2019-20 Russian Ladies' Figure Skating

[flanker]

I think Sasha and Alina is likely. One huge star + the rising prodigy.

Are there any criteria on how skaters are chosen for Japan Open? I know that it‘s a team competition, a bit like WTT, so I thought there might be some rules on how to choose skaters.

That's what I would like to know too. Is it the organizer's thing? When I look at the last year, it seems to me that for all three teams there was one strong man/lady and one - now I'm out of definitions, because how to put skaters like Oda, Vasiljevs, Abbott and Masha Sotskova and Mariah Bell in one box (I see there an exception of Japan ladies, because at that time Kaori and Satoko could heve been seen as equal to me).

 

[Tolstoj]

It's absolutely moronic to put Nastia on the reserve national team and then not give her a senior Grand Prix. Doing this stupid move of course got people's hopes up like mine that she would get two Grand prix's let alone one. That didn't even happen. They should have just put Masha and Sima on the reserve team and left it at that.

No way will Anastasia skate juniors this upcoming year. Let her skate some lower-level senior events Challengers open skates Russian Nationals and Cup of Russia. If they put her in juniors and she bombed or went up against Alysa Liu who has multiple triple axels and got beaten by her Rusfed would send Nastya to Siberia! In other words Juniors is a no-win situation for Anastasia. And her being 16 turning 17 next season against 14 year old girls would put extra pressure on Anastasia that she does not need.

I think this could also be a response to some backlash the Fed got when Sima didn't go to Nationals despite having one of the highest SB internationally (up to that point), there was an article that criticized the process at domestic competitions.

Sotskova maybe should have stayed out considering her disappointing season despite having plenty of opportunities to come back, but i guess they want to give her another chance due to world standings.

It could also be (doubt) a way to balance the number of Moscow skaters vs SPB skaters: if you give all the spots to Eteri skaters + CSKA spots, then SPB will always have less spots.

Bad luck for Gubanova: she bombed the only challenger event (Tallinn Trophy) where scores were bigger and the competition wasn't as tough, while Sima did her best there and won, and due to RusFed's selection process she gets the GP spot thanks to that PB.

 

[Lunalovesskating]

The one thing I am excited about is Evgenia and Serafima being together at Skate Canada! These two had such an adorable friendship during juniors and funnilly enough both said during juniors that their favorite jump is the Salchow and no they are trying to learn to jump a 4S at the same time

 

[Scott512]

I think this could also be a response to some backlash the Fed got when Sima didn't go to Nationals despite having one of the highest SB internationally (up to that point), there was an article that criticized the process at domestic competitions.

Sotskova maybe should have stayed out considering her disappointing season despite having plenty of opportunities to come back, but i guess they want to give her another chance due to world standings.

It could also be (doubt) a way to balance the number of Moscow skaters vs SPB skaters: if you give all the spots to Eteri skaters + CSKA spots, then SPB will always have less spots.

Bad luck for Gubanova: she bombed the only challenger event (Tallinn Trophy) where scores were bigger and the competition wasn't as tough, while Sima did her best there and won, and due to RusFed's selection process she gets the GP spot thanks to that PB.

So a freaking Challenger event like Tallin is more important than Russian Nationals? I like how people and the Russian Federation make up the the rules as they go along.

Sima did not even qualify for Russian national 6 months ago. so she couldn't even break into the 16 girls that skated at Russian Nationals. That alone should disqualify her from getting a senior Grand Prix event. How do you go from not qualifying for Russian Nationals to even getting a Grand Prix event? Lol. Russian Federation found a way. WS and SB should be wiped away if you can't even make your own Nationals event of 16 ladies.

Alot of pressure on Sima now let's see what she does. Open skates will be very interesting. She better be in good form. Masha too. I hope Masha brings some fire and desire this season that was lacking last season. it's of course important to be a well-rounded person like she is and going to University is very important. But I and many others got the feeling that she lost interest in figure skating last season. Is that rekindled? We will find out.

 

[Lunalovesskating]

As far as I remember Challenger assignments are usually published a few weeks before each challenger. So we will probably know the assignments around August-September.
I hope Evgenia goes to Nebelhorn Trophy or Ondrej Nepela, because Autumn Classics is one week after Russian Test Skates and back to back skates are just not ideal.
I also wonder if they will split all of Eteri's Seniors up for the Challengers or if we will see maybe two at the same Challenger.

 

[Scott512]

I am still furious. Let's face it, as much as I love Sotskova and Sakhanovich, I feel their GP spots are wasted opportunities. Gubanova could have shined here. The girl has potential to medal at Worlds for crying out loud.

Agreed jontor.

But just trying to figure out Nastya getting the shaft again is like beating your head against the wall or spitting into the wind. For them to reward Maria and Sima with grands prix events after not even putting them on the national team or the reserve team is bemusing to me. The worst thing they did was put Gubanova on the Russian national team as a reserve. They should have just left her out in the cold like they usually do.

Hoping Nastya can skate cleaner this year than she ever has. Her beautiful skating is wonderful she needs to be cleaner and more consistent. She has a lot of pressure on her tiny shoulders even if she's only skating and challengers this season. She has to know she has no wiggle room unlike others.

 

[Tolstoj]

So a freaking Challenger event like Tallin is more important than Russian Nationals? I like how people and the Russian Federation make up the the rules as they go along.

Sima did not even qualify for Russian national 6 months ago. so she couldn't even break into the 16 girls that skated at Russian Nationals. That alone should disqualify her from getting a senior Grand Prix event. How do you go from not qualifying for Russian Nationals to even getting a Grand Prix event? Lol. Russian Federation found a way. WS and SB should be wiped away if you can't even make your own Nationals event of 16 ladies.

Alot of pressure on Sima now let's see what she does. Open skates will be very interesting. She better be in good form. Masha too. I hope Masha brings some fire and desire this season that was lacking last season. it's of course important to be a well-rounded person like she is and going to University is very important. But I and many others got the feeling that she lost interest in figure skating last season. Is that rekindled? We will find out.

It is an ISU competition, so for ISU it is more important than Nationals. Those are the same rules as last season: for instance Samodurova got two spots last year despite finishing 11th at Nationals. Maybe it's for the better, cause there are a lot of controversies on how domestic competitions goes.

I remember last year Gubanova and other CSKA skaters were pushed big times at early domestic competitions despite frankly disappointing performances, while Sakhanovich was a bit unlucky with the draw, she had the toughest cup of russia events.

There is pressure on all the skaters as always, i'm confident Sima will do her best cause she is such an hard worker, and she trusts her coach.

 

[Jontor]

With the 10 GP girls already clear for RusNats. Which girls can we expect to fight for the remaining 8 spots at Senior Russian Nationals?

I expect from Juniors: Tarakanova, Vasilieva, Sinitsyna, Kanysheva, Tarusina

From last years Rusnats: Gubanova (!!), Guliakova, Nugumanova, Panenkova, Talalaikina (I really hope to see her again, she has potential)

After 13 years of RusNats, I can't see Leonova qualify a 14th time this year. Sorry Alena.

Who am I forgetting??

 

[nussnacker]

Everything is possible, but still, Rika was hardly able to do two clean 3As in one program during the last season, so I'm not yet on the boat of two clean 3As plus one 4S (even UR) in one program.

She did it twice last season though at challenger and NHK, but that was after she bombed her short before on both events.
I would say it's more accurate to say Rika didn't manage to perform both clean short and free one the same event even once last year.
Yeah, I mean me too, I can't necessarily bet on Rika's consistency right now, but she seems determined to do that, would be interesting to watch nevertheless. :confused2:

I think another thing is how important consistency will be this season. In a way, a lot of success of Eteri students comes from actually performing their planned content consistently, and even if some might potentially have weaker TES (rarely, but that happens), the fact that the girls manage to perform their content cleanly (most of the time) seems to be a crucial thing going forward. Aka, I mean, it's not about what's planned, but what's actually landed =)

 

[Fluture]

It seems Sasha‘s 4T got more consistent towards the end of the season:

https://www.instagram.com/talented_skaters/p/By94k2kDh__/?igshid=1bq32gk1rtgmh

Would be interesting to see a statistic for her and Anna‘s 4Lz

 

[Arbitrary]

It seems Sasha‘s 4T got more consistent towards the end of the season:

https://www.instagram.com/talented_skaters/p/By94k2kDh__/?igshid=1bq32gk1rtgmh

Would be interesting to see a statistic for her and Anna‘s 4Lz

Internationally Anna landed Qlutz only once. Few times more when skating for local competitions.

Sasha landed twice internationally but did land few more solid 4T.

Lilibeth landed her 4S only once also.

When any of three crashed a quad judges happily dumped their PCS also. I see it because any quad is considered a trick for girls yet.

 

[hanca]

I am still furious. Let's face it, as much as I love Sotskova and Sakhanovich, I feel their GP spots are wasted opportunities. Gubanova could have shined here. The girl has potential to medal at Worlds for crying out loud.

If Gubanova really wanted a spot at GP, she could have skated at three challengers last season and make sure that her season best is high enough. Her season best is lower than Sakhanovich’s season best, so why should she be more deserving? Based on what? Last season it was Sakhanovich who was treated unfairly by the system. She did not get to the nationals while having much better scores than several of those who qualified to the nationals only because they had GP events. Then they skated badly at the GP events and at the nationals... it wasn’t fair, but it was how the system was set up. So this season it is Sakhanovich who benefits from the system.

If I was Russian federation, I would re-think the system of qualifying to the nationals. I wouldn’t give automatic spot every lady who has a GP event; I would make a condition that they have to score at the GP event at least 190 otherwise they will have to qualify for the nationals through Russian cups like anyone else. Relatively speaking, 190 is not that high, even Russian juniors can manage that, but it would not waste spots at the nationals on skaters who underperform. Panenkova, Tsurskaya and Sotskova should have never qualified to the nationals last year. Panenkova scored 168 and 161 at her GP events and for that she got to the nationals, Tsurskaya scored 149 and 159 and for that she got to the nationals. Sotskova 176 and 177 and got to the nationals. And then Sakhanovich didn’t get to the nationals even though her season best at the challenger event was over 200. How fair is that?

 

[Vandevska]

It seems Sasha‘s 4T got more consistent towards the end of the season:

https://www.instagram.com/talented_skaters/p/By94k2kDh__/?igshid=1bq32gk1rtgmh

Would be interesting to see a statistic for her and Anna‘s 4Lz

It seems like also as time went on she started relying more on height instead of rotation speed. Which is great because no matter how much her body doesn't change, the rotation speed will mostly be affected.

As for Anna, I'm still amazed how her triples are so low, but then the quad is like bam! super high.

 

[Fluture]

It seems like also as time went on she started relying more on height instead of rotation speed. Which is great because no matter how much her body doesn't change, the rotation speed will mostly be affected.

As for Anna, I'm still amazed how her triples are so low, but then the quad is like bam! super high.

Yes, I agree, her quad got higher. I have no idea what will happen, of course, but at this point her quad looks relatively stable and I think she will keep it. Ironically, it‘s one of her 3-3 that makes me worry a bit more. Her 3Lz-3Lo is spectacular of course but it has a different technique than Alina, she rotates very quickly and goes up into the second jump immediately after the landing. I don‘t know how to properly explain it... but for me that looks more like a technique that could be affected than the one she has on her 4T.

Well, this means that Anna generally is capable of jumping higher. So, maybe she will work on her triples to give them more height too. She is working on a 3A. For now this seems pretty unlikely to me, looking at her 2A but then again, the difference between er 3Lz and 4Lz is also striking. So, it will be interesting to see what happens. Especially regarding 3A for 3A.

Under normal circumstances, I‘d put the chances to land it for them like this

Alena > Sasha > Anna

But since Alena was recently injured and probably isn‘t back to training it yet...

Sasha > Anna > Alena

 

[Vandevska]

Yes, I agree, her quad got higher. I have no idea what will happen, of course, but at this point her quad looks relatively stable and I think she will keep it. Ironically, it‘s one of her 3-3 that makes me worry a bit more. Her 3Lz-3Lo is spectacular of course but it has a different technique than Alina, she rotates very quickly and goes up into the second jump immediately after the landing. I don‘t know how to properly explain it... but for me that looks more like a technique that could be affected than the one she has on her 4T.

Well, this means that Anna generally is capable of jumping higher. So, maybe she will work on her triples to give them more height too. She is working on a 3A. For now this seems pretty unlikely to me, looking at her 2A but then again, the difference between er 3Lz and 4Lz is also striking. So, it will be interesting to see what happens. Especially regarding 3A for 3A.

Under normal circumstances, I‘d put the chances to land it for them like this

Alena > Sasha > Anna

But since Alena was recently injured and probably isn‘t back to training it yet...

Sasha > Anna > Alena

I think it's Sasha > Alena > Anna

 

[Jontor]

If Gubanova really wanted a spot at GP, she could have skated at three challengers last season and make sure that her season best is high enough. Her season best is lower than Sakhanovich’s season best, so why should she be more deserving? Based on what? Last season it was Sakhanovich who was treated unfairly by the system. She did not get to the nationals while having much better scores than several of those who qualified to the nationals only because they had GP events. Then they skated badly at the GP events and at the nationals... it wasn’t fair, but it was how the system was set up. So this season it is Sakhanovich who benefits from the system.

If I was Russian federation, I would re-think the system of qualifying to the nationals. I wouldn’t give automatic spot every lady who has a GP event; I would make a condition that they have to score at the GP event at least 190 otherwise they will have to qualify for the nationals through Russian cups like anyone else. Relatively speaking, 190 is not that high, even Russian juniors can manage that, but it would not waste spots at the nationals on skaters who underperform. Panenkova, Tsurskaya and Sotskova should have never qualified to the nationals last year. Panenkova scored 168 and 161 at her GP events and for that she got to the nationals, Tsurskaya scored 149 and 159 and for that she got to the nationals. Sotskova 176 and 177 and got to the nationals. And then Sakhanovich didn’t get to the nationals even though her season best at the challenger event was over 200. How fair is that?

I like Gubanova because she has the kind of artistry that appeals to me. And she has the TES content. But that's subjective and I can understand if not everyone is on the Gubanova-train. But when it comes to Gubanova vs Sakhanovich last season, I think clearly Gubanova wins this. Gubanova ended in fifth place in the Challenger Series ahead of Sakhanovich who only scored 174 points in her second event. At the Russian Cup Final, Gubanova came fifth (and was criminally underscored in my subjective opinion), Sakhanovich came 11th!!

But I totally agree with you about the unfairness when it comes to qualifying to RusNats. Last year even Radionova q to Nationals although she didn't compete in her GP assignments. She ended up WD, but really, that was just bonkers. And yes, Sakhanovich should have been there, ahead of the trainwrecks that was Tsurskaya, Sotskova and Panenkova last season. A qualifying score of 190 in the GP or Challenger events should be implemented. Then the rest can fight in the Cup of Russia. How does the CoR group stage work?? Is it the score that matters or is it the placing??

 

[moriel]

If Gubanova really wanted a spot at GP, she could have skated at three challengers last season and make sure that her season best is high enough. Her season best is lower than Sakhanovich’s season best, so why should she be more deserving? Based on what? Last season it was Sakhanovich who was treated unfairly by the system. She did not get to the nationals while having much better scores than several of those who qualified to the nationals only because they had GP events. Then they skated badly at the GP events and at the nationals... it wasn’t fair, but it was how the system was set up. So this season it is Sakhanovich who benefits from the system.

If I was Russian federation, I would re-think the system of qualifying to the nationals. I wouldn’t give automatic spot every lady who has a GP event; I would make a condition that they have to score at the GP event at least 190 otherwise they will have to qualify for the nationals through Russian cups like anyone else. Relatively speaking, 190 is not that high, even Russian juniors can manage that, but it would not waste spots at the nationals on skaters who underperform. Panenkova, Tsurskaya and Sotskova should have never qualified to the nationals last year. Panenkova scored 168 and 161 at her GP events and for that she got to the nationals, Tsurskaya scored 149 and 159 and for that she got to the nationals. Sotskova 176 and 177 and got to the nationals. And then Sakhanovich didn’t get to the nationals even though her season best at the challenger event was over 200. How fair is that?

There is a little fault in your proposal.
GPs happen fairly late in the season, last one a month before rusnats. This means that most top skaters would be automatically forced to do Russian Cup events early in the season, to ensure that they have a pass to Rusnats in case they bomb GP or get injured.
Adding even more (unnecessary) competitions for the top skaters.
Also, the GP qualifier, imho, is more of an aknowledgment of past results: as in skaters who performed well enough last year to deserve a chance this year. You can be sure that changing the rule the way you suggest would only add more voices to the "russian skaters being discarded after 1st mistake", "one time champions" and so on.

 

[Jontor]

There is a little fault in your proposal.
GPs happen fairly late in the season, last one a month before rusnats. This means that most top skaters would be automatically forced to do Russian Cup events early in the season, to ensure that they have a pass to Rusnats in case they bomb GP or get injured.
Adding even more (unnecessary) competitions for the top skaters.
Also, the GP qualifier, imho, is more of an aknowledgment of past results: as in skaters who performed well enough last year to deserve a chance this year. You can be sure that changing the rule the way you suggest would only add more voices to the "russian skaters being discarded after 1st mistake", "one time champions" and so on.

Maybe there could be a qualifying round in early December for those that bombed their GP/CS events, and match that against the skaters who came through CoR stages.

 

[Fluture]

This whole debacle would be solved if they just added another group at Nationals. They have the most talented ladies in the world and still only 18 get to participate in the Nats? Come on.

 

[Scott512]

I like Gubanova because she has the kind of artistry that appeals to me. And she has the TES content. But that's subjective and I can understand if not everyone is on the Gubanova-train. But when it comes to Gubanova vs Sakhanovich last season, I think clearly Gubanova wins this. Gubanova ended in fifth place in the Challenger Series ahead of Sakhanovich who only scored 174 points in her second event. At the Russian Cup Final, Gubanova came fifth (and was criminally underscored in my subjective opinion), Sakhanovich came 11th!!

But I totally agree with you about the unfairness when it comes to qualifying to RusNats. Last year even Radionova q to Nationals although she didn't compete in her GP assignments. She ended up WD, but really, that was just bonkers. And yes, Sakhanovich should have been there, ahead of the trainwrecks that was Tsurskaya, Sotskova and Panenkova last season. A qualifying score of 190 in the GP or Challenger events should be implemented. Then the rest can fight in the Cup of Russia. How does the CoR group stage work?? Is it the score that matters or is it the placing??

Thanks. I knew Anastasia outperformed Sima last year. Those are the facts. You should have presented this to the Russian Federation. Sima at 19 finishing 11th at the Russian cup final is not good. If Anastasia ever did that it would be held against her until she was in her thirties! And yes Nastya was underscored yet again at Russian cup final.

Let's be honest though you only get a few years in ladies Russian figure skating to prove yourself. Time runs out fast. Many of the girls are done by the time they're 19 or 20. That's what makes Anastasia Gubanova getting the shaft again so hard. Even though she's only 16 time is running out for her in her discipline in her country. That my friends is undeniable.