2022 U.S. Nationals: Senior Men's Free Skate

[el henry]

Okay, that definitely explains American attitude toward it.

yes, we are trying very hard here in the US (and we have much more work to do) regarding knowledge of Black history and dance treasures like Revelations.

of course, Jason’s “Sinnerman” is beloved in countries other than the USA and by skating fans around the world as well, so I am glad that his interpretation and skating can bring perhaps a small measure of appreciation of Ailey elsewhere

 

[lariko]

Larko, I'll tell you why I have such a problem with this comment and those who agree with you. I had the same problem back in the 90's when I supported Maria Butyrskaya. I never said anything against Michelle Kwan but, you'd think I'd robbed her by the way I was attacked by her fans. However, I never said anything bad about Michelle and I NEVER blamed her, Or Sarah Huges for that matter, for the judges not calling their obvious Flutzes. The skaters have no power over the decisions the judges make and if you have a problem with Jason's numbers, it's the judges you need to speak negatively about, not the skaters.

I didn't say that it was Brown did the shafting. And not even judges, because judges clearly placed Malining in the second position and assessed him in 300's. This comment applies to the USFS who did the shafting.

 

[mrrice]

I didn't say that it was Brown did the shafting. And not even judges, because judges clearly placed Malining in the second position and assessed him in 300's. This comment applies to the USFS who did the shafting.

This is good to hear. I saw Ilia's Mom Tatiana at Worlds in 1999. I loved her smile and she and Maria Butyrskaya were friends. I watched their practice session and they hung out together the entire time. Maybe just leave Jason's name out of your complaints as he has nothing to do with the outcome. Ilia became a star to many people who only watch, or follow skating at Nationals. I bet that most casual fans had never heard of him 3 days ago, and now he's "Overnight" sensation.

 

[lariko]

This is good to hear. I saw Ilia's Mom Tatiana at Worlds in 1999. I loved her smile and she and Maria Butyrskaya were friends. I watched their practice session and they hung out together the entire time. Maybe just leave Jason's name out of your complaints as he has nothing to do with the outcome. Ilia became a star to many people who only watch, or follow skating at Nationals. I bet that most casual fans had never heard of him 3 days ago, and now he's "Overnight" sensation.

I vehemently disagree with USFS choice, regardless of your sentiments toward Malinin's mother or 'he's going to be fine, he got a puppy!' sentiment. What I wanted, what made sense, what was right, didn't happen.

I am happy about Malinin's score. I am happy about him being assigned to the Worlds. I am not happy about Brown being picked over Malinin for Olympics, and since it was Malinin vs Brown, in more ways than one, I don't see how I can leave out Brown's name.

 

[mrrice]

I vehemently disagree with USFS choice, regardless of your sentiments toward Malinin's mother or 'he's going to be fine, he got a puppy!' sentiment. What I wanted, what made sense, what was right, didn't happen.

I am happy about Malinin's score. I am happy about him being assigned to the Worlds. I am not happy about Brown being picked over Malinin for Olympics, and since it was Malinin vs Brown, in more ways than one, I don't see how I can leave out Brown's name.

You're not happy about the judges selecting Jason over ilia, I get that but, all Jason did was skate. Call out the judges but, why drag Jason into it.

 

[lariko]

You're not happy about the judges selecting Jason over ilia, I get that but, all Jason did was skate. Call out the judges but, why drag Jason into it.

Judges selected Malinin over Brown.

 

[mrrice]

Judges selected Malinin over Brown.

Then it's the US Fed that selected Jason, they're the people you should mad at. Skaters and coaches have zero power to change the outcome. Just ask Ross and his coaches.

 

[lariko]

Then it's the US Fed that selected Jason, they're the people you should mad at. Skaters and coaches have zero power to change the outcome. Just ask Ross and his coaches.

I am not mad at Brown. I have never meet him personally, or even watched him skate live. I don't like his skating. And I specifically described why I don't like his skating.

 

[rollerblade]

Geez, so much mud slinging...

Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on which camp you're on), there's still the final boss: covid tests results. None of the spots are guaranteed until the skaters are in the official olympic bubble on the ice for their 6 minute warmup.

 

[readernick]

I don't like it when things get personal. I don't like the fans making personal comments disparaging Jason and I think we should keep that same standard with Ilya.

I will just say that arrogance is very common among young men I think it is just a normal stage of development and helps them take risks. Experience teaches humility. Even if you are good at one thing, you probably aren't good at everything.


Nathan is incredibly humble. It's amazing that he seems to be truly good at everything and yet manages to stay down to earth. Respect!

 

[moonkat]

I don't like it when things get personal. I don't like the fans making personal comments disparaging Jason and I think we should keep that same standard with Ilya.

I will just say that arrogance is very common among young men I think it is just a normal stage of development and helps them take risks. Experience teaches humility. Even if you are good at one thing, you probably aren't good at everything.


Nathan is incredibly humble. It's amazing that he seems to be truly good at everything and yet manages to stay down to earth. Respect!

Why do we care so much about arrogance? If they didn't all believe they deserve to win how would they be good competitors.

I like Jason's skating, but think Ilia should go per his 2nd place finish and 4 quads.

It is clear that US fed support is why an artistic skater like Jason is scored so high. We cannot discuss anything without talking about the skaters the fed is supporting. Personal is any convincing statements against whatever position another stands for.

Jumps are art, not just tech and not an unfortunate interuption to an otherwise artistic program. This is something I've alway believed, but it is not well accepted. What is frustrating is that someone who likes jumps is dismissed as an Olympics-only viewer or the assumption that a non-casual fan does not want Ilia to replace Vincent (or Jason in priority per his national results or that a long time fan cannot possibly believe Vincent's victory in the grand prix over Nathan places him ahead of Jason in priority). Is it that hard to imagine someone can enjoy Jason's skating, but want Ilia to go to the Olympics instead?

 

[moonvine]

Tomoki confirmed his withdrawal was due to Covid.

 

[el henry]

Thanks to @moonvine , I looked up Tomoki's post. So sad, I love his programs and he probably won't do Leslie Odom Jr. three years in a row

 

[readernick]

[

Why do we care so much about arrogance? If they didn't all believe they deserve to win how would they be good competitors

Confidence is one thing. Arrogance is another. One leads to success, the other often restricts growth , development and leads to failure while alienating those around you. I could provide many examples of the results of arrogance but it would get political.

It is possible to discuss a skaters pros and cons without making statements that are blatantly false, rude and disparaging. Many posters who disagree with the decision have done so. Those who can't, well I have an ignore option on this website and I use it for any one who can't show basic respect to any skater whether I like that skater or not. Different opinions are welcome, lack of manners, and respect aren't. Jason wouldn't get the PCS he deserves if he was from a smaller fed, true. This is also true for all technically exceptional skaters in terms of GOE. So, I'm not sure why that matters in this case. All guys at US Nationals get that same judging bias internationally

I don't think those who like jumps are only Olympic viewers. This debate between art and sport continuously happens on this site not just during Olympic years. So, clearly, those who admire technical difficulty aren't just Olympic year viewers. I also agree that jumps are sometimes art. Ilya's jumps aren't at that point to me yet but Yuzuru Hanyu and Kolyada, for example, jump with such beauty that is becomes an important part of the artistic performance. I also find Jason Brown's 3F to be extremely artistic. This point though has nothing to do with my original post.

 

[CoyoteChris]

[
Confidence is one thing. Arrogance is another. One leads to success, the other often restricts growth , development and leads to failure while alienating those around you. I could provide many examples of the results of arrogance but it would get political.

Wow. Very well said. ITA. Not getting political either..., Confidence is what makes great fighter pilots. I have had the honor in my history studies to speak with WWII airmen from America, Japan, and Germany, and especially the Tuskegee Airmen. None of them were in the least bit arrogant except for one American. Many of the arrogant ones, and I wont mention names, died due to their arrogance. I could talk for hours. Not a fan of arrogance.

 

[CoyoteChris]

Artur Dmitriev Jr. - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Wow....what a dope slap moment....didnt realize this guy was the son of THE A.D. Skated for Russian in what? 2018? Didnt see his status at USFS or on wiki as far as if Russia let him go or?

 

[moonkat]

Confidence is one thing. Arrogance is another. One leads to success, the other often restricts growth , development and leads to failure while alienating those around you. I could provide many examples of the results of arrogance but it would get political.

It is possible to discuss a skaters pros and cons without making statements that are blatantly false, rude and disparaging. Many posters who disagree with the decision have done so. Those who can't, well I have an ignore option on this website and I use it for any one who can't show basic respect to any skater whether I like that skater or not. Different opinions are welcome, lack of manners, and respect aren't. Jason wouldn't get the PCS he deserves it he was from a smaller fed, true. This is also true for all technically exceptional skaters in terms of GOE. So, I'm not sure why that matters in this case. All guys at US Nationals get that same judging bias internationally

About jumps, I agree they can be art. I don't think those who like jumps are only Olympic reviewers. This debate between art and sport continuously happens on this site not just during Olympic years. So, clearly, those who admire technical difficulty aren't just Olympic year viewers. I also agree that jumps are sometimes art. Ilya's jumps aren't at that point to me yet but Yuzuru Hanyu and Kolyada, for example, jump with such beauty that is becomes an important part of the artistic performance. I also find Jason Brown's 3F to be extremely artistic. This point though has nothing to do with my original post.

Okay, what I mean is why talk of skaters being arrogrant(aka immature). It's their performance on ice that should matter. If this arrogance leads to failure then it does. When we talk of arrogrance or non-pc behavior, some people end up saying the skater doesn't deserve their placement.

That was off point. I was expressing my frustrations in general after years of watching US skaters get the boost that ignores issues that blow up as their bodies reach maturity.

 

[CoyoteChris]

Karen Chen had boot problems for what seemed like forever. I think everyone had decided she was never coming back.

Then she shows up at Philly International and @Seven Sisters and I were floored. We never thought we’d see her back on competitive ice. But Karen was like “not so fast.” She comes off as an ice Princess but she’s actually a very resilient and gutsy skater.

But this is not the Karen Chen fan fest. So I’ll just say I hope Yaro’s boot problems are resolved quickly

One heck of a short program, Yaro had....

 

[CoyoteChris]

yes, we are trying very hard here in the US (and we have much more work to do) regarding knowledge of Black history and dance treasures like Revelations.

Here is an Idea...have the Nicholas Brothers tap dance on the Jumbotron at Nationals! 2 minutes in....

Stormy Weather in color - The Nicholas Brothers and Cab Calloway | Colorized with DeOldify

The Nicholas Brothers' tap dance scene from the movie "Stormy Weather" (1943). Cab Calloway and his orchestra performing "Jumpin' Jive".â Subscribe to our ch...

www.youtube.com

 

[moonvine]

Artur Dmitriev Jr. - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Wow....what a dope slap moment....didnt realize this guy was the son of THE A.D. Skated for Russian in what? 2018? Didnt see his status at USFS or on wiki as far as if Russia let him go or?

It looks like he last competed for Russia in 2018 so hopefully. If he goes somewhere like Cranberry next year we will know for sure.