2016 Finlandia Trophy Ladies SP

[Tutto]

Liza
Costume : NO. The skirt is short and young looking while the white stuff just looks like something an old maid would wear... not a good outfit.
Music : Mozart must be rolling in his communal grave.... One of the most beautiful slow movement from his concertos is totally destroyed here with some sort of accordion weird thingy becoming a tango for the step sequence later on... WHAT THE TANGO! I never thought I'd say this twice in my lifetime... imagine in the span of 4 SPs. I have no idea what is going on these days with trying to do such weird combinations of styles and music ...I just don't understand this at all... If I thought the costume parts were clashing, well the music sections are even worse.

:thumbsup:

 

[cathlen]

Anna - I agree love the costume and commands you attention and like some of you don't like the hip hop STSEQ.... would have been great to have the Por Una Cabeza instrumental all the way through......she didn't need that to excel herself- I love Anna - but something holds me back with her - maybe its her general skating.. I was surprised she got 69 - should have been close to Mao and Kaetlyn.....

Have you noticed that neither Mao nor Kaetlyn did 3-3? And Anna did 3Lz-3T, so her TES was already visibly higher. She totally deserved the score. I may agree that a little higher PCS for Kaetlyn or Mao wouldn't hurt though.

 

[Sugarpova]

We are just fans not judges. I do not see that Gracie has outstanding SS - many other people keep saying that. OK. What baffles me is that as soon as Liza started to have problems with jumps judges reduced her pcs dramatically down from the 2015 66-68 peak. Similar trend can be seen with Mao who to my mind should have a small but still an edge over everybody else in pcs. Gracie's pcs are somehow prtotected by judges despite her serious jumping instability.

i agree with your prev post about the pecking order
eggs are in another basket now & I doubt without the 3A she's gonna get more

as for Mao I loved this programm way better than last years.

 

[Tolstoj]

Mao underscored. should have been at least a 66. judge number 6 clearly on something giving 6 for SS. really dude? what is wrong with you?

Pogo? nice but for some judges to give her 0 instead of - GOE for that bungled combo is beyond me. totally overscored.

loved loved loved Osmond! i love her edge work, speed, spins. gorgeous skater.

Disagree, Anna's GOEs were low overall, even in the 3lo and the 2a and honestly i can't find anything wrong with those elements.

Plus in my opinion her PCS should be higher (interpretation she gave some facial expressions while i find Mao's SP a little cold), but i don't agree for the most part of these scores here, so let them go and we shall see, my podium prediction:

1. Anna Pogorilaya
2. Mao Asada
3. Elizaveta Tuktamysheva.

 

[Tolstoj]

Liza is not suffering - she just jumps somewhat worse and does not get high scores any longer. For me she is overall a similar skater to Gracie: good jumper when the jumps are good - not much to be impressed about other than that. And she used to have decent pcs 2 seasons ago while being virtually the same skater as now. I would even say that she has improved pcs wise. But with the abundance of other Russians the judges shifted her way down in pcs pecking order. She just have to bring her top jumping form back including 3A - otherwise, with combined pcs below 90 it will be a challenge for her even to clear 200. I may be wrong but let's see if tomorrow she gets pcs higher than 60 - she had 68 at 2015 Europeans and 66 at 2015 worlds.

Actually even 2 years ago she built her marks winning those minor events with new PB everytime, because her PCS were low at first (as usual for Liza, unfortunately).

One thing i don't understand about her SP this season, she used to have a huge Lutz when she does it at the very beginning of the program, and she is capable to land her 3T-3T combo in 2nd half so i would switch those two elements in order to gain more points on both the bv and the GOEs.

Mishin is playing too conservatively in my opinion.

 

[solani]

Anna - I agree love the costume and commands you attention and like some of you don't like the hip hop STSEQ.... would have been great to have the Por Una Cabeza instrumental all the way through......she didn't need that to excel herself- I love Anna - but something holds me back with her - maybe its her general skating.. I was surprised she got 69 - should have been close to Mao and Kaetlyn.....

I see your point but I kind of like the beat in the step sequence (not from a musical point of view ), Anna is best when she can attack the step sequence and the beat allows her to do that. And it pays off - level 4 with good GOE.

Regarding Elizaveta - she had problems with her levels in the step sequence (level 2) and spins (all level 3). We know she can do better and her score would have been much higher if she had hit those levels (about 2.5 - 3.5 points ...).

 

[sneakers]

Actually even 2 years ago she built her marks winning those minor events with new PB everytime, because her PCS were low at first (as usual for Liza, unfortunately).

One thing i don't understand about her SP this season, she used to have a huge Lutz when she does it at the very beginning of the program, and she is capable to land her 3T-3T combo in 2nd half so i would switch those two elements in order to gain more points on both the bv and the GOEs.

Mishin is playing too conservatively in my opinion.

obviously she isn't in top form yet to get her 3-3 backloaded, this has always been with Lisa, her PCS was always low, that 2014 season she was very consistent with the jumps and judges seem to tie her pcs with her technical capabilities, strange but true.

 

[puremagic]

I did not see Mao's combo clearly because of the camera. Understand, it was 3F-2Lo. I enjoyed her program - music was somewhat unusual but I like it and like her interpretation. Her step sequence is to die for! If she brings 3A and 3Lo into the combo, I think, this program can score 42+35=77

Take a look at this scores:
http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2014/wc2014_Ladies_SP_Scores.pdf
http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2015/wc2015_Ladies_SP_Scores.pdf

Even with 3Lo+2Lo, 3F and 3A Mao got 78.66.
Liza with 3T+3T, 3Lz and 3A earned only 77.62.

 

[Globetrotter]

We are just fans not judges. I do not see that Gracie has outstanding SS - many other people keep saying that. OK. What baffles me is that as soon as Liza started to have problems with jumps judges reduced her pcs dramatically down from the 2015 66-68 peak. Similar trend can be seen with Mao who to my mind should have a small but still an edge over everybody else in pcs. Gracie's pcs are somehow prtotected by judges despite her serious jumping instability.

Actually, I do think SS has some of the stronger SS among the active ladies. Her strength is in the ease of gaining speed and good basic gliding and ability to change direction well. But the rest of the components? IN? PE? Nope nope. Ashley deserves better PE but much lower SS, Gracie the reverse.

 

[Meoima]

I don't get why people complain about Liza's costumes this season, you all forget the horror she put on herself last season? Please the new costumes are major improvements for her.

 

[solani]

I don't get why people complain about Liza's costumes this season, you all forget the horror she put on herself last season? Please the new costumes are major improvements for her.

I agree. I think she should wear short skirts because she has really nice legs. Her waist isn't very slender compared to other female skaters, so I think it's a good idea to show off her legs. And I must say that I love the color of her new boots. Shiny white - is there a name for that color? Love it.

 

[sabinfire]

I agree. I think she should wear short skirts because she has really nice legs. Her waist isn't very slender compared to other female skaters, so I think it's a good idea to show off her legs. And I must say that I love the color of her new boots. Shiny white - is there a name for that color? Love it.

Ivory/pearl?

I think the costume is fine in comparison to what Liza typically wears.

 

[lyndichee]

Take a look at this scores:
http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2014/wc2014_Ladies_SP_Scores.pdf
http://www.isuresults.com/results/wc2015/wc2015_Ladies_SP_Scores.pdf

Even with 3Lo+2Lo, 3F and 3A Mao got 78.66.
Liza with 3T+3T, 3Lz and 3A earned only 77.62.

Liza definitely deserved the higher technical score for her jumps. On the other hand, Mao's PCS was and should have been significantly higher. Without Liza's consistency throughout the season and the 3A, the judges probably would not be giving her close to that much PCS ever again. Mao has much better spins, SS, choreography and transitions.

 

[andromache]

If Liza won't ever again have the success of her 2014-2015 season, I just hope she's happy competing and setting realistic goals for herself. Seeing skaters beat themselves up hurts my heart. Her jumps, when successful, are a thing of beauty, even though I find the rest of her skating to be lackluster.

White skates > tan skates. Bless her new white skates.

ETA: Comparing her to Gracie is a bit of a mistake, IMO, and misses the nuances of their skating. Gracie has more in her programs, better SS, and better spins. And while Gracie does have some of the best jumps out there, Liza's are better. And when Liza is kicking butt, she can sell the heck out of her somewhat empty programs. When Gracie is kicking butt, the "selling" still isn't there until all the jumps are finished. They each have pros and cons - overall, I'd say Gracie is more well-rounded than Liza - but that hardly matters when she's a headcase .

 

[noidont]

Liza is not skating with any speed, weird because in her Nebelhorn exhibition she skated with lots of speed with a sp jump layout. She is completely capable of skating faster and more powerful. I don't know what's going on here. It doesn't seem like she is intentionally holding back.

 

[Mista Ekko]

........I don't think she as ever gotten an incorrect edge call on the flip. Show me.

Judges will be judges though, you must know this

 

[Rissa]

Mao is past her peak. The program is monotonous and she looks sluggish. Her PCS is a clear warning from the judges.

To you maybe. To me, and many others, it was a fascinating program and she looks etheral. And I really can't call myself a fan of Mao as evidenced by my slamming her performance ability and cookie-cutrer FS choreo last year. This SP though? She got me, hook line and sinker. I love Pogo, much more than Mao, and I love Pogo's SP, but Mao's SP is on a completely different, higher level choreo-wise.

Lol, "warning".

Anna :
Costume: I like it.
Music : why but oh why did they feel like they needed to add some cheap beat box to the tango during the step sequence? And not only that, but while doing that, they mixed it badly and we can barely hear, at least on youtube/my computer, the main music... WHAT THE TANGO!!!!!!

To add dynamics and differentiate it from the rest of the program, to create a peak. Good decision because otherwise it would have been too monotonous sound-wise.

 

[largeman]

I just realized I never pasted the link :hslap:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x4wdz9y_161007-m-a-初戦-sp_sport (her complete SP performance starts at the 0:58 mark. Much better camerawork than the stream)

Here's an alternative video of Mao's program (thanks mikaboo for sharing in Mao's fan fest), one where you can actually see her jump combo and more importantly her face :luv17:

(You can see that her triple loop was landed somewhat roughly)

 

[Ophelia]

Actually, I think the PCS scores in this competition as a whole, is what I think the ladies deserve, unlike the crazy scores given out in Worlds 2016. None of them deserve like 9s in SS for sure but I am being harsh. If PChan and Hanyu only get high 8s or low 9s, then the ladies with strongest SS like Mao or Gold should only be having low to mid 8s.

Reading what ISU and USFA defines as SS, it's about overall skating quality as defined by clarity of technique, edge control, flow over the ice, command of edge, steps and turns, multidirectional and one foot skating, and use of effortless power to accelerate and vary speed. The key criteria here relating to speed is effortless power to accelerate and vary speed, not speed truck all the way. Which is why IMO, I find that PChan has the loveliest SS to watch and why I think Yuna Kim's SS is overrated when compared to Mao. Asada can gain speed easily through turns and edges, just that she doesn't go for great speed. Caro Kostner had the best SS among her peers but it was only after she gained precision and control over her skating - she used to be much faster as a young girl but looked like a speed truck. Asada has the variety and edge and control, just that she does not accelerate to great speed, thus that is the only check not within the SS criteria. We have lots of faster girls but how many of them look as effortless and have similar edge and turn quality?

For the most under rated SS, will suggest to rewatch Yuka Sato in the 90s for her sure command of the blades and note how quiet her blades are even when turning. That's a sure sign of how smooth and how deep the edges must be. That is SS gold standard.

Patrick Chan's SS are to die for. He has both speed, precision, and fluidity.

I'm going to disagree with you on Asada. People need to stop trying to make up excuses for her lack of speed by saying she has "control and edge and whatever". Her SS is very intricate, but she's so slow through it. Her speed actually decelerates during her SS, probably a trade-off in maintaining that quality.

 

[4everchan]

Erm. As you've said to me : I have ears. My point is that in this case, it doesn't achieve its purpose as they did the mixing badly and it's not working at all.

To you maybe. To me, and many others, it was a fascinating program and she looks etheral. And I really can't call myself a fan of Mao as evidenced by my slamming her performance ability and cookie-cutrer FS choreo last year. This SP though? She got me, hook line and sinker. I love Pogo, much more than Mao, and I love Pogo's SP, but Mao's SP is on a completely different, higher level choreo-wise.

Lol, "warning".



To add dynamics and differentiate it from the rest of the program, to create a peak. Good decision because otherwise it would have been too monotonous sound-wise.