2024 Worlds: Men's thoughts and comments

[gsk8]

Ilia Malinin soars to new heights in Montreal

2024 World Figure Skating Championships: Men USA's Ilia Malinin soared to new heights with his record-breaking free skate in Montreal on Saturday night.

www.goldenskate.com

Just wow. Raise your hands if you have watched Malinin's FS more than three times in the past 24 hours!

And to make it even better, Brown strongly hinted he would be back and is off to create new programs!

Vasiljevs, OTOH wants to take a break

I'm so thrilled for all the medalists and hope that Uno keeps going as he is so special to watch! I do feel he's way too caught up on how his coach feels and wonder if that's healthy and/or not productive. I adore Lambiel, but, just saying...

Good on Siao Him Fa for an awesome comeback, but the backflip needs to go. I just think it's disrespectful. Save it for the shows.

I want a Kagiyama doll so I can pinch the cheeks whenever I want

 

[ladyjane]

Brace yourselves, as this going to be a long one. It took nearly 6 hours to watch the men's short but it was definitely worth it. I enjoyed watching even the men in the beginning, with some nice surprises. Too bad for some who had quite good skates, but when there's 40 competing, there are always going to be 16 not continuing in the FS. But, what a pity to not see Ivan Shmuratko again (his skates always know how to move people), or Valtter, Jari and Maurizio. Or Davide, who really is showing promise (I always felt him to be rather bland, but not this night). What a shame for Adam Hagara (I think the season was just too long with the combination of jrs and srs), for Boyang Jin who had the worst skate of his life (Brian really felt for him. I heard him say: "are you allright?"). Highlights for me were Luc (who did contine), Donovan (who skated well) and Jari in that group. I felt sorry for Adam, but as he turned it around two days later, those feelings left me soon enough. Good to see Roman demonstrating he's still got it, as always enjoying Dennis and Jason. Shoma had a dream short, Yuma is always a delight, and Ilia showed me he can do more than jump only. And there was lots more in those six hours but I'll stop.

The Free is a different beast. Not in the case of Donovan (those swinging hips), who is just getting better all the time, the great Adam with his superb FS early on, poor Nika who doesn't have much to offer when the jumps are gone, the great Dennis, Jason and Lukas, Mikhail showing a bit more personality than usual, Gabriele who always seems to have one good and one bad programme (this was the badder one), Cactus Alexander showing his European medal wasn't a fluke even if he didn't manage that 10th placement, I know Shoma could have skated better but I applaud his sportmanship, and that smile of his is a jewel in itself, Yuma doing good again, and Ilia being the real quad God.

The boarding was really too close. Never have I seen so many skaters kicking it and falling. The only one doing that on purpose (without the falling) was Keegan, and that wasn't during the competition but at the gala.

Love the men!

 

[Anna K.]

I have mixed feelings.

There was a lot to enjoy in this competition. I’d say there was something for everyone in the good news box after the FS: Adam’s climb to bronze for those who love surprises, high placement of Jason for those who prefer quadless artistry, and Malinin’s quad showdown for quad lovers. And a world record breaking score for the news as a cherry on a cake. (Did it actually get in the news? Not on the first page I guess.)

However, the truth is that I spent most of the time annoyed by programs that barely featured anything except jumping passes that were unsuccessful way too many times (Adam climbed so well and Jason placed so high with reason, you know). And in the end, I heard a commentator shouting excitedly that quad Axel should be worth more points and thoughts were circling in my head: So, as if it wasn’t enough that half of the field fall down trying a quad Lutz, do we now need a quad Axel that is so pointy that everybody needs a quad Axel or quit? Well, apparently you shouldn’t be worried if you are Jason Brown; then you should just wait until all wannabe quadsters fall down and then bag your medal. But what if you are an average elite skater? What would be a more realistic goal for you, to receive Jason’s PCS or to secure the BV of Malinin’s 4A? Given that, to secure BV, you don’t even need to stay on your feet - just add more than half extra rotation. I wish I could get out of my head that picture of coaches doing their math. But I can’t.

So, the aftertaste is exactly opposite to that after the Women's event. Girls had very few Ultra-Cs but they were nicely executed. In the Men's event, there was abundance of failed quads, mad jump score record of the winner, and a question in my head: what’s next?

Oh, whatever. Boys will be boys. Congratulations, Ilia!

 

[cheerknithanson]

I almost had a heart attack in anticipation for Ilia's FP. And then was screaming in delight (Not at the top of my lungs, but still screaming) as he kept landing his jumps. That was amazing.

 

[SmileHappy34]

All I am going to say is Wow . What a men's competition.

Thank you. It was a joy to watch.

 

[sheskates]

I don’t think Adam should have gotten a +GOE on his choreo sequence with an illegal element. His backflip isn’t even good.

 

[Arigato]

From Golden Skate's twitter feed:

Benoît Richaud

"Re the back flip: I love it. Because, I think we need to bring new elements. We need to be allowed to give a little bit of freedom to the skater. To give them more space to create new things. You know, I want to see more crazy spins. I want to see new creativity. The crowd is more crazy than that. So, you see the impact. "

Even judges were grinning during Adam's back flip. How dare they be so disrespectful. They should be banned from judging. I think we should also start using horses to pull Adam off the ice to protect the other skaters. You never know what could happen!!!!

But seriously, I welcome all the creativity Benoît and Adam want to add to the sport. Those two make the perfect choreographer-skater team. And were it not for Benoît having such long discussions with Adam about fighting for what he wants, people wouldn't have had the pleasure of seeing ISU history being made last night by Adam with the largest leap from a short program to the podium. I look forward to next season to see what they come up with.

 

[Mathman]

From Golden Skate's twitter feed:

Benoît Richaud

"Re the back flip: I love it. Because, I think we need to bring new elements. We need to be allowed to give a little bit of freedom to the skater. To give them more space to create new things. You know, I want to see more crazy spins. I want to see new creativity. The crowd is more crazy than that. So, you see the impact."

Thjere are, however, good reasons why backflips are not encouraged. The first is that we don't want unsupervised children practicing them in their own in emulation of top skaters, and end up breaking their necks. The other is that it is not really a skating move. It is acrobatics that has nothing to do with ice or skating.

The same thing applies to head-bangers and Detroiters in pairs -- crowd-pleasers in professional adagio shows (especially in small nightclubs or on cruise ships, where the rink is only a couple of meters across -- but disallowed in competitions.

 

[Merry]

That quote from Benoit Richaud drives me slightly nuts. Yes, new elements are wonderful. No, the backflip is not a new element, nor is it creative. And Adam is not the first person to put one into a competitive program at a high level while they were illegal (.... if nothing else, Surya Bonaly did it all the time to thumb her nose at the judges. She also landed them neatly on 1 foot.).

 

[4everchan]

Thjere are, however, good reasons why backflips are not encouraged. The first is that we don't want unsupervised children practicing them in their own in emulation of top skaters, and end up breaking their necks. The other is that it is not really a skating move. It is acrobatics that has nothing to do with ice or skating.

Kids don't need figure skating to see back flips. A lot of people try them on the ground already. It is a move done in many other places like cheerleading. I think pretty much all moves are dangerous in figure skating... I wouldn't want to mess up a raspberry twist or get tossed for a triple twist. Some of the falls yesterday must have been so painful too... I don't know. It is not my favourite move but whatever...it can be fun.

The same thing applies to head-bangers and Detroiters in pairs -- crowd-pleasers in professional adagio shows (especially in small nightclubs or on cruise ships, where the rink is only a couple of meters across -- but disallowed in competitions.

 

[Anna K.]

Ilia Malinin: lands 4A and 3Lz+3A sequence.

The web: Adam did a backflip!

 

[TontoK]

That quote from Benoit Richaud drives me slightly nuts. Yes, new elements are wonderful. No, the backflip is not a new element, nor is it creative. And Adam is not the first person to put one into a competitive program at a high level while they were illegal (.... if nothing else, Surya Bonaly did it all the time to thumb her nose at the judges. She also landed them neatly on 1 foot.).

Someone had a backflip counter for the gala. There were something like 5 or so.

So you are correct. It's not a new or innovative element. It might be a crowd-pleaser, but it's not anything groundbreaking or extra-ordinary.

I'm open to hearing a case for allowing it, especially in the free skate, but to argue that it's a "new element" is absurd.

 

[Arigato]

The other is that it is not really a skating move. It is acrobatics that has nothing to do with ice or skating.

"Acrobatics" have been around skating for decades. No one is arguing a back flip is a new element but, rather, that elements be allowed in programs that were not allowed before. And in that regard, it would be new. If anyone would listen to interviews skaters and choreographers give instead of popping off with value judgments, we might actually get somewhere.

 

[Mathman]

Best back flip: Jumpin' Jpe Sabovcik (1984 Olympic bronze medalist and long-time professional show skater). As far as I know he is the only skater who could do a back flip in full lay-out position. He also was landing quds in practice, but never attempted one in competition.

About Malinin's performance, though, I have to say this. Although I hope he adds more blade-to-ice skating to his programs in the future, this one-quad-after-another performance was well constructed and well delivered. Every jump was perfectly executed and with adaquate flow-out, and the choreography built and built throuout the program.

Of course Johnny Weir and Tara Lipinski going bananas with every jump was a big help at engaging the U.S. television audience.

 

[Mathman]

"Acrobatics" have been around skating for decades.

True, but I cannot tell the difference between a back flip on ice and a back flip on dry land. So it seems strange to me that this should be regarded as a skating move.

My favorute skating moves are those that can't be done anywhere except on ice. Ina bauers, spreadeagles -- that sort of thing. What makes ice skating different frpm other athletic endeavers, rather that what make it the same.

 

[Arigato]

True, but I cannot tell the difference between a back flip on ice and a back flip on dry land. So it seems strange to me that this should be regarded as a skating move.

My favorute skating moves are those that can't be done anywhere except on ice. Ina bauers, spreadeagles -- that sort of thing.

I love it when Yuzu does his 3A on land. You miss out on a treat. Oh, wait. That means the 3A is not a "skating move." Dreadful . . .

 

[Arigato]

Oh, I forgot -

Best back flip: Jumpin' Jpe Sabovcik (1984 Olympic bronze medalist and long-time professional show skater). As far as I know he is the only skater who could do a back flip in full lay-out position. He also was landing quds in practice, but never attempted one in competition.

Joe did a fantastic tucked axel. The height he got was astounding.

Jozef Sabovčík’s tucked axel - one of the all-time epic tricks in figure skating | By Rocker SkatingFacebook

Jozef Sabovčík’s tucked axel - one of the all-time epic tricks in figure skating

www.facebook.com

 

[Mathman]

Oh, wait. That means the 3A is not a "skating move." Dreadful . . .

Well, I have to be honest. That is the reason that I m not so gung ho about triple Axels and quads as many skating fans are. If you can do them on dry land, where does the ice skating come in? Why put on ice skates in the first place?

 

[Minz]

I think the backflip is cool and I don’t mind it. However, I absolutely understand why it’s extremely dangerous and why it’s banned.

Also, I think it’s very different if he does it once or twice vs doing it every single program.

 

[Arigato]

Well, I have to be honest. That is the reason that I m not so gung ho about triple Axels and quads as many skating fans are. If you can do them on dry land, where does the ice skating come in? Why put on ice skates in the first place?

Aw, come on Mathman. Skating can be a beautiful and expressive sport. I can see beauty in Joe's single tucked axel, as I can see beauty when Matteo Rizzo slides across the ice with his knee and out into a jump. The expression is individualized, I don't want to see skating standardized. "You can't do this. You can't do that." I dance and have done so for creative expression since I was 4 years old. There are no rules when I do it.

But I also know when I'm not really looking at choreo. I have Ilia's FS on as I type this and it is merely one setup after another (as it would have to be) to stuff that many jumps into the allotted time. Are his jumps well-executed? Yes. And he just did his "raspberry twist" thing. (Something you don't need ice for. ) Do I have a problem with him doing it on ice? No. That's his expression. Just as I have no problem with whatever Adam wants to put in to his program to express himself. My mother was a painter and you don't really think I told her what she could put on her canvas do you?