2018 Four Continents Short Dance

[slider11]

I agree with you. Does the lack of height difference affect their twizzles? They've made other errors this season but that's been the most common one. I'm no skater, but I can't really see how height would be a problem for that, especially since their twizzles were so good last season.

The most common lack of height difference related problem is normally with lifts, right? I mean, in pairs also with twists, but lifts are the big one in dance. They haven't been having problems with the lifts - all levels fours this season IIRC. Would the lack of height difference affect step sequences and patterns? I'd think it helps to be somewhat similar in height in terms of matching lines, etc.

They definitely need to figure some things out, but I wouldn't jump to splitting up yet, especially since there won't necessarily be partners available who are the perfect fit.

I know it's a long debate about limitations with sibling skaters - pros and cons. I just think the Parsons are fighting the sibling and the height thing. It seems like they hold back their power and dynamic presence at times. Maybe that has nothing to do with being related or being close in height. And obviously twizzles have nothing to do with any of it. I just see such potential!

 

[Ic3Rabbit]

M/C and the Parsons look shaky, insecure and not polished. I was hoping for a better senior debut from them. A coaching change and packaging might be in order. The Parsons to Marina and M/C to Gadbois?

I would never send M/C to Gadbois, it's doubtful they would be taken on there as H/D are already there, I'd send them to Novi.

Parsons I would love to see work with Tanith and Charlie with some help from Ben.

 

[SnowWhite]

I know it's a long debate about limitations with sibling skaters - pros and cons. I just think the Parsons are fighting the sibling and the height thing. It seems like they hold back their power and dynamic presence at times. Maybe that has nothing to do with being related or being close in height. And obviously twizzles have nothing to do with any of it. I just see such potential!

I mean if the right partner, even the right partner for one of them, was around, but I don't see a point in splitting if it's to pair up with skaters below their level.

 

[cohkaix]

FD STO:
http://www.isuresults.com/results/season1718/fc2018/SEG008.HTM

 

[Mrs. P]

I agree with you. Does the lack of height difference affect their twizzles? They've made other errors this season but that's been the most common one. I'm no skater, but I can't really see how height would be a problem for that, especially since their twizzles were so good last season.

The most common lack of height difference related problem is normally with lifts, right? I mean, in pairs also with twists, but lifts are the big one in dance. They haven't been having problems with the lifts - all levels fours this season IIRC. Would the lack of height difference affect step sequences and patterns? I'd think it helps to be somewhat similar in height in terms of matching lines, etc.

They definitely need to figure some things out, but I wouldn't jump to splitting up yet, especially since there won't necessarily be partners available who are the perfect fit.

All great points. I also think this is a huge learning experience for Wheaton. The coaches have to learn eventually how to coach senior-level teams. Wheaton has been great at promoting strong basics and technical ability. That is what help the Shibs through even with their struggles. I'm confident both teams will get through this. The problem here seems to be nerves and confidence not a lack of technical ability.

i also value diversity in coaching styles. U.S. Ice Dance need not always be a inner-Detroit thing.

 

[Barb]

Kana and Chris are in second place?! Yay!! Fabulous!!! And it seems that finally they got the rhumba pattern L4

 

[Heleng]

I don't buy the whole Parsons need new partners thing. Yes they are similar in height and that creates challenges -- but they are super well-matched and their high skating quality is similar.

Anyway, this moment brought to you by Cognitive Dissonance.

:agree: Well said, Mrs. P, and I also think they have a charming natural ease and connection with each other. They don't look at all alike, so it's a different kind of connection on ice than say the Shibs, but it's a quality unique to them that would be lost with other partners.

 

[Anyasnake]

I caught up ! You know the level in Ice Dance is crazy when you watch 4CC on Olympic year and the teams are Olympic level.

H/B : I agree with Ben. They have to let themselves go because the technical is there, but they won't get PCS if they are restrained. They are so strong now it's time to focus on having fun on the ice.

M/R : Oooooh yeah. I wanted them on the podium I hope it'll stay that way, they look trained, confident, ready for the Games and have great programs this year !

S/F : They have such a strong technical palette ! And an ease on the ice. Not a surprise in 3rd, because they've already convinced me during the past competitions. I really could see them future Canadian champions sooner than expected.

M/C : I still have the "refined/polished" issue, because you look at their feet they have some great edges. And they are not restrained, that adds to the performance. But really, I need refinement in the packaging so the look classy (without being tacky). But strong team.

W/L : They have the energy, sometimes sliiightly rough around the edges, but great posture (especially from him) and comittment. I really like them !

P/P : Too bad about the twizzles. They have some crazy edges too. Again a slight issue (IMO obviously) with the whole packaging.

 

[GGFan]

I couldn't watch live but I had to drop in to pay tribute to the real star of the competition: Jean-Luc's back It's so noticeable when you're watching the performances :luv17:

 

[NoNameFace]

I couldn't watch live but I had to drop in to pay tribute to the real star of the competition: Jean-Luc's back It's so noticeable when you're watching the performances :luv17:

he's one of a kind, his ability of integration the flow and control of the movement on edges is incredible - it's like Alina's level on picture taken at Euros backstage: eating, talking to the phone, talking to Evgenia, stretching and peeling an orange, Jean-Luc has it all at the same time. And yeah, his posture is probably the best out there in the current field, no arms flailing or trying too hard to be cool in terms of expression. He's that 'fireball'

 

[NoNameFace]

I don't buy the whole Parsons need new partners thing. Yes they are similar in height and that creates challenges -- but they are super well-matched and their high skating quality is similar.

Anyway, this moment brought to you by Cognitive Dissonance.

like usually, totally agree - it's the same song that was played for Hawayek/Baker and Aldridge/Eaton maaaany times before, yet it looks like H/B could have found a new ground for themselves and Aldridge/Eaton are getting back together. It's often non-related to the height difference/frame, posture difference between partners to make a strong team for Ice Dance - I'd risk a statement that it's far more difficult to find two skaters with equal skill, way of movement and quality matching than finding partners having 'universally acceptable/appraised' height/frame difference, the first mentioned being more important and fundamental for building a partnership.

with Parsons, I never have this notion of siblings skating - they are looking very mature and sophisticated already in terms of presentation for me, like a lot of junior-to-senior teams never looked; they have their jitters in transition period and have to refine more their technique, which should not be automatically linked to their little height difference. For me, it's the term of right material and hard work on it to be put, not the physical obstacles; they are for me actually one of few young teams that have same level of energy/dynamic going in both partners.

 

[Crossover]

I caught up ! You know the level in Ice Dance is crazy when you watch 4CC on Olympic year and the teams are Olympic level.

H/B : I agree with Ben. They have to let themselves go because the technical is there, but they won't get PCS if they are restrained. They are so strong now it's time to focus on having fun on the ice.

M/R : Oooooh yeah. I wanted them on the podium I hope it'll stay that way, they look trained, confident, ready for the Games and have great programs this year !

S/F : They have such a strong technical palette ! And an ease on the ice. Not a surprise in 3rd, because they've already convinced me during the past competitions. I really could see them future Canadian champions sooner than expected.

M/C : I still have the "refined/polished" issue, because you look at their feet they have some great edges. And they are not restrained, that adds to the performance. But really, I need refinement in the packaging so the look classy (without being tacky). But strong team.

W/L : They have the energy, sometimes sliiightly rough around the edges, but great posture (especially from him) and comittment. I really like them !

P/P : Too bad about the twizzles. They have some crazy edges too. Again a slight issue (IMO obviously) with the whole packaging.

You read my mind, especially on S/F? You sum up the competition very well. :agree:

 

[SnowWhite]

like usually, totally agree - it's the same song that was played for Hawayek/Baker and Aldridge/Eaton maaaany times before, yet it looks like H/B could have found a new ground for themselves and Aldridge/Eaton are getting back together. It's often non-related to the height difference/frame, posture difference between partners to make a strong team for Ice Dance - I'd risk a statement that it's far more difficult to find two skaters with equal skill, way of movement and quality matching than finding partners having 'universally acceptable/appraised' height/frame difference, the first mentioned being more important and fundamental for building a partnership.

with Parsons, I never have this notion of siblings skating - they are looking very mature and sophisticated already in terms of presentation for me, like a lot of junior-to-senior teams never looked; they have their jitters in transition period and have to refine more their technique, which should not be automatically linked to their little height difference. For me, it's the term of right material and hard work on it to be put, not the physical obstacles; they are for me actually one of few young teams that have same level of energy/dynamic going in both partners.

That's a good point. Going by ISU bios, H/B are even a bit closer in height that P/P. And even Tessa and Scott have only about an inch more in height difference. Smart/Diaz have a significantly smaller height difference, and when Adria was with Sara, they were identical in height to Rachel and Michael. So it should be workable.

 

[Barb]

That's a good point. Going by ISU bios, H/B are even a bit closer in height that P/P. And even Tessa and Scott have only about an inch more in height difference. Smart/Diaz have a significantly smaller height difference, and when Adria was with Sara, they were identical in height to Rachel and Michael. So it should be workable.

Really? wow, Rachel looks so tall but apparently she is only 1.60m

 

[dorispulaski]

Michael Parsons should try those thick soles "elevator" platform skates that Stavisky used to use to look a little taller than Denkova. I think Jean-Luc already is It takes a while to adapt though.

....
M/C : I still have the "refined/polished" issue, because you look at their feet they have some great edges. And they are not restrained, that adds to the performance. But really, I need refinement in the packaging so the look classy (without being tacky). But strong team.

....

P/P : Too bad about the twizzles. They have some crazy edges too. Again a slight issue (IMO obviously) with the whole packaging.

The one thing I would not go to Linichuk for is help with packaging, especially if your goal is "not tacky'"

 

[lappo]

Michael Parsons should try those thick soles "elevator" platform skates that Stavisky used to use to look a little taller than Denkova. I think Jean-Luc already is It takes a while to adapt though.




The one thing I would not go to Linichuk for is help with packaging, especially if your goal is "not tacky'"

I SO agree with you! I really hope that the WISA guys will get more than this help from the federation as both teams have clearly showed their potential...

 

[Anyasnake]

I SO agree with you! I really hope that the WISA guys will get more than this help from the federation as both teams have clearly showed their potential...

When they skate you see them trying a lot, whether it's in the expression or in the skating itself. However, it works in the skating and that is why it needs to be polished over the years. The goal is to make it look like it's so easy for you - you get all the points.

In the packaging, something more natural would work for them I guess... they have to find themselves as skaters. They are still young, but a sibling team like P/P has to do the job twice as much as a regular team. There is a whole artistic side that cannot be ignored when you are out of juniors. But if the Shibs managed to succeed, they can do it, and probably use some tips !

So, maybe it would be nice to get outside help, not necessarily from skaters, and perhaps considering taking the next steps in skating : maybe a change of coaches ? Because the next years are going to be decisive for US skaters, the field is too massive.

 

[lappo]

When they skate you see them trying a lot, whether it's in the expression or in the skating itself. However, it works in the skating and that is why it needs to be polished over the years. The goal is to make it look like it's so easy for you - you get all the points.

In the packaging, something more natural would work for them I guess... they have to find themselves as skaters. They are still young, but a sibling team like P/P has to do the job twice as much as a regular team. There is a whole artistic side that cannot be ignored when you are out of juniors. But if the Shibs managed to succeed, they can do it, and probably use some tips !

So, maybe it would be nice to get outside help, not necessarily from skaters, and perhaps considering taking the next steps in skating : maybe a change of coaches ? Because the next years are going to be decisive for US skaters, the field is too massive.

I think they need a bit more time to adjust to their senior status, something that in ID usually requires more time than in singles. I'm all for the help from whoever can truly help them, i.e working with new choreographers to add to their dancing vocabulary would be very good IMO, now that they are young. The reasonable part of my brain agrees with the coaching change, the "fairy-tale lover" other half of my brain would truly love them to become the frontrunners of WISA as an established ice dance school in the USA. But ypu are right and I hope that they make the best choices in their best interests and that they receive the best of support!

 

[labgoat]

I mean if the right partner, even the right partner for one of them, was around, but I don't see a point in splitting if it's to pair up with skaters below their level.

I think the Parsons could do quite well if they took a path more like Sinead & John Kerr. They need to burn the SP costumes or give them back to Daniel Doran from 1989. My sis and I used to call them skaters doing toothpaste commercials.

https://youtu.be/gLI1IYA0RuE