2023-2024 Russian Nationals Jumping Championships | Page 62 | Golden Skate

2023-2024 Russian Nationals Jumping Championships

Mariott

Now the flower is making its way through concrete
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2022
Country
Russia
7-9 year olds should not have "fans" etc., that's my stance, whether it's through tiktok dance videos or being in movies or doing figure skating or whatever. They should grow up among friends and family, people who have real instead of parasocial relations with them and care about them on a much more real and deeper level. They also should not be in the limelight. Sometimes it's inevitable, but I don't see any good in it.
Figure skating is the sport of the young (except perhaps ID). It is the realities of today that all competitions are shown and all broadcasts find their viewers. If I see a young girl impressing me with graceful skating, and another, for example, with technical difficulty, why should I stay away? It's normal to notice young talents, to follow their successes, to wish them luck. And it's good that we can follow their path from their first performances to more serious tournaments, instead of waiting until they are 17-18. This is my position, and I believe that this in no way prevents athletes from growing up healthy and mentally complete, because they have a family, friends among their peers, full communication in a familiar circle.
Pathological cases, of course, should be dealt with by the police and specialists in children's rights, which exist in every country.
 

katymay

Medalist
Joined
Mar 7, 2006
You should have seen reddit yesterday, on every video of Bazyluk's 4-1-4 historical brilliance: "Eteri will rot" "Eteri wont see heaven" "Poor girl"... absolute quotes of exact comments, these people are demon possessed.
No sport inspires as many Green Eyed Monsters as figure skating, and there is no place where I see more of them then on reddit. Unhinged Jealousy has always been in figure skating, long before the internet. I believe it is because it is a sport that demands so many resources of the parents-money and time spent at the rink and at competitions. And after taking a second mortgage to keep your kid on the ice, puberty happens and dreams are snuffed out. And it is hard to see more talented kids in Russia easily landing quads, when your own kid can barely do a double jump after 10 years and thousands of dollars. Reddit is probably the most toxic place on the internet, a place where the Green Eyed Monsters are in control and can feel good about themselves for spreading hate borne of envy.
 

Mathematician

Ecclesiastes 7:1-2 / KJV
Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 8, 2023
I meant by that:

1. They don't really stand out. No exceptional jumps (i'm not talking about difficulty but the way the jumps look). Usacheva with her ripponless triples was praised more than Khromykh who was attempting quads. Mura's jumps (and others) get more praise. No exceptionnal artistry. They are good but are not always called the best. For example, Mura receives more praise than Petrosyan.

2. They were overshadowed by their teammates of the same gen. Khromykh was in the shadow of Valieva and Usacheva, Petrosyan was in the shadow of Akateva, Zhilina, Mura, Samodelkina when they were in juniors. She was not getting better results nor was talked about as much as the others. After the ban, she was loosing to Akateva, Mura and even Valieva who is older (one year, but it changes everything in Russia).

3. She isn't ultra dominating. It looks like she became the top girl by default because others are struggling with injuries, consistency.

The result of all of that is that she isn't the it girl that everyone is talking about. Despite being the nats champ. Like Khromykh, she was not the one whose success was the most anticipated. There was not high expectations. She just ended better than Khromykh.
Yes very good points indeed. However, I disagree with "no exceptional artistry". Petrosian is more sophisticated than Muravieva artistically. And Khromykh isnt in the conversation. Maybe she isnt Lipnitskaya tier but its very high level and not worse than anyone else internationally either (right now). In Russia I think Akateva is a bit more artistic but Akateva is truly at the highest level in that regard.


7-9 year olds should not have "fans" etc.,
I dont care what anyone says, if you could call yourself a "fan" of anyone who isnt at least junior eligible thats weird.

Maybe I get it with female fans because they often find young kids cute or whatever, but if its a man thats effectively always going to be very off-putting.

You are right, I don't care that much about most female figure skaters, mostly because I don't like the typical feminine programs and think that in general there is not enough difference in programs. Sometimes someone stands out to me though or I like their programs or personality or whatever.
Most of the Japanese skaters are super fast, so if you say that, it irritates me a bit. (They also sometimes have rather high bvs, there are some who have an (unstable) 3A.)
I'm not a fan of Muravieva's programs, although I find them a bit on the better side. I think she has better edges than most female Russian skaters, but most of all she has a certain something in her movements and gestures, a bit in the direction of Kostornaya. Her jumps also look nice and not forced to me. And then her body looks like it might not undergo any major changes anymore, so I think she might be close to what she looks like as an adult skater, but that's of course just guesswork.
I am also convinced that having a 3A but no quads is usually a sign of a rather good technique, while having quads but no 3A is very odd and often stems from "cheated" technique or simply speed of rotation due to lightness. I'm always sceptical about that. No idea if Petrosyan will be able to recover her 3A, but that's just why in my pretty amateur view Muravieva looks indeed very good for the future.
Hm, maybe Japanese are not slow, thats not what I was saying. But I saw the best Japanese girls at international events and I think the difference was quite perceptible still. I believe jumps also count towards SS by rules but maybe not. Anyways people always criticize Russian SS but typically they just mean the edge factor of SS, which isnt really a massive argument in my opinion. I do sort of agree about your comment on quads vs 3A but there are plenty of other girls who fit the "cheated" quad standard and get lots of attention so it doesnt really explain why people ignore Petrosian. I realize you're just stating your own reasons but the question in general still remains to me why Petrosian is so unappreciated.
 
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Mathematician

Ecclesiastes 7:1-2 / KJV
Record Breaker
Joined
Aug 8, 2023
No sport inspires as many Green Eyed Monsters as figure skating, and there is no place where I see more of them then on reddit. Unhinged Jealousy has always been in figure skating, long before the internet. I believe it is because it is a sport that demands so many resources of the parents-money and time spent at the rink and at competitions. And after taking a second mortgage to keep your kid on the ice, puberty happens and dreams are snuffed out. And it is hard to see more talented kids in Russia easily landing quads, when your own kid can barely do a double jump after 10 years and thousands of dollars. Reddit is probably the most toxic place on the internet, a place where the Green Eyed Monsters are in control and can feel good about themselves for spreading hate borne of envy.
Yes. I also think the jealousy comes from their own inadequacy. They wish they could be similar but have to come up with excuses as to why those girls are actually unfortunate to make themselves feel better; "yes this girl is beautiful, artistic and athletic but she is still worse off than I am. She must have paid too big a price for this, I'm happy with my mediocrity". I imagine the great majority of the haters are out of shape or lacking something severely in their heart or purpose.
 

Couch Expert

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 19, 2024
Simple: take the athletes of the ice. How difficult can it be to wrap your mind around this concept that injury means injury, and ignoring injuries and gaslighting athlets about their body signaling that something is wrong is counterproductive and plain cruel.
With this approach big sport just won't function. I imagine such microinjuries and common bruises are usual thing on every training in figure skating - well, in every other sport as well. How one can improve in a sport with real chances to win tournaments - if they will be removed from training and spend valuable time to recover - after every painful experience? It's impossible.
What you suggest is similar to remove any soccer player from the match after some rough collision over struggle for ball, for example. When usually they just lie on grass while writhing in pain for some time. Then they get up and go to play again. That's the same thing here - the only difference is that she is still a kid and there was too little time to recover. Nevertheless it's the same logic for junior and kids sport as well. Unless you forbid any kind of tournaments until 18 y.o. - there are always will be very competitive parents (Kostyleva's mother is infamous case unfortunately) and underage athletes who will see such injuries as neccessary price for their ambitions. Everyone inside sport are used to it - coaches, athletes, parents, experienced fans. Since it is everyday occurence to them. The problem lies with common people who are not used to children tears. And journalists who are perfectly aware of how things are inside junior sport outside of tv cameras - but if camera catches it - they are happy to make most evil and horrendous picture from it to get as many attention and trafic from clickbait headlines as possible.
 

Couch Expert

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 19, 2024
And to think she could have been the first world champion for Armenia, making history and amazing the world, making her community proud and basking in their love. Sad, sad... if only RusFed had the athlets' interests at heart, Petrosyan might have amounted to something actually great. Now, she's second to a 12 yo in a jumping tournament.... hurray?
She couldn't. She wouldn't get the same training conditions, financial support and treatment from Armenian federation - and she would be forced to spend year or two on quarantine without competitions as well. Meaning fatal blow for her motivation to train and rapid degradation of abilities in less strict environment she is used to. I am surprised how people still don't get it after so many examples of this. European champion? Maybe. World champion? No.
 

Couch Expert

Rinkside
Joined
Jan 19, 2024
She wouldn't get the same PCS and GOEs with Armenia.
For fairness sake - with Russia she would get even less PCS and GOEs internationally nowadays.
Not moving to Armenia immediately or even before 2022 was the biggest mistake of her life, and that’s why I can't wholeheartedly cheer for her successes.
Following this logic - you can't cheer for ANY Russia's skater. Then.. what are you doing here?
 
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Mariott

Now the flower is making its way through concrete
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2022
Country
Russia
I dont care what anyone says, if you could call yourself a "fan" of anyone who isnt at least junior eligible thats weird.

Maybe I get it with female fans because they often find young kids cute or whatever, but if its a man thats effectively always going to be very off-putting.
On this occasion, I remind you that I`m a woman. It's just that there have been precedents for confusion because the boy in the avatar :biggrin:

Men don`t write about little girls that they are cute, it would really look scary, even if it was said from a father's point of view (and in the young skaters' fan community almost all of them are fathers or happy relatives). Men usually discuss them like any other athlete, in the vein of "look, she's got her own set of jumps, she'll beat all the competition if she puts her mind to it, and her triple lutz is much better this season". I don't think that's a bad thing.
 

niks

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 13, 2022
Health problems

What is up with Dima Aliev? What kind of health issues? He did very well at Nats and then went on to do many shows, so it didn't seem like he had any problems

But today he did seem sort of off. Not sure if it was something physical or not though. It was mostly that throughout the competition and even at the end after winning and all, like when they were doing the celebratory lap around the rink, you could tell he was mainly just going through the motions. His heart was very very far away from it all :(
 

niks

On the Ice
Joined
Mar 13, 2022
There're also St. Petersburg Championships with some top skaters before Junior Nats

Looking forward to this next weekend! Great start list on the men side from what you posted on another thread.
Do you know if Zhenya will participate too? I don't remember him being on your initial list
 

AlexBreeze

Record Breaker
Joined
May 27, 2021
Country
Russia
Do you know if Zhenya will participate too? I don't remember him being on your initial list
He stopped taking part in such competitions after he entered university. He recently ran away from Team Mishin hoodie presentation because of his exams, he has a very busy schedule. So I guess not. Although he was actually going to compete last year, but he caught a cold.
 

Mariott

Now the flower is making its way through concrete
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2022
Country
Russia
What is up with Dima Aliev? What kind of health issues? He did very well at Nats and then went on to do many shows, so it didn't seem like he had any problems

But today he did seem sort of off. Not sure if it was something physical or not though. It was mostly that throughout the competition and even at the end after winning and all, like when they were doing the celebratory lap around the rink, you could tell he was mainly just going through the motions. His heart was very very far away from it all :(
He's got a bad back, he gets aggravations.
And of course, he was upset about the bad performance.
 

Mariott

Now the flower is making its way through concrete
Record Breaker
Joined
Feb 10, 2022
Country
Russia
I will never understand Galliamov's haircut.

Even his best friend used to make fun of his haircut: "My hair is cooler than yours right now." 🤣

bdJXAaN8f_k.jpg
 
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