2017-18 State of Russian Ladies skating

[Sam-Skwantch]

lol...Yulia has been thru countless hours of instruction and has certainly soaked in training techniques from those coaches. She was a bit of a mentor herself several times but especially in the Sochi group where kids looked up to her. I’m sure she’ll be an excellent source of knowledge to aspiring skaters. There is nothing unusual about this and there is so much she can share with people. Elena has already done clinics and don’t forget she was once a pretty decent singles skater herself.

In my area we have current NHL and International figure skaters who come and put on masterclasses every summer. They are very helpful and fun and I’ve never heard a single complaint.

 

[tjb]

lol...Yulia has been thru countless hours of instruction and has certainly soaked in training techniques from those coaches. She was a bit of a mentor herself several times but especially in the Sochi group where kids looked up to her. I’m sure she’ll be an excellent source of knowledge to aspiring skaters. There is nothing unusual about this and there is so much she can share with people.

there is might be nothing unusual for the US, but certainly not for russia. you can't be a coach here without a proper education.
and honestly it really worries me. first it was just plushy, but now it's more of them. how can they teach kids without a basic knowledge of pedagogy?
these people just charging money for ignorance and trying to make some rubles on their famous names.
they don't even bother to recieve an education before opening something called "academy"

 

[dante]

I think it started with Plushenko who was missing his alma mater Lesgaft State Physical Education Academy and decided to call his school an academy. Someone thought it's a new trend and called Lipnitskaya's school an academy too.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

there is might be nothing unusual for the US, but certainly not for russia. you can't be a coach here without a proper education.
and honestly it really worries me. first it was just plushy, but now it's more of them. how can they teach kids without a basic knowledge of pedagogy?
these people just charging money for ignorance and trying to make some rubles on their famous names.
they don't even bother to recieve an education before opening something called "academy"

It’s a four week class in March isn’t it? Are they forcing local skaters to attend against their will or something?

Ya know...not everyone is trying to win Russian Nationals every time they lace up. For most who skate it is not going to be in the cards. These classes and interactions are often highlights for skaters and can have a lasting impact. The fact that you’re offended that a girl who worked her tail off and gave her heart and soul to represent her country at the Olympics is trying to make a living by helping develop that same sport is really baffling to me. Maybe everyone will share your feelings and no one will sign up....but I doubt it.

I’d certainly not pass a chance up to ask Yulia to help me improve my spins! Especial my Camel spin which is funny haha!

 

[EdgeCall]

I remember when Robin Szolkowy started coaching right after his active career there was also talk that he has no formal education and should first go to school again. Then again he has a lot more personal experience and Mozer as a mentor.

 

[hanca]

This. With all respect I doubt that Elena or Yulia have any idea about body mechanics, proper jumping technique or physics attached to the sport (which is really important and help prevent injuries). Lambiel at least started with choreography and majority of his pupils came to him from other coaches and they already had basics and technique. Unless Elena will teach ice dance. In this case yes please because Russian ice dance field needs it

Well, Elena used to land triples before she switched to ice dance. There was youtube of her skating at that time. Yulia - we know what she could do in her best years. I don’t think you can manage triples without having a clue about body mechanics. If you do something roughly 15 years, you do know a lot about it without any formal education.

 

[skatenewbie]

this

thank you!

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Well, Elena used to land triples before she switched to ice dance. There was youtube of her skating at that time. Yulia - we know what she could do in her best years. I don’t think you can manage triples without having a clue about body mechanics. If you do something roughly 15 years, you do know a lot about it without any formal education.

Baby Lena

https://youtu.be/GYolQHaMbpI

That cantilever tho :yes2:

 

[Shayuki]

Well, Elena used to land triples before she switched to ice dance. There was youtube of her skating at that time. Yulia - we know what she could do in her best years. I don’t think you can manage triples without having a clue about body mechanics. If you do something roughly 15 years, you do know a lot about it without any formal education.

Well... Judging by the difference between former skater-commentators and coach-commentators, you have to wonder if one actually knows a lot about it.

Yulia herself is not a great example of managing triples, also - Her technique in fact even during her olympic season was a ticking time bomb and one could see that they wouldn't last.

There also is a big difference between knowing how to do something versus knowing how to teach someone to be able to do something. Some teaching method that worked for Yulia might work for some, but other skaters might require a completely different approach that Yulia has no experience of - What would she do then? I also wonder about something simple like Yulia herself being very blessed when it comes to flexibility - How does she deal with skaters who aren't? Does she know about the required approaches in that regard?


It's fine and all for a casual, fun event where you get to meet some of your heroes, but if I personally had to choose, I'd pick actual coaches over former skaters every time.

 

[Sam-Skwantch]

Well... Judging by the difference between former skater-commentators and coach-commentators, you have to wonder if one actually knows a lot about it.

Yulia herself is not a great example of managing triples, also - Her technique in fact even during her olympic season was a ticking time bomb and one could see that they wouldn't last.

There also is a big difference between knowing how to do something versus knowing how to teach someone to be able to do something. Some teaching method that worked for Yulia might work for some, but other skaters might require a completely different approach that Yulia has no experience of - What would she do then?


It's fine and all for a casual, fun event where you get to meet some of your heroes, but if I personally had to choose, I'd pick actual coaches over former skaters every time.

So you wouldn’t let Eteri coach you :shocked:

 

[Shayuki]

So you wouldn’t let Eteri coach you :shocked:

Right, I guess I do mistakenly consider her an actual coach. But even then there's this "until this person proves otherwise" factor.

 

[russianfan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obR2TAVXzXA

i hope Alina will show them what mistake they've made by not mentioning her there
also funny thing is that they've separated medals earned by SU/Russia in the table if we will sum them it will be clear which country really owns skating :clapper:

 

[QueenOfTheRoad]

.... first it was just plushy, but now it's more of them. how can they teach kids without a basic knowledge of pedagogy?
these people just charging money for ignorance and trying to make some rubles on their famous names.
they don't even bother to recieve an education before opening something called "academy"

Hasn't Plushenko graduated from the University of Physical Education and Sport? I don't know how curriculum is in Russia, but in my home country you would have got both knowledge of pedagogy and knowledge to be a coach (i have friends who studied at these kind of uni and now are teachers) . What is different in Russia? Do you need something additional to the Uni to be a coach?

 

[hanca]

Well... Judging by the difference between former skater-commentators and coach-commentators, you have to wonder if one actually knows a lot about it.

Yulia herself is not a great example of managing triples, also - Her technique in fact even during her olympic season was a ticking time bomb and one could see that they wouldn't last.

There also is a big difference between knowing how to do something versus knowing how to teach someone to be able to do something. Some teaching method that worked for Yulia might work for some, but other skaters might require a completely different approach that Yulia has no experience of - What would she do then? I also wonder about something simple like Yulia herself being very blessed when it comes to flexibility - How does she deal with skaters who aren't? Does she know about the required approaches in that regard?


It's fine and all for a casual, fun event where you get to meet some of your heroes, but if I personally had to choose, I'd pick actual coaches over former skaters every time.

Most of Russian coaches were skaters. Not all, but the big majority was.

 

[Shayuki]

Most of Russian coaches were skaters. Not all, but the big majority was.

So the majority of Russian coaches aren't coaches? Can that be true?

Being a coach and a former skater isn't exclusive.

Eteri has a degree from Academy of Physical Education.

Oh, so she even is a coach? Well, then I guess what I said about that is pointless.

 

[ejnsofi]

So you wouldn’t let Eteri coach you :shocked:

Eteri has a degree from Academy of Physical Education. And fact that you're trained to do jumps and spins doesn't mean you actually know how to teach them. If you have experience sure you can help yourself and adjust some aspects of technique to your needs (like entrance and exit of jump, way to change spin position, the lineup of stsq etc.) but it's totally different from teaching. I'm an excellent swimmer - I know how to adjust my body in water and I feel when I should stop pushing myself. I can feel when I'm off the line and when my recurrence was not right. I've been swimming many years but I wouldn't dare to teach kids how to do it as it's a great responsibility and I know I don't have a proper knowledge and training to do so.

 

[Spirals for Miles]

Even Tatiana Tarasova was a skater, though quite a long time ago

 

[Lily flowers]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obR2TAVXzXA

i hope Alina will show them what mistake they've made by not mentioning her there
also funny thing is that they've separated medals earned by SU/Russia in the table if we will sum them it will be clear which country really owns skating :clapper:

I’m guessing the video was edited before Europeans, since they mention Zhenya being undefeated. I think if it was made after, they would mention her as well.

 

[dante]

I tend to agree with tjb.

Plushenko was trained by one of the greatest theorists of figure skating for 20 years.
Plushenko has been very serious about coaching from the beginning, he initially aimed to raise a champions.
Plushenko is rich, he's much less dependent on sponsors.
Plushenko is more experienced in business, he knows when something goes wrong and he needs to take the initiative.

I'm not saying that someone's screwing Yulya over, but I still got the feeling that her name is being traded.

also funny thing is that they've separated medals earned by SU/Russia in the table if we will sum them it will be clear which country really owns skating :clapper:

RU1, URS, EUN, RUS and OAR are always separated, unless it's a statistics related to doping.

 

[tjb]

So the majority of Russian coaches aren't coaches? Can that be true?

Being a coach and a former skater isn't exclusive.

i think all of russian coaches were skaters in the past. i can't remember a single person who wasn't a skater.
but to become a coach you also need to recieve a sports education. many of the athletes are learning in the universitys during their careers. medvedeva for example became a student of a state university of physycal education this year, because she wants to be a coach in the future. but after university you only receiving a lower level licence, there is additional education required (and some low level coaching expirience) to get a higher level licence to become an actual coach.
i don't think that plushenko has a high level coaching licence.
and people like lipnitskaya and illinykh they don't even recieved a basic education

eteri is an actual coach of the highest category