they didn’t have an opportunity for straight comparison while the couples skated after each other. This is another compliment from judges towards Zueva. The real yesterday’s difference in Skating Skills was more than 0.60 points.
Just for fun – if the number of judges is the same in every couple’s Protocol then judge number 5 gave GOE -2 to I&Z’s Paso Doble Pattern, the same judge gave 7.75 points for Skating Skills, but S&K got 8.50 points for Skating Skills from this judge – out of reality, no?
As to presentation:
Vika is elegant and smooth, no tension, no passion. Nikita is dynamic sometimes, but no passion, but I saw tension in Twizzles – but probably not planned. Nikita’s posture misses that pride and determination of Spanish dancers…and once again head so much forward very often – it kills elegant image completely.
They are trying to catch Spanish arm movements – but the result is not done yet – some movements are Spanish, but sometimes it is hardly defined what it is.
Marina Zueva really tried to avoid some strong and dynamic music to give kids more space to concentrate on Paso Doble pattern, but then it completely looses its sense. They skate with elegance, but no pasion, no attack or fire and this kind of presentation given to Paso Doble pattern is much more Waltz looking than Spanish looking like.
Component score was generous to them.
Overall the first competive program is behind them. I can make a positive compliment that they skated without major mistakes. It was good beginning of their competive career.
They were careful (as expected at the first competition) and far to Spanish dance style. Their program had many and many small mistakes which caused drop of Levels (and it should drop much more and it would drop in another country).
I expect that they will correct mistakes and improve in Skating Skills, because right now, their level of Skills are behind all other 4 top Russian senior couples.
What I don’t like is the fact that they really look like a copy of Tessa & Scott. I take Canadian couple like great dancers, but I am persuaded that every couple should keep their own identity and their own face, not trying to be like somebody else. In case of Vika & Nikita – Zueva still doesn’t now them if she thinks that those style is theirs.
Probably he or she means +2 but made a mistake gave -2... I don't have any other explanation...
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- Aug 1, 2011
Last edited:
Honestly, Cizeron is the best male dancer now. He has this amazing smoothness that leaves everyone else behind.
Video – a report also about the Short Dance – short interview with S&K and I&Z:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-dPY2aOCTA
Katsalapov & Sinitsina interview from 14th of November:
http://www.sports.ru/others/figure-skating/1024993143.html
Nikita: “I was shaky in Twizzles, but I saved them. There were mistakes of course. From technical side the program became “crumpled“. I take marks like deserved, it doesn’t have sense to argued with judges at first competition. We don’t know yet where to breath (take a break) and where to improve.“
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I don't understand it too much, did they want to talk with judges about higher marks, but thanks to first appearance at competition they didn't???
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-dPY2aOCTA
Katsalapov & Sinitsina interview from 14th of November:
http://www.sports.ru/others/figure-skating/1024993143.html
Nikita: “I was shaky in Twizzles, but I saved them. There were mistakes of course. From technical side the program became “crumpled“. I take marks like deserved, it doesn’t have sense to argued with judges at first competition. We don’t know yet where to breath (take a break) and where to improve.“
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I don't understand it too much, did they want to talk with judges about higher marks, but thanks to first appearance at competition they didn't???
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