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- Dec 25, 2012
Yes, the first senior B comps.
Finlandia and Japan open. But I am also watching the JGP for the first time this year.
Jason Brown and Adam Rippon, Two Amazing Skaters
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Yes, the first senior B comps.
Finlandia and Japan open. But I am also watching the JGP for the first time this year.
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2012
I would disagree that Jason is more consistent because he doesn't have the quad. I really, really like Adam and have always held my breath when he skates. He's another one of those skaters that rarely skates a clean program twice in a competition. I think he's beautiful on the ice, graceful, complete, but the quad isn't the only jump he misses. And every year breaks my heart when he doesn't perform well. Adam would or will make a fantastic show performer when he doesn't have the pressure of competition. When you look at Adam and then compare him to say Max Aaron.......you see a complete skater who finishes every move, glides across the ice...but doesn't have the necessary BIG jumps. Jason, on the other hand, is just basically more consistent all around IMO. But as far as presentation, Adam is a few years ahead of Jason. For one thing he's older and has been on the scene longer and has had the time to develop his presentation. Jason is just coming into his own after last season. In the long run? I think Jason will be more successful than Adam when their careers are finished. I think if Adam could put 2 programs together and skate cleanly he'd be difficult to beat.
- Joined
- Feb 27, 2012
Minor (I hope 
) self-correction:
Whether the first Challenger competition is what some are awaiting is what I should have been asking earlier.
The first Senior Bs already have come and gone, I believe -- if the category includes the Asian Open and Skate Down Under.
) self-correction:Whether the first Challenger competition is what some are awaiting is what I should have been asking earlier.
The first Senior Bs already have come and gone, I believe -- if the category includes the Asian Open and Skate Down Under.
I think guys had in mind, that quads in programs affects also other easier jumps. You need to put more effort to quad , more energy and more stress on usage of stamina. Just look for example at Javier Fernandez. When he land 3 quads there is 100 % chance he will miss other easier triple 
. Quads are puting more pressure in head also in this case, because you just starting to think, ok I landed 3 quads, now I can't miss anything, this are just easy triples, and bum poping a lutz. Falling on quads is propably even worse, because your confidence is going really down
Quads changes everything
. Quads are puting more pressure in head also in this case, because you just starting to think, ok I landed 3 quads, now I can't miss anything, this are just easy triples, and bum poping a lutz. Falling on quads is propably even worse, because your confidence is going really downQuads changes everything
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2014
I think guys had in mind, that quads in programs affects also other easier jumps. You need to put more effort to quad , more energy and more stress on usage of stamina. Just look for example at Javier Fernandez. When he land 3 quads there is 100 % chance he will miss other easier triple
Quads changes everything
Pretty much this.
Agree.
Adam was expected to do much better than he has (based on his Jr Career) . Although he's never been a US Sr Champ, he's been as high as 6th at Worlds. He's musical. He has a quad-but like all US men, has had trouble getting the quad consistently in competition. He changes coaches frequently. He's running out of time.
Jason doesn't have a quad. (so we don't know how he'd do in competition) He's musical , (but to me anyway-inauthentic) He is fairly consistent without a quad. He doesn't coach hop. He's young and has time to develop.
I find it amusing that somehow a clean complete program is somehow a BAD thing. Personally, I think it's great that Jason and his team value programs as a whole and do not mar the integrity of those programs for the sake of cramming jumps he hasn't mastered.
Really, it comes down to strategy. So far it's worked pretty well for Jason. He managed to get a medal in his debut GP season, get a berth on the Olympic team and finish in the top 10.
Really, it comes down to strategy. So far it's worked pretty well for Jason. He managed to get a medal in his debut GP season, get a berth on the Olympic team and finish in the top 10.
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2014
I don't think it's a bad thing, and no one said it's a bad thing. People just wonder what if he put a quad in his program. Jason is perfect for now. But if he upgrades his jump layout, what will be the outcome? Personally I also want to see that happen, too. I really want to know how much quads affect programs as well. :think:
No one said it is bad. We only agreed there that program without a quad is easier than this with quad, but even program without quad can be bombed. It is pretty clear that he will not put jump that he didn't mastered. But it is pretty clear that if Jason wants to move up in the field he will have sooner or late to bring quads.
The program of course is technically easier without the quad, but I don't get why one should downplay Jason's consistency because of it. Doing a clean program (as Jason did with all his SPs this season) consistenly in competition after competition is not easy, quad or no. And Jason ups the difficultly in other ways by putting in transitions or doing tough footwork (I doubt any of us would consider his FS easy after doing that Riverdance step sequence!).
Jason managed to get in the final FS group at the Olympics without a quad last season. Jason will need a quad no doubt, but at this point of time, he's been OK without it because only a few of his competitors have mastered it.
I think Jason's team knows this, which is exactly why they haven't put it in. Kori Ade has always emphasized the importance of being confidence and taking each element one by one. The last thing she want would be for Jason to get all hopped up about doing the quad that he totally messes up on everything else. It might mean some short-term setbacks, but they are clearly thinking about 2018.
Jason managed to get in the final FS group at the Olympics without a quad last season. Jason will need a quad no doubt, but at this point of time, he's been OK without it because only a few of his competitors have mastered it.
I think Jason's team knows this, which is exactly why they haven't put it in. Kori Ade has always emphasized the importance of being confidence and taking each element one by one. The last thing she want would be for Jason to get all hopped up about doing the quad that he totally messes up on everything else. It might mean some short-term setbacks, but they are clearly thinking about 2018.
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- Joined
- Jul 31, 2014
The when is the interesting questions. I kinda feel that the longer he can put off, in someways the better. By making a name for himself without the quad, he has kind created an interesting wild card to play when the time is right. It seems clear the powers that be in skating want men doing quads, that means when he does add a quad (this is of course assuming it is not a disaster) his scores kinda have to go up. If they don't, an argument against doing quads is created. . . and I don't think anyone wants that. So the longer he goes, and the higher he can get his scores without it, the better he likely will be in the long run. It may prove wise for he and his team to hold a little something back and have something new to play when it is needed.
That being said. . . I kinda suspect he will try one at Skate America. Being from the Chicago area, he is not going to have as good of crowd (most likely) as he likely will at Skate America this year for a long time. The home town advantages brings energy to a performances which helps. And if he falls, well he fell on his first attempt in his home town (area), he likely will fall on a quad eventually, what better place to get your first fall out of the way than in a home town audience that is still going to be supportive, and likely appreciate that you that tried something new for your home town for them.
As much of a valuable card to play it is, it has got to be mentally exhausting for him worrying about getting the first one out of the way and under his belt.
I don't think it's wrong to say that a quad changes a program. It's easier to perform, sell the program, do transitions, do showy footwork, ect. when you haven't expended energy on a quad (if you do it up top) or need to worry about an upcoming quad (if you do it later). So I am a little worried about how the quad would affect Jason's skating and consistency. I hope he gets it soon, but I'll take a clean quadless program over a fall on the quad, all else being equal (I would, however, take a fall over a quadless program if that fall were a dumb fluke fall on 3S or something).
Not to mention, the mistakes likely won't be limited to just the quad (e.g. I don't think he'd be able to skate the rest of the program with ease if he fell on his opening quad, even if he's physically up to it, just because of the psychological toll it takes for someone who isn't used to falling). Basically, I hope Jason trains hard in practice to get it ASAP, but I don't want him rushing it into competition if it's not ready.
Anyway, why are we including the quad as a plus for Adam in the first place? :scratch: I don't think he's ever landed a quad in competition either? I know he tried quad lutz, but I dunno if gambling on an unstable quad lutz without a toe or salchow is a very good strategy...
Not to mention, the mistakes likely won't be limited to just the quad (e.g. I don't think he'd be able to skate the rest of the program with ease if he fell on his opening quad, even if he's physically up to it, just because of the psychological toll it takes for someone who isn't used to falling). Basically, I hope Jason trains hard in practice to get it ASAP, but I don't want him rushing it into competition if it's not ready.
Anyway, why are we including the quad as a plus for Adam in the first place? :scratch: I don't think he's ever landed a quad in competition either? I know he tried quad lutz, but I dunno if gambling on an unstable quad lutz without a toe or salchow is a very good strategy...
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2014
I don't know if that was my fault, but all I meant is that Jason is either on par or better already, so if he gets dat quad, Adam wouldn't be able to catch him. (though other people raised the point that it would affect the rest of Jasons Program/consistency too)
I wasn't saying it's anyone's fault for bringing up Adam and quads (it's just a discussion
). Just making the point that the quad isn't really something that works in Adam's favour, since he doesn't have much of one either. (Very, very unstable quad lutz with no toe/salchow to fall back on probably isn't enough). It probably makes more sense to mention quad when comparing Jason to, say, Joshua, who has landed some quads even if he's having trouble recently (Max too, but that's so obvious it's barely worth mentioning).I think you sounded fine. I just hope I didn't offend anyone else who mentioned the quad in this Adam vs. Jason debate.
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2012
I think Kori has brought Jason along with planned precision. He's only 18 years old and competing against men that are much older and have been around longer. They always said their sights were set on the 2018 Olympics! This past year was just cream I think. She's not rushing him. She's not endangering his health. And the thing is - once he gets a jump down it's gold!!!
But I agree with Mrs. P about Adam. I just keep waiting for him to put it all together. Love watching him skate when I'm not white-knuckling it afraid he's going to fall.
But I agree with Mrs. P about Adam. I just keep waiting for him to put it all together. Love watching him skate when I'm not white-knuckling it afraid he's going to fall.
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2014
Jason was born on 15th December 1994. He is 19 already.
Anyways other than that I have nothing sort of disagree with you.
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2013
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