2020-21 US Women's Figure Skating | Page 63 | Golden Skate

2020-21 US Women's Figure Skating

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AFAIK, none of us in this thread belong to the USFS selection committee, and none of us were in the room when the USFS selection committee made its decision.

Throwing around words like "undeniably" and "unquestionably" in this thread is not convincing to me.
 
ice coverage said:
AFAIK, none of us in this thread belong to the USFS selection committee, and none of us were in the room when the USFS selection committee made its decision.

Throwing around words like "undeniably" and "unquestionably" in this thread is not convincing to me.
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And I'm not convinced that just because the USFSA does something that they followed their policy, whether or not any of us were in the room. I use words like "unquestionably" because the selection policy is there for all of us to read. I don't need to convince anyone of anything; you've convinced yourself that achieving a career best score at an event where a skater finished 9th and dismissing a Skate America win because it's "quasi international" are grounds to select the Nationals silver medalist.
 
drivingmissdaisy said:
... dismissing a Skate America win because it's "quasi international"
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Please do not put words into my mouth.

I have never dismissed Mariah's 2020 Skate America win. Mariah clearly was solidly ahead of Amber at 2020 Skate America, and I never have claimed otherwise.
That said, I stand by my description of 2020 Skate America as a "quasi international."
We all know that the ISU has said that it does not view 2020 GP results as normal results from a true international.
The tech panel and judges at 2020 Skate America all were from the U.S.
Unlike true internationals:
Skaters could not earn ISU tech minimums at 2020 Skate America, and could not earn ISU World Standing points at 2020 Skate America.
(Unlike a normal GP, also could not earn ISU Season's Bests or ISU Personal Bests at 2020 Skate America.)​

As for Four Continents, my point of view is that as merely one part -- of lower priority -- of Amber's body of work (including 2021 Nats as highest priority), the USFS selection committee would have considered her 2020 Four Continents results.

drivingmissdaisy said:
.And I'm not convinced that just because the USFSA does something that they followed their policy, whether or not any of us were in the room. I use words like "unquestionably" because the selection policy is there for all of us to read. ...
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You have not convinced me, and I have not convinced you.
It's called a difference of opinion. And we both are entitled to our opinions.

Yes, the selection policy is there for all of us to read -- that's the whole point!
Given that we nonetheless have a difference of opinion, your usage of the word "unquestionably" is (IMO ;)) not valid. And your claims of "unquestionably" and "undeniably" are why I continue to respond in this thread.
 
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drivingmissdaisy said:
My main issue is that USFSA isn't going by "body of work" and I disagree with people's interpretation that it does. If you want to go by the Nationals result, that's fine but then just announce that as the policy. Going by the National result, Amber gets the spot hands down. Adding the other events, each with a lower weight than 2021 Nationals but in their sum weighing more heavily than any one event alone, the spot unquestionably should go to Mariah. I don't think that when you compare Amber and Mariah, something like Amber scoring a career best of 190 while placing 9th at an event Mariah didn't compete in because she was slated to compete in a more prestigious competition shouldn't tip anything in Amber's favor. None of this probably matters since I don't think Karen or Bradie will miss Worlds, but it is frustrating that the USFSA continues to avoid setting more clear guidance on how it will choose athletes for big events and I hope the Olympic selections are more clear cut.
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They deliberately do that because they want to have their own personal discretion, a clear cut guidance doesn't allow that without heavy scrutiny.

But I can also understand why there is some discretion in the situation, 4ccs is not exactly always filled with the top tier ladies so if someone goes to that event and places really well that doesn't necessarily mean she's going to go to Olympics or Worlds and do as well.
 
4CC 2020 had some very high tier ladies who are also going to be at 2021 Worlds: Rika Kihira, Kaori Sakamoto and Yelim Kim. Neither Karen nor Amber finished ahead of any of them, but Bradie beat Kaori and Yelim Kim.
 
Not sure Yelim counted as a top tier lady. She wasnt Korea's number one, it was her first senior season, she didnt medal on the grand prix, she didnt have any special elements...
 
chuckm said:
4CC 2020 had some very high tier ladies who are also going to be at 2021 Worlds: Rika Kihira, Kaori Sakamoto and Yelim Kim. Neither Karen nor Amber finished ahead of any of them, but Bradie beat Kaori and Yelim Kim.
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My comment didn't specifically reference 2020 (mainly because I didn't want to go check the roster of who was there) it was a generic comment about 4ccs, you don't always get the top tier ladies going to that event. So I can understand why they would want some discretion to 'discount' a high placement for events that have a weaker field.
 
Amei said:
My comment didn't specifically reference 2020 (mainly because I didn't want to go check the roster of who was there) it was a generic comment about 4ccs, you don't always get the top tier ladies going to that event. So I can understand why they would want some discretion to 'discount' a high placement for events that have a weaker field.
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The same thing happened to Ross Miner in 2018. Ross finished with the Silver and was left off the 2018 team. Ross had been to Worlds and was the Bronze Medalist at 4CC in 2012. Ross did have a couple of bad seasons between these events but, it was a real shame to see his heartbreak after Nationals.
 
Hmm, hope she goes for it. At least a sign of resistance. On the other side, not much to gain with one 3a, podium still far off reach and a another us spot on jeopardy if it goes wrong
 
Amei said:
Haven't they been alluding to her training a triple axel since last season? The cynic in me says its the media's attempt to make at least 1 US lady look competitive for this year's Worlds podium.
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No one thinks the US ladies are going to podium. Bradie is very hardworking and ,from what I understand, left her old coach because she wanted to learn the 3A. So, she is definitely serious about learning it. However, I don't think it is close to being ready.
 
I definitely don’t think Bradie should attempt a triple axel at Worlds. It wouldn’t be enough to get her on the podium, she doesn’t need it to place where she needs to, and there’s just too much at stake. The fight for 4th is going to be incredibly fierce and she can’t afford to introduce a new element she can’t rotate yet.
 
readernick said:
No one thinks the US ladies are going to podium. Bradie is very hardworking and ,from what I understand, left her old coach because she wanted to learn the 3A. So, she is definitely serious about learning it. However, I don't think it is close to being ready.
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Frankly, our ladies are not deep enough to warrant a 3rd spot at this time. The consistency among the top 5 seems to switch and expect for glimpses from Alysa and Mariah. Even a solid #2 can be iffy at times.
 
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